Fast Food Workers Strikes = Win for better health

Ummm... y'all are angry because fast food workers would like to be paid a fair wage?

My uncle worked in Wal-mart his entire life. He retired a millionaire because he used his money wisely, invested it and made something from that 'minimum wage' job.

I work in retail and many of my coworkers have held their job for 25 years or more. To them it IS a career. It is their ONLY career. SOMEBODY has to do these jobs so why shouldn't it be a career?

Somebody insinuated these jobs are meant to be stepping stones to REAL jobs? Really? And who is going to pay for that education for these people to acquire REAL careers if they're only barely making enough to make ends meet? Hmmmm?

Gosh guys. Check your privilege.

Maybe.. just maybe if they didn't buy $330 shoes or buy a $600 smart phone they would have the money to pay for that education.

Also, if someone has been working retail for 25 years and is still at the bottom of the totem pole, that person is doing something very wrong.

I've worked retail and I started making slightly more than minimum wage. People get raises in those jobs, they move up in the company as they gain experience and show initiative. And then they get replaced by new people coming into the workforce.

Honestly, I don't think I ever actually made minimum wage, even with my first job. Most places offer a bit over that to start and then give regular raises and promotions.

Absolutely. You start at the bottom and work your way up. That's how my uncle made all his money and how my coworkers are doing so well after 25 years in the job. It can be a career if you treat it properly and work your way up.

I just hate the attitude that 'retail' is somehow a 'lesser' job and people should be working for something 'better'.

This issue is much more complex than just "getting educated and getting a better job." The demographics of fast food workers surprise many people: the majority are older than 25, at least 30% have at least some college education, and about another 30% have at least one child to support. Many workers took FF jobs after being laid off from better paying jobs, so they took whatever they could get in order to keep working, and this has led to the FF industry being one of the fastest growing employers in the country. Unfortunately, the low pay and hours means many still have to rely on SNAP and WIC, which comes out of taxpayers' pockets whether they eat at FF joints or not. Entry-level jobs that are ideal for teenagers and high school graduates to help pay for some kind of advanced education, whether college or a trade, are instead going to older people, pushing youth out, making it more difficult for them to get educated if they don't qualify for scholarships or financial aid. Not to mention, the cost of college has skyrocketed in the last couple decades. In addition, the erratic work schedules at FF restaurants often make it difficult for someone to participate in educational enhancement or get a 2nd job so they can get ahead in life. Non-management FF workers rarely get health insurance, paid sick days, or any kind of retirement plan. Throw in an unexpected illness or injury and there's a good chance they'll be both out of a job and even more dependent on welfare. People with full-time jobs with benefits who complain that they don't make $15/hour need to look at their TOTAL compensation packages, because that's what your real salary is. You can get this information from your employer's HR department. For example, when I figure in my TC, I actually make about $12K more than my paid salary. Those things matter. Raising the FF minimum wage or providing workers with some kind of benefits would help reduce these workers' need for government aid, making us all better off. A reasonable argument could certainly be made as to whether $15 an hour is appropriate, or whether workers would be better off with decent benefits in place of higher pay. But as far as minimum wage increases causing proportional exorbitant increases in the cost of the food, well, the CEOs and other executives of these companies get huge salaries and bonuses, but no one complains about that affecting prices. In fact, places like In&Out Burger start their workers at $10/hour and offers benefits; for that the company gets happier, more committed, more experienced employees and a much lower turnover rate. Meanwhile, places like McDonald's are able to keep food costs unusually low BECAUSE their workers are so poorly compensated. There's a lot more to this and most social issues than meets the eye.

It's not so much that they shouldn't make minimum wage, it's more about fair working conditions and livable wage/hours. Minimum wage isn't a liveable wage in most states and then to top it off the fast food places only give their workers about 10 hours a week but they make their schedules sporadically making it very hard for them to get a second job.

I work for the state. I don't make a livable wage!

Ummm... y'all are angry because fast food workers would like to be paid a fair wage?

My uncle worked in Wal-mart his entire life. He retired a millionaire because he used his money wisely, invested it and made something from that 'minimum wage' job.

I work in retail and many of my coworkers have held their job for 25 years or more. To them it IS a career. It is their ONLY career. SOMEBODY has to do these jobs so why shouldn't it be a career?

Somebody insinuated these jobs are meant to be stepping stones to REAL jobs? Really? And who is going to pay for that education for these people to acquire REAL careers if they're only barely making enough to make ends meet? Hmmmm?

Gosh guys. Check your privilege.

Maybe.. just maybe if they didn't buy $330 shoes or buy a $600 smart phone they would have the money to pay for that education.

Also, if someone has been working retail for 25 years and is still at the bottom of the totem pole, that person is doing something very wrong.

I've worked retail and I started making slightly more than minimum wage. People get raises in those jobs, they move up in the company as they gain experience and show initiative. And then they get replaced by new people coming into the workforce.

Honestly, I don't think I ever actually made minimum wage, even with my first job. Most places offer a bit over that to start and then give regular raises and promotions.

Absolutely. You start at the bottom and work your way up. That's how my uncle made all his money and how my coworkers are doing so well after 25 years in the job. It can be a career if you treat it properly and work your way up.

I just hate the attitude that 'retail' is somehow a 'lesser' job and people should be working for something 'better'.

I think by "better." they mean something better than that minimum-wage entry-level position. It isn't that retail isn't a "real" job, but that an adult supporting a family shouldn't be working his or her entire life in a job a high school student qualifies for.

Ummm... y'all are angry because fast food workers would like to be paid a fair wage?

My uncle worked in Wal-mart his entire life. He retired a millionaire because he used his money wisely, invested it and made something from that 'minimum wage' job.

I work in retail and many of my coworkers have held their job for 25 years or more. To them it IS a career. It is their ONLY career. SOMEBODY has to do these jobs so why shouldn't it be a career?

Somebody insinuated these jobs are meant to be stepping stones to REAL jobs? Really? And who is going to pay for that education for these people to acquire REAL careers if they're only barely making enough to make ends meet? Hmmmm?

Gosh guys. Check your privilege.

Maybe.. just maybe if they didn't buy $330 shoes or buy a $600 smart phone they would have the money to pay for that education.

How do you know those items weren't gifts, or purchased at thrift shops, or obtained on some sort of payment plan? You'd be amazed at the high-end clothing you can find at thrift shops. And pretty nice phones are available on monthly payment plans - they don't need to cost a fortune up front. In many cases, a smart phone is the only phone/internet access a person has - kind of important if you're trying to get in touch with prospective employers. Don't be so quick to judge.

I'm not really following your logic here, sorry.

Yeah me either. All the company has to do is fire those people who refuse to go to work and hire more.

It's not the fast food industry's fault that people are obese. No one is forcing you to eat it 24/7.

You and someone else said, it’s about personal responsibility. Sounds like everyone before the industrial revolution(before obesity started to get out of hand) everyone exercised personal responsibility. Junk food is cheaper than healthier food. You think back in the day people counted calories? You think animals in the wild practice calorie counting? The issue we’re eating food that we’re not designed to eat. You have the equation backwards, we’re not getting fatter because we’re eating more. We’re eating more cause we’re getting fatter. Child who grow “over consume calories” they get bigger. Yet not necessarily fatter. The issue isn’t over consumption of calories, it’s the way the foods we eat has an effect on our hormones. Most of the junk food out there today, is highly calorie dense, with sugar, which makes us hungrier. I would estimate 95% of the food we eat isn’t natural. But it’s the personal lacking responsibility. Tell that to any obese person who has tried countless times to lose weight, tell them they’re inactive, lazy, and just eat too much. See what they say… The problem is deeper than what you think.

This issue is much more complex than just "getting educated and getting a better job." The demographics of fast food workers surprise many people: the majority are older than 25, at least 30% have at least some college education, and about another 30% have at least one child to support. Many workers took FF jobs after being laid off from better paying jobs, so they took whatever they could get in order to keep working, and this has led to the FF industry being one of the fastest growing employers in the country. Unfortunately, the low pay and hours means many still have to rely on SNAP and WIC, which comes out of taxpayers' pockets whether they eat at FF joints or not. Entry-level jobs that are ideal for teenagers and high school graduates to help pay for some kind of advanced education, whether college or a trade, are instead going to older people, pushing youth out, making it more difficult for them to get educated if they don't qualify for scholarships or financial aid. Not to mention, the cost of college has skyrocketed in the last couple decades. In addition, the erratic work schedules at FF restaurants often make it difficult for someone to participate in educational enhancement or get a 2nd job so they can get ahead in life. Non-management FF workers rarely get health insurance, paid sick days, or any kind of retirement plan. Throw in an unexpected illness or injury and there's a good chance they'll be both out of a job and even more dependent on welfare. People with full-time jobs with benefits who complain that they don't make $15/hour need to look at their TOTAL compensation packages, because that's what your real salary is. You can get this information from your employer's HR department. For example, when I figure in my TC, I actually make about $12K more than my paid salary. Those things matter. Raising the FF minimum wage or providing workers with some kind of benefits would help reduce these workers' need for government aid, making us all better off. A reasonable argument could certainly be made as to whether $15 an hour is appropriate, or whether workers would be better off with decent benefits in place of higher pay. But as far as minimum wage increases causing proportional exorbitant increases in the cost of the food, well, the CEOs and other executives of these companies get huge salaries and bonuses, but no one complains about that affecting prices. In fact, places like In&Out Burger start their workers at $10/hour and offers benefits; for that the company gets happier, more committed, more experienced employees and a much lower turnover rate. Meanwhile, places like McDonald's are able to keep food costs unusually low BECAUSE their workers are so poorly compensated. There's a lot more to this and most social issues than meets the eye.

I could hug you. :flowerforyou: Good explanation.

Bottom line- It isn't a simple issue and everyone's situation is not the same

The fastfood workers are useful idiots that are being used by SEIU.....the union could give a rats *kitten* about the plight of the fry cooker....if you raise the minimum raise you increase all wages....this ploy is to try to save SEIU......which organzes home care workers who make min. wage to $10 p/hr and these slime balls take union days from them....Let's remember these workers have to have pictures of items on the register to ring up orders.....if it goes to $15 per hour......I have been practicing "Would you like frys with that"....I am all in at 15 per......

I am very much in favor of doubling the minimum wage.

We, as taxpayers, are subsidizing these corporations through corporate tax breaks, and governmental benefits provided for their workers, who are paid laughably low wages. I think that no business has a God-given right to exist in this country if it cannot meet a minimal standard of decent treatment of and pay for its employees. If you cannot pay your employees a decent wage, you do not have a valid business plan!!

Not everyone has the transportation to be able to travel to a better paying job, the confidence to try to achieve something better, or the family financial backup to take time away from paid work to be able to spend time training through school or whatever for a new career.

When people are at work, they are trading precious hours of their lives for money, and there should be a decent minimum wage, enough to allow people to afford housing and other basic needs, and a bit of cash to put away as well. Even though working at a fast food place may seem a "low-skill" job, those folks are on their feet constantly, hustling, putting up with often disrespectful customers, and I think they deserve monetary recognition for that.

I have 11 years of post-high-school education and training, and am lucky enough to have a well-paid, very interesting career. It bothers me that there are so many folks out there who have the unlucky combination of poorly-paid and stressful/dull work. At least we can legislate some relief for them as far as pay goes.

I am very much in favor of doubling the minimum wage.

We, as taxpayers, are subsidizing these corporations through corporate tax breaks, and governmental benefits provided for their workers, who are paid laughably low wages. I think that no business has a God-given right to exist in this country if it cannot meet a minimal standard of decent treatment of and pay for its employees. If you cannot pay your employees a decent wage, you do not have a valid business plan!!

Not everyone has the transportation to be able to travel to a better paying job, the confidence to try to achieve something better, or the family financial backup to take time away from paid work to be able to spend time training through school or whatever for a new career.

When people are at work, they are trading precious hours of their lives for money, and there should be a decent minimum wage, enough to allow people to afford housing and other basic needs, and a bit of cash to put away as well. Even though working at a fast food place may seem a "low-skill" job, those folks are on their feet constantly, hustling, putting up with often disrespectful customers, and I think they deserve monetary recognition for that.

I have 11 years of post-high-school education and training, and am lucky enough to have a well-paid, very interesting career. It bothers me that there are so many folks out there who have the unlucky combination of poorly-paid and stressful/dull work. At least we can legislate some relief for them as far as pay goes.

Good points. I always wonder why people who rant against a minimum wage increase don't seem to care when under-performing CEOs get big salary increases and bonuses. All those things add to the cost of a product or service one buys. However, giving low-wage workers a little more money also helps to stimulate the economy, because such workers spend most of their money on the consumable goods that drive Gross Domestic Product (GDP). Not to mention, higher wages help reduce government assistance payouts, and that's good for all taxpayers.

To everyone saying that Minimum wage is not meant to be a Livable wage: That is absolutely its intent.

From the Fair Labor Standards act of 1938 (the thing that created minimum wage):

§ 202. Congressional finding and declaration of policy
(a) The Congress finds that the existence, in industries engaged in commerce or in
the production of goods for commerce, of labor conditions detrimental to the
maintenance of the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and
general well-being of workers


(b) It is declared to be the policy of this chapter, through the exercise by Congress
of its power to regulate commerce among the several States and with foreign
nations, to correct and as rapidly as practicable to eliminate the conditions above
referred to in such industries without substantially curtailing employment or earning
power.

That pretty clearly states that minimum wage should be a livable wage.

read this a little more closely.

how exactly does it clearly state that a minimum wage should be livable?

A) talks about "labor conditions detrimental to the
maintenance of the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and
general well-being of workers..." and ends mid sentance.

gives congress the right to ' to eliminate the conditions above
referred to in such industries without substantially curtailing employment or earning
power."

it seems to me that this is focused more on labor conditions. its not clear to me wether 'curtailing employment or earning power' is really directed at the worker or the employer.

I'm not saying your wrong but IMO you'd need a little more to 100% prove what your saying.

where did you get this from?

To everyone saying that Minimum wage is not meant to be a Livable wage: That is absolutely its intent.

From the Fair Labor Standards act of 1938 (the thing that created minimum wage):

§ 202. Congressional finding and declaration of policy
(a) The Congress finds that the existence, in industries engaged in commerce or in
the production of goods for commerce, of labor conditions detrimental to the
maintenance of the minimum standard of living necessary for health, efficiency, and
general well-being of workers


(b) It is declared to be the policy of this chapter, through the exercise by Congress
of its power to regulate commerce among the several States and with foreign
nations, to correct and as rapidly as practicable to eliminate the conditions above
referred to in such industries without substantially curtailing employment or earning
power.

That pretty clearly states that minimum wage should be a livable wage.

Well that pretty much says it. Lawyered.

But there in lies the question, what is needed for "minimum standard of living" Cell phones, cable, car, would not qualify, I would qualify it as adequate amount/qualify of food, shelter, and clothing, and minimum wage jobs would get you those 3 especially if you lived with a roommate and had no kids. I don't think it can or should support a family just an individual's basic needs.

And this is coming from someone that leans to the socialist side of the line, vs. the capitalist side

I agree with the last quoted post so much. I don't think minimum wage is meant to support families and/or pay for many of life's luxuries. Unfortunately many people think the latest iPhone is a necessity.

But I also hate this attitude of "minimum wage isn't meant to be enough for adults to survive on". I think that is a pretty disturbing thought to be honest, and I'm even more disturbed by that because I know of so many low wage entry-level jobs that I could see that attitude extending to in the future. Not everyone can be at the absolute top of their field. Not every person has the right psychological makeup for serving in the armed forces or the intellect required to become an attorney or surgeon.

I know I'll probably just sound like another bleeding heart if I continue discussing this topic.

BUT -- I want to add that in my opinion, things have really changed in the last 10-15 years when it comes to retail and food service, entry level jobs. I think at least SOME of the other posters here might not even realize how drastically things have changed. I'm in my thirties and when I was a college student in the late 90's and starting out in the early 2000s, it was EASY in my area to find a full-time retail job. You could walk into a drugstore and get a non managerial job with steady pay working 32-40+ hrs per week. So if you budgeted properly you could live off that (at least in my area). NOW...most retail stores, excluding the big box stores (and sometimes including the big box stores) have NO full-time employees except for management. A lot of this is to avoid providing staff with insurance and other benefits. But it means that for people with limited skills and education there is a huge gap there, and often they are unable to get a job working 40 hours per week.

Also...try asking 2-3 different fast food restaurants or retail stores if you can work part-time at each of them and coordinate schedules. They will most likely just laugh as they turn you down cold. I've held some part-time retail gigs over the years in addition to my full-time office jobs and believe me, they don't want to be flexible at most places - least of all when it comes to someone who is trying to support a family and pay their rent on retail wages. It's messed up.

I think $15/hr DOES sound insane for my area, where most college grads start out making $10/hr. Somewhere in the $8-10 range seems more acceptable to me for a new minimum wage. JMHO, obviously.

I am very much in favor of doubling the minimum wage.

We, as taxpayers, are subsidizing these corporations through corporate tax breaks, and governmental benefits provided for their workers, who are paid laughably low wages. I think that no business has a God-given right to exist in this country if it cannot meet a minimal standard of decent treatment of and pay for its employees. If you cannot pay your employees a decent wage, you do not have a valid business plan!!

Not everyone has the transportation to be able to travel to a better paying job, the confidence to try to achieve something better, or the family financial backup to take time away from paid work to be able to spend time training through school or whatever for a new career.

When people are at work, they are trading precious hours of their lives for money, and there should be a decent minimum wage, enough to allow people to afford housing and other basic needs, and a bit of cash to put away as well. Even though working at a fast food place may seem a "low-skill" job, those folks are on their feet constantly, hustling, putting up with often disrespectful customers, and I think they deserve monetary recognition for that.

I have 11 years of post-high-school education and training, and am lucky enough to have a well-paid, very interesting career. It bothers me that there are so many folks out there who have the unlucky combination of poorly-paid and stressful/dull work. At least we can legislate some relief for them as far as pay goes.

Good points. I always wonder why people who rant against a minimum wage increase don't seem to care when under-performing CEOs get big salary increases and bonuses. All those things add to the cost of a product or service one buys. However, giving low-wage workers a little more money also helps to stimulate the economy, because such workers spend most of their money on the consumable goods that drive Gross Domestic Product (GDP). Not to mention, higher wages help reduce government assistance payouts, and that's good for all taxpayers.

It seems reasonable, but doesn't higher wages equate to a higher cost of doing business, and therefore an eventual increase in the prices of the products and services being offered to offset these higher costs? So effectively your spending power hasn't increased at all. Also to those that have not received an increase in pay, who also will have to pay more for these same products and services, isn't it in effect a pay cut?
Just a thought. I could be thinking this through all wrong.

The higher minimum wage goes up, the less value my own job holds. MY pay doesn't go up when minimum wage goes up.

It might if you're a union employee. A lot of union contracts specify salary levels as a multiple of minimum wage, so if minimum wage goes up so does their paycheck. Wonder why unions care about what the takehome pay for a burger flipper is? This is why.

Also, the reason most minimum wage jobs are part time now is to avoid providing mandatory benefits, such as health insurance. Unintended consequences are a beeotch.