A calorie is a calorie ...
Replies
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Because there are soooooo many posts on here were users advocate others eating whatever junk they want because 'a calorie is a calorie', so long as there is a deficit.
I don't really have anything new to add to the conversation, I was just reminded of something that I recently came across in the book 'New Rules of Lifting'. This subject is mentioned as something that grinds the author's gears:
"Differentiating calories. I started this chapter by mentioning a statement that drives me nuts: “If you want to lose weight, eat less and exercise more.” There’s another that I find even more maddening: “A calorie is a calorie.” This one isn’t half-true. It’s wholly false. Your body processes different calories in different ways. It uses much more energy to digest protein than to digest carbohydrates, and more to digest carbohydrates than fat." - from L. Schuler and A. Cosgrove, The New Rules of Lifting, p. 263.
You obviously haven't been to the Easy Mac thread yet.,,,
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I don't get why people have to get so upset over what other people eat.
Don't see what this comment has to do with the thread. I haven't noticed anyone getting upset about what others eat. Could you please point to a comment that you are referring to so this doesn't see so totally out of the blue?
If you are going to be critical of other people it's more polite, I believe, to make sure you do understand what they are saying and also to be specific so others don't think you mean them.If you ask someone who is very successful and fit what they do to get that way, you can't be offended that they don't tell you "I ate pizza, fries and cake the whole time!" because people who are very serious about health are never going to do that.
Hmm, now I am really confused. Maybe you posted in the wrong thread? Or didn't read this one?Everyone is here for different reasons. Many seem to be here to lose weight at the cost of anything else. They won't exercise (used to be me), won't eat a vegetable and then complain that they are starving on their two pieces of pizza and two donuts a day. They refuse to accept that a focus on nutrition AND calories is how many of us get to eat enough food for satiety and get offended when you tell them this has been your successful plan.
Who are these people and what do they have to do with this thread?Someone eating kale is not an indictment of your food choices.
Thank goodness, as I ate kale this morning! Wouldn't want to have thereby indicted my own food choices. I definitely would have had to appoint a special prosecutor for the trial!7 -
I barfed while reading it.crzycatlady1 wrote: »Because there are soooooo many posts on here were users advocate others eating whatever junk they want because 'a calorie is a calorie', so long as there is a deficit.
I don't really have anything new to add to the conversation, I was just reminded of something that I recently came across in the book 'New Rules of Lifting'. This subject is mentioned as something that grinds the author's gears:
"Differentiating calories. I started this chapter by mentioning a statement that drives me nuts: “If you want to lose weight, eat less and exercise more.” There’s another that I find even more maddening: “A calorie is a calorie.” This one isn’t half-true. It’s wholly false. Your body processes different calories in different ways. It uses much more energy to digest protein than to digest carbohydrates, and more to digest carbohydrates than fat." - from L. Schuler and A. Cosgrove, The New Rules of Lifting, p. 263.
You obviously haven't been to the Easy Mac thread yet.,,,
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Because there are soooooo many posts on here were users advocate others eating whatever junk they want because 'a calorie is a calorie', so long as there is a deficit.
I don't really have anything new to add to the conversation, I was just reminded of something that I recently came across in the book 'New Rules of Lifting'. This subject is mentioned as something that grinds the author's gears:
"Differentiating calories. I started this chapter by mentioning a statement that drives me nuts: “If you want to lose weight, eat less and exercise more.” There’s another that I find even more maddening: “A calorie is a calorie.” This one isn’t half-true. It’s wholly false. Your body processes different calories in different ways. It uses much more energy to digest protein than to digest carbohydrates, and more to digest carbohydrates than fat." - from L. Schuler and A. Cosgrove, The New Rules of Lifting, p. 263.
This sort of response was addressed earlier in the thread.
You can tell from this that Schuler and Cosgrove are using "calorie" as a synonym for food. That your body spends more calories in digesting protein than in digesting fat or carbs doesn't mean than the calories from protein are different (the foods are different and protein is different from fat).
I think Schuler and Cosgrove would even acknowledge this, that they are using (and assume others are using) "calories" in a slangy way, and that as long as "a calorie is a calorie" is not used to suggest "a food is a food," that they would agree. If they've run into it meaning "it does not matter what you eat," I get the response, but it's very clear when used on MFP that that is not what it means. In particular, satiety is an issue.
On the other hand, worrying about TEF is a fool's game, and I wonder if Schuler and Cosgrove still maintain otherwise (I know they've updated other things about various NRoL books).6 -
Because there are soooooo many posts on here were users advocate others eating whatever junk they want because 'a calorie is a calorie', so long as there is a deficit.
I don't really have anything new to add to the conversation, I was just reminded of something that I recently came across in the book 'New Rules of Lifting'. This subject is mentioned as something that grinds the author's gears:
"Differentiating calories. I started this chapter by mentioning a statement that drives me nuts: “If you want to lose weight, eat less and exercise more.” There’s another that I find even more maddening: “A calorie is a calorie.” This one isn’t half-true. It’s wholly false. Your body processes different calories in different ways. It uses much more energy to digest protein than to digest carbohydrates, and more to digest carbohydrates than fat." - from L. Schuler and A. Cosgrove, The New Rules of Lifting, p. 263.
Sure, thermic effect exists and is higher for protein rich foods, but that would not make a tangible practical difference within a normal diet. Sure you can burn 100 extra calories or so if you eat more than 80% of your calories in protein, but who does that? Even if we take thermic effect into consideration, the protein in McDonald's burger is processed similarly to a home cooked clean organic grass fed meal with the same macros.3 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »Because there are soooooo many posts on here were users advocate others eating whatever junk they want because 'a calorie is a calorie', so long as there is a deficit.
I don't really have anything new to add to the conversation, I was just reminded of something that I recently came across in the book 'New Rules of Lifting'. This subject is mentioned as something that grinds the author's gears:
"Differentiating calories. I started this chapter by mentioning a statement that drives me nuts: “If you want to lose weight, eat less and exercise more.” There’s another that I find even more maddening: “A calorie is a calorie.” This one isn’t half-true. It’s wholly false. Your body processes different calories in different ways. It uses much more energy to digest protein than to digest carbohydrates, and more to digest carbohydrates than fat." - from L. Schuler and A. Cosgrove, The New Rules of Lifting, p. 263.
Sure, thermic effect exists and is higher for protein rich foods, but that would not make a tangible practical difference within a normal diet. Sure you can burn 100 extra calories or so if you eat more than 80% of your calories in protein, but who does that? Even if we take thermic effect into consideration, the protein in McDonald's burger is processed similarly to a home cooked clean organic grass fed meal with the same macros.
As clearly evidenced in this study: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/hormonal-responses-fast-food-meal.html/3 -
Good read. I have always firmly believed that many people follow these different diet for a sense of belonging and to boost their egos.
There are certainly less decisions to be made when someone follows a strict preset (to be nice I won't call it a cult) list of do's and don't's. I think that is why at one point diets such as Jenny Craig, Nutrisystem and et al were so popular. People didn't have to make decisions...just eat the pre-made pre-determind meals.1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »I don't get why people have to get so upset over what other people eat.
Don't see what this comment has to do with the thread. I haven't noticed anyone getting upset about what others eat. Could you please point to a comment that you are referring to so this doesn't see so totally out of the blue?
If you are going to be critical of other people it's more polite, I believe, to make sure you do understand what they are saying and also to be specific so others don't think you mean them.If you ask someone who is very successful and fit what they do to get that way, you can't be offended that they don't tell you "I ate pizza, fries and cake the whole time!" because people who are very serious about health are never going to do that.
Hmm, now I am really confused. Maybe you posted in the wrong thread? Or didn't read this one?Everyone is here for different reasons. Many seem to be here to lose weight at the cost of anything else. They won't exercise (used to be me), won't eat a vegetable and then complain that they are starving on their two pieces of pizza and two donuts a day. They refuse to accept that a focus on nutrition AND calories is how many of us get to eat enough food for satiety and get offended when you tell them this has been your successful plan.
Who are these people and what do they have to do with this thread?Someone eating kale is not an indictment of your food choices.
Thank goodness, as I ate kale this morning! Wouldn't want to have thereby indicted my own food choices. I definitely would have had to appoint a special prosecutor for the trial!
How dare you persecute me! I haven't had breakfast yet, but I can assure you it won't include kale :sick:5 -
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.1 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
^^^Ditto! Excellent article.1 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.2 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
I got blood drawn at my job for a screening and the phlebotomist told me I should read up on the blood type diet!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's still a thing!3 -
That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.1
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That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.
I eat 250 grams and up of carbs per day. Why am I not skinny fat?14 -
When I'm maintaining, I eat 200 or over grams of carbs a day.
I'm not skinny fat either.
Adequate protein intake combined with resistance training determine if someone becomes skinny fat vs. retaining lean mass during weight loss, not carb intake.8 -
That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.
I eat 250 grams and up of carbs per day. Why am I not skinny fat?
I eat 400g of carbs per day and I'm trying to gain weight (bulking). Not skinny fat either. I mean, I lift 3x per week, but I wouldn't say I'm crazy active. Using words like "nobody should", "eating like that will make you fat" .. these generalizations have got to go.7 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Eh. I almost lost a friend over the blood type diet (mind you that was in 1998). She insisted that it's the only way to lose weight. I insisted I have no clue what my blood type is. (Still don't. I should probably get that determined one of these days).
TBH... I don't get that there's even an argument pertaining to a unit of measurement. It just seems silly to me. Same as it seems silly to me that the diet lauded as 'healthy' is a vegetarian diet (in the article in the OP). It's almost as if there's no middle ground between high carb, high fat on one side and no meat on the other.
Not to mention... homemade lasagna is probably the yummiest dish ever!2 -
Good read. I have always firmly believed that many people follow these different diet for a sense of belonging and to boost their egos.
There are certainly less decisions to be made when someone follows a strict preset (to be nice I won't call it a cult) list of do's and don't's. I think that is why at one point diets such as Jenny Craig, Nutrisystem and et al were so popular. People didn't have to make decisions...just eat the pre-made pre-determind meals.
Thanks for this article - it was an interesting read. I like to think that this is how I eat now, as I follow no restrictions other than calorie and portion control. Works a treat - over 100lbs gone in a year.5 -
That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.
Different macro combinations work for different people.
Adequate protein is important for muscle retention, but that is usually a constant number. If you are an active person and your TDEE is higher due to activity, you can more or less keep protein constant and fill the rest with what you want.
Eating a high amount of carbs != skinny fat unless you're running a huge deficit and not getting enough protein.2 -
That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.
Excuse me? I eat, well less, 214 grams and I don't see no problem here Mister.3 -
Why?That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous.
Why?True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active.
Why?Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing.
Why?I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day.
Why?My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates.
You have much to learn...If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.9 -
futuresize8 wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
I got blood drawn at my job for a screening and the phlebotomist told me I should read up on the blood type diet!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's still a thing!
Oh wow! I'm appalled! And somehow not surprised :-(1 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
This pops up on MFP every once in a while.
I'm a B, and apparently we are supposed to eat like riders on the steppes (or Dothraki, as I like to think of it). Recommendations are lots of goat, absolutely no chicken, and fermented mare's milk (well, this last one was really just lots of dairy, but I like it my way).
I love that diet.5 -
That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.
Let me guess....you eat Paleo. Every CrossFit "box" I've seen pushes paleo like it's a religion.
Eating carbs will not make you fat unless you're in a caloric surplus. There is no net fat storage while in a deficit regardless of the macro composition of your diet.9 -
That graphic is a horrible example of what you should eat. 263g of carbs in 1 day? Ridiculous. True, weight will probably be lost, but nobody should eat that many grams of carbs in a day unless they are crazy super active. Eating like that will make you fat, even if your number on the scale goes down. Skinny-fat is a real thing. I CrossFit and power lift. I burn anywhere from 800-2k calories 5x a week and don't eat more than 100g per day. My goal is 15% of my daily calories coming from carbohydrates. If all you care about is the number on the scale, great. Eat whatever you want and never go over your calorie goal. That number will go down. But as it does, so does your calorie goal. If you care about fat loss and building lean muscle then you need to pay attention to the macros of what you're putting in your mouth. More lean muscle means your RMR is higher which means even though you lose weight, you get to keep eating.
Eating more carbs doesn't make you skinny fat. Eating too little protein could be an issue (as could being sedentary), but you don't have to eat 15% carbs or some such to get adequate protein. At maintenance I really have no benefit (even thinking of it conservatively) to protein for more than about 20% of my diet (100-110 g), so how I choose to spend the remaining 80% between fat and carbs beyond getting in the minimum fatty acids needed really does not matter for body composition.6 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
This pops up on MFP every once in a while.
I'm a B, and apparently we are supposed to eat like riders on the steppes (or Dothraki, as I like to think of it). Recommendations are lots of goat, absolutely no chicken, and fermented mare's milk (well, this last one was really just lots of dairy, but I like it my way).
I love that diet.
Well, I'm also B, but I'll pass on the goat. Totally down with the dairy, though.3 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
This pops up on MFP every once in a while.
I'm a B, and apparently we are supposed to eat like riders on the steppes (or Dothraki, as I like to think of it). Recommendations are lots of goat, absolutely no chicken, and fermented mare's milk (well, this last one was really just lots of dairy, but I like it my way).
I love that diet.
This is hilarious.2 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
This pops up on MFP every once in a while.
I'm a B, and apparently we are supposed to eat like riders on the steppes (or Dothraki, as I like to think of it). Recommendations are lots of goat, absolutely no chicken, and fermented mare's milk (well, this last one was really just lots of dairy, but I like it my way).
I love that diet.
Well, I'm also B, but I'll pass on the goat. Totally down with the dairy, though.
Every type of goat dairy product I've tried tastes like the animal smells. I just can't consume it.4 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
This pops up on MFP every once in a while.
I'm a B, and apparently we are supposed to eat like riders on the steppes (or Dothraki, as I like to think of it). Recommendations are lots of goat, absolutely no chicken, and fermented mare's milk (well, this last one was really just lots of dairy, but I like it my way).
I love that diet.
Well, I'm also B, but I'll pass on the goat. Totally down with the dairy, though.
Every type of goat dairy product I've tried tastes like the animal smells. I just can't consume it.
Ah so the blood type diet would work for you:)
3 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Tacklewasher wrote: »
Bookmarked and thank you for this.
Still can't believe there is a blood type diet.
Seriously, it was a thing years ago. My bloodtype is AB neg and a couple of (younger) family members actually asked if I read the book. Very depressing news for AB blood types - we're very fragile and apparently most food gives us cancer.
This pops up on MFP every once in a while.
I'm a B, and apparently we are supposed to eat like riders on the steppes (or Dothraki, as I like to think of it). Recommendations are lots of goat, absolutely no chicken, and fermented mare's milk (well, this last one was really just lots of dairy, but I like it my way).
I love that diet.
Inexplicably, I can't have full-fat dairy, but apparently fat-free is OK. And I can't have chicken, but I can have rabbit. I've never had rabbit but people tell me it tastes like chicken, so it's probably not safe, right?3
This discussion has been closed.
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