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Government control of portion sizes and calories
Replies
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peckchris3267 wrote: »What about those whose job involves hard physical labor and they require high calorie food? Are they going to have to buy two lunches now to get through the rest of the day just because others have no self control?
They could pack their own lunches and not hold outside establishments accountable for their failure to plan.
Notwithstanding the sanctimonious nonsense we've seen from the individual that you're responding to, in the UK much of the industry that involves significant manual labour is very mobile. Much of the construction industry involves a peripatetic workforce who end up staying in budget hotels.
From the perspective of someone who ends up staying in mid-market hotels 3-4 nights per week, it becomes quite challenging to plan..., while I'm not in a manual job I still need to allow around 800 calories for lunches.1 -
Packerjohn wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »I actually don't see people walking around with soda much, and certainly not bottles larger than 591 ml (the 20 oz), which is popular but I don't think more than the 12 oz can. This could be location specific, though. I do see people walking with coffee/coffee drinks and water. People must buy the ridiculous Big Gulp things, but I never see people walking around drinking them.
Go to a convenience store, gas station, truck stop, etc where people are getting in their cars. The large cups fly out of those places.
Well, then, they aren't walking around, are they?
I don't drive much either, so again may be atypical.
On the giant coffees, I mostly see people with coffee on the commute too, and probably walking around the vast majority of people I see aren't drinking anything (although we may be more likely to have a water bottle with us, as that seems common enough). I personally HAVE been known to walk around with a giant cold brew sometimes (mostly on a very hot day). My point was more that giant drink does not necessarily = lots of calories.
For the record, I have no particular broader point on the walking around with drinks thing except the UK posters seem to be getting the idea that everyone in the US is carrying giant beverages at all times and really that does not reflect what I see at all (in a city full of people walking around quite a bit).
True for me here in the US, too . . . but just wait until they design and market a strap-on tummy-mounted cup holder with built-in straw extender.
Hey . . . <furrows brow, thinks . . . heads for Kickstarter>.
Just kidding. Really.
They pretty much beat you to it:
This is available on Amazon.
I'm torn between inspiring and awesome....
Needs tubing, otherwise my arms may get sore from all those 12 oz curls.
That was in my original design, back just a few posts ago. Just sayin'.
Or maybe it just should just be soda pop or sweet tea or fancy coffee sold in a single-use recyclable Camelbak?1 -
Packerjohn wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »I actually don't see people walking around with soda much, and certainly not bottles larger than 591 ml (the 20 oz), which is popular but I don't think more than the 12 oz can. This could be location specific, though. I do see people walking with coffee/coffee drinks and water. People must buy the ridiculous Big Gulp things, but I never see people walking around drinking them.
Go to a convenience store, gas station, truck stop, etc where people are getting in their cars. The large cups fly out of those places.
Well, then, they aren't walking around, are they?
I don't drive much either, so again may be atypical.
On the giant coffees, I mostly see people with coffee on the commute too, and probably walking around the vast majority of people I see aren't drinking anything (although we may be more likely to have a water bottle with us, as that seems common enough). I personally HAVE been known to walk around with a giant cold brew sometimes (mostly on a very hot day). My point was more that giant drink does not necessarily = lots of calories.
For the record, I have no particular broader point on the walking around with drinks thing except the UK posters seem to be getting the idea that everyone in the US is carrying giant beverages at all times and really that does not reflect what I see at all (in a city full of people walking around quite a bit).
True for me here in the US, too . . . but just wait until they design and market a strap-on tummy-mounted cup holder with built-in straw extender.
Hey . . . <furrows brow, thinks . . . heads for Kickstarter>.
Just kidding. Really.
They pretty much beat you to it:
This is available on Amazon.
I'm torn between inspiring and awesome....
Needs tubing, otherwise my arms may get sore from all those 12 oz curls.
That was in my original design, back just a few posts ago. Just sayin'.
Or maybe it just should just be soda pop or sweet tea or fancy coffee sold in a single-use recyclable Camelbak?
If we join forces with this:
We'd be unstoppable!3 -
VintageFeline wrote: »OliveGirl128 wrote: »VintageFeline wrote: »To go boxes in restaurants aren't really a thing here.
I always ask for one when I order my food because I know some of its going home with me. I'm on a wet burrito kick right now when we go out and those things are huge!
I could ask but I wouldn't get one. Unless a restaurant delivers food (say an Indian or Chinese) then they won't even have a box for you take home leftovers. Even then it would be odd to ask to take your leftovers. They'd probably also look at you as if you'd just grown two heads in front of their very eyes. Just not a British thing.
They are the norm here.. but that's probably because of our massively huge restaurant portions.1 -
This article was on the BBC this morning about the UK government setting targets to reduce the calories in fast food and ready meals.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-40967300
Responses on Facebook were very negative with people feeling that this was too 'nanny-state' but I can see the benefits. It is difficult to make healthy decisions on convenience food when you only have an array of high calorie options. Bringing down he calories and portion sizes as a whole will help people make better decisions.
However, I believe that at a less controversial move would simply be to provide the nutritional information so that customers can make an informed choice. Some restaurant chains in the UK do this but the vast majority do not. Then you can make people more aware of how many calories they are consuming but they are allowed to make their own choice in whether to overindulge.
What do you think?
on enforcing some sort of maximum calories on items - no
on enforcing calorie listings on fast food or large chains - yes
No one is forcing people to eat the entire thing by themselves in 1 sitting - that is their own stupid choice (as it should be). Huge portions at a fast food place could be a good value for a family - no reason a large burger and fries or large order of chicken nuggets or a donut/dessert item can't be split amongst multiple family members or a couple; or last multiple meals for a single person. Having a visible calorie listing on the menu is imo a good idea though (and maybe a reminder sign somewhere of a typical calorie %DV). More people need to be educated that certain items/combos are multiple days/persons worth of food. Others don't care and would just order like 5 of whatever smaller item (which already happens).2 -
Education doesn't lead to implementation. The calorie info on food doesn't do anything to stop people from overconsumption. Why the *kitten* do adults need the government to tell them how or what to eat?!4
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Education doesn't lead to implementation. The calorie info on food doesn't do anything to stop people from overconsumption. Why the *kitten* do adults need the government to tell them how or what to eat?!
Quite.
And as I said upthread, there's a plethora of options from low calorie right through to indulgent in the ready meals section of our supermarket fridges. The calories and macro breakdown AND percentages of average RDA recommendations are right there on the front (this applies to all packaged foods, not just ready meals). That was helpful legislation brought in some years ago. And guess what? We're still fat and getting fatter.
Adults aren't totally oblivious that they are eating too much, including too many calorie dense foods. They are however in denial. Ain't no legislating for that.2 -
Education helps, if people are not given the basics in the first place, many are not likely to look out information for themselves.4
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Education helps, if people are not given the basics in the first place, many are not likely to look out information for themselves.
I see this as the key. Rather than putting the money into regulating portion sizes, hire a high-powered "big food" ad agency to put out PSAs to push healthy eating guidelines. Make the spots as compelling as McDonald's ads. Pile up splashy booklets in places people go often containing easily understood and implemented meal plans, using the principles that make woo diet plans attractive. Sometimes people just don't know where to start. Spotlight meal combinations at various fast-food places that incorporate appropriate calories rather than trying to persuade people to avoid fast food altogether. Teach people how to incorporate treats into their diet rather than making big macs the devil.1 -
Education helps, if people are not given the basics in the first place, many are not likely to look out information for themselves.
I see this as the key. Rather than putting the money into regulating portion sizes, hire a high-powered "big food" ad agency to put out PSAs to push healthy eating guidelines. Make the spots as compelling as McDonald's ads. Pile up splashy booklets in places people go often containing easily understood and implemented meal plans, using the principles that make woo diet plans attractive. Sometimes people just don't know where to start. Spotlight meal combinations at various fast-food places that incorporate appropriate calories rather than trying to persuade people to avoid fast food altogether. Teach people how to incorporate treats into their diet rather than making big macs the devil.
I actually think the NHS does a good job at this sort of thing. This campaign which is aimed at families https://www.nhs.uk/change4life-beta/cards#Oijl3LHBzlVfpfRx.97 is fantastic for example.
They even have an app where they provide a free, albeit quite boring, easy to cook meal plan.
But as someone said upthread. People can have all the information in the world. It doesn't mean they will use it unfortunately.3 -
VintageFeline wrote: »OliveGirl128 wrote: »VintageFeline wrote: »To go boxes in restaurants aren't really a thing here.
I always ask for one when I order my food because I know some of its going home with me. I'm on a wet burrito kick right now when we go out and those things are huge!
I could ask but I wouldn't get one. Unless a restaurant delivers food (say an Indian or Chinese) then they won't even have a box for you take home leftovers. Even then it would be odd to ask to take your leftovers. They'd probably also look at you as if you'd just grown two heads in front of their very eyes. Just not a British thing.
That must be because I see you live in London. In the North of England it's not unusual or odd to take your leftovers. But you'd usually get it wrapped in tinfoil rather than in a special box.
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VintageFeline wrote: »OliveGirl128 wrote: »VintageFeline wrote: »To go boxes in restaurants aren't really a thing here.
I always ask for one when I order my food because I know some of its going home with me. I'm on a wet burrito kick right now when we go out and those things are huge!
I could ask but I wouldn't get one. Unless a restaurant delivers food (say an Indian or Chinese) then they won't even have a box for you take home leftovers. Even then it would be odd to ask to take your leftovers. They'd probably also look at you as if you'd just grown two heads in front of their very eyes. Just not a British thing.
That must be because I see you live in London. In the North of England it's not unusual or odd to take your leftovers. But you'd usually get it wrapped in tinfoil rather than in a special box.
Ha! Same in Edinburgh on the no leftovers (where I'm from). Maybe I just live in too posh places.....1 -
VintageFeline wrote: »OliveGirl128 wrote: »VintageFeline wrote: »To go boxes in restaurants aren't really a thing here.
I always ask for one when I order my food because I know some of its going home with me. I'm on a wet burrito kick right now when we go out and those things are huge!
I could ask but I wouldn't get one. Unless a restaurant delivers food (say an Indian or Chinese) then they won't even have a box for you take home leftovers. Even then it would be odd to ask to take your leftovers. They'd probably also look at you as if you'd just grown two heads in front of their very eyes. Just not a British thing.
That must be because I see you live in London. In the North of England it's not unusual or odd to take your leftovers. But you'd usually get it wrapped in tinfoil rather than in a special box.
My '10 pound pom' immigrant grandparents who moved from London to Australia in the 1960's would always ask for a 'doggy bag' (leftovers wrapped packaged to take home) whenever we ate out when I was a child (late 1980's).
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Doggy bags were definitely a thing but I haven't seen anyone offered, ask or take one since I don't know when. But then maybe people are just clearing their plates more now and have no need!2
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It was commonly called a doggy bag in the US when I was a kid. I remember during my teenage years I thought that was an embarrassing term (no clue why, teenagers), and when my mom told me to get a doggy bag for my leftovers made a point of refusing to use the term (we were probably at some sort of steakhouse which is what we used to do for special family dinners), and they brought it in a wrapper with little drawings of dogs on it. Naturally, everyone laughed at me.1
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lemurcat12 wrote: »It was commonly called a doggy bag in the US when I was a kid. I remember during my teenage years I thought that was an embarrassing term (no clue why, teenagers), and when my mom told me to get a doggy bag for my leftovers made a point of refusing to use the term (we were probably at some sort of steakhouse which is what we used to do for special family dinners), and they brought it in a wrapper with little drawings of dogs on it. Naturally, everyone laughed at me.
Yeah, it was called a "doggy bag" because there was always the pretense that you were taking the leftovers home for your dog.
Nowadays, you don't even get a bag, you get a styrofoam clamshell.
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This is what happens when the prime are subjects, not citizens.
Moochelle's school lunch mandate was a failure because it demanded a one size fits all based on all students having a sedentary base line. No allowance for different natural metabolic rates or activity. Athletes had to being food from home.
In some schools, they were taking away three lunches students brought from home.
Government caused the rise in obesity by pushing high carb low fat food pyramid.4 -
To answer some of the points above.
1. People will just buy 2 portions if they are made smaller/less calorific.
There is evidence that this is not how people behave. We are talking small decreases of say 10% or less. We do not have exact "calorimeters" in our body. Most will buy their big Mac or ready meal and be just as satisfied. Just as people didn't add more salt when it as taken out of food.
2. This is unwarranted government control
Well you take a view on that. But in the US vitamin D is added on a voluntary basis to 99% of milk and in the UK salt has been taken out of food on a voluntary basis- a small and gradual reduction. Both have proved successful at reducing disease/illness and death.
If millions of people were dying in plane crashes each year which is what is happening with the obesity crisis, you would at least expect the government to encourage the airlines to fly a bit more safely!
3. We should improve nutritional information, education and personal responsibility instead.
You fight wars normally with all the tools at your disposal - navy, army and air force. Much has been done in these other aspects as well but there is much to do.
They can each help to contribute to each other. The sum can be greater than the parts.
4. Government guidelines and interference has caused the obesity crisis
Well by and large it has been caused overwhelmingly by our affluence. There is not much obesity in developing countries where getting enough food is the problem. We need to fight back with all the tools at our disposal.
5. This is the nanny state telling us what to do.
For some reason we think it is OK for McDonald's and Coke telling us what to do!
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To answer some of the points above.
1. People will just buy 2 portions if they are made smaller/less calorific.
There is evidence that this is not how people behave. We are talking small decreases of say 10% or less. We do not have exact "calorimeters" in our body. Most will buy their big Mac or ready meal and be just as satisfied. Just as people didn't add more salt when it as taken out of food.
2. This is unwarranted government control
Well you take a view on that. But in the US vitamin D is added on a voluntary basis to 99% of milk and in the UK salt has been taken out of food on a voluntary basis- a small and gradual reduction. Both have proved successful at reducing disease/illness and death.
If millions of people were dying in plane crashes each year which is what is happening with the obesity crisis, you would at least expect the government to encourage the airlines to fly a bit more safely!
3. We should improve nutritional information, education and personal responsibility instead.
You fight wars normally with all the tools at your disposal - navy, army and air force. Much has been done in these other aspects as well but there is much to do.
They can each help to contribute to each other. The sum can be greater than the parts.
4. Government guidelines and interference has caused the obesity crisis
Well by and large it has been caused overwhelmingly by our affluence. There is not much obesity in developing countries where getting enough food is the problem. We need to fight back with all the tools at our disposal.
5. This is the nanny state telling us what to do.
For some reason we think it is OK for McDonald's and Coke telling us what to do!
McDonald's and Coca-Cola have never told me what to do. They offer products for me to purchase, if I want them. They run advertisements that express, in their opinion, the advantages of their products. But I'm free to turn them down if I don't want them.3 -
The ones who benefit most from decreasing the portion sizes will be the restaurants as they will be able to give you half the food they were giving you without reducing prices.
They McDs did this with their fries several years ago after that guy sued the fast food chains claiming they caused him to have a three heart attacks0
This discussion has been closed.
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