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Is a calorie equal to a calorie?
Replies
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myinsbroker wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »moosmum1972 wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Not sure what you mean a calories is a unit of measure in energy
If you have 300 calories in pure suger vrs 300 calories in complex carbs you will have difrent longevity of energy
that would be like going to the Indy 500 with a beat up old car because a car is a car
Maybe come back when you have an understanding of what 'energy' is (in the sense of 'energy balance', which is what defines how weight is lost or gained) and it will make more sense to you.
I do now, The point is at one time I didn't, I looked for advise from those that are supposed to be experts. to say a calorie is a calorie and then say well you need to learn physics is ridiculous.
I am not going to sell and Insurance policy without breaking it down to an understandable language that people can understand in a practical real world way
Same way giving that advice to a person new to losing weight is harmful
and that's the last I will say on it
We're saying that because there are multiple types of energy. And you are confusing two of them. You are telling us we aren't correct because you aren't understanding the terms we are using. But you don't want to talk about it anymore so it is what it is I guess :drinker:
Because I don't really want to argue or make everyone angry and I can see this is going nowhere
All I wanted to do is try and make people aware that the blanket statement that a calorie is just a calorie can cause harm.
I didnt get it here when I was told this it was from my heart doctor well before I seen this forum. All I am saying is that blanket advice took me from 320lbs to 360 lbs and a lot of pain struggling with binging.
I have since went to the internet becuase I was 368 and learned how to eat right. Now I am at 305
I know see this same blanket statement on this forum and all I want is for the next person to not be misled. I am not trying to start a fight I just know the pain I have had over it and dont want to see others do the same, That is all
...but...but...myinsbroker wrote:and that's the last I will say on it
You lost weight because your caloric intake was less than your caloric output. How is this confusing?
My calorie intake is less because the calories I take in work better
...and your proof is?
Why are people feeding the T ........
I think someone has made a second account...again.
Really now you are resorting to false accusations?
Wow
Have you gone back to read this thread in it's entirety, or at least the first few pages where good helpful information was shared about why a calorie is a calorie, but nutrition and satiety are important factors to consider in building a sustainable plan for oneself? Have you read any of the stickied posts I suggested?
Yes I understand what you are saying,
What I will say and I dont read the forum all the time, honestly when I go to add to my diary and I see a thread that sounds interesting on that left side I might click and that is how I ran into this thread yesterday so I dont frequent this forum. However in the past I have seen it said simple a calorie is just a calorie and if there is any question it is meet with the " does 10 Lbs of rocks wiegh more then 10 lbs of feathers " cliche
If I seen it most times presented difrently like it is now after back and forth then we wouldnt be speaking about this right now
All I am saying is when it was rpesented to me ( not on this forum) I didnt know enough to question, I was dont dont get crazy with this or that just keeep under the calories, I didnt know anything aboout fiber protien fat to keep full or complexe carbs for lasting energy
If it was said more times (like it is now present and has been presented in this thread) a calorie is just a calorie but nutrients can make the difrence in meeeting calorie cgoals we wouldnt be having this conversation righ now
I think this was meant to be a concession (though admittedly not the most conciliatory one).
I think it's possible that someone has learned something.4 -
WinoGelato wrote: »You keep saying that this is common place but I have been on these boards A LOT and I don't see it.
People see what they want to see, to fit the narrative they keep telling themselves...
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myinsbroker wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »moosmum1972 wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Not sure what you mean a calories is a unit of measure in energy
If you have 300 calories in pure suger vrs 300 calories in complex carbs you will have difrent longevity of energy
that would be like going to the Indy 500 with a beat up old car because a car is a car
Maybe come back when you have an understanding of what 'energy' is (in the sense of 'energy balance', which is what defines how weight is lost or gained) and it will make more sense to you.
I do now, The point is at one time I didn't, I looked for advise from those that are supposed to be experts. to say a calorie is a calorie and then say well you need to learn physics is ridiculous.
I am not going to sell and Insurance policy without breaking it down to an understandable language that people can understand in a practical real world way
Same way giving that advice to a person new to losing weight is harmful
and that's the last I will say on it
We're saying that because there are multiple types of energy. And you are confusing two of them. You are telling us we aren't correct because you aren't understanding the terms we are using. But you don't want to talk about it anymore so it is what it is I guess :drinker:
Because I don't really want to argue or make everyone angry and I can see this is going nowhere
All I wanted to do is try and make people aware that the blanket statement that a calorie is just a calorie can cause harm.
I didnt get it here when I was told this it was from my heart doctor well before I seen this forum. All I am saying is that blanket advice took me from 320lbs to 360 lbs and a lot of pain struggling with binging.
I have since went to the internet becuase I was 368 and learned how to eat right. Now I am at 305
I know see this same blanket statement on this forum and all I want is for the next person to not be misled. I am not trying to start a fight I just know the pain I have had over it and dont want to see others do the same, That is all
...but...but...myinsbroker wrote:and that's the last I will say on it
You lost weight because your caloric intake was less than your caloric output. How is this confusing?
My calorie intake is less because the calories I take in work better
...and your proof is?
Why are people feeding the T ........
I think someone has made a second account...again.
Really now you are resorting to false accusations?
Wow
Have you gone back to read this thread in it's entirety, or at least the first few pages where good helpful information was shared about why a calorie is a calorie, but nutrition and satiety are important factors to consider in building a sustainable plan for oneself? Have you read any of the stickied posts I suggested?
Yes I understand what you are saying,
What I will say and I dont read the forum all the time, honestly when I go to add to my diary and I see a thread that sounds interesting on that left side I might click and that is how I ran into this thread yesterday so I dont frequent this forum. However in the past I have seen it said simple a calorie is just a calorie and if there is any question it is meet with the " does 10 Lbs of rocks wiegh more then 10 lbs of feathers " cliche
It's been discussed MANY times on this forum. NEVER have I seen a thread where it was not stated, over and over, that food choice matters for satiety and nutrition, and that "a calorie is a calorie" means that calories are what matters for weight gain, loss, or maintenance. What makes it possible to eat the right calories is more individual and likely does relate to food choice, in part.
Every single time. Not every single post, but always one of the first few posts and repeatedly after that.
When people claim that they got the impression from a discussion that food choice did not matter for any purpose, they can never identify a thread where that happened.
Also, and I ask this sincerely, surely the fact that food choice matters for nutrition is really, really common knowledge and impossible not to be aware of, no? I mean, not only every thread on the topic at MFP, but the US Dietary Guidelines, MyPlate, what they teach in school, what's in every popular magazine and so on.
As for mattering for satiety, isn't that a matter of common sense and paying attention?2 -
stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?1 -
Why are we skating around the real issue? Tube, crew, or ankle?1
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stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
Socks are a special sub bread.1 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
Socks are a special sub bread.
kitten = master debator
by the way.
ah- sub bread- interesting- whole wheat or white?1 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
Socks are a special sub bread.
kitten = master debator
by the way.
ah- sub bread- interesting- whole wheat or white?
Depends if it's the clean or dirty version.
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Wheelhouse15 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
I was on a forum for a while where there was a guy who basically had a sock army, we all knew it and who they were, but he actually did create an individual personality and decently detailed profile for each, he had way too much time on his hands and it was kind of disturbing lol.
That's at least interesting and fun, and sometimes you want to play devil's advocate to fully explore the contrary position to a popular topic that you generally agree with.1 -
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PikaJoyJoy wrote: »
how did you find a real live picture of me?!?!?!?!?1 -
stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
archaic BB/Newsboard/forum/usenet term
Sock-Sock puppet, once upon a time(when the internet was young) your identity was associated with your email, and having your email could be easily associated with your real identity. As the internet expanded from educational and premium pay services to "throwaway" accounts from services like AOL, it became possible and then easy to create alternate identities. A sock(puppet) is a secondary, tertiary, etc account that may or may not be associated with the primary account and is used for some level of trolling. Either to upvote/agree or downvote/disagree with the primary account.0 -
2
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stanmann571 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
archaic BB/Newsboard/forum/usenet term
Sock-Sock puppet, once upon a time(when the internet was young) your identity was associated with your email, and having your email could be easily associated with your real identity. As the internet expanded from educational and premium pay services to "throwaway" accounts from services like AOL, it became possible and then easy to create alternate identities. A sock(puppet) is a secondary, tertiary, etc account that may or may not be associated with the primary account and is used for some level of trolling. Either to upvote/agree or downvote/disagree with the primary account.
2 -
This content has been removed.
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moosmum1972 wrote: »PikaJoyJoy wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
archaic BB/Newsboard/forum/usenet term
Sock-Sock puppet, once upon a time(when the internet was young) your identity was associated with your email, and having your email could be easily associated with your real identity. As the internet expanded from educational and premium pay services to "throwaway" accounts from services like AOL, it became possible and then easy to create alternate identities. A sock(puppet) is a secondary, tertiary, etc account that may or may not be associated with the primary account and is used for some level of trolling. Either to upvote/agree or downvote/disagree with the primary account.
Mfp peeps....don't ever change.
You missed a great thread last weekend. We had one of the more infamous trolls start a usual thread and it ended up in a Samuel L Jackson meme thread with tons of puns. It was the best lol.1 -
Great discussion.
A few years ago, before I had kids, I did a weight loss program here.. I stayed within my calories... but I also drank a lot of beer, I tracked it, I went way over. Beer was the only thing that I'd go way over on... I still lost lots of weight.2 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »moosmum1972 wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Not sure what you mean a calories is a unit of measure in energy
If you have 300 calories in pure suger vrs 300 calories in complex carbs you will have difrent longevity of energy
that would be like going to the Indy 500 with a beat up old car because a car is a car
Maybe come back when you have an understanding of what 'energy' is (in the sense of 'energy balance', which is what defines how weight is lost or gained) and it will make more sense to you.
I do now, The point is at one time I didn't, I looked for advise from those that are supposed to be experts. to say a calorie is a calorie and then say well you need to learn physics is ridiculous.
I am not going to sell and Insurance policy without breaking it down to an understandable language that people can understand in a practical real world way
Same way giving that advice to a person new to losing weight is harmful
and that's the last I will say on it
We're saying that because there are multiple types of energy. And you are confusing two of them. You are telling us we aren't correct because you aren't understanding the terms we are using. But you don't want to talk about it anymore so it is what it is I guess :drinker:
Because I don't really want to argue or make everyone angry and I can see this is going nowhere
All I wanted to do is try and make people aware that the blanket statement that a calorie is just a calorie can cause harm.
I didnt get it here when I was told this it was from my heart doctor well before I seen this forum. All I am saying is that blanket advice took me from 320lbs to 360 lbs and a lot of pain struggling with binging.
I have since went to the internet becuase I was 368 and learned how to eat right. Now I am at 305
I know see this same blanket statement on this forum and all I want is for the next person to not be misled. I am not trying to start a fight I just know the pain I have had over it and dont want to see others do the same, That is all
...but...but...myinsbroker wrote:and that's the last I will say on it
You lost weight because your caloric intake was less than your caloric output. How is this confusing?
My calorie intake is less because the calories I take in work better
...and your proof is?
Why are people feeding the T ........
I think someone has made a second account...again.
Really now you are resorting to false accusations?
Wow
Have you gone back to read this thread in it's entirety, or at least the first few pages where good helpful information was shared about why a calorie is a calorie, but nutrition and satiety are important factors to consider in building a sustainable plan for oneself? Have you read any of the stickied posts I suggested?
Yes I understand what you are saying,
What I will say and I dont read the forum all the time, honestly when I go to add to my diary and I see a thread that sounds interesting on that left side I might click and that is how I ran into this thread yesterday so I dont frequent this forum. However in the past I have seen it said simple a calorie is just a calorie and if there is any question it is meet with the " does 10 Lbs of rocks wiegh more then 10 lbs of feathers " cliche
It's been discussed MANY times on this forum. NEVER have I seen a thread where it was not stated, over and over, that food choice matters for satiety and nutrition, and that "a calorie is a calorie" means that calories are what matters for weight gain, loss, or maintenance. What makes it possible to eat the right calories is more individual and likely does relate to food choice, in part.
Every single time. Not every single post, but always one of the first few posts and repeatedly after that.
When people claim that they got the impression from a discussion that food choice did not matter for any purpose, they can never identify a thread where that happened.
Also, and I ask this sincerely, surely the fact that food choice matters for nutrition is really, really common knowledge and impossible not to be aware of, no? I mean, not only every thread on the topic at MFP, but the US Dietary Guidelines, MyPlate, what they teach in school, what's in every popular magazine and so on.
As for mattering for satiety, isn't that a matter of common sense and paying attention?
Sigh. I suspect, as usual, you won't get a response to these questions. One of these days, maybe. If that does happen, and I'm not in the thread, can you tag me in it? Apparently that's a thing, you can tag people into threads even if they aren't participating, even to tell them that they shouldn't derail a thread they aren't participating in. #themoreyouknow4 -
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moosmum1972 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »moosmum1972 wrote: »PikaJoyJoy wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
archaic BB/Newsboard/forum/usenet term
Sock-Sock puppet, once upon a time(when the internet was young) your identity was associated with your email, and having your email could be easily associated with your real identity. As the internet expanded from educational and premium pay services to "throwaway" accounts from services like AOL, it became possible and then easy to create alternate identities. A sock(puppet) is a secondary, tertiary, etc account that may or may not be associated with the primary account and is used for some level of trolling. Either to upvote/agree or downvote/disagree with the primary account.
Mfp peeps....don't ever change.
You missed a great thread last weekend. We had one of the more infamous trolls start a usual thread and it ended up in a Samuel L Jackson meme thread with tons of puns. It was the best lol.
Was that the shouty man thread?
Yup! That was glorious!2 -
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myinsbroker wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »moosmum1972 wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »myinsbroker wrote: »Not sure what you mean a calories is a unit of measure in energy
If you have 300 calories in pure suger vrs 300 calories in complex carbs you will have difrent longevity of energy
that would be like going to the Indy 500 with a beat up old car because a car is a car
Maybe come back when you have an understanding of what 'energy' is (in the sense of 'energy balance', which is what defines how weight is lost or gained) and it will make more sense to you.
I do now, The point is at one time I didn't, I looked for advise from those that are supposed to be experts. to say a calorie is a calorie and then say well you need to learn physics is ridiculous.
I am not going to sell and Insurance policy without breaking it down to an understandable language that people can understand in a practical real world way
Same way giving that advice to a person new to losing weight is harmful
and that's the last I will say on it
We're saying that because there are multiple types of energy. And you are confusing two of them. You are telling us we aren't correct because you aren't understanding the terms we are using. But you don't want to talk about it anymore so it is what it is I guess :drinker:
Because I don't really want to argue or make everyone angry and I can see this is going nowhere
All I wanted to do is try and make people aware that the blanket statement that a calorie is just a calorie can cause harm.
I didnt get it here when I was told this it was from my heart doctor well before I seen this forum. All I am saying is that blanket advice took me from 320lbs to 360 lbs and a lot of pain struggling with binging.
I have since went to the internet becuase I was 368 and learned how to eat right. Now I am at 305
I know see this same blanket statement on this forum and all I want is for the next person to not be misled. I am not trying to start a fight I just know the pain I have had over it and dont want to see others do the same, That is all
...but...but...myinsbroker wrote:and that's the last I will say on it
You lost weight because your caloric intake was less than your caloric output. How is this confusing?
My calorie intake is less because the calories I take in work better
...and your proof is?
Why are people feeding the T ........
I think someone has made a second account...again.
Really now you are resorting to false accusations?
Wow
Have you gone back to read this thread in it's entirety, or at least the first few pages where good helpful information was shared about why a calorie is a calorie, but nutrition and satiety are important factors to consider in building a sustainable plan for oneself? Have you read any of the stickied posts I suggested?
Yes I understand what you are saying,
What I will say and I dont read the forum all the time, honestly when I go to add to my diary and I see a thread that sounds interesting on that left side I might click and that is how I ran into this thread yesterday so I dont frequent this forum. However in the past I have seen it said simple a calorie is just a calorie and if there is any question it is meet with the " does 10 Lbs of rocks wiegh more then 10 lbs of feathers " cliche
If I seen it most times presented difrently like it is now after back and forth then we wouldnt be speaking about this right now
All I am saying is when it was rpesented to me ( not on this forum) I didnt know enough to question, I was dont dont get crazy with this or that just keeep under the calories, I didnt know anything aboout fiber protien fat to keep full or complexe carbs for lasting ene
If it was said more times (like it is now present and has been presented in this thread) a calorie is just a calorie but nutrients can make the difrence in meeeting calorie cgoals we wouldnt be having this conversation righ now
@myinsbroker , I'm glad you're getting a clearer idea of what some of the diet and nutrition terms really mean, and how some of the important concepts fit together. That can only help you, as you continue working to progress your weight, heath and fitness goals.
You might actually want to consider delving into the forums a bit more often, especially to read the posts in the "most helpful posts" section of each forum topic (we call those posts "stickies" because they stick around). There's a wealth of user-tested information there, and I've found the content much more usable and science-based than the overwhelming majority of the diet/health blogs, email newsletters or IG posts I've ever read.
I understand that your experience on this thread maybe wasn't that much fun, but I'd encourage you not to let that put you off the forums altogether.
I can even understand how the practical insight you got from some other sources - that some foods were more filling and energizing for the same calories, so those eating choices helped you succeed - was something you wanted to share here. It's unfortunate whoever wrote what you read used a confusing figure of speech that encouraged you to misunderstand the actual mechanism behind those good results.
It was decent of you to come back and post here after having a bit of a rethink.
Best wishes for future progress!0 -
Yup, freakin' quixotic Pollyanna-fied girt scout.0
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stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
@JoRocka I have used the word troll once since being here and the comment was deleted and I got a warning for it! But now i see people using it all the time, so maybe things have changed..
All i said to this person was "why are you trolling this thread"?0 -
moosmum1972 wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »moosmum1972 wrote: »PikaJoyJoy wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »I used to post in a forum where people were constantly creating socks then arguing with themselves in threads. So tiresome, except when they screwed up which account they were posting from and were forced to retire in shame. That part was fun.
Most people who sock are really obvious because they don't go through the effort of building a unique and distinct personality for the sock, Other then "everything I don't believe" or "agrees with me on everything"
wait- when did socks become a thing?
We keep talking about socks- and I keep thinking about *kitten* jokes- and realize you guys are talking about something else- are we not allowed to say trolls?
archaic BB/Newsboard/forum/usenet term
Sock-Sock puppet, once upon a time(when the internet was young) your identity was associated with your email, and having your email could be easily associated with your real identity. As the internet expanded from educational and premium pay services to "throwaway" accounts from services like AOL, it became possible and then easy to create alternate identities. A sock(puppet) is a secondary, tertiary, etc account that may or may not be associated with the primary account and is used for some level of trolling. Either to upvote/agree or downvote/disagree with the primary account.
Mfp peeps....don't ever change.
You missed a great thread last weekend. We had one of the more infamous trolls start a usual thread and it ended up in a Samuel L Jackson meme thread with tons of puns. It was the best lol.
Was that the shouty man thread?
Shhh, don't invoke the name of the Dark One!
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I can even understand how the practical insight you got from some other sources - that some foods were more filling and energizing for the same calories, so those eating choices helped you succeed - was something you wanted to share here.
Except that that point had been made numerous times in the thread, so assuming we were all ignorant of it is rather puzzling, and that would be my problem (one of them) with the way this discussion always goes.
It does go back to the meta conversation, what are basic rules of common courtesy for discussion (and I get we don't have agreement on that in a forum like this). IMO, jumping in and telling people something that is widely known and that they have already said -- and if he/she didn't know it was already said that points out the problem with jumping in a thread and proceeding to lecture people without reading it first -- is not very polite. If someone I met immediately started explaining to me that Paris is a city in France (thus suggesting they believed I was so ignorant as to be unaware of that), I would be taken aback, and that's how I take that kind of thing here. It feels extremely insulting -- lecturing someone as if they need to be informed of things they already know always is, IMO, which is why even though I know I can be pedantic and annoying I TRY (I'm sure don't always succeed) to make it clear I am not assuming others don't know things, especially things that are actually common knowledge (and have already been said by those people).
If we are going to talk about the broader issues of word choice and how to communicate and so on, I think that is something worth adding to the conversation.3 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »I can even understand how the practical insight you got from some other sources - that some foods were more filling and energizing for the same calories, so those eating choices helped you succeed - was something you wanted to share here.
Except that that point had been made numerous times in the thread, so assuming we were all ignorant of it is rather puzzling, and that would be my problem (one of them) with the way this discussion always goes.
It does go back to the meta conversation, what are basic rules of common courtesy for discussion (and I get we don't have agreement on that in a forum like this). IMO, jumping in and telling people something that is widely known and that they have already said -- and if he/she didn't know it was already said that points out the problem with jumping in a thread and proceeding to lecture people without reading it first -- is not very polite. If someone I met immediately started explaining to me that Paris is a city in France (thus suggesting they believed I was so ignorant as to be unaware of that), I would be taken aback, and that's how I take that kind of thing here. It feels extremely insulting -- lecturing someone as if they need to be informed of things they already know always is, IMO, which is why even though I know I can be pedantic and annoying I TRY (I'm sure don't always succeed) to make it clear I am not assuming others don't know things, especially things that are actually common knowledge (and have already been said by those people).
If we are going to talk about the broader issues of word choice and how to communicate and so on, I think that is something worth adding to the conversation.
I agree with every word you've written.
"I can even understand" how someone would do that - swoop into a thread and post 'information' they'd found helpful, when they saw the thread name in a sidebar, even though they don't understand the culture or context they're swooping into. "Understand" is not "approve" is not "encourage".
I felt that others had made the corrective points. For folks to become regular and helpful forum participants, they need the correctives. 100%.
IMO only, they may also need someone to see and acknowledge that they probably meant well . . . or to offer them the social band-aid of the assumption that they did. IMO, people are unlikely to become regular and useful participants if they simply feel criticized.
(I think this person did mean well initially, based on saying that this realization about (so called) "different kinds of calories" was the difference between weight loss failure and weight loss success. And I did find it decent that s/he came back and posted that last post, even though I could surely quibble about style, form and tone. Most people in similar cases leave in a huff, with snarky parting shots - as in the recent flounce from the "CICO, still skeptical?" thread. So, I felt like posting something in addition to the (true, valid) correctives.)4
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