What would you do? (sorry, this is long)
Replies
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I have another MFP account and created this one just for this question so I can keep my privacy.
I'm a female and have a longtime female friend who's married. Her husband is normally nice to me but has a mean, selfish streak and is always hurting his wife's feelings -- almost every time we have coffee she talks about some awful thing he said to her.
Background:
My doctor scheduled an outpatient surgery for me. They knock you out with anesthesia, so you must have a ride home. They also want the name and phone of your driver or you can't have the surgery. The surgery was for a medical condition I've had before. If I let it go I could get cancer.
The surgery office is 4 blocks from my house.
My friend agreed to drive me home. She lives 2 miles away.
I live in a small town where there are no taxis.
What happened:
Her husband is obsessed with the weather. He refuses to get mental health help.
He checked the weather 5 days before my appointment, saw a forecast for icy rain, and told his wife she couldn't drive me.
I checked the weather myself. My appointment was at 6:30 a.m. and I would be ready to leave at 9:30 a.m. The icy rain was forecast for late in the day (it actually began about 10 at night). There was absolutely no bad weather forecast for the first half of the day.
She sounded like she didn't want to drive me, so I found another driver.
She later told me that when she tried to talk to her husband about it, he screamed, "I don't care! We don't drive in icy rain!"
She also apologized and said she felt terrible.
My dilemma:
This woman is a longtime good friend.
She did apologize and said she felt terrible.
I also feel nobody is obligated to do anything they feel uncomfortable about.
But the whole thing is too nutty for me -- there was no icy rain, and this wasn't like cancelling going out for coffee. The surgery did find some things wrong with me and it was very important to take care of them or it could turn into cancer.
I guess I feel repulsed by the whole thing. I would ask questions before I did that to somebody.
I can't imagine going over to their house again.
Am I blowing this out of proportion? Would you be friends with a family like that?
Nothing.. There is nothing you can do.
Your friend is her own person who can make her own decisions. The husband is right, its not safe to drive in Icy weather. The husband just wants her to be safe. At the end of the day, there is nothing wrong with that.
At some point your friend needs to stand up to her husband and say cut the crap out.
With that being said, I think you need to find a new desalinated driver.
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I think you chalk this up to knowing what her boundaries are.
She isn't willing to break this travel ban issue with her husband...and whether her husband needs counseling, medication, or whatever isn't in your control nor really it should be. What her marriage is or is not is none of your business, unless it is abusive. I don't think this is necessarily abusive...a bit messed up, yes, potentially very enabling, yes... but that's not your job to meddle. Getting mixed up in someone's marital relationship rarely works out well.
What you know now is what to depend on your friend for, and what not to depend on your friend for. You were certainly disappointed by your friend because for most people this would not have been an issue, and I presume you live in a climate like I do where unless it's pretty extreme, we go right on driving through slow, sleet and hail.
But I'd like to suggest that not all friends are great for all things. I have a friend that I can't trust to be on time, for instance, but are loving and trustworthy except for that. I have another friend who is very overweight...I'm not asking him for support on my diet. But I wouldn't get rid of them because they don't meet all my needs. Friends are often not all things, and that's OK, they can still be friends but just honor the limits they have.
You have the choice of holding resentment. You can end the friendship. And that's your right.
But I would suggest shaking off the hurt and realize now you know where you shouldn't ask her to help you, because she has this limitation.4 -
And it's OK to be sad if the relationship has changed for the worse with you over time. That does happen and its disappointing. Friendships change, and it's important to keep in the present. Whatever was years ago may not be reality today.2
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kenyonhaff wrote: »I think you chalk this up to knowing what her boundaries are.
She isn't willing to break this travel ban issue with her husband...and whether her husband needs counseling, medication, or whatever isn't in your control nor really it should be. What her marriage is or is not is none of your business, unless it is abusive.
But I would suggest shaking off the hurt and realize now you know where you shouldn't ask her to help you, because she has this limitation.
She was in a quandry about taking me. She does stand up to her husband on occasion. I didn't want to start a family argument and found another ride, with some worry not knowing if I could find one.
I'm not hurt at all. I'm repulsed that this this was even an issue. The issue is not the ride. The issue is the callous weirdness of the whole thing.
I agree with you, her marriage is not under my control.
To everyone, thanks for your input. To clarify, the weather issue was IMAGINARY. The icy rain was not in the forecast for the time of my appointment. It showed up 12 hours later, at night. The husband has a weather phobia and said he did not care if I didn't have a ride (over a serious medical appointment).
Should I have anticipated this problem? I don't know, I'm not a mind reader. This is the only ride I've asked of anybody in probably 15 years. I have a car in great condition. I'm not a needy person. I very rarely ask anybody to do me favors. I'm usually the one on the other end, feeding people's animals, collecting their mail, and giving them rides.
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Maybe I'm alone in this, but I don't do drama.
It wouldn't even be so much about her canceling on you (although, I don't like people who go back on their word after something has already been arranged) but the whole thing with her husband sounds like it's too much.
I wouldn't want to be friends with someone who almost every time we had coffee (from what you've said) is complaining about some horrid thing her husband said. I'd feel she'd either need to a) leave him or b) stop involving me in her marriage. I'd end the friendship and not look back.2 -
Well, I definitely feel bad for her, and agree with others that I (personally) wouldn't cut her out of your life completely over this one instance, however, I do know what it's like to be disappointed in a friendship, and I've found that open communication is always important in these situations.
Don't feel badly if you do need to create some distance. Some people are meant to be in our lives for a season, not for a lifetime, and that's okay.1 -
kenyonhaff wrote: »I think you chalk this up to knowing what her boundaries are.
She isn't willing to break this travel ban issue with her husband...and whether her husband needs counseling, medication, or whatever isn't in your control nor really it should be. What her marriage is or is not is none of your business, unless it is abusive.
But I would suggest shaking off the hurt and realize now you know where you shouldn't ask her to help you, because she has this limitation.
She was in a quandry about taking me. She does stand up to her husband on occasion. I didn't want to start a family argument and found another ride, with some worry not knowing if I could find one.
I'm not hurt at all. I'm repulsed that this this was even an issue. The issue is not the ride. The issue is the callous weirdness of the whole thing.
I agree with you, her marriage is not under my control.
To everyone, thanks for your input. To clarify, the weather issue was IMAGINARY. The icy rain was not in the forecast for the time of my appointment. It showed up 12 hours later, at night. The husband has a weather phobia and said he did not care if I didn't have a ride (over a serious medical appointment).
Should I have anticipated this problem? I don't know, I'm not a mind reader. This is the only ride I've asked of anybody in probably 15 years. I have a car in great condition. I'm not a needy person. I very rarely ask anybody to do me favors. I'm usually the one on the other end, feeding people's animals, collecting their mail, and giving them rides.
Sorry, just to clarify, the husband has a phobia and you said the weather issue was imaginary? A phobia is not imaginary. He saw something that scared him and didn't want his wife out in the weather that scared him (whether forecast for that time or not) as he has a real fear of what could happen. If he has a genuine phobia then you can't understand what he was thinking. Just like an anxiety attack is not just feeling a bit worried or an ED is not just wanting to be slim, a genuine phobia is not just being worried of something. Phobias can take over a persons life and leave them with serious issues. Personally I think you are making way to much out of this. You got to your appointment, your friend stands up to her husband when she needs to and yet you are here giving out about her being in a lousy marriage (maybe she doesn't see it that way), slamming her husband for his issues and not being a good friend as you had to find a ride to your appointment. If she wasn't 100% happy about giving you the lift in the first place, maybe her husband picked up on that and it kicked his phobia into overdrive and he got anxious over the weather and dealt with it as he knew how: stopped her from taking you so he knew she'd be safe.
I have many friends in many different relationships that I don't understand or that don't necessarily conform to my views but they are my friends, I love them unconditionally and it's their life so as long as they are happy, it's all cool. Some of them do nothing but complain about their other half, but they have genuine love there too.3 -
I've only read half the comments, so excuse me if I'm repeating anything.
I disagree with staying friends.
I agree that you need to have compassion both for her and for her husband.
I think you should sit her down and explain that you can no longer sit around and watch your friend be in pain. And tell her that you need to lovingly distance yourself as you can no longer stand it. Assure her you'll be there if she's willing to make a change.
This will be uncomfortable. But this is much cleaner and ultimately much kinder than slowly drifting away.
This might actually spur her on to do something more about her situation.1 -
Maybe I'm alone in this, but I don't do drama.
It wouldn't even be so much about her canceling on you (although, I don't like people who go back on their word after something has already been arranged) but the whole thing with her husband sounds like it's too much.
I wouldn't want to be friends with someone who almost every time we had coffee (from what you've said) is complaining about some horrid thing her husband said. I'd feel she'd either need to a) leave him or b) stop involving me in her marriage. I'd end the friendship and not look back.
You're not alone. This sounds like a total downer to me. Negativity is such a drain. Sharing the occasional complaint is normal, but excess drama and dealing with other peoples' toxic relationships long-term isn't healthy, so I generally avoid it. I would support the friend if she's gonna work on a solution, get some help or get out, but if she's just gonna wallow in it, I don't want to be a part of it.
People tend to adopt the attitudes and behaviors of the people they spend a lot of time with. Therefore, if you are a couch potato but you want to be more fitness-oriented, you should hang out with people who are fitness-oriented. Over time, you'll start to adopt their behaviors and become one of them. Same goes for negative attitudes and behaviors.
And people bitching about their spouses are some of the worst.
I'm married, I love my relationship and I have a lot of fun, so I'd like to focus on having gratitude for what I have. It's not perfect, but it's pretty awesome! I like to spend time with like-minded people. The last thing I need or want to do is be around people with a negative marital mindset. I don't need that. I've never been a fan of that kind of crap. If you aren't having a good time, then do something about it. Complaining to your friends and family about your marriage doesn't make things better. It's disrespectful, it undermines your relationship and it reinforces bad attitudes. It doesn't reflect well on you, either. Like I said, the occasional gripe is gonna happen. That's OK. It's those chronically miserable people I can't handle.
So yeah, she would have to go. Maybe I'm mean, but that's how I feel. And it has nothing to do with not getting a ride. That's not even a concern of mine.1 -
As a person from a very disfunctional family, here is my advice.
1) you come first, so if the relationship with these people is hurting you, affecting your balance and your mental health, do whatever is necessary to protect yourself, including taking some distance.
It may mean to cut them off completely or to change the relationship, for example you can still see your friend for coffee and such, but understand that you can't rely on her on the big stuff.
2) if you decide to continue this friendship and to support her in her difficulties, just remember that you can't fix her problem, only she can. you can be there for her as a friend, not as a therapist or a social worker.
In this case I suggest that you make it clear to her that you are there for help if she wants to change the situation with her husband, whether she wants to divorce, to seek help from a therapist or else, but set boundaries.2 -
...I have many friends in many different relationships that I don't understand or that don't necessarily conform to my views but they are my friends, I love them unconditionally and it's their life so as long as they are happy, it's all cool. Some of them do nothing but complain about their other half, but they have genuine love there too.
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My friend does have a lot of friends, but I'm probably the only one she can be completely honest around. When she talks about her husband, my only comment is to say I wouldn't live with someone like that. Part of her choice to stay with him might be financial, but I don't really buy that. They own a nice house etc. they could sell and split. For whatever reason, she chooses to stay.
From personal experience I know that putting it as "she chooses to stay" is too simple. I stayed for hundreds of not good enough justifications in a previous (seemingly similar) relationship. The real reason I stayed was far more complex than reasons and justifications alone
I too had many friends - but I am still grateful for two of the most special women ever- They only knew some of it, but they stuck with me through it all. Their friendship and knowing and trusting I could trust that was what pulled me out in the end.
Stay there for your friend, she probably feels awful for the situation. Stuck between a rock and a hard place. I know this action has hurt you but focus on the real culprit, his hysterics.1 -
But the whole thing is too nutty for me -- there was no icy rain, and this wasn't like cancelling going out for coffee. The surgery did find some things wrong with me and it was very important to take care of them or it could turn into cancer.
I guess I feel repulsed by the whole thing. I would ask questions before I did that to somebody.
I can't imagine going over to their house again.
Am I blowing this out of proportion? Would you be friends with a family like that?
sounds a bit like you're projecting your feelings about the potential of cancer (you're allowed to be scared) onto your friend.
she is your friend, she is living in a difficult situation. he is not your friend.0 -
Have you experienced the husbands nutty/abusive behavior towards your friend yourself?
I have a friend who constantly cancels appointments and then blames it on his "overbearing and bossy" wife when in fact most of the time it is him.
It is important to verify these kinds of things before making decisions that impact on others.2 -
Thanks for the comments, everybody. I know you don't have a lot of information, but the feedback is helpful.
I don't think I can be friends on an equal footing again, which is a shame, but that's how I feel. I'm not angry, just appalled. I don't expect my friends to be perfect people. But my values and how I reason things out are completely different.
I agree with TmacMMM about not liking drama and wanting to count on my friends. I very rarely ask anybody for favors. Her husband's reaction was hysterical drama and is especially not the way to react over a ride for a medical situation.
My friend does have a lot of friends, but I'm probably the only one she can be completely honest around. When she talks about her husband, my only comment is to say I wouldn't live with someone like that. Part of her choice to stay with him might be financial, but I don't really buy that. They own a nice house etc. they could sell and split. For whatever reason, she chooses to stay.
Yes, she chooses to stay for some reason she's not telling you. Nor does she need to. It's her life, not yours.
Due to differences in personality and various life situations, you shouldn't expect all your friends to serve the same functions. That doesn't mean that you can't still talk or have the occasional lunch/coffee date (as another user mentioned) but maybe you shouldn't rely on her for things like a ride home from the hospital when you know she won't be able to pull through because of her life situation.
Calling a serious situation "hysterical drama" and saying you can't be friends "on equal footing" is not helpful to you or to her. You have other people to pick you up from the hospital, you have your own values and your own hard choices to make. Let her make hers.2 -
I think it's fair to be upset with your friend, but don't let this ruin the friendship. Just know that what you can expect from her may be limited by her relationship with her husband - she's in a very delicate situation, so cut her some slack (within reason).
A lot of people said the husband needs therapy. Clearly. But so does your friend. Tell her that (delicately obviously). She needs more than you can give (not a dig on you, some problems require professional intervention), and it could give her the confidence to do something about her relationship with her husband.0 -
I'd talk directly to the friend, nice, calm. Just tell her you felt let down, as it was hard to ask for help and you'd wished she could have been there when you needed her. Accept her apology (which I'm sure you will get) and move on. Then, without saying so, just limit your friendship with her. Sounds like maybe you have been in the role of helping/listening too much- and maybe you're just realizing that it's been a one-way road. I've "broken up" with needy friends that dump all their stuff on me all the time...just reduce those coffee meet ups to like 25%- if it was once a week go once a month. If it was monthly, move to a couple a year to catch up. You'll be happier.0
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