Does anyone actually want help?

I believe that many if not most folks who are overweight/obese or who deal with eating disorders tend to have a really difficult time with living in reality and facing truth, just in general. This is why many people became overweight in the first place: they shut their eyes to the reality that their behavior is unhealthy, even though they *want* to be healthy. Their ideals do not line up with their actions. So they have to shut down their consciences in order to deal with the discomfort of that disparity.

Once you shut down your conscience for a long period of time, your head gets pretty messed up. You start to live in a fantasy land.

Now - Bring that mentality into MFP. They "want" help (or they say so) and probably deep down they do. But they also "want" to continue their bad behavior (because it's a habit, or feels good, or tastes good, or is their emotional crutch, whatever). The latter overcomes the former, thus, they're looking for people to tell them it's okay to continue as they are.

And when people DON'T tell them that...they freak.

There is an old, spiritual principal that says, "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."

This applies to just about every good thing in life. Not many will follow the narrow path. It's too hard. But.....some will! Those are the people I care about. And they're out there. And they're listening.

I believe that many if not most folks who are overweight/obese or who deal with eating disorders tend to have a really difficult time with living in reality and facing truth, just in general. This is why many people became overweight in the first place: they shut their eyes to the reality that their behavior is unhealthy, even though they *want* to be healthy. Their ideals do not line up with their actions. So they have to shut down their consciences in order to deal with the discomfort of that disparity.

Once you shut down your conscience for a long period of time, your head gets pretty messed up. You start to live in a fantasy land.

Now - Bring that mentality into MFP. They "want" help (or they say so) and probably deep down they do. But they also "want" to continue their bad behavior (because it's a habit, or feels good, or tastes good, or is their emotional crutch, whatever). The latter overcomes the former, thus, they're looking for people to tell them it's okay to continue as they are.

And when people DON'T tell them that...they freak.

There is an old, spiritual principal that says, "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."

This applies to just about every good thing in life. Not many will follow the narrow path. It's too hard. But.....some will! Those are the people I care about. And they're out there. And they're listening.

Sage words on both your posts on this thread

Agree. I think this is a GREAT post!

I believe that many if not most folks who are overweight/obese or who deal with eating disorders tend to have a really difficult time with living in reality and facing truth, just in general. This is why many people became overweight in the first place: they shut their eyes to the reality that their behavior is unhealthy, even though they *want* to be healthy. Their ideals do not line up with their actions. So they have to shut down their consciences in order to deal with the discomfort of that disparity.

Once you shut down your conscience for a long period of time, your head gets pretty messed up. You start to live in a fantasy land.

Now - Bring that mentality into MFP. They "want" help (or they say so) and probably deep down they do. But they also "want" to continue their bad behavior (because it's a habit, or feels good, or tastes good, or is their emotional crutch, whatever). The latter overcomes the former, thus, they're looking for people to tell them it's okay to continue as they are.

And when people DON'T tell them that...they freak.

There is an old, spiritual principal that says, "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."

This applies to just about every good thing in life. Not many will follow the narrow path. It's too hard. But.....some will! Those are the people I care about. And they're out there. And they're listening.

Sage words on both your posts on this thread

Agree. I think this is a GREAT post!

Someone has her **** together

We want OUR LEVEL of truth meaning if a beginner like me is reading the boards we are discerning whether or not the advice is practical for us. I know my strengths and weaknesses and if I see advice that fits me then yeah I will adhere. But if I see someone saying lift weights 3 days a week ... P90X 2 days...log calories and weigh your food!!!....Then of course you just lost me. Now everything they said is TRUTH and will work but hey that plan personally does not work for me. Just me 2 cents.

so you are saying logging calories and weighing food loses you??? I don't understand...

I was confused by this too... If someone says lift weights 3 days a week, and workout (cardio) 2 days a week, and count calories, you are lost? What lost you? And when you say that plan doesn't work for you, then what plan does? Not working out or counting calories? Hmm....

Why would you assume that because a person says that plan doesn't work for them that they don't want to do anything at all? Your response is exactly what I was talking about in my post. You're attacking this poster on a personal level by assuming they aren't dedicated, and you don't even know what she's confused about yet.

all, I did was ask a question as to how this would lose someone..I do not see how this is attaching...back off captain save an MFP'r on a white horse..geez

Or do you more-so want to vent on these boards? Talk about fads that you cycle through, ask very specific impossible questions to answer in a paragraph, defend the protocol you follow although you may not be seeing ANY results..

As a fitness professional, i use MFP to help my clients stay accountable and to track my own macros. I occasionally visit the boards to help out, maybe clear up some confusion, answer questions etc...

Most of the time it seems like people dont really want to hear it? they dont want truths or accuracy. They want...sympathy.

Can anyone shed some light? or am i just being cynical

Lately it seems like those who are coming here for help get knocked down with sarcastic/jibberish like answers and then the thread gets way off topic of what the original person asked. I like coming here to see if I can help or get help. Initially people don't want to hear the truth but the more they hear it the more they are going to have to accept it.

True enough, as annoying as it may seem to have people asking what we deem silly or whatnot...lots can be said for being tactful and kind. I do think if you can't be nice then don't answer. Just because its the internet and your not speaking face to face does not equal " toughen up its the internet" It does work both ways,...don't have to coddle the ones asking these types of questions, but the people answering them with sarcastic answers are no better.

Or do you more-so want to vent on these boards? Talk about fads that you cycle through, ask very specific impossible questions to answer in a paragraph, defend the protocol you follow although you may not be seeing ANY results..

As a fitness professional, i use MFP to help my clients stay accountable and to track my own macros. I occasionally visit the boards to help out, maybe clear up some confusion, answer questions etc...

Most of the time it seems like people dont really want to hear it? they dont want truths or accuracy. They want...sympathy.

Can anyone shed some light? or am i just being cynical

I definitely want help but end up being more confused than before! I know most people mean well but the info is conflicting. I've received opposite information on the same thread such as Eat more. Eat less. Move more. Move less. Be more accurate with logging. Take a break from logging. Lift heavy. Do more cardio. Eat this. No, eat that.

It's really, really difficult to understand who is genuinely trying to help vs. someone who is simply pushing an agenda. As such, the "truth" becomes very subjective.

We want OUR LEVEL of truth meaning if a beginner like me is reading the boards we are discerning whether or not the advice is practical for us. I know my strengths and weaknesses and if I see advice that fits me then yeah I will adhere. But if I see someone saying lift weights 3 days a week ... P90X 2 days...log calories and weigh your food!!!....Then of course you just lost me. Now everything they said is TRUTH and will work but hey that plan personally does not work for me. Just me 2 cents.

so you are saying logging calories and weighing food loses you??? I don't understand...

I was confused by this too... If someone says lift weights 3 days a week, and workout (cardio) 2 days a week, and count calories, you are lost? What lost you? And when you say that plan doesn't work for you, then what plan does? Not working out or counting calories? Hmm....

Why would you assume that because a person says that plan doesn't work for them that they don't want to do anything at all? Your response is exactly what I was talking about in my post. You're attacking this poster on a personal level by assuming they aren't dedicated, and you don't even know what she's confused about yet.

I was simply saying I have LOST interest in that plan because that would not be practical for ME right now. I currently do not have weights nor gym membership. I currently have a treadmill/dog a few workout tapes and MFP so if the workout is outside of my means then I have LOST interest.

< did not have gym membership until two years ago ..I still worked out at home, ran, and watched my calories...

what about the logging and weighing food? Is that not practical either?

She's too new to separate the "move, measure, log" part from the "P90x, lift barbells, buy food scale." part.

I think she means when things are really specific and not something she can do based her resources, she loses interest in the thread. I don't think she means she loses interest in exercise and logging. For example, if a question about eating turns into a discussion about low carb or Paleo, it "loses" her because it's outside of what is realistic for her.

Hey. N00b here.

Don't know about everyone else but I'm paying attention. I'm not posting questions because I'm looking for the answers first, not because I don't have questions. I find a lot of info in the Eat, Train, Progress group and I soak up every nugget that SideSteel and Sara churn out. I read Yoovie's blog. The whole thing. I read Bret Contreras' book, and then I read it again. I search the forums for questions I've got or just things I'm curious about and I look for the advice that's already been given and I've read some very helpful things. I add people when I come across folks who have walked the talk, but I'm not on a friending and posting spree because I'm also busy busting my *kitten* in the gym, tracking EVERY lift I do and comparing it to last week's, logging every scrap I put in my face, working my 9-5 and sleeping.

What you post does matter. I do appreciate it, I'm listening and it's helping. Don't give up on us n00bs just yet!

If the question is something like, "Does everything I eat count?" or "Is standing exercise?" or "Does 'water' mean water?" I'd agree with you. But there are times when people come forward with advice derived from careful observation of their own patterns -- things which may not have been covered in a study -- and they are excoriated.

If the question is something like, "Does everything I eat count?" or "Is standing exercise?" or "Does 'water' mean water?" I'd agree with you. But there are times when people come forward with advice derived from careful observation of their own patterns -- things which may not have been covered in a study -- and they are excoriated.

Muscle is heavier than fat.

Right?