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    Processed Sugar

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    • Posts: 9,420 Member
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      Considering the fact people had just ran a marathon and they needed to replenish their glucose levels for both energy and their muscles, it wouldn't surprise me... Now, keep that up at breakfast, lunch, afternoon snack, dinner, late nigh snack and see what happens.

      Well, right. That's why the word is "moderation"

      But your original question was "is there ever a time when processed sugar is beneficial?"

      The answer is clearly yes.
    • Posts: 22,511 Member
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      Well, right. That's why the word is "moderation"

      But your original question was "is there ever a time when processed sugar is beneficial?"

      The answer is clearly yes.

      Exactly. Sitting on the couch all day? A Snickers bar and a Coke is not the best choice. Running an ultra? Best thing you could do for yourself. The food isn't good or bad, its just a collection of nutrients that is a good or bad choice depending on the situation.
    • Posts: 10,321 Member
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      Well, right. That's why the word is "moderation"

      But your original question was "is there ever a time when processed sugar is beneficial?"

      The answer is clearly yes.

      Here is what my "bag" looks like for a long cycling ride. (2) 90 Cal Coca-Cola cans - 50g, (4) Clif Bar Energy Bloks - 48 grams, and a couple Clif Bars - 40-50 grams, and Skratch Labs Exercise Hydration Mix (3 servings in 2 bottles) - 60g.

      I consume about 300-400 cals per hour and most of that is sugar. It gives me energy to fuel my ride which is definitely a nutritional benefit in my opinion.
    • Posts: 919 Member
      If there was a situation where you would want to spike insulin, that would be a benefit, I guess. Whether or not you consider that a nutritional benefit is another story.

      It's also a benefit to me if I want to meet my macros quickly and conveniently instead of gorging myself on foods that are low in processed sugar.

      It's all about context and goals.
    • Posts: 307 Member
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      :laugh:
      :laugh: :laugh:
    • Posts: 9,420 Member
      If there was a situation where you would want to spike insulin, that would be a benefit, I guess. Whether or not you consider that a nutritional benefit is another story.

      It's also a benefit to me if I want to meet my macros quickly and conveniently instead of gorging myself on foods that are low in processed sugar.

      It's all about context and goals.

      Insulin spikes trigger muscle growth.
    • Posts: 919 Member
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      Insulin spikes trigger muscle growth.

      Those are the lines along which I was thinking, knowing that insulin is anabolic. Beneficial? Completely subjective.
    • Posts: 30,886 Member
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      So... my steak attachment... Where does that fit in?

      I had the same thought.

      Also, I can control myself about sugar. You know how people can tell if they are controlling themselves about sugar? They can count calories and see if they are exceeding the calories they intended to eat because they eat more sugar than they meant to. I see no reason to preemptively decide that everyone will lose control due to sugar and cut it out.

      Most people probably eat too much sugar for the same reason they eat too many calories from other foods--they don't actually watch what they eat and just go by what tastes good.
    • Posts: 30,886 Member
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      So a tablespoon of molasses mixed with brown sugar does not give you the same amount of nutrients as a tablespoon of molasses by itself?

      Do you even math, brah?

      I believe she's saying that there's no actual benefit from subbing brown sugar for white sugar in everything. In the amounts talked about, the little bits of extra stuff you would get from brown sugar would be minimal and thus not a reason to ditch white. I haven't run the comparison (I'm mostly annoyed by the focus on WHITE sugar for other reasons, namely the weird idea that brown is less processed), but it seems plausible.
    • Posts: 30,886 Member
      I just realized something. WTF is wrong with me? I can barely afford produce. Really 'barely' is synonymous with can't really but try anyway. If every one of you happily munching on cookies, cake, and bread with corn syrup hidden in it start switching to produce prices will get even higher and I'll be totally screwed.

      Sugar is good for you! White sugar is the best! Snort it! Cook it! Mainline it! Chow down! But stay away from my strawberries!

      Um, one can eat ice cream and also eat produce, you know.

      My ice cream is usually more expensive than the produce too, but maybe that's because this is farm country or something. If I can ever find my ice cream maker, I might even make my own ice cream with produce. (I'll probably add a little sugar, though, because I'm wild that way.)

      Sadly, in the winter the locally-grown produce isn't so available (because snow and all that) but produce still seems to be available at quite reasonable prices.

      Besides, given that this is a weird cold summer, I'm still picking strawberries from my garden. Just getting far fewer tomatoes than usual.
    • Posts: 9,420 Member
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      Those are the lines along which I was thinking, knowing that insulin is anabolic. Beneficial? Completely subjective.

      Sorry. I read it as "insulin spikes are BAD" Too much MFP for me :)
    • Posts: 1,885 Member
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      Um, one can eat ice cream and also eat produce, you know.

      My ice cream is usually more expensive than the produce too, but maybe that's because this is farm country or something. If I can ever find my ice cream maker, I might even make my own ice cream with produce. (I'll probably add a little sugar, though, because I'm wild that way.)

      Sadly, in the winter the locally-grown produce isn't so available (because snow and all that) but produce still seems to be available at quite reasonable prices.

      Besides, given that this is a weird cold summer, I'm still picking strawberries from my garden. Just getting far fewer tomatoes than usual.

      Eat it at your own risk. Fruit is poisonous. Just google poisonous fruit, you'll get all kind of pictures that look exactly like those berries you should pass by in the store. The ones I'm standing over protectively, snarling. It's to keep anyone from getting sick, I tell ya! Stay away!
    • Posts: 9,420 Member
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      Eat it at your own risk. Fruit is poisonous. Just google poisonous fruit, you'll get all kind of pictures that look exactly like those berries you should pass by in the store. The ones I'm standing over protectively, snarling. It's to keep anyone from getting sick, I tell ya! Stay away!

      I just did a Google search. You wouldn't believe what I found!
    • Posts: 1,885 Member
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      I just did a Google search. You wouldn't believe what I found!

      Yup. Fruit leads to a prolonged, horrendous death full of foaming at the mouth, convulsions, and agonized regret. I'm just going to take these to the cashier now and buy them, then dispose of them in a safe, concrete-lined pit where they can't do any more damage.

      The perfectly safe, tasty cookies are on Aisle 3. :tongue:
    • Posts: 729 Member
      The question is, if a starving man only had water to survive on while his twin brother had water and sugar, which one will die first? :D Some scientists supposedly did a study on mice regarding a similar issue, feeding one over the other sugar water. Guess what they found!?!?


      http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-08/daily-soda-habit-impairs-evolutionary-fitness-mice-study-finds
    • Posts: 10,321 Member
      The question is, if a starving man only had water to survive on while his twin brother had water and sugar, which one will die first? :D Some scientists supposedly did a study on mice regarding a similar issue, feeding one over the other sugar water. Guess what they found!?!?


      http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-08/daily-soda-habit-impairs-evolutionary-fitness-mice-study-finds

      Can you post actual study?
    • Posts: 729 Member
      No. I never said anything about this study being real or not; it's just interesting to think about this stuff. :)
    • Posts: 3,982 Member
      The question is, if a starving man only had water to survive on while his twin brother had water and sugar, which one will die first? :D Some scientists supposedly did a study on mice regarding a similar issue, feeding one over the other sugar water. Guess what they found!?!?


      http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-08/daily-soda-habit-impairs-evolutionary-fitness-mice-study-finds
      That is a bold statement and conclusion. The given scenario and what the study tested weren't the same. At all.
    • Posts: 1,885 Member
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      That is a bold statement and conclusion. The given scenario and what the study tested weren't the same. At all.

      True, it wasn't. Although it was interesting. If it's the one I read when I googled the keywords, researchers took wild mice and raised them to the mousy equivalent of teenage years. Half were on sugar water as well as balanced food, the other half were fed cornstarch water and a balanced mouse diet.

      Then they turned both groups loose to compete in a controlled wildish environment with wild raised mice. The sugar water mice did much worse. The females died younger. The males didn't die younger but fathered less children.

      However, I don't remember it saying they controlled for weight. If they didn't, then MFP sugar eaters will rightly argue that it can't apply to them because the human sugar eaters are controlling for weight through calorie counting and treats in moderation.
    • Posts: 3,982 Member
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      True, it wasn't. Although it was interesting. If it's the one I read when I googled the keywords, researchers took wild mice and raised them to the mousy equivalent of teenage years. Half were on sugar water as well as balanced food, the other half were fed cornstarch water and a balanced mouse diet.

      Then they turned both groups loose to compete in a controlled wildish environment with wild raised mice. The sugar water mice did much worse. The females died younger. The males didn't die younger but fathered less children.

      However, I don't remember it saying they controlled for weight. If they didn't, then MFP sugar eaters will rightly argue that it can't apply to them because the human sugar eaters are controlling for weight through calorie counting and treats in moderation.
      That is indeed what it was.

      It would be good to see the entire study to see if sugar was on top of what they ate, and what amount of sugar they ate as a portion of their diet. Even at the same calorie level, sugar making up too much of the diet would effect the ability to obtain required nutrients.

      And of course, even if it does hold true for mice, we should be very careful extrapolating this to humans.
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    • Posts: 88
      Because maple syrup, mollasses, etc have energy and nutrients, and are not the endproducts of large scale environmental destruction. Drive out of Miami sometime when they are burning cane. Stevia adds pleasure with no calories. Bees do not generally bleach their "products", I think you might be tilting towards sophistry. Putting honey in a bottle in no way compares with monoculture, and factory processing. :flowerforyou:
    • Posts: 88
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      Why?
    • Posts: 30,886 Member
      Because maple syrup, mollasses, etc have energy and nutrients, and are not the endproducts of large scale environmental destruction. Drive out of Miami sometime when they are burning cane. Stevia adds pleasure with no calories. Bees do not generally bleach their "products", I think you might be tilting towards sophistry. Putting honey in a bottle in no way compares with monoculture, and factory processing. :flowerforyou:

      Sugar has energy. That's been covered. The environmental impacts are a separate topic and more complicated than you acknowledge here. Otherwise, look at the specifics of the cookie example--the idea that sugar makes it bad for you and maple syrup not is based on nothing beyond a rather superstitious idea about one being processed and the other not. Nutritionally and calorie wise there's no real difference. Eat beyond moderation and both are bad ideas.

      The inclusion of agave nectar in the usual list of supposedly more "natural" so better alternatives is one obvious problem with this way of compartmentalizing things.
    • Posts: 10,477 Member
      Because maple syrup, mollasses, etc have energy and nutrients, and are not the endproducts of large scale environmental destruction. Drive out of Miami sometime when they are burning cane.

      Sorry to rain on your parade but molasses comes out of the same process as sugar - two products of the same establishment.

      Don't judge the entire sugar industry by the 3rd world practices of the Southern USA either ;-)
    • Posts: 70 Member
      Well said sir.
    • Posts: 4,301 Member
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      lolwut?

      ETA: I like to link where I extracted quotes from....

      http://www.globalhealingcenter.com/sugar-problem/refined-sugar-the-sweetest-poison-of-all

      and lol at that article.

      Any time you write lolwut it is code for. . .do not pay attention to this poster. And thanks for the link we all need a laugh now and again.
    • Posts: 8,171 Member
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      Sorry to rain on your parade but molasses comes out of the same process as sugar - two products of the same establishment.

      Don't judge the entire sugar industry by the 3rd world practices of the Southern USA either ;-)

      And then there is the fact that the majority of sugar comes from sugar beets, not cane.
    • Posts: 419 Member
      Of course no benefits. People just love sweet stuff.
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