Do we go nowhere ?

_barefoot_ wrote: »

WorkerDrone83 wrote: »

_barefoot_ wrote: »

I can only go by my own experience with God and I would even go as far as saying ..
If someone had a gun to my head and ask me if I was a christian and if I said yes he would kill me .
I would say Yes in a heart beat . I would lay down my life for God .

Ooh, hypotheticals. What if the gun was held to someone else's head?

I would still tell the truth and tell them I am a christian .

That's so Ned Stark of you. I like your style.

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_barefoot_ wrote: »

No one has said why they don't believe ...

Is there a reason to why you don't want to believe .
No. But reason is literally why I not able to believe "god".
Are you mad at God ?
Which one? Actually, I'm not angry with any of them. The behavior of many of their followers piss me off though.
Do you feel you are not worth is love ?
If that's a typo and you intended to ask, "Do you not feel you are worth his love?" the answer is I don't feel "he" is worthy of my love.

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laprimaJenny wrote: »

4legsRbetterthan2 wrote: »

_barefoot_ wrote: »

No one has said why they don't believe ...

Is there a reason to why you don't want to believe .

Are you mad at God ?
Do you feel you are not worth is love ?

10 pages later.....

I have actually tried to believe, and I was raised to. But, I got derailed when I was about 8 because I didn't understand why dinosaurs aren't in the bible (I was pretty obsessed with dinosaurs when I was little). I tried to revisit it as an adult, and I just have no faith that there is some greater power out there. Its not based out of anger, or feeling unworthy. Its just a lack of proof for me. And I just can't put faith in something I have not proof of.

I hear people say things like this all the time but I can’t fully grasp it. When you chose to love another human being, your putting faith into that person without proof or evidence that they will treat you right! I’m not arguing that you should believe. Rather im just expressing that I don’t fully understand how someone can trust a human, that is in essence faulty and likely to hurt you. Yet, not even attempt to trust God who supposedly is perfect.

I have a long track record with people, and that's why i choose to keep them at arm's reach. Don't assume everyone is inherently trusting.

Further more, why would i trust someone i have no track record on, but only a series of promises and stories? experience tells me that promises and stories are never what they are made out to be.

I consider myself to be a culturally Jewish agnostic. While I had a Jewish education, became bat mitzvah, occasionally attend synagogue, and encourage (okay, force) my children to do the same, I cannot say I have ever truly believed in God any more than I did the tooth fairy. (I was a skeptic right from the beginning, since my parents forgot to stick a quarter under my pillow when I lost my very first tooth.)

Judaism is not particularly concerned with the afterlife. The religion is much more concerned with the here and now and doing mitzvot (good deeds) for their own sake rather than in hopes of some eternal reward. Of course opinions about the hereafter differ among Jews. (Talk to four Jewish scholars and get five different opinions.) there is the concept of “The World to Come”...but disagreement as to whether this is some sort of parallel universe where one goes after death, or something that will come into being following some far down the road “end times.”

Judaism has always been more about debate than dogma. But I can say that the even among my Jewish friends who do believe in God, the afterlife is not what guides their moral compasses. Far more important is the concept of “tikkun olam” or improving the world...for now, for those around us, and for future generations. Which makes far more sense to me. I like to think that when I am decomposing in my simple pine box, I will be remembered for having done something to make a better world for my descendants.

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Is there life before birth?
Where do we come from?
Why did we leave there?
**************
becomes
**************
Is there life after death?
Where are we going?
Why are we going there?


Why the focus on the future, and none on the past?

newmeadow wrote: »

Ever notice how when something terrific happens (polio vaccine, drugs that prevent HIV from turning into AIDS, magnificent musical symphonies, architecture that defies the boundaries of human imagination, fictional works of literary genius that are works of intricate beauty, simple kindnesses extended on a whim that make the difference between life and death) and when these wonderful things happen PEOPLE take or give credit to THEMSELVES exclusively.

When bad things happen (people die, people get sick, people get mistreated, people suffer in an endless and horrible variety of ways) it's always GOD that did it or who let it happen because He just doesn't care about us?

Yeah, what does that say about US and our maturity as people?

If you want to know about God (and I know most of you don't and that's okay) - but for those of you who question His existence and what He can do, then take the time to PRAY to God and really PRAY from the heart. Then you'll have an idea of what you're working with and what God can do.

I actually find it to be opposite. Anything great that happens gets blamed by the grace of God. One of the most disturbing things to see after some type of disaster is people being interviewed and them proclaiming they were saved by the grace of god.....while people just as faithful, and I guarantee praying just as hard perished. It is quite arrogant to think that God chose to spare you while other met a horrible demise. And yet God gets a free pass when disasters strike. Then it gets explained away as, he works in mysterious ways, God has a plan we don't understand. It's just a fancy way of saying I don't know. It's ok to not know, it's less okay to make things up to fit your narrative when you don't. God has a good gig, he gets all the credit fro saving someone from a flood, to helping a football player score a touchdown. And gets a pass for the tragedies, because he's.....mysterious......

bojack3 wrote: »

newmeadow wrote: »

Ever notice how when something terrific happens (polio vaccine, drugs that prevent HIV from turning into AIDS, magnificent musical symphonies, architecture that defies the boundaries of human imagination, fictional works of literary genius that are works of intricate beauty, simple kindnesses extended on a whim that make the difference between life and death) and when these wonderful things happen PEOPLE take or give credit to THEMSELVES exclusively.

When bad things happen (people die, people get sick, people get mistreated, people suffer in an endless and horrible variety of ways) it's always GOD that did it or who let it happen because He just doesn't care about us?

Yeah, what does that say about US and our maturity as people?

If you want to know about God (and I know most of you don't and that's okay) - but for those of you who question His existence and what He can do, then take the time to PRAY to God and really PRAY from the heart. Then you'll have an idea of what you're working with and what God can do.

I actually find it to be opposite. Anything great that happens gets blamed by the grace of God. One of the most disturbing things to see after some type of disaster is people being interviewed and them proclaiming they were saved by the grace of god.....while people just as faithful, and I guarantee praying just as hard perished. It is quite arrogant to think that God chose to spare you while other met a horrible demise. And yet God gets a free pass when disasters strike. Then it gets explained away as, he works in mysterious ways, God has a plan we don't understand. It's just a fancy way of saying I don't know. It's ok to not know, it's less okay to make things up to fit your narrative when you don't. God has a good gig, he gets all the credit fro saving someone from a flood, to helping a football player score a touchdown. And gets a pass for the tragedies, because he's.....mysterious......

The first error I see is referring to God as a "he"...it all spirals down hill from there. I agree with most of what you said... no one knows "what" this power is so how can we give it blame or credit? I just find it hard to accept there is nothing bigger than we are... or that we are just some random mistake

bojack3 wrote: »

Bullet_with_Butterfly_Wings wrote: »

bojack3 wrote: »

newmeadow wrote: »

Ever notice how when something terrific happens (polio vaccine, drugs that prevent HIV from turning into AIDS, magnificent musical symphonies, architecture that defies the boundaries of human imagination, fictional works of literary genius that are works of intricate beauty, simple kindnesses extended on a whim that make the difference between life and death) and when these wonderful things happen PEOPLE take or give credit to THEMSELVES exclusively.

When bad things happen (people die, people get sick, people get mistreated, people suffer in an endless and horrible variety of ways) it's always GOD that did it or who let it happen because He just doesn't care about us?

Yeah, what does that say about US and our maturity as people?

If you want to know about God (and I know most of you don't and that's okay) - but for those of you who question His existence and what He can do, then take the time to PRAY to God and really PRAY from the heart. Then you'll have an idea of what you're working with and what God can do.

I actually find it to be opposite. Anything great that happens gets blamed by the grace of God. One of the most disturbing things to see after some type of disaster is people being interviewed and them proclaiming they were saved by the grace of god.....while people just as faithful, and I guarantee praying just as hard perished. It is quite arrogant to think that God chose to spare you while other met a horrible demise. And yet God gets a free pass when disasters strike. Then it gets explained away as, he works in mysterious ways, God has a plan we don't understand. It's just a fancy way of saying I don't know. It's ok to not know, it's less okay to make things up to fit your narrative when you don't. God has a good gig, he gets all the credit fro saving someone from a flood, to helping a football player score a touchdown. And gets a pass for the tragedies, because he's.....mysterious......

The first error I see is referring to God as a "he"...it all spirals down hill from there. I agree with most of what you said... no one knows "what" this power is so how can we give it blame or credit? I just find it hard to accept there is nothing bigger than we are... or that we are just some random mistake

99.9% of every species that has been on this earth is now extinct. We are far from a perfect creation, we have lots of poor design features. If this was all created, I'd say this creator needs to step up his game.

That's called evolution. I dont believe in a "creator" per se... but I find it arrogant of humans to think that we are the end all be all

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Bullet_with_Butterfly_Wings wrote: »

bojack3 wrote: »

Bullet_with_Butterfly_Wings wrote: »

bojack3 wrote: »

newmeadow wrote: »

Ever notice how when something terrific happens (polio vaccine, drugs that prevent HIV from turning into AIDS, magnificent musical symphonies, architecture that defies the boundaries of human imagination, fictional works of literary genius that are works of intricate beauty, simple kindnesses extended on a whim that make the difference between life and death) and when these wonderful things happen PEOPLE take or give credit to THEMSELVES exclusively.

When bad things happen (people die, people get sick, people get mistreated, people suffer in an endless and horrible variety of ways) it's always GOD that did it or who let it happen because He just doesn't care about us?

Yeah, what does that say about US and our maturity as people?

If you want to know about God (and I know most of you don't and that's okay) - but for those of you who question His existence and what He can do, then take the time to PRAY to God and really PRAY from the heart. Then you'll have an idea of what you're working with and what God can do.

I actually find it to be opposite. Anything great that happens gets blamed by the grace of God. One of the most disturbing things to see after some type of disaster is people being interviewed and them proclaiming they were saved by the grace of god.....while people just as faithful, and I guarantee praying just as hard perished. It is quite arrogant to think that God chose to spare you while other met a horrible demise. And yet God gets a free pass when disasters strike. Then it gets explained away as, he works in mysterious ways, God has a plan we don't understand. It's just a fancy way of saying I don't know. It's ok to not know, it's less okay to make things up to fit your narrative when you don't. God has a good gig, he gets all the credit fro saving someone from a flood, to helping a football player score a touchdown. And gets a pass for the tragedies, because he's.....mysterious......

The first error I see is referring to God as a "he"...it all spirals down hill from there. I agree with most of what you said... no one knows "what" this power is so how can we give it blame or credit? I just find it hard to accept there is nothing bigger than we are... or that we are just some random mistake

99.9% of every species that has been on this earth is now extinct. We are far from a perfect creation, we have lots of poor design features. If this was all created, I'd say this creator needs to step up his game.

That's called evolution. I dont believe in a "creator" per se... but I find it arrogant of humans to think that we are the end all be all

I think it's fine to think there is something beyond our understanding......I think it's arrogant to claim to know what that is.

"_barefoot_ wrote: »

I also like to add for new born again christians start off reading ..

The Gospel of John - This is the best place for new believers, especially, to start reading. This book will give you a good understanding of who Jesus is and what His ministry is about. Although the other Gospel accounts (Matthew, Mark and Luke) do this, the book of John particularly focuses on who Jesus is rather than just what He did.

Psalms - This is a great place to start if you're looking for encouragement. The Psalms offer hope, and healing, and help us to better understand that God is with us no matter our circumstances. I often suggest reading Psalms if stress and anxiety keep you up at night because the poetry style of writing is not only relatable, but also very comforting.

Proverbs - This book is packed with wisdom. It offers biblical knowledge and instruction to help guide us in our day-to-day life. It's a great place to start if you want practical direction on how to live out this Christian life. The brevity of each verse also make it an easy and light read.

If you don't have time to read the Bible they have daily audio bible you can down load or stream it on you're app
Great to listen to it on you way to work or doing a workout or whatever .

I could see there being a day when I might regain my faith in God, but I have some serious issues with the Bible and organized religion. If humans are imperfect and untrustworthy why put faith in something that has been in their hands for centuries, getting warped again and again to fit their agendas?

newmeadow wrote: »

Ever notice how when something terrific happens (polio vaccine, drugs that prevent HIV from turning into AIDS, magnificent musical symphonies, architecture that defies the boundaries of human imagination, fictional works of literary genius that are works of intricate beauty, simple kindnesses extended on a whim that make the difference between life and death) and when these wonderful things happen PEOPLE take or give credit to THEMSELVES exclusively.

When bad things happen (people die, people get sick, people get mistreated, people suffer in an endless and horrible variety of ways) it's always GOD that did it or who let it happen because He just doesn't care about us?

Yeah, what does that say about US and our maturity as people?

If you want to know about God (and I know most of you don't and that's okay) - but for those of you who question His existence and what He can do, then take the time to PRAY to God and really PRAY from the heart. Then you'll have an idea of what you're working with and what God can do.

Is that the way it works though? It's not like God leaves a note on your nightstand saying, "Dear Joe, Last night you asked me to watch over your family and loved ones, so today your mother is going to just miss being in a car accident. Instead of breaking her arm, the driver who runs a red light will simply pass through the intersection without causing an accident. Have a nice day."

And what about if/when you pray for things that are outside of or against His plan? What then?


Really it comes down to this -
If you have faith, you will see God's hand in various things every day. If you don't, you'll see those same things as chance, or making your own luck, or whatever else. It's not terribly different than a fortune teller in that sense. If you believe in a reader's abilities, then you'll interpret their vague predictions as coming true when various things happen. If you don't, you won't.

In this case, faith has to come first.


Unless, and there's always an unless, right? Unless you believe God reveals himself to people. I personally do not believe that, but based on some posts in this thread, I suspect some people do. But even in that scenario, the faith comes first, doesn't it? Don't you have to favor the possibility of God for him to reveal himself to you?