A calorie is a calorie ...
Replies
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Weight loss is an energy balance equation. All calories are equal for weight loss. No one here has ever said all foods are the same for health.
Again, I have to assume you didn't read the whole thread, or any of the stickies in each of the forums.
If you read the whole thread, as well as the original post you might notice that it was not talking about weight loss.
It was showing an (just one) example of the vast nutritional bang for your buck that you could get during two days with the same caloric intake.
The illustrated analysis of the meals highlighted that while the caloric (energy) value was the same on each day one did not provide anywhere near the nutritional value and therefor was inferior in regards to health.
I can only assume you didn't read the original post.
But do people ever say that all foods are the same from a nutritional standpoint? Of course not, that would be silly. So I'm still not sure the point of all of this. Is it that there are lots of different ways of eating and some ways provide more macro and micronutrients than others? Ok. Agreed. Where did you get the idea that anyone would say otherwise?12 -
Weight loss is an energy balance equation. All calories are equal for weight loss. No one here has ever said all foods are the same for health.
Again, I have to assume you didn't read the whole thread, or any of the stickies in each of the forums.
If you read the whole thread, as well as the original post you might notice that it was not talking about weight loss.
It was showing an (just one) example of the vast nutritional bang for your buck that you could get during two days with the same caloric intake.
The illustrated analysis of the meals highlighted that while the caloric (energy) value was the same on each day one did not provide anywhere near the nutritional value and therefor was inferior in regards to health.
I can only assume you didn't read the original post.
I wasn't responding to your OP, im responding to the new poster who is trying to say that you won't lose weight eating processed food.
No one here ever suggests that eating nutritious foods isn't important for health, just that it's not necessary for weight loss.8 -
nokanjaijo wrote: »KatzeDerNacht22 wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »KatzeDerNacht22 wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »Wynterbourne wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »Why is this person spending almost half their daily calories on a chick pea curry and a pear?
That's what confuses me.
I can't speak for them, but I frequently only eat two meals a day. Multiple small meals and snacks drives me insane. So half my calories on a curry looks perfectly normal to me.
See, having half the day's calories in half the day's meals does make sense. That isn't what's happening here.
You can speak for them because the whole day's menu is in the article.
They have three meals and three snacks. Presumably this is over the course of the day. Doesn't seem like something you'd find people doing that often.
I find eating like that much simpler, but I can see why many people would. I like it cos I'm never hungry and fits my day
You find eating like what simpler?
Several meals, someone said they don't like having 3 meals and snacks andnokanjaijo wrote: »Wynterbourne wrote: »nokanjaijo wrote: »Why is this person spending almost half their daily calories on a chick pea curry and a pear?
That's what confuses me.
I can't speak for them, but I frequently only eat two meals a day. Multiple small meals and snacks drives me insane. So half my calories on a curry looks perfectly normal to me.
See, having half the day's calories in half the day's meals does make sense. That isn't what's happening here.
You can speak for them because the whole day's menu is in the article.
They have three meals and three snacks. Presumably this is over the course of the day. Doesn't seem like something you'd find people doing that often.
3 meals and 3 snacks is way simpler for me, eating like that. I said that cos I do that all the time. But I guess most people don't.
Okay, I think a great many people do that. I bet it's very common.
What i don't think many people do is have 6 meals, eat almost half the day's calories in one meal then spread the other half over the remaining 5 meals. That's what I'm calling odd. It would be pretty uncommon, I think.
It seems to me like the author of this article was having a difficult time getting the two menus to come to the same calorie count and look like roughly the same amount of food. So they had to cram a bunch of calories into the dinner meal to force it.
I do that a lot. I don't have much control over my dinner. Could be lots of veggies or it could be fast food. So i skimp on breakfast and lunch, so that I'll have plenty of calories for dinner. Dinner is frequently half my calories so i don't go under my goal, and i don't go to bed hungry.0 -
sydney_bosque wrote: »That's simply not true. https://blog.bulletproof.com/not-the-calories-stupid-reply-to-time-magazine/. You may still lose some weight, but not as quickly. And refined foods will never help the process.
I pretty much live off refined foods and I lost 125 lbs as well. And A LOT of those were carbs.10 -
WinoGelato wrote: »
Weight loss is an energy balance equation. All calories are equal for weight loss. No one here has ever said all foods are the same for health.
Again, I have to assume you didn't read the whole thread, or any of the stickies in each of the forums.
If you read the whole thread, as well as the original post you might notice that it was not talking about weight loss.
It was showing an (just one) example of the vast nutritional bang for your buck that you could get during two days with the same caloric intake.
The illustrated analysis of the meals highlighted that while the caloric (energy) value was the same on each day one did not provide anywhere near the nutritional value and therefor was inferior in regards to health.
I can only assume you didn't read the original post.
But do people ever say that all foods are the same from a nutritional standpoint? Of course not, that would be silly. So I'm still not sure the point of all of this. Is it that there are lots of different ways of eating and some ways provide more macro and micronutrients than others? Ok. Agreed. Where did you get the idea that anyone would say otherwise?
People frequently (even within this thread) write things like I can just eat soft drink, lollies, 'junk' food and still lost weigh, calorie deficit is all that matters ...
Many places on the forums people write - and I'm paraphrasing - you can eat whatever you want. CICO is all that matters, etc etc.
Now you might be able to read an implied meaning into that and mentally add, but you need to eat a balanced diet to be healthy but not every person using this app and the forums does that, or understands that.
All calories are equal. SURE. For weight loss, to a point ... but health is not just weight loss. As you are saying yourself, nutrition etc matters when your looking a HEALTH.
Which is what the linked original article is about.
..........
Why are you so intent on arguing a point that you basically agree on?
Are you saying, don't post that because everyone (you) already knows that so why even talk about it?
Or arguing semantics just for arguments sake?
..............
If you don't like the article, or don't like my opinion. Great. That's okay. I can live with that.
Doesn't mean it is wrong to share or that my point about not all calorie sources being equal in VALUE (not energy measurement if you can separate the concepts).
We're on page bloody 6 of arguing the same point with different perspectives on a linguistical term.
If you don't see the point - seriously - why are you posting (basically repeated opinion) on this thread across three days?
These questions are rhetorical mind you.
I was going to write: this has become ridiculous, I give up.
I think it's more appropriate to write, I move on.
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sydney_bosque wrote: »Just do me a favor and research how blood sugar and insulin affect weight gain/loss. Then tell me I'm wrong. In strictly terms of a measurement of energy, yes calories are just a unit of measurement. But that's not what was implied. We are talking about calories compared with calories in different foods. And even with exercise. You can't just create a calorie deficit and lose weight. It's just not that simple.
You are wrong.
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2012/02/is-sugar-fattening.html?m=1sydney_bosque wrote: »Just do me a favor and research how blood sugar and insulin affect weight gain/loss. Then tell me I'm wrong. In strictly terms of a measurement of energy, yes calories are just a unit of measurement. But that's not what was implied. We are talking about calories compared with calories in different foods. And even with exercise. You can't just create a calorie deficit and lose weight. It's just not that simple.
You are wrong. Here's the blog of an actual obesity researcher on the topic.
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/08/carbohydrate-hypothesis-of-obesity.html?m=1
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/09/hyperinsulinemia-cause-or-effect-of.html?m=1
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/09/fat-tissue-insulin-sensitivity-and.html?m=1
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2012/02/is-sugar-fattening.html?m=1
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/08/carbohydrate-hypothesis-of-obesity.html?m=1
http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/05/clarifications-about-carbohydrate-and.html?m=1
While sugar does have effects on the body, it doesn't have a special snowflake role in weight.9 -
sydney_bosque wrote: »Look, I have a degree in organic produce, and have since studied a LOT about nutrition.
All calories are not equal. That's like saying, "A pound is a pound!" When you lose weight. No. You could lose a pound of fat, and that would be awesome. Or, you could lose a pound of muscle, which is horrible. It's much more complex.
Put simply, the type of calories we eat determine how well our systems function. And, primarily important to weight loss, they determine blood sugar and insulin levels, along with other hormones that basically decide how you will use a calorie.
Bottom line: A calorie from white bread or refined sugar is most efficiently stored in your body as reserve energy in the form of glucose. Guess what the organ is for energy storage? Yep. Fat cells.
However, a calorie that comes from broccoli takes nearly double the energy to convert it into glucose, and is much more efficiently broken down into usable vitamins and minerals. Therefore, 100 calories from a donut will go directly to your waist. 100 calories from a vegetable will go towards fueling your systems. Mainly your excretory system; which is what actually gets stuff out of storage in your fat cells and eliminated from the body.
So, no. A calorie is not just a calorie.
A degree in organic produce?
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I will take both for 4000 Cal Alex.... but I'll have to add some extra walkies to compensate!5
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sydney_bosque wrote: »crzycatlady1 wrote: »sydney_bosque wrote: »Just do me a favor and research how blood sugar and insulin affect weight gain/loss. Then tell me I'm wrong. In strictly terms of a measurement of energy, yes calories are just a unit of measurement. But that's not what was implied. We are talking about calories compared with calories in different foods. And even with exercise. You can't just create a calorie deficit and lose weight. It's just not that simple.
I've lost around 50lbs and have been in successful maintenance for several years now and yep, it really is that simple
Are you claiming that you can eat bread, sugar, and carbs and as long as you are still under your calorie goal then the weight will drop off?
If she isnt, I am. And basic science proves it as a fact.13 -
sydney_bosque wrote: »How about someone posts a scientific study that shows refined food calories are equal to complex food calories
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/hormonal-responses-fast-food-meal.html/9 -
sydney_bosque wrote: »crzycatlady1 wrote: »sydney_bosque wrote: »Just do me a favor and research how blood sugar and insulin affect weight gain/loss. Then tell me I'm wrong. In strictly terms of a measurement of energy, yes calories are just a unit of measurement. But that's not what was implied. We are talking about calories compared with calories in different foods. And even with exercise. You can't just create a calorie deficit and lose weight. It's just not that simple.
I've lost around 50lbs and have been in successful maintenance for several years now and yep, it really is that simple
Are you claiming that you can eat bread, sugar, and carbs and as long as you are still under your calorie goal then the weight will drop off?
I honestly don't know if you're just having fun with us, but of course you can lose weight eating these kinds of foods. Weight loss happens when a calorie deficit is created. But, within that scientific truth it doesn't matter what kinds of foods your eating to make up your calorie intake.
I lost 50lbs and improved all my health markers, including normalizing a high glucose number, and I ate bread, sugar, carbs, fast food, 'processed' diet foods etc during my weight loss phase. I created a deficit and I lost the weight. Now I'm several years into successful maintenance and I continue to eat those things on a regular basis but I've expanded my diet a bit and now eat a wide variety of foods including veggies, whole grain and lean meats as well. I have a bmi of around 21, am in excellent health with no medical conditions anymore and I haven't cut out any of the foods I like.
Also-my before/after pictures are in my profile area, feel free to check them out
Here's a couple articles you might enjoy reading-one is about a guy who ate a Twinkie diet and lost weight and improved all his health markers and then another guy who only ate McDonalds for several months and also lost weight and improved his health markers. What they both had in common was they created the correct calorie deficit for their weight goals and lost weight-
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/
http://www.today.com/health/man-loses-56-pounds-after-eating-only-mcdonalds-six-months-2D793291589 -
After page 1, the only thing I can think of is the movie " Stripes".
"Lighten up, Frances".3 -
We're going to Home Depot today to select new flooring for a rental unit.
I'm sure we're going to be confused because the square feet we're covering are going to be different since some of them will be covered in carpet and others will be covered in hardwood laminate.19 -
crzycatlady1 wrote: »sydney_bosque wrote: »crzycatlady1 wrote: »sydney_bosque wrote: »Just do me a favor and research how blood sugar and insulin affect weight gain/loss. Then tell me I'm wrong. In strictly terms of a measurement of energy, yes calories are just a unit of measurement. But that's not what was implied. We are talking about calories compared with calories in different foods. And even with exercise. You can't just create a calorie deficit and lose weight. It's just not that simple.
I've lost around 50lbs and have been in successful maintenance for several years now and yep, it really is that simple
Are you claiming that you can eat bread, sugar, and carbs and as long as you are still under your calorie goal then the weight will drop off?
I honestly don't know if you're just having fun with us, but of course you can lose weight eating these kinds of foods. Weight loss happens when a calorie deficit is created. But, within that scientific truth it doesn't matter what kinds of foods your eating to make up your calorie intake.
I lost 50lbs and improved all my health markers, including normalizing a high glucose number, and I ate bread, sugar, carbs, fast food, 'processed' diet foods etc during my weight loss phase. I created a deficit and I lost the weight. Now I'm several years into successful maintenance and I continue to eat those things on a regular basis but I've expanded my diet a bit and now eat a wide variety of foods including veggies, whole grain and lean meats as well. I have a bmi of around 21, am in excellent health with no medical conditions anymore and I haven't cut out any of the foods I like.
Also-my before/after pictures are in my profile area, feel free to check them out
Here's a couple articles you might enjoy reading-one is about a guy who ate a Twinkie diet and lost weight and improved all his health markers and then another guy who only ate McDonalds for several months and also lost weight and improved his health markers. What they both had in common was they created the correct calorie deficit for their weight goals and lost weight-
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/
http://www.today.com/health/man-loses-56-pounds-after-eating-only-mcdonalds-six-months-2D79329158
QFT.4 -
mactaffy428 wrote: »After page 1, the only thing I can think of is the movie " Stripes".
"Lighten up, Frances".
I have gif for that!
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Weight loss is an energy balance equation. All calories are equal for weight loss. No one here has ever said all foods are the same for health.
Again, I have to assume you didn't read the whole thread, or any of the stickies in each of the forums.
If you read the whole thread, as well as the original post you might notice that it was not talking about weight loss.
It was showing an (just one) example of the vast nutritional bang for your buck that you could get during two days with the same caloric intake.
The illustrated analysis of the meals highlighted that while the caloric (energy) value was the same on each day one did not provide anywhere near the nutritional value and therefor was inferior in regards to health.
I can only assume you didn't read the original post.
The problem is that you chose for your title -- intentionally, I am sure -- a statement that IS about weight loss and has nothing to do with nutrition.
Obviously (as I've pointed out numerous times) different foods have different nutrient content. I am still puzzled about why you seem to think this was some kind of controversial point or a revelation to, like, anyone.
The only reason you are getting pushback is the claim that this someone relates to "a calorie is a calorie."
Again, foods have different nutrient contents. Everyone not living under a rock knows that and agrees. Calories do not have nutrient content, they are merely units of energy. That a calorie = a calorie does not mean that what you eat does not matter.
However, it is true that you will lose weight eating under your TDEE (by more than a nominal amount, anyway) no matter what the calories are supplied by. Obviously if the calories come from a diet that is too void of nutrients or imbalanced there will be other bad effects. Again, no one denies this, it is not controversial or in debate, the claim that it is is disingenuous and rather insulting or, at least, a pointless strawman.9 -
crzycatlady1 wrote: »In terms of weight loss, yes a calorie is a calorie. In terms of overall health yes, you should eat a varied diet consisting of foods that a. you enjoy eating b. fit within your calorie goals c. have a high satiety level for you and d. gives you a good balance of macros and micros
My view on those priorities is a little different. I would say:
a) eat foods that meet your nutritional requirements
b) don't exceed your caloric needs
c) fill you up
d) you like
How you rank those attributes is all about a values I guess and the whole calorie in calorie out is the whole equation depends entirely on if you want to 'lose weight' or be healthy.
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I thought the linked article gave a good visual regarding calories being equal in an easy to understand illustrative manner.
Some of the actual text is a bit wishy washy, but it is just a little piece for a health insurance mob.
Food for thought though.
Why must it be one or the other?
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I'm not sure how people can't grasp that a calorie is a defined unit of energy. Nothing more, nothing less.13
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crzycatlady1 wrote: »In terms of weight loss, yes a calorie is a calorie. In terms of overall health yes, you should eat a varied diet consisting of foods that a. you enjoy eating b. fit within your calorie goals c. have a high satiety level for you and d. gives you a good balance of macros and micros
My view on those priorities is a little different. I would say:
a) eat foods that meet your nutritional requirements
b) don't exceed your caloric needs
c) fill you up
d) you like
How you rank those attributes is all about a values I guess and the whole calorie in calorie out is the whole equation depends entirely on if you want to 'lose weight' or be healthy.
................
I thought the linked article gave a good visual regarding calories being equal in an easy to understand illustrative manner.
Some of the actual text is a bit wishy washy, but it is just a little piece for a health insurance mob.
Food for thought though.
Why must it be one or the other?
Are you just on page one? Keep reading.5
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