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Flu shots? For them or against ?
Replies
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Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?GaleHawkins wrote: »nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU
It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
Whatttt???? Have you ever heard of a randomized controlled trial? Amateur.As far if Vitamin D3 is effective as a flu shot can not be proven one way or the other but some studies shows Vit D can lessen the risk for sickness.
This ties in with your ridiculous assertion that Vit D protects against influenza:
Essentially, you are trying to say that Vit D protects against influenza. It doesn't, no matter what you want to believe. And the study you keep linking to doesn't establish that in any way shape or form, so stop reposting it. All your doing is proving over and over that your an amateur.If low Vitamin D levels are a factor in getting the flu and other illnesses why not just develop flu protection by using Vitamin D that does not come with the side effects that can come with flu shots that can only offer limited protection at best or none at worse?
For the umpteenth time, Mercola is a quack. When you link to Mercola you lose the argument every time. The article you link to is complete garbage. What Metcola links to in that article doesn't support his pet hypothesis.For those who like to mention Mercola over and over here is some info from him dated 2011.
articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/09/22/new-study-shows-only-half-of-people-infected-with-flu-virus-actually-get-sick--why.aspx
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Im 18 now and never got the flu shot and has never got the flu. I rarely get sick. But everyone I know who gets shots like these get sick so easily.10
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@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up. Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
Welcome to MFP forums and the best of success in staying healthy.5 -
Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?GaleHawkins wrote: »nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU
It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.
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classyrice wrote: »Im 18 now and never got the flu shot and has never got the flu. I rarely get sick. But everyone I know who gets shots like these get sick so easily.
Mmm hmm.
You couldn't pay me to get one.
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GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up. Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
Welcome to MFP forums and the best of success in staying healthy.
Of course it is people with 'weaker immune systems' who go for the shots the most - those most at risk of the worst outcomes from influenza - ie death - are more vigilant about being protected.
No surprises there.
But healthy people do often get sick with the flu too as has been pointed out already.
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I get the flu shot every year, ever since I got the flu when I was 26 and was out of work for three weeks with it. I never want to be that miserable again4
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GaleHawkins wrote: »
Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?GaleHawkins wrote: »nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU
It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.
So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?
Here is the original paper:
http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
Please point out where it says that in the original research article.
Again, what in the world are you getting at here?8 -
Really? Why do you expect this? How would most people know if their immune system is weak. I'm required to get the flu vaccine along with the majority of the people I work with. None of us get sick that often. So no, her observation doesn't add up.GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up.
True, but healthy people do get the flu as I pointed out earlier, which you seemed to conveniently ignore.Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
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VeronicaA76 wrote: »For them. I see no problem with them, have no negative reactions, and if it keeps me from getting sick even just one time a year, it's worth it to me.
Some people don't want them for thier own personal reason, I don't have a problem with that. Thier choice, thier business.
My bolding. You say that bit like 1 time a year is quite a small thing. That seems quite frequent to me - especially given we're talking about an illness that requires time off work in most cases (every case?). I'd certainly get it if I was getting flu that frequently or maybe even knowingly coming into contact with it that often through friends+colleagues. Would you still think it worth it if it was stopping you getting sick 1 time in 5 years? 10? 20? At the latter end of that scale, a shot every year it could actually mean taking less time off work to just catch the flu (although obviously more unpleasant!!). Some people have to book a half day off at work to go to the doctors - don't know if one could get it elsewhere at the weekend, but then that's more time in figuring out where to go... Very different scenario if your employer or someone offers it of course.0 -
Aaaah, to be young and not give a crap about the people around you
Or not so young and obsessed with conspiracy theories and miracle cures
Once I was out of school, I stopped getting the flu shot because I figured I was young and healthy and not in danger of getting the flu.
Then two things happened: A thirty-something woman I worked with who was at least outwardly healthy, got the flu and ended up in the hospital. This caused me to do some research, which was the second thing that happened - I learned about herd immunity, and how if healthy people get the shot, it helps to limit the spread of the flu virus which can protect people who can't get the shot for medical reasons.
The research around Vitamin D is fascinating, but is in it's infancy and still mostly stumbling in the dark.
Since I do occasionally leave my apartment and mingle with people whose health status I simply don't know, I get the shot as one small way to be a decent human being. And it's a little extra insurance for myself. The 5 minutes I spend at CVS getting the shot, and the couple of hours my arm is sore, is a small price to pay.14 -
Yes, we both do and my husband did when he was alive. My health is precarious and we go to church and the pool and other places with people. Also, my work provides the shot free and then I have insurance for my child. I hate the needle/shot but more I hate the sickness and what it can do to us. Also pneumonia for me and soon shingles.1
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Flu shots coddle your immune system. There are vaccinations that are indisputable (measles, hepatitis, meningitis, etc.) because contracting them is commonly fatal. Then there are band-aid vaccinations like the flu shot where roughly 36k die/year from the flu which is usually complemented by other complications. Not exactly lethal. When the strains of the flu are constantly changing, vaccination cannot really give you the security or protection from those strains. Cut the bull* that you're doing ME a favor by getting YOUR flu shot. If it makes you feel better to get one, great, get one for yourself. However, until its required by law, I'm going to continue taking my Vitamin C pouches, drinking my tea, and using my hand sanitizer ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
This is like saying push-ups & deadlifts coddle muscle growth, so you're going to sit on that couch over yonder and wait to get fit.
So you're disputing the repeatable, provable scientific disciplines of immunology and virology, but totally on board with use of supplements (which by very definition cannot prove effectivity) like vitamin C, drinking tea, and using hand sanitizer? I have some snake oils and poultices to sell you.13 -
Rosemary7391 wrote: »Some people have to book a half day off at work to go to the doctors - don't know if one could get it elsewhere at the weekend, but then that's more time in figuring out where to go... Very different scenario if your employer or someone offers it of course.
If it's a problem to take off work to go to the doctor, most pharmacies give flu shots, at least where I live (east coast USA). The pharmacy gives shots as long as they are open, which includes weekends.
Some communities organize additional places for shots, like at soup kitchens where they are free for the poor.1 -
Rosemary7391 wrote: »Some people have to book a half day off at work to go to the doctors - don't know if one could get it elsewhere at the weekend, but then that's more time in figuring out where to go... Very different scenario if your employer or someone offers it of course.
If it's a problem to take off work to go to the doctor, most pharmacies give flu shots, at least where I live (east coast USA). The pharmacy gives shots as long as they are open, which includes weekends.
Some communities organize additional places for shots, like at soup kitchens where they are free for the poor.
Yeah, in the last few years I have gotten my flu shot:
-at Target
-at an area independent pharmacy (they ran a coupon in the paper!)
-at an on-site event offered by my employer
-at local grocery store pharmacy while shopping
The three that weren't at work were by far the most flexible about day/time. The slowest was the grocery store pharmacy, but in large part that was because there was only one person who could administer the shot and they were occupied by a Grade-A Difficult Customer at the same time that I walked up and asked about the shot.1 -
MarylandRose wrote: »Rosemary7391 wrote: »Some people have to book a half day off at work to go to the doctors - don't know if one could get it elsewhere at the weekend, but then that's more time in figuring out where to go... Very different scenario if your employer or someone offers it of course.
If it's a problem to take off work to go to the doctor, most pharmacies give flu shots, at least where I live (east coast USA). The pharmacy gives shots as long as they are open, which includes weekends.
Some communities organize additional places for shots, like at soup kitchens where they are free for the poor.
Yeah, in the last few years I have gotten my flu shot:
-at Target
-at an area independent pharmacy (they ran a coupon in the paper!)
-at an on-site event offered by my employer
-at local grocery store pharmacy while shopping
The three that weren't at work were by far the most flexible about day/time. The slowest was the grocery store pharmacy, but in large part that was because there was only one person who could administer the shot and they were occupied by a Grade-A Difficult Customer at the same time that I walked up and asked about the shot.
I've only ever had vaccines at the GP. Except for yellow fever, they couldn't do that one and I had to travel to a bigger place in the next city for it. Maybe pharmacies do flu shots here too but I've not been in one lately to see! Hence why I said you'd have to figure out where to go...0 -
MarylandRose wrote: »Rosemary7391 wrote: »Some people have to book a half day off at work to go to the doctors - don't know if one could get it elsewhere at the weekend, but then that's more time in figuring out where to go... Very different scenario if your employer or someone offers it of course.
If it's a problem to take off work to go to the doctor, most pharmacies give flu shots, at least where I live (east coast USA). The pharmacy gives shots as long as they are open, which includes weekends.
Some communities organize additional places for shots, like at soup kitchens where they are free for the poor.
Yeah, in the last few years I have gotten my flu shot:
-at Target
-at an area independent pharmacy (they ran a coupon in the paper!)
-at an on-site event offered by my employer
-at local grocery store pharmacy while shopping
The three that weren't at work were by far the most flexible about day/time. The slowest was the grocery store pharmacy, but in large part that was because there was only one person who could administer the shot and they were occupied by a Grade-A Difficult Customer at the same time that I walked up and asked about the shot.
Yep, I've seen "Flu shots available now!" signs outside of Walmart, Target, CVS, and both grocery stores I go to in the last couple of weeks. I had figured that's why this discussion had popped back up. I guess that isn't true everywhere.1 -
Really? Why do you expect this? How would most people know if their immune system is weak. I'm required to get the flu vaccine along with the majority of the people I work with. None of us get sick that often. So no, her observation doesn't add up.GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up.
True, but healthy people do get the flu as I pointed out earlier, which you seemed to conveniently ignore.Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
When we get disease like the flu we can assume we aren't truly healthy because our immune system was compromised at that time.5 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »
Really? Why do you expect this? How would most people know if their immune system is weak. I'm required to get the flu vaccine along with the majority of the people I work with. None of us get sick that often. So no, her observation doesn't add up.GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up.
True, but healthy people do get the flu as I pointed out earlier, which you seemed to conveniently ignore.Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
When we get disease like the flu we can assume we aren't truly healthy because our immune system was compromised at that time.
You can assume anything. Of course you would be going against the body of knowledge within immunology and virology, which would contradict your assumption.4 -
I'm against them. I work in health care and the one time I was forced to get a flu shot (or wear a mask at work all shift, no thank you) at a hospital job I started to see issues with my overall health decline. I think it's coincidental that it started right after that flu shot that I didn't even need. There are many strains of the flu so one shot won't help with all strains and I've always been told the shot you get most likely isn't the same as the strains out there.8
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KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.
I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.8 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »
Really? Why do you expect this? How would most people know if their immune system is weak. I'm required to get the flu vaccine along with the majority of the people I work with. None of us get sick that often. So no, her observation doesn't add up.GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up.
True, but healthy people do get the flu as I pointed out earlier, which you seemed to conveniently ignore.Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
When we get disease like the flu we can assume we aren't truly healthy because our immune system was compromised at that time.
This is an unfounded assumption.0 -
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perkymommy wrote: »KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.
I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.
I assume you never eat at restaurants, at friends' houses, or buy prepackaged food? Or for that matter, food ingredients not hand raised by you? Because the flu shot has a heck of a lot more oversight ensuring it is exactly what it says it is, and a lot more transparency, than anything else you might put in your body.9 -
perkymommy wrote: »KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.
I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.
If this is truly your view, then I see no way - other than insurance/receptionist/janitor/cafeteria/etc - that you really work in health care.3 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »
Really? Why do you expect this? How would most people know if their immune system is weak. I'm required to get the flu vaccine along with the majority of the people I work with. None of us get sick that often. So no, her observation doesn't add up.GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up.
True, but healthy people do get the flu as I pointed out earlier, which you seemed to conveniently ignore.Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
When we get disease like the flu we can assume we aren't truly healthy because our immune system was compromised at that time.
Wrong as usual Gale.
This is an argument by repeated assertion, a logical fallacy. It's a typical debate technique when you have nothing to support your weak argument, usually employed by those like yourself who spend alot of time dumpster diving in the world of pseudoscience.
Now, do you have any peer reviewed citations to support this nonsense?4 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »
Really? Why do you expect this? How would most people know if their immune system is weak. I'm required to get the flu vaccine along with the majority of the people I work with. None of us get sick that often. So no, her observation doesn't add up.GaleHawkins wrote: »@classyrice I expect it is the people with weaker immune systems that goes for the shots the most so your observation adds up.
True, but healthy people do get the flu as I pointed out earlier, which you seemed to conveniently ignore.Typically healthy people do not get sick often anyway.
When we get disease like the flu we can assume we aren't truly healthy because our immune system was compromised at that time.
nope - you can have the strongest most well adapted immune system in the world and present it with a new virus and unless the new virus mimics an existing virus (for which you are prepared) and you immune system will fail - i.e. you will get sick.0 -
perkymommy wrote: »KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.
I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.
Why in the world do you think they are lying about what is in the vaccine?
And I agree with other posters, you really should not be involved in the healthcare field with these tires of responses.3 -
perkymommy wrote: »KANGOOJUMPS wrote: »well for... of course. why put your life in any kind of sickness if you do not have to. no brainer really. I think the people that are against are just afraid of needles.
I have no problem with needles. I have a problem with something foreign being put in to my body that I truly am not certain that's what it really is what they say it is.
Why in the world do you think they are lying about what is in the vaccine?
And I agree with other posters, you really should not be involved in the healthcare field with these tires of responses.
John do you not understand the resistance to the flu shots is coming from within the healthcare profession not the unaware public in general.5 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »
Huh???? What in the world are you getting at here?GaleHawkins wrote: »nbcnews.com/id/44275043/ns/health-cold_and_flu/t/why-some-people-dont-get-flu/#.WZopsj6GPIU
It seems those who do not get the flu really do get the flu.
I was not trying to get at anything. The article stands on its on legs. Everyone gets the flu but the flu does not get everyone per the article. The status of one's immune system seems to be what decides the side effects of getting the flu.
So spectacularly wrong. You really think that that is what the research says?
Here is the original paper:
http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1002234
Please point out where it says that in the original research article.
Again, what in the world are you getting at here?
John did you follow your posted link quoted in this post and read the below?
journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article/comment?id=10.1371/annotation/b761db38-b594-44b3-b608-1743595d6ab7
Vitamin D may explain some of the findings of this paper4
This discussion has been closed.
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