High vs. Low carbs
Replies
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CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »ok what i want to know is why someone who is saying carbs are the answer yet says that people should eat grains,veggies and fruits and then their diary contains little to no fruits and veggies on most days and most of it is processed carbs and cereal? sorry but I dont think that you should tell people to eat the "healthier" carbs and to avoid the junk food(processed carbs" yet you are doing just that. dont preach to the choir unless you have your sermon in check.
Explain why I eat unprocessed carbs and still weigh 153 lbs then. Carbs are carbs.
you dont eat many unprocessed carbs I see a lot of cereal,gummies, cookies,etc on your diary,yet you are saying those things will cause my high cholesterol and so on. I dont hardly eat those things like I said. I never said carbs werent carbs. you are the one who says that those things cause health issues and proceeded to promote fruits,veggies and grains yet your diary shows you dont eat much when it comes to fruits and veggies. more grains and processed food than anything. what I am saying is,dont promote one way of eating if you arent going to do it yourself. dont tell people to avoid thing because they will cause health issues yet you do it. as for your weight. you are obviously eating at maintenance and its not going to matter what you eat. if you havent gained or lost then you are in maintenance. its that easy to figure out.
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Anyhow, to the OP:
High carb versus low carb, in the vast majority of cases is totally irrelevant, unless you have medical issues or are a serious athlete. Eat whatever level of carbs you prefer, as long as you stick to your calorie goal it won't matter.
Some days I eat few carbs. Others I eat primarily carbs. Neither really has any impact, energy is energy. As long as I'm burning more calories than I eat, my body has no choice but to make up the deficit by burning body fat.0 -
and by burning muscle0
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and by burning muscle
True, all weight loss comes, to a limited extent, from muscle tissue as well.
However, since I do progressive strength training, eat higher amounts of protein, and lose weight at no more than 1% body weight/week, I can dramatically reduce the loss of lean tissue.0 -
@_Terrapin_
Are you for real? Do you really not know that your body can burn muscle tissue as fuel?
And yes, I agree you can minimize that by combating it with strength training simultaneously in order to sustain muscle mass. (Or you can adopt Keto... oh wait, I won't go there again...)
[edited by mfp mod]0 -
Yes there are low carb atheletes! Do they WIN? No. Kenyans are some of the fastest people on earth and tell me what they eat. Grains, sugar, and corn. All carbs.
Very few people are among "the fastest people on earth." There are many factors - maybe or maybe not including diet - that contribute to that. It is incredulous that you are supporting your assertion that LC diets make people lethargic by claiming there are no world famous winning athletes who eat a low carb diet.
Applying that logic, if we're not all Nobel prize winners we are just morons.
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Please continue high carb, why eat fat to lose fat? It's absurd. Keep sticking to your carb load because you'll need the energy throughout the day no matter what you're doing to get it done.
This is a great example of being severely misinformed about how fat acts in regards to nutrition. You ABSOLUTELY have to eat fat to lose fat. Fat that you eat doesn't turn into body fat.... Carbs do! There are thousands of studies and evidence to prove this. Processed carbs spike glucose levels, and then what is not used (most of it) is immediately stored as fat. Why do you think you love carbs so much? Because it's actually a sugar addiction. This is why we all are struggling...
It's not your fault though. The media and government is constantly giving you terrible advice and trying to trick us into eating more grains and sugar for their own gains. You're an example of a success of theirs.
https://www.ketovangelist.com/category/ketogenic_studies/
Also you don't understand how cholesterol works either. Cholesterol issues happen when you eat constant processed carbs (bread, pasta, etc) in conjunction with high fat. It's not the fatty meats that are the problem, it's the breads. These create a constant state of inflammation in your body with wreaks havoc on your health.
I eat super fatty cuts of meat every day and I have great cholesterol levels. What I don't eat, is processed carbs or sugar.
I am sorry but that is dead wrong. The only way that carbs get stored as fat is if one is in a calorie surplus. I get 50% of my calories from carbs, and I have had zero issues losing and maintaining my weight. Excess calories make people fat, period. Please link us to studies showing that carbs get stored as fat in a calorie deficit.
For the record, protein spikes your insulin levels as much as carbs, but I don't see anyone running around saying that protein gets stored as fat.
And there are no human clinical studies showing that sugar is an addictive substance.
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@OMP33
We don't have to keep arguing. If you're happy with your lifestyle that is great. However, as others have said, do some research before you start spreading advice that can actually kill them.
This is a fun movie to watch, and it's funny yet informative. It's a good place to start.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/196879
You're the one spreading misinformation! Go watch Forks over Knives! A whole food-plant based diet is the healthiest one to live! If you really think eating butter and saturated fat foods is GOOD for you, then you really need a reality check. Open your diary and let's see what you're eating. Here's some links for you..
Meat Hormones & Female Infertility
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/meat-hormones-female-infertility/
Why is Meat a Risk Factor for Diabetes?
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/why-is-meat-a-risk-factor-for-diabetes/
Meat and Weight Gain in the PANACEA Study
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/meat-and-weight-gain-in-the-panacea-study/
What are the Healthiest Foods?
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/what-are-the-healthiest-foods/
Forks over Knives..... lol http://anthonycolpo.com/forks-over-knives-the-latest-vegan-nonsense-dissected-debunked-and-destroyed/0 -
@_Terrapin_
Are you for real? Do you really not know that your body can burn muscle tissue as fuel?
And yes, I agree you can minimize that by combating it with strength training simultaneously in order to sustain muscle mass. (Or you can adopt Keto... oh wait, I won't go there again...)
who in this thread said that you don't burn muscle as fuel???????0 -
If you are working out, I think the extra carbs are a good idea..0
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Carbs jack up Cholesterol? Do you associate carbs with chips, ice cream, cookies, and just food? Those are all high fat foods! When I'm talking about carbs, I mean grains, vegetables, fruits, legumes, and starches! All those foods have close to 0 cholesterol, many have none. Meat on the other hand and other fatty foods, are wayyyy high in Chol.
The most recent research calls into question the assumption that dietary cholesterol is directly related to serum cholesterol. Since you suggest you are repeatedly posting "facts" here to protect the OP, you should do some research to ensure your "facts" are correct.
As to the relation between carbs and cholesterol, there is growing evidence that low carb increases good cholesterol and decreases bad cholesterol.:
"Low-carbohydrate weight loss diets have an edge over low-fat diets for improving HDL cholesterol levels long term, according to a study funded by the National Institutes of Health.
Dieters who followed low-carb or low-fat plans for two years along with a lifestyle modification program lost the same amount of weight -- on average about 7% of their body weight or 15 pounds.
But throughout the two-year study, low-carbohydrate dieters had significantly increased HDL, or "good," cholesterol levels compared to low-fat dieters." http://www.webmd.com/cholesterol-management/news/20100802/low-carb-diets-improve-cholesterol-long-term
"The low-carb diet was most beneficial for lowering triglycerides, the main fat-carrying particle in the bloodstream, and also delivered the biggest boost in protective HDL cholesterol.
. . .
Research shows that a moderately low-carbohydrate diet can help the heart, as long as protein and fat selections come from healthy sources."
http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/carbohydrates/low-carbohydrate-diets/
here is where I take issue with the WebMD article. They took 300 obese people so of course they are going to have improved health markers when they lose weight. Also, why did they not control the calorie intake in both groups? The low carb group did not have a set calorie number and the other group was just told to eat between 1200 to 1800 a day…
Any WOE that promotes hitting micro nutrients, macros, and hitting calorie targets to lose weight is going to result in better health markers. Low Carb is not anymore healthier than any other WOE.0 -
And yes, I agree you can minimize that by combating it with strength training simultaneously in order to sustain muscle mass. (Or you can adopt Keto... oh wait, I won't go there again...)
Keto doesn't help at all in terms of maintaining muscle mass vs. not being in keto, except in that keto diets tend to be higher in protein, and protein does promote muscle conservation.
But at a diet controlled for protein, how much carbs vs. fat you have won't make a real difference. Higher carb would actually be slightly better (insulin levels are higher, and insulin promotes muscle growth/maintenance) but the difference would be small. Protein is the major dietary factor.0 -
@_Terrapin_
Are you for real? Do you really not know that your body can burn muscle tissue as fuel? I can't even fathom continuing any sort of conversation with you at this point.
And yes, I agree you can minimize that by combating it with strength training simultaneously in order to sustain muscle mass. (Or you can adopt Keto... oh wait, I won't go there again...)
So your context is? I'm asking if you understand what it takes to actually burn muscle? Have few calories would you need to consume without resistance training to bun muscle? Again, I was asking what context your were referencing. If I run, bike, lift, swim, and eat about 2800 calories I can slowly lose weight. Most of it is fat, but I was curious where your context was? At what stage am I burning muscle given the four types of exercise above?
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I see the poor OP hasn't returned.
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nutmegoreo wrote: »I see the poor OP hasn't returned.
Dat gum it you're right. Okay so a question......wait.
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_Terrapin_ wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »I see the poor OP hasn't returned.
Dat gum it you're right. Okay so a question......wait.
Doh, how do you keep a turkey in suspense?
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nutmegoreo wrote: »_Terrapin_ wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »I see the poor OP hasn't returned.
Dat gum it you're right. Okay so a question......wait.
Doh, how do you keep a turkey in suspense?
Oops. So, caging lately?
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_Terrapin_ wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »_Terrapin_ wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »I see the poor OP hasn't returned.
Dat gum it you're right. Okay so a question......wait.
Doh, how do you keep a turkey in suspense?
Oops. So, caging lately?
I've been bad :devil:0 -
I switched my food choices to whole foods, grain and plant base two weeks ago so it's high carb low fat. I have lost 2 lbs since the switch. I am sleeping way better and have so much more energy. My carbs usually stay around 2000
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Carbs jack up Cholesterol? Do you associate carbs with chips, ice cream, cookies, and just food? Those are all high fat foods! When I'm talking about carbs, I mean grains, vegetables, fruits, legumes, and starches! All those foods have close to 0 cholesterol, many have none. Meat on the other hand and other fatty foods, are wayyyy high in Chol.
The most recent research calls into question the assumption that dietary cholesterol is directly related to serum cholesterol. Since you suggest you are repeatedly posting "facts" here to protect the OP, you should do some research to ensure your "facts" are correct.
As to the relation between carbs and cholesterol, there is growing evidence that low carb increases good cholesterol and decreases bad cholesterol.:
"Low-carbohydrate weight loss diets have an edge over low-fat diets for improving HDL cholesterol levels long term, according to a study funded by the National Institutes of Health.
Dieters who followed low-carb or low-fat plans for two years along with a lifestyle modification program lost the same amount of weight -- on average about 7% of their body weight or 15 pounds.
But throughout the two-year study, low-carbohydrate dieters had significantly increased HDL, or "good," cholesterol levels compared to low-fat dieters." http://www.webmd.com/cholesterol-management/news/20100802/low-carb-diets-improve-cholesterol-long-term
"The low-carb diet was most beneficial for lowering triglycerides, the main fat-carrying particle in the bloodstream, and also delivered the biggest boost in protective HDL cholesterol.
. . .
Research shows that a moderately low-carbohydrate diet can help the heart, as long as protein and fat selections come from healthy sources."
http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/carbohydrates/low-carbohydrate-diets/
here is where I take issue with the WebMD article. They took 300 obese people so of course they are going to have improved health markers when they lose weight. Also, why did they not control the calorie intake in both groups? The low carb group did not have a set calorie number and the other group was just told to eat between 1200 to 1800 a day…
Any WOE that promotes hitting micro nutrients, macros, and hitting calorie targets to lose weight is going to result in better health markers. Low Carb is not anymore healthier than any other WOE.
just want to add my experience, I had high cholesterol when I was thin and before I gained the weight. they put me on the low cholesterol diet(no fried foods,no red meats,no bad fats,no sauces or cream based things) and told me to go low fat. didnt work. stopped that diet 6 months or so later when my next test came back worse than it was before hand. before I came here(to mfp) my cholesterol was still high. of course i gained weight so that didnt help. when I started losing the weight it went down a little but I was on meds for it too so that could have helped. last year again it improved a little but was still awfully high,I started eating better too. so I decided to try lower carb(not low carb) I was taking in 150g a day. went back to the dr 6 months later and all my levels went down more than half of what they were. then I got back eating normal carbs that MFP set for me(225 or so) and I went back a few months ago and my cholesterol is back up again,not to where it was but still over most normal ranges. so Im trying to cut back on carbs again but for me its hard to do but Im trying.I can take or leave cookies,donuts,cake,chips,etc and only have those things like once a month and I only have a portion.(so say one small cupcake no icing). so for me high carbs even the healthy kind causes my cholesterol to raise. I even made sure I cut out most of any processed food I did eat for a few months and it made no difference.0 -
Thanks for a well written reply. Too many random absolute rules in this thread. I eat 600 cals of fat a day with a total intake of 1700. I am the healthiest and lowest weight I've been in 30 years, my blood levels are normal. I used to follow the low fat highway. I have many seen many other benefits besides weight loss. What I do is extreme, but it works for me - each person is different - there is no magic one fits all system.Please continue high carb, why eat fat to lose fat? It's absurd. Keep sticking to your carb load because you'll need the energy throughout the day no matter what you're doing to get it done.
This is a great example of being severely misinformed about how fat acts in regards to nutrition. You ABSOLUTELY have to eat fat to lose fat. Fat that you eat doesn't turn into body fat.... Carbs do! There are thousands of studies and evidence to prove this. Processed carbs spike glucose levels, and then what is not used (most of it) is immediately stored as fat. Why do you think you love carbs so much? Because it's actually a sugar addiction. This is why we all are struggling...
It's not your fault though. The media and government is constantly giving you terrible advice and trying to trick us into eating more grains and sugar for their own gains. You're an example of a success of theirs.
https://www.ketovangelist.com/category/ketogenic_studies/
Also you don't understand how cholesterol works either. Cholesterol issues happen when you eat constant processed carbs (bread, pasta, etc) in conjunction with high fat. It's not the fatty meats that are the problem, it's the breads. These create a constant state of inflammation in your body with wreaks havoc on your health.
I eat super fatty cuts of meat every day and I have great cholesterol levels. What I don't eat, is processed carbs or sugar.
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Please continue high carb, why eat fat to lose fat? It's absurd. Keep sticking to your carb load because you'll need the energy throughout the day no matter what you're doing to get it done.
This is a great example of being severely misinformed about how fat acts in regards to nutrition. You ABSOLUTELY have to eat fat to lose fat. Fat that you eat doesn't turn into body fat.... Carbs do! There are thousands of studies and evidence to prove this. Processed carbs spike glucose levels, and then what is not used (most of it) is immediately stored as fat. Why do you think you love carbs so much? Because it's actually a sugar addiction. This is why we all are struggling...
It's not your fault though. The media and government is constantly giving you terrible advice and trying to trick us into eating more grains and sugar for their own gains. You're an example of a success of theirs.
https://www.ketovangelist.com/category/ketogenic_studies/
Also you don't understand how cholesterol works either. Cholesterol issues happen when you eat constant processed carbs (bread, pasta, etc) in conjunction with high fat. It's not the fatty meats that are the problem, it's the breads. These create a constant state of inflammation in your body with wreaks havoc on your health.
I eat super fatty cuts of meat every day and I have great cholesterol levels. What I don't eat, is processed carbs or sugar.
I am sorry but that is dead wrong. The only way that carbs get stored as fat is if one is in a calorie surplus. I get 50% of my calories from carbs, and I have had zero issues losing and maintaining my weight. Excess calories make people fat, period. Please link us to studies showing that carbs get stored as fat in a calorie deficit.
For the record, protein spikes your insulin levels as much as carbs, but I don't see anyone running around saying that protein gets stored as fat.
And there are no human clinical studies showing that sugar is an addictive substance.
Generally the rise in insulin from protein is less than that from carbohydrates. Less insulin us required for protein than carbs.
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CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »Please continue high carb, why eat fat to lose fat? It's absurd. Keep sticking to your carb load because you'll need the energy throughout the day no matter what you're doing to get it done.
Because it works for some people for a variety of reasons - control of blood sugar, reduction of carb-induced cravings, satiation caused by fat.
It is a calorie deficit that causes you to lose fat. Your body doesn't care where the calories come from.
My diet has been between 60 & 70% fat for the last 4 months. I've lost 36 lbs - while achieving my primary goal of keeping my blood sugar is in the normal range - a goal that your advice to up the carbs would wreak havoc on.
Exercise works for some people (and is certainly good for everyone), but it is not necessary for weight loss.
Others have already commented on the absurdity of suggesting specific calorie amounts the OP should reach.
I'm just trying to look out for the OP and make sure they are eating enough. I'm all about consistency and sustainability when it comes to diets. Low carb diets are not successful in the long run, people only use them to lose weight.
no, low carb is not for weight loss,you do lose a lot of water weight at first from it,but it helps many people with health issues, those with pcos,insulin resistance,glucose issues,etc can benefit from a low carb diet. it can be sustainable in the long run. there are people here who have done it for years. some people cannot have high amounts of carbs.
Higher fat is more insulin resistant than fruits and vegetables. Its hard to be sustainable in the long term with a HF diet.
What?
Wtf does this even mean???0 -
@OMP33
We don't have to keep arguing. If you're happy with your lifestyle that is great. However, as others have said, do some research before you start spreading advice that can actually kill them.
This is a fun movie to watch, and it's funny yet informative. It's a good place to start.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/196879
You're the one spreading misinformation! Go watch Forks over Knives! A whole food-plant based diet is the healthiest one to live! If you really think eating butter and saturated fat foods is GOOD for you, then you really need a reality check. Open your diary and let's see what you're eating. Here's some links for you..
Meat Hormones & Female Infertility
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/meat-hormones-female-infertility/
Why is Meat a Risk Factor for Diabetes?
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/why-is-meat-a-risk-factor-for-diabetes/
Meat and Weight Gain in the PANACEA Study
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/meat-and-weight-gain-in-the-panacea-study/
What are the Healthiest Foods?
http://nutritionfacts.org/video/what-are-the-healthiest-foods/
*scratches head*
So a biased propaganda film is your main source? You took everything that Forks over Knives said as gospel?0 -
Carbs jack up Cholesterol? Do you associate carbs with chips, ice cream, cookies, and just food? Those are all high fat foods! When I'm talking about carbs, I mean grains, vegetables, fruits, legumes, and starches! All those foods have close to 0 cholesterol, many have none. Meat on the other hand and other fatty foods, are wayyyy high in Chol.
The most recent research calls into question the assumption that dietary cholesterol is directly related to serum cholesterol. Since you suggest you are repeatedly posting "facts" here to protect the OP, you should do some research to ensure your "facts" are correct.
As to the relation between carbs and cholesterol, there is growing evidence that low carb increases good cholesterol and decreases bad cholesterol.:
"Low-carbohydrate weight loss diets have an edge over low-fat diets for improving HDL cholesterol levels long term, according to a study funded by the National Institutes of Health.
Dieters who followed low-carb or low-fat plans for two years along with a lifestyle modification program lost the same amount of weight -- on average about 7% of their body weight or 15 pounds.
But throughout the two-year study, low-carbohydrate dieters had significantly increased HDL, or "good," cholesterol levels compared to low-fat dieters." http://www.webmd.com/cholesterol-management/news/20100802/low-carb-diets-improve-cholesterol-long-term
"The low-carb diet was most beneficial for lowering triglycerides, the main fat-carrying particle in the bloodstream, and also delivered the biggest boost in protective HDL cholesterol.
. . .
Research shows that a moderately low-carbohydrate diet can help the heart, as long as protein and fat selections come from healthy sources."
http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/carbohydrates/low-carbohydrate-diets/
here is where I take issue with the WebMD article. They took 300 obese people so of course they are going to have improved health markers when they lose weight. Also, why did they not control the calorie intake in both groups? The low carb group did not have a set calorie number and the other group was just told to eat between 1200 to 1800 a day…
Any WOE that promotes hitting micro nutrients, macros, and hitting calorie targets to lose weight is going to result in better health markers. Low Carb is not anymore healthier than any other WOE.
Please point out anyplace - not just in this thread, but anywhere - that I said that low carb was healthier than any other WOE.
I was countering a specific challenge by an individual who asserted that a high carb diet couldn't possibly be connected to high cholesterol by linking to two independent articles, both of which acknowledged that lower carb diets appear to be associated with reduced cardiovascular risk (as compared to both lower calorie and higher carb diets).
As to your specific criticism, many advocates promote low carb/keto as weight loss without the need to count calories - and that is the experience of many who eat that way. It makes sense to test the diet the way it is advocated. Over a period of 2 years, each group lost identical amounts. That fact, alone, supports the contention that LC creates a natural calorie deficit - without the need to count. And if they ended up with equivalent calorie deficits (as measured by the equivalent weight loss), the lack of a specific restriction on calories could not - as actually implemented with respect to calories - have impacted the results. If your concern is that the calorie group was not given additional restrictions, you should re-read the study. The calorie restricted group was also restricted as to fat content.
And if you still don't like the WebMD study, the Harvard paper includes a number of other underlying studies that reached the same conclusion - replacing some carbs with fat or protein did a better job of reducing cardiovascular risk.
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CamilleRose237 wrote: »Since I started eating clean and watching macros (I don't count every meal), I have limited the carbs I eat in terms of pastas, whit breads, etc. I weight train every day and do cardio. However I've seen little change in my body fat on my stomach. Recently I've been eating a "carb load" in the morning with my usual breakfast and limiting them for the rest of the day and am seeing slight improvement. Any advice on eating higher or lower carbs to cut body fat?
OP for losing weight it is all about Calories in vs Calories out.
So how big is your deficit you keep or stick to.
high or low carb your choice
My advice is eat now how you later want to maintain your weight. So in moderation. And a balanced diet is nice but not needed. All up to you
I eat high carb, because i like it. But i eat my fat too, and sugar and the rest
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CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »ok what i want to know is why someone who is saying carbs are the answer yet says that people should eat grains,veggies and fruits and then their diary contains little to no fruits and veggies on most days and most of it is processed carbs and cereal? sorry but I dont think that you should tell people to eat the "healthier" carbs and to avoid the junk food(processed carbs" yet you are doing just that. dont preach to the choir unless you have your sermon in check.
Explain why I eat unprocessed carbs and still weigh 153 lbs then. Carbs are carbs.
Because you don't eat tan excess of them.
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