Paleo Diet

And the studies do suggest that whole grain fiber has health benefits that veggies and fruits don't. The opposite is also true, veggie and fruits contain health benefits that grains don't. Which is why it's good to eat both.

I missed that please provide quote where they suggest grains have benefits over veggies.

And the studies do suggest that whole grain fiber has health benefits that veggies and fruits don't. The opposite is also true, veggie and fruits contain health benefits that grains don't. Which is why it's good to eat both.

I missed that please provide quote where they suggest grains have benefits over veggies.

Besides the part that said people in the study who ate more whole grains lived longer? What would be the point? I've already added the quotes and the links. If you choose not to read or believe them that's okay. As I've repeatedly said, my intent is not to try and stear anyone away from a Paleo diet. It is merely to point out that there is plenty of medical scientific evidence that whole grains are not only not bad for you, but they are good for you.

So the answer is they do not say anywhere that whole grains have any benefits over vegetables. That’s what I thought, if you’re going to make a statement you should be prepared to back it up, or qualify it as your opinion. Everyone has a right to their opinion, just like they have the right to be wrong.

Another fad? Dieting should all be about moderation.

I agree. And why wouldn't sugar and beans be included? Those things can be gathered.

Really, so go gather some sugar, and get back to me when you have a 5 pound bag of the white stuff.

I recently talked to someone who was on a Paleo Diet - Paleolithic (Yep like the cave man) It sounds sort of interesting... You eat anything that you could hunt or gather. No dairy, sugar, beans, etc... Not really sure on the specifics.

The main interest to me was the amount of bacon that she eats and still looses weight. I mean, a lot of bacon. She has lost 18lbs.

Just wondering what peoples thoughts are.


Feel free to add me as a friend!!! - I need all of the motivation that I can get.

Kait

Hey Kait!

I've been primal for over 2 months now and I have nothing but good things to say about it. I was on the food pyramid eating a low-fat, whole grain based diet and I got to points where I was blacking out and shaking all the time. I couldn't eat enough and was starving all the time even though it was all healthy food. Since I have been Primal, I have lost fat, increased my muscle mass, increased energy, decreased my fibromyalgia symptoms, got rid of heart burn, have improved my overall quality of life, and best of all I'm NOT STARVING. I think you probably have gotten all the info from previous posters on what the basic lifestyle entails, so I won't repeat it. But the real question you have to answer for yourself is "WHY???"

Why do people who cut out grains/sugar/starch vegetables/legumes able to lose weight?
Why do they have more energy?
Why are they able to get off their insulin and other diabetic medications?
Why do they keep their muscle mass while losing fat even though they don't have to exercise?
Why do they get rid of their GERD?
Why is your friend able to lose weight eating a crap load of bacon???

Personally if I found a "diet" with all these great things associated with it, I think it would be worth looking into. So, that 's what I did. I'll never go back to my previous way! If you need informational materials let me know. I have done a ton of research.

And the studies do suggest that whole grain fiber has health benefits that veggies and fruits don't. The opposite is also true, veggie and fruits contain health benefits that grains don't. Which is why it's good to eat both.

I missed that please provide quote where they suggest grains have benefits over veggies.

Besides the part that said people in the study who ate more whole grains lived longer? What would be the point? I've already added the quotes and the links. If you choose not to read or believe them that's okay. As I've repeatedly said, my intent is not to try and stear anyone away from a Paleo diet. It is merely to point out that there is plenty of medical scientific evidence that whole grains are not only not bad for you, but they are good for you.

So the answer is they do not say anywhere that whole grains have any benefits over vegetables. That’s what I thought, if you’re going to make a statement you should be prepared to back it up, or qualify it as your opinion. Everyone has a right to their opinion, just like they have the right to be wrong.

Sorry, difference of opinion I guess. I consider living longer to be better.

But the point is they never said you would live longer eating grains over veggies. Again you need to consider the base line, which for some reason you just will not do, I know it doesn't help your case and maybe that is why you try to brush it off. But the base line is the normal diet not a diet high in veggies. Their studies do not say you will live longer eating plenty of whole grains over eating plenty of veggies. Period end of story, you’re trying to extrapolate information that is just not in evidence.

Another fad? Dieting should all be about moderation.

I agree. And why wouldn't sugar and beans be included? Those things can be gathered.

Really, so go gather some sugar, and get back to me when you have a 5 pound bag of the white stuff.

Have you never seen a sugar cane? Processed, refined sugar is gross, for sure, and I avoid it in my pescetarian diet because it is ground with animal bones and yadda yadda. But if you've ever had sugar right from the cane, you can't tell me that's not natural and it surely is delicious.

http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/EvolutionPaleolithic/Cereal Sword.pdf

http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/the-whole-truth-about-whole-grains

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/whole-grains/NU00204

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/health-gains-from-whole-grains/

All of your links compare whole grains to refined grains, NONE compare grain based diets with diets based on no grains. So pretty much your post is a strawman that has no bearing with the subject at hand. I AGREE whole grains are better than refined grains. You win. LOL

My post wasn't intended to compare whole grains vs. no grains not was I trying to "win" anything. I believe that you can follow the Paleo diet and be healthy and I've never said otherwise. I just object to the spreading of false information, such as whole grains are bad for you (you not meaning any one person in particular, just "you" as a general term). They are not and the posts support my argument. I kind of like the strawman reference though (straw, grain, funny).

Actually the links support that whole grains are "better" for you, not good for you.

No, they support that they are good for you.

From the Harvard link:

"By keeping the stool soft and bulky, the fiber in whole grains helps prevent constipation, a common, costly, and aggravating problem. It also helps prevent diverticular disease (the development of tiny pouches inside the colon that are easily irritated and inflamed) by decreasing pressure in the intestines."

"An intriguing report from the Iowa Women's Health Study linked whole-grain consumption with fewer deaths from noncardiac, noncancer causes. Compared with women who rarely or never ate whole-grain foods, those who had at least two or more servings a day were 30 percent less likely to have died from an inflammation-related condition over a 17-year period "

"In a study of more than 160,000 women whose health and dietary habits were followed for up to 18 years, those who averaged 2 to 3 servings of whole grains a day were 30 percent less likely to have developed type 2 diabetes than those who rarely ate whole grains"

From mayo clinic:
"Hailed as the "staff of life" for their historical importance to human survival, grains are an essential part of a healthy diet."

From webmd:
"We all know we're supposed to eat more whole grains. We know they're "good" for us (full of fiber, phytochemicals, and vitamins and minerals)."
"Frankly, we are only just realizing the nutritional fallout from almost eliminating whole grains from our diet over the past hundred years."
"After analyzing data from more than 15,000 people aged 45-65, researchers from the University of Minnesota School of Public Health found that as whole-grain intake went up, total mortality (the rate of death from all causes) went down"
"One study found that women who ate three or more servings of whole-grain foods a day had significantly lower body mass indexes (BMIs) than those eating less than one serving a day. (This was found in men, too, but the link was more significant in women.)"

***there is a lot more on there but I guess if you really wanted to know you could just read the articles.

Like I said, better for you. I understand what you are saying, and what the studies are saying, but it doesn’t seem that you understand the base line here. When they say whole grains are good for you, good for you compared to what? The base line is a standard American diet, which is loaded with processed grains, sugars and other junk.

I really like this line, “decreased mortality from all causes” well it seems that eating whole grains will protect you from getting shot in a drive by. LOL This is the same, and may I add, lame, line of reasoning used by vegetarians. As a group veggies are healthier than the average American, the average American eats meat, therefore eating meat is unhealthy, or eating only veggies is more healthy than eating meat. Wrong, Wrong, Wrong. There is a lot that goes along with it, like it takes a huge commitment to be a vegetarian, people that are able to make that commitment are also more likely to lead a “healthier” life all around, more exercise, don’t smoke, don’t do a lot of things that contribute to health related mortality. Same thing with whole grains, I would hazard a guess that most people that eat whole grains are more health conscious, therefore they are more healthy. But again what is your base line, more healthy than who? It is my contention that grains are more harmful to most people than they are beneficial, and that even if they are not harmful, they don’t even come close to being the best option, for anything you can name, other than maybe taste, for people that are addicted to grains. Fiber is better obtained through veggies, protein through meat, vitamins and minerals through meat, veggies and fruits, carbs through veggies and fruits, all are much, much better options than grains.

http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/EvolutionPaleolithic/Cereal Sword.pdf

http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/the-whole-truth-about-whole-grains

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/whole-grains/NU00204

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/health-gains-from-whole-grains/

All of your links compare whole grains to refined grains, NONE compare grain based diets with diets based on no grains. So pretty much your post is a strawman that has no bearing with the subject at hand. I AGREE whole grains are better than refined grains. You win. LOL

My post wasn't intended to compare whole grains vs. no grains not was I trying to "win" anything. I believe that you can follow the Paleo diet and be healthy and I've never said otherwise. I just object to the spreading of false information, such as whole grains are bad for you (you not meaning any one person in particular, just "you" as a general term). They are not and the posts support my argument. I kind of like the strawman reference though (straw, grain, funny).

Actually the links support that whole grains are "better" for you, not good for you.

No, they support that they are good for you.

From the Harvard link:

"By keeping the stool soft and bulky, the fiber in whole grains helps prevent constipation, a common, costly, and aggravating problem. It also helps prevent diverticular disease (the development of tiny pouches inside the colon that are easily irritated and inflamed) by decreasing pressure in the intestines."

"An intriguing report from the Iowa Women's Health Study linked whole-grain consumption with fewer deaths from noncardiac, noncancer causes. Compared with women who rarely or never ate whole-grain foods, those who had at least two or more servings a day were 30 percent less likely to have died from an inflammation-related condition over a 17-year period "

"In a study of more than 160,000 women whose health and dietary habits were followed for up to 18 years, those who averaged 2 to 3 servings of whole grains a day were 30 percent less likely to have developed type 2 diabetes than those who rarely ate whole grains"

From mayo clinic:
"Hailed as the "staff of life" for their historical importance to human survival, grains are an essential part of a healthy diet."

From webmd:
"We all know we're supposed to eat more whole grains. We know they're "good" for us (full of fiber, phytochemicals, and vitamins and minerals)."
"Frankly, we are only just realizing the nutritional fallout from almost eliminating whole grains from our diet over the past hundred years."
"After analyzing data from more than 15,000 people aged 45-65, researchers from the University of Minnesota School of Public Health found that as whole-grain intake went up, total mortality (the rate of death from all causes) went down"
"One study found that women who ate three or more servings of whole-grain foods a day had significantly lower body mass indexes (BMIs) than those eating less than one serving a day. (This was found in men, too, but the link was more significant in women.)"

***there is a lot more on there but I guess if you really wanted to know you could just read the articles.

Like I said, better for you. I understand what you are saying, and what the studies are saying, but it doesn’t seem that you understand the base line here. When they say whole grains are good for you, good for you compared to what? The base line is a standard American diet, which is loaded with processed grains, sugars and other junk.

I really like this line, “decreased mortality from all causes” well it seems that eating whole grains will protect you from getting shot in a drive by. LOL This is the same, and may I add, lame, line of reasoning used by vegetarians. As a group veggies are healthier than the average American, the average American eats meat, therefore eating meat is unhealthy, or eating only veggies is more healthy than eating meat. Wrong, Wrong, Wrong. There is a lot that goes along with it, like it takes a huge commitment to be a vegetarian, people that are able to make that commitment are also more likely to lead a “healthier” life all around, more exercise, don’t smoke, don’t do a lot of things that contribute to health related mortality. Same thing with whole grains, I would hazard a guess that most people that eat whole grains are more health conscious, therefore they are more healthy. But again what is your base line, more healthy than who? It is my contention that grains are more harmful to most people than they are beneficial, and that even if they are not harmful, they don’t even come close to being the best option, for anything you can name, other than maybe taste, for people that are addicted to grains. Fiber is better obtained through veggies, protein through meat, vitamins and minerals through meat, veggies and fruits, carbs through veggies and fruits, all are much, much better options than grains.

And regarding fiber: There has never been one study or any investigations done that more fiber is better for you. It was just "thrown out there" along with all the other crap that we were told is good for us and it was taken in as part of the conventional wisdom the we listen to today.

It depends on what you mean by "more". There are plenty of studies that show that fiber is good for you, so in the sense that "more than none" is good for, there certainly are. If you mean "more than X amount" it would depend entirely on the value of X.

You can actually drink wine on the diet

Yes, but only on occasion. Alcohol really messes with the fat burning process.

But it tastes so good and makes me feel warm and happy. I drink wine just about every night and I've been losing steadily with my whole grains and beans. That said, I do not have any other health problems such as diabetes or insulin resistance because I've avoided simple carbs for about 10 years now.

Can anyone say oxymoron

I have been toying with the idea of starting to try a paleo -ish lifestyle. I do crossfit (and totally love it) and a lot of people that crossfit eat paleo. To be honest, every time I see one of these threads talking about paleo it's the paleo people that turn me off. I agree with the one poster who said paleo people tend to bash everything else. I can see that it's not for everyone and everyone has different motivations/reasons for eating the way they do, but why do so many of these "paleo" eaters come off so elitist? You know you really put a bad taste out there for those that are considering doing paleo.

Personally, I'm most concerned about giving up so many things at once. I can do no grains, that's fine, but beans and dairy too, that's going to be rough. I try to eat clean most of the time (this past weekend, and the left overs this week have been an exception) so it won't be that much of a change, like I said, just restricting so many items at once will take some effort. I'd be open to some support from those of you that are paleo but I don't need anyone telling me this is best and everything else sucks. I don't believe in that, there's a plan for everyone and they don't have to all be the same. Just because one person is a vegatarian doesn't make them the devil, and by the same means, just becuase you're paleo doens't make you god. So any open minded paleo people that want to help me out, I'd be open to that!

I would be interested in examples. If you have followed the “paleo” threads you have seen me, I post on most of them when I see one. In all the threads I have seen about Paleo, I have never seen a “Paleo” person start the attacks, it has ALWAYS been in defense against the lies and misinformation and attacks by the, everything in moderation,,,,,,,,,, (I’ll be nice) people. I admit I have a bias and maybe I don’t see the elitist attitudes. Take this thread for example, the very first response was to question it as a “fad”, and fad carries the connotation that you must be easily duped to fall for that “fad”, in other words you are an idiot for falling for a fad, while I am so much smarter because I do everything in moderation.

And then we have the folks that will pick one thing out of the diet and assume that everyone is eating only that one thing and eating it until they can’t stand and say “See this diet sucks compared to my moderation diet”. Really? This is a back handed attack, this is elitist. We also have those that accuse us of being hypocrites if we dare to eat one thing that is not “on” the diet, and again hold up the everything in moderation moniker, well after all if you do “everything” in moderation then you can’t possibly go off your diet, or can you. Any of these “superior” human beings ever go over their moderation?

Seriously, you're going to try to attack me on this for my opinion. This is exactly what I'm talking about, and here I'm trying to make an effort and eat paleo, way to go. You people are adults get over yourselves. I'll find "support" somewhere else.

Can anyone say oxymoron