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Fat Acceptance Movement
Replies
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Of course I accept people why wouldn't I accept another human being?
The question is does that person accept him/herself. That's where the issue is. And I think they can start to help themselves if they get what all of us want in life, love and acceptance.0 -
Looks like MFP didn't post what I wrote... weird
What you want to be is body+ ie loving your body even if you want to change parts about it. HAES is a dangerous and fanatical organization where they say doctors are liars conspiring against them and that morbid obesity does not have any negative health effects.7 -
DisruptedMatrix wrote: »Looks like MFP didn't post what I wrote... weird
What you want to be is body+ ie loving your body even if you want to change parts about it. HAES is a dangerous and fanatical organization where they say doctors are liars conspiring against them and that morbid obesity does not have any negative health effects.
I don't know anything about them but some would say the same about a bunch of organizations. People are smart they either will eventually figure stuff out or not, their choice.
I think individuals are still deserving of my acceptance, though maybe not organizations as a whole.1 -
If anyone here is laboring under the illusion that HAES still stands for healthy behaviors at any size, they have since dropped any pretense towards encouraging their followers to do that. I cannot find the link right now, but it was posted on Reddit.
They backed away from it after pressure saying that the rhetoric was "healthist" and "ableist".
The fat acceptance movement, when you scratch the surface and look at its leaders and what they do has gone beyond merely wanting people not to be fat shamed. Some of them actively hate thin people. They actively discourage weight loss. They use old science and twist science to back their agenda and actively seek out and recruit young, vulnerable people to join their numbers.
I find them to be loathsome and beneath contempt. The best of them are misguided. The worst of them are hateful charlatans out to make a buck.
I cannot abide fat shaming, but the fat acceptance movement isn't about that any more.
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DisruptedMatrix wrote: »Looks like MFP didn't post what I wrote... weird
What you want to be is body+ ie loving your body even if you want to change parts about it. HAES is a dangerous and fanatical organization where they say doctors are liars conspiring against them and that morbid obesity does not have any negative health effects.
I don't know anything about them but some would say the same about a bunch of organizations. People are smart they either will eventually figure stuff out or not, their choice.
I think individuals are still deserving of my acceptance, though maybe not organizations as a whole.
That's why I'm body+
some people say hate for their body fuels their weightloss. I dislike how I currently look, but I would not succeed if I were not focusing on positivety. I cannot stand people who turn there nose up at the obese. Everyone deserves acceptance. You don't know what happened in that persons life that led them to where they are, not everyone can lose weight due to medications and hormonal imbalances and health issues. It is also so much harder for abese people to get healthy. The willpower it takes for a fit person to continue their workout is different from the willpower it takes for a morbidly obese person. People seem surprised by how many calories I burn on a walk- It's because I am carrying around an extra 100lbs you don't have to deal with. Remember what it was like being pregnant? Imagine being pregnant all the time. On top of that you have to be in the right mindset to stick to it. Maybe this year isn't the year they would be able to suceed because they are too insecure... but... next year they will tell the people they've been trying to please that they will live their life for themselves, and this change will be what starts them on their journey (that was what happened with me. I tried twice before but I wasn't in the proper mindset)
For me, I used to be 98lbs. Then my mom started starving me, I saw a guy's eye get gouged out with a wine glass, and I was abused for years. Surprise! I developed negative coping habits involving food.5 -
DisruptedMatrix wrote: »DisruptedMatrix wrote: »Looks like MFP didn't post what I wrote... weird
What you want to be is body+ ie loving your body even if you want to change parts about it. HAES is a dangerous and fanatical organization where they say doctors are liars conspiring against them and that morbid obesity does not have any negative health effects.
I don't know anything about them but some would say the same about a bunch of organizations. People are smart they either will eventually figure stuff out or not, their choice.
I think individuals are still deserving of my acceptance, though maybe not organizations as a whole.
That's why I'm body+
some people say hate for their body fuels their weightloss. I dislike how I currently look, but I would not succeed if I were not focusing on positivety. I cannot stand people who turn there nose up at the obese. Everyone deserves acceptance. You don't know what happened in that persons life that led them to where they are, not everyone can lose weight due to medications and hormonal imbalances and health issues. It is also so much harder for abese people to get healthy. The willpower it takes for a fit person to continue their workout is different from the willpower it takes for a morbidly obese person. People seem surprised by how many calories I burn on a walk- It's because I am carrying around an extra 100lbs you don't have to deal with. Remember what it was like being pregnant? Imagine being pregnant all the time.
For me, I used to be 98lbs. Then my mom started starving me, I saw a guy's eye get gouged out with a wine glass, and I was abused for years. Surprise! I developed negative coping habits involving food.
Yikes I'm sorry you had to see that at any age!
Totally agree positivity toward ourselves and others is always the right choice for me anyway, although it can be hard sometimes.1 -
The fat acceptance movement has coopted the language of body positivity for its own ends, though.
Body positivity was originally aimed at people with scars, acne, disfigurements and the like. Even just liking inheriting dad's nose.
It was never meant to be about accepting a medically dangerous condition because you decided to say you like your body instead of doing something about it.
In likewise fashion, fat acceptance has coopted the language of racism, homophobia, and feminism. They have tried to assert that fatness is an issue with ties to all of these.
They want people to believe that fatness is immutable.
There is nothing wrong with loving yourself. I think loving yourself enough to care is vital to making the change necessary to lose weight.
I don't think fatness is immutable like race, sexual orientation, or having an amputated leg.4 -
Where did my post go? Did it get deleted? This is like the 5th time that I've left a thread and when I come back my post is gone.0
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »The fat acceptance movement has coopted the language of body positivity for its own ends, though.
Body positivity was originally aimed at people with scars, acne, disfigurements and the like. Even just liking inheriting dad's nose.
It was never meant to be about accepting a medically dangerous condition because you decided to say you like your body instead of doing something about it.
In likewise fashion, fat acceptance has coopted the language of racism, homophobia, and feminism. They have tried to assert that fatness is an issue with ties to all of these.
They want people to believe that fatness is immutable.
There is nothing wrong with loving yourself. I think loving yourself enough to care is vital to making the change necessary to lose weight.
I don't think fatness is immutable like race, sexual orientation, or having an amputated leg.
NO. Body+ included body type. Love yourself at 200lbs. Love yourself at 150. Even if you aren't your ideal, love yourself.0 -
DisruptedMatrix wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »The fat acceptance movement has coopted the language of body positivity for its own ends, though.
Body positivity was originally aimed at people with scars, acne, disfigurements and the like. Even just liking inheriting dad's nose.
It was never meant to be about accepting a medically dangerous condition because you decided to say you like your body instead of doing something about it.
In likewise fashion, fat acceptance has coopted the language of racism, homophobia, and feminism. They have tried to assert that fatness is an issue with ties to all of these.
They want people to believe that fatness is immutable.
There is nothing wrong with loving yourself. I think loving yourself enough to care is vital to making the change necessary to lose weight.
I don't think fatness is immutable like race, sexual orientation, or having an amputated leg.
NO. Body+ included body type. Love yourself at 200lbs. Love yourself at 150. Even if you aren't your ideal, love yourself.
Not way, way back when it first started with roots in feminist thought. It wasn't actually named yet. I'm not saying you can't love yourself.
There's a difference between loving who you are on the inside, and just accepting what you are on the oustide as unchangeable.
Body positivity was about accepting and loving that which you could not change.5 -
I've always been curious about what goes through peoples mind when they become 50-100-150-200lbs over weight. Dont they start to get worried, dont they care?
Once i hit a 30lb gain, the thing that spurred me on was the more i gain the longer it's going to take to lose, and the harder it'll be to get started.3 -
Agree to disagree?GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »DisruptedMatrix wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »The fat acceptance movement has coopted the language of body positivity for its own ends, though.
Body positivity was originally aimed at people with scars, acne, disfigurements and the like. Even just liking inheriting dad's nose.
It was never meant to be about accepting a medically dangerous condition because you decided to say you like your body instead of doing something about it.
In likewise fashion, fat acceptance has coopted the language of racism, homophobia, and feminism. They have tried to assert that fatness is an issue with ties to all of these.
They want people to believe that fatness is immutable.
There is nothing wrong with loving yourself. I think loving yourself enough to care is vital to making the change necessary to lose weight.
I don't think fatness is immutable like race, sexual orientation, or having an amputated leg.
NO. Body+ included body type. Love yourself at 200lbs. Love yourself at 150. Even if you aren't your ideal, love yourself.
Not way, way back when it first started with roots in feminist thought. It wasn't actually named yet. I'm not saying you can't love yourself.
There's a difference between loving who you are on the inside, and just accepting what you are on the oustide as unchangeable.
Body positivity was about accepting and loving that which you could not change.
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Christine_72 wrote: »I've always been curious about what goes through peoples mind when they become 50-100-150-200lbs over weight. Dont they start to get worried, dont they care?
Once i hit a 30lb gain, the thing that spurred me on was the more i gain the longer it's going to take to lose, and the harder it'll be to get started.
I can't tell you for other people but here's what went through my mind.- "I've always been big. It doesn't matter. Even at my thinnest I was called fat." (true. First time I was called "fat" was second grade. I look at pictures and see a pretty thin kid, but kids are cruel)
- "My weight is my business, not anyone else's. It's not affecting my health so it's not a problem" (and for a long time, that was true)
- "I really don't want to revisit my eating disorder years" (believe me, this is a REALLY good reason to stay away from dieting)
- "My value is not in my appearance". (This is still true, and I still believe it).
- "I can do everything I want to do so its not a problem" (again, it was true.. until I got past about 50 lbs overweight, but by then I had so many other health issues because of injuries and an autoimmune disorder it was hard to untangle things)
At 270, which for me is about 100 lbs overweight, I had a breakdown. At that point I KNEW I had a problem that was far more than cosmetic. I KNEW at that point that my weight was making everything harder, especially because I'd been battling pericarditis due to my lupus. and I KNEW it had to change. And so the overwhelming fear of dieting / hunger / obsessive calorie counting that I'd done in the past was pushed to the side. I'm now down to the size I started college at. I'm REALLY glad I took control. I wish I'd done it years earlier. But the eating disorder / body dysmorphia demons are definitely real. So I can't say its all roses and daisies.
Oh, and I still can't do everything I want to do. That ship has sailed, and not because of weight. Spine problems are lifelong. But I can do MORE than I could when I was heavy, and so I'm grateful, and this has all been entirely worthwhile. I just have to guard against obsession.7 -
Christine_72 wrote: »I've always been curious about what goes through peoples mind when they become 50-100-150-200lbs over weight. Dont they start to get worried, dont they care?
Once i hit a 30lb gain, the thing that spurred me on was the more i gain the longer it's going to take to lose, and the harder it'll be to get started.
Of course we do. I've tried to lose weight in the past. twice i lost 30lbs and then fell off the wagon. I had a lot of other mental things to deal with that got in the way, and food was my coping mechanism. It wasn't until I stopped living life for others and caring about what others think, that i finally KNEW that this time was going to be it. I'm different because I know what I want (in the past I wasn't sure I wanted to lose weight and get loose skin and not eat what I want rather than stay a sexy fatass). Also, this time around i know the most important factor is....always get back on the wagon. one bad day won't ruin a diet. Feeling so much guilt and shame that you avoid coming to MFP will.2 -
DisruptedMatrix wrote: »
Agree to disagree?GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »DisruptedMatrix wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »The fat acceptance movement has coopted the language of body positivity for its own ends, though.
Body positivity was originally aimed at people with scars, acne, disfigurements and the like. Even just liking inheriting dad's nose.
It was never meant to be about accepting a medically dangerous condition because you decided to say you like your body instead of doing something about it.
In likewise fashion, fat acceptance has coopted the language of racism, homophobia, and feminism. They have tried to assert that fatness is an issue with ties to all of these.
They want people to believe that fatness is immutable.
There is nothing wrong with loving yourself. I think loving yourself enough to care is vital to making the change necessary to lose weight.
I don't think fatness is immutable like race, sexual orientation, or having an amputated leg.
NO. Body+ included body type. Love yourself at 200lbs. Love yourself at 150. Even if you aren't your ideal, love yourself.
Not way, way back when it first started with roots in feminist thought. It wasn't actually named yet. I'm not saying you can't love yourself.
There's a difference between loving who you are on the inside, and just accepting what you are on the oustide as unchangeable.
Body positivity was about accepting and loving that which you could not change.
Deal
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Thanks for your replies guys xx
I could see a 100-200lb overweight person looking in the mirror and being totally overwhelmed at the thought of losing all that weight, and maybe thinking they have 2 or more loooong years of misery and suffering ahead of them to lose it all. They then justify their weight to themselves instead of having to deal with diet and restriction or they'd rather be fat and "happy" then thin and miserable.0 -
Also- I don't know how relevant this is to anyone else... I was unconsciously waited for a prince in shining armor to come down and make all my mental problems go away and make me happy so I'd want to lose weight. Then I had my revelation where I started living for myself. I realized the only person who can heal me is me, sometimes with professional help. Whether or not i find love is something seperate than how I feel about myself. I want to feel pride in myself, I want to love myself. Weightloss is my way of loving myself. I'm trying to be my own best friend.
I couldn't lose weight when I didn't like myself, hated who I was, believed I couldn't accomplish anything.6 -
Oddly enough, or maybe not, I joined a fat acceptance group on Facebook about 6 months before I decided to get healthy. I stopped hating my body or myself for being that way (300lbs). I now believe that mindset set me up for success when I decided to get healthy. I'm down over 00 lbs and cleared to stop my high blood pressure meds. I've gained and lost, but this is the first time I've been able to sustain and continue the loss for over a year. Just my anecdotal 2 cents.14
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Ridiculous movement normalizing a preventable condition that has very real negative health impacts that affects our entire society. All done in the name of making sure we don't possibly hurt someone's feelings. PC nonsense.13
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PC nonsense? We should go around calling people derogatory names?
I believe in freedom of speech for sure but I also believe people have worth regardless of their outward appearance.4 -
PC nonsense? We should go around calling people derogatory names?
I believe in freedom of speech for sure but I also believe people have worth regardless of their outward appearance.
If you think the Fat Acceptance movement is about just not being fat shamed, you're mistaken. It's toxic, and bordering on thin hatred.
It is pc nonsense, and fosters unhealthy behavior.
It's not cool to fat shame, but the fat acceptance movement isn't about that.
I suggest you take a look at Marilyn Wann's facebook page every day to get a real look at how they think.9 -
Christine_72 wrote: »I've always been curious about what goes through peoples mind when they become 50-100-150-200lbs over weight. Dont they start to get worried, dont they care?
Once i hit a 30lb gain, the thing that spurred me on was the more i gain the longer it's going to take to lose, and the harder it'll be to get started.
For me I was going through stuff when I initially gained, and once I got to around 150 (30 lbs over where I like to be, about 10 lb overweight by BMI) I was upset enough about how I looked that I went into "I look bad anyway, doesn't matter" mode, wearing more stretchy things, avoiding close looks in the mirror, not weighing (well, I hadn't been doing that as much before), just shoving it out of my mind (which I'm ridiculously good at). I realized at times that I was getting even fatter, but wouldn't confront it directly, thinking, oh, I'll have to deal with that soon, and then time would pass.
This is why weighing myself is important to me for loss (better for me if I accept the number) and maintenance. I am way too good at not thinking about things.
I also would have said (and think) that my worth is not tied up in my looks (and that I was able to focus on health and not weight or looks when I started losing the first (and only other) time, when I didn't know what I was doing and lacked confidence that it would work, was a really positive thing for me, and why I think a true focus on health and not the number could be good for people (agree that doesn't seem to be HAES, from what I've seen).
Because of all this, getting to a point where I stopped hating myself and beating myself up for getting fat -- the shame, which back in the day kicked in at only a little overweight -- was actually important to getting to a point where I could deal with it, even though maybe being more appearance focused overall would have helped me not get there sooner or not be okay with some degree of gaining, initially. (In high school I figured one either was attractive or wasn't -- I was cute, looking back, but of course didn't think I was -- and never really developed an understanding that one has some degree of control over how one looks or any of the girly ways to make yourself look better, beyond the real basics, and related to that I had a negative idea that even caring was bad and shallow, which is something I'm mostly over now but lingers at the back of my mind sometimes. Wish I'd known about more positive ways to focus on body+strength in high school, like weight training as something girls could do too.)
Anyway, I get not understanding since I had a teacher in high school who was extremely obese (really uncommon then) and I recall thinking that I just wouldn't buy bigger clothes and lose if my clothes got tight. For for reason, that turned out not to work for me, although it still seems logical on the surface. Gaining was surprisingly easy to do without thinking about much (or as something other than one of those will get to things that get put off with everything more immediate to deal with, one more day won't matter).2 -
Hmmm I think I agree with HAES if it means "Happy at every size". But not as it's current H = Healthy. But I suppose that's different that the FA movement? I guess over all it doesn't affect me. It does in some ways in that the government will eventually keep increasing my public health care costs... but I don't think I could blame that only on obesity. There's the aging baby boomer population too. And it comes off my paycheck before I even see the money... so... meh? And to be honest, I probably over-use my doctor lol. I probably go way too often. Granted if she would just take 2 minutes to answer question on the phone instead of making me book an appointment that takes 30 minutes of her time and an hour of mine... that would be good too.
I think personally what irks me is when people complain about being the weight they are but then do nothing to change it. That's not living the good life, and it's annoying that they bring it up and then get upset when you join the conversation. Like... don't bring it up if you don't want to talk about it or if you don't want people to try to help a bit. As friends, we do want to try to help you solve an issue that's upsetting you. Of course that's completely different if some random stranger on the bus brings it up. I guess I should remember that not everyone's brain works the same way though. Just because my nature is to "problem solve (think math geek)" doesn't mean everyone is like that.0 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »If anyone here is laboring under the illusion that HAES still stands for healthy behaviors at any size, they have since dropped any pretense towards encouraging their followers to do that. I cannot find the link right now, but it was posted on Reddit.
They backed away from it after pressure saying that the rhetoric was "healthist" and "ableist".
The fat acceptance movement, when you scratch the surface and look at its leaders and what they do has gone beyond merely wanting people not to be fat shamed. Some of them actively hate thin people. They actively discourage weight loss. They use old science and twist science to back their agenda and actively seek out and recruit young, vulnerable people to join their numbers.
I find them to be loathsome and beneath contempt. The best of them are misguided. The worst of them are hateful charlatans out to make a buck.
I cannot abide fat shaming, but the fat acceptance movement isn't about that any more.
I can't recall her name, but I recently read about a plus size model who lost weight and received vile abuse from HAES and FA people. She was called a traitor and told to kill herself.4 -
Alatariel75 wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »If anyone here is laboring under the illusion that HAES still stands for healthy behaviors at any size, they have since dropped any pretense towards encouraging their followers to do that. I cannot find the link right now, but it was posted on Reddit.
They backed away from it after pressure saying that the rhetoric was "healthist" and "ableist".
The fat acceptance movement, when you scratch the surface and look at its leaders and what they do has gone beyond merely wanting people not to be fat shamed. Some of them actively hate thin people. They actively discourage weight loss. They use old science and twist science to back their agenda and actively seek out and recruit young, vulnerable people to join their numbers.
I find them to be loathsome and beneath contempt. The best of them are misguided. The worst of them are hateful charlatans out to make a buck.
I cannot abide fat shaming, but the fat acceptance movement isn't about that any more.
I can't recall her name, but I recently read about a plus size model who lost weight and received vile abuse from HAES and FA people. She was called a traitor and told to kill herself.
I can't recall her name either, but I saw those same stories.
Heck, Ashley Graham posted some pictures taken from an angle that made it look like she had lost some weight and the shade they threw on her was off the hook.
Here's an example of "Fat Acceptance". A woman wrote in to Ragen Chastain, saying she had been diagnosed with a medical condition (intercranial pressure or something like that). The possible effects of this? Blindness. The treatment for this? Weight loss.
What did Ragen say? Weight loss is temporary, and dangerous because diets fail (she cited that flawed study from the 50's that showed the 95% regain rate which was based on people returning to old eating habits) and people regain more weight and that fat people should be given the same treatment plan as thin people, any other course of treatment is fat shaming.
Thankfully, the woman ignored her.
These people maintain that doctors fat shame them by saying that their joint pain is caused by their weight. They say that they thin people get joint pain too, and they should just be given knee replacements without regard to the fact that those things have weight limits.
I could go on and on.
If you want a real education, read r/fatlogic.5 -
Just because my nature is to "problem solve (think math geek)" doesn't mean everyone is like that.
Yeah, I have this same tendency and have to remind myself that sometimes people just want to vent, but it's SO HARD to resist the "if it's a perceived problem, here are some ideas on how to solve it." (Of course some do want that.)1 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »Alatariel75 wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »If anyone here is laboring under the illusion that HAES still stands for healthy behaviors at any size, they have since dropped any pretense towards encouraging their followers to do that. I cannot find the link right now, but it was posted on Reddit.
If you want a real education, read r/fatlogic.
I love when I find a fellow kittenlord in the wild.0 -
I worry about people's health. Shaming is never the answer. We put zero body fat and thin physique on too much of a pedestal though, very few people have frames like that.2
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My concern is with people like Whitney Thore who promote HAES. In her show where she states she doesn't have health issue, there have been episodes as of late where she's needed medical attention during/after intense exercise sessions because she BELIEVES she's healthy and that's just not the case.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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There should not be fat shaming, but there sure should not be acceptance of a known heath issue.0
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