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Why did you get married?
Replies
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If cheating occurs something is wrong or not working in that relationship. Examples; 1. my friend was dating a daddy figure rather than partner. It didn't work out. 2. My other friend was with a guy for seven years he cheated on her throughout. They came across as more brother and sister lol. 3. The other married well you would think it would work the artful met the dodger lol. Cheating was part of their sadistic power games. Their still together the cheating has become a game. The man says his not leaving because the other woman are not better than his wife. The wife I'm not leaving he retires soon I'm not letting a younger woman have access to my earnings.
One thing for sure cheating happens when something can't be clearly communicated1 -
huntersvonnegut wrote: »LaDispute57 wrote: »I am a divorce attorney. Statistically, about half of you will be in to see me despite your protestations to the contrary.
So if statistically about half of all marriages end in divorce, statistically about half of all marriages end in death.
Its the how they died you gotta pay attention to
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LaDispute57 wrote: »I am a divorce attorney. Statistically, about half of you will be in to see me despite your protestations to the contrary.
that "half of you" as in 50% - wasn't this disproved as in a wrong datum ?0 -
777Gemma888 wrote: »Tell me something-
If your man or woman -cheats on you with someone-who's to blame ? the person who was able to seduce them or your partner who succumbed down to that level? What if the seducer was single ? What if seducer wasn't?
If I was married and my husband were to cheat, given the levels of leash release I prefer to allow ... It's my fault. If the boundaries and rules we agreed upon are broken, with me not keeping sight of the rules of engagement or the rules of times apart, the onus is hypothetically mine to shoulder.
I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
Isn't open relationship enough for this? why "marriage" with those parameters ?1 -
777Gemma888 wrote: »I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
First bit - that's messed up imo and does not show any commitment on the part of the husband. A marriage is about more than "a piece of paper" or about the sex. If partner A chooses to travel for work, there should not be any obligation on partner B to show up and "service the needs" within 2 weeks or else partner A cheats. What if both partners work to support the family? What if partner A is away for work and partner B ends up in hospital with an accident? Oh, sorry but you weren't here to service me so I cheated on you. That's absolute rubbish, sorry.
Second bit - If a couple opts for an open marriage and agree to the terms of how it will work that's different.
Threats of "if you don't do X, I'm going to do Y" are not okay.4 -
@vm007 I think it is actually a range. According to the American Psychological Association, the divorce rate is 40-50% for 2018. The rate is higher for subsequent marriages. http://www.apa.org/topics/divorce/
I do know that for the past 35 years I have never had a slow down in work. I swear sometimes the rate feels like 90%. Unfortunately, I add to those stats having gotten divorced twice. I imagine being married to an attorney is a pain in the butt. But still... I got 14 years the first time and 21 the second time. Undoubtedly a credit to the wonderful women I was married to.3 -
sugaraddict4321 wrote: »777Gemma888 wrote: »I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
First bit - that's messed up imo and does not show any commitment on the part of the husband. A marriage is about more than "a piece of paper" or about the sex. If partner A chooses to travel for work, there should not be any obligation on partner B to show up and "service the needs" within 2 weeks or else partner A cheats. What if both partners work to support the family? What if partner A is away for work and partner B ends up in hospital with an accident? Oh, sorry but you weren't here to service me so I cheated on you. That's absolute rubbish, sorry.
Second bit - If a couple opts for an open marriage and agree to the terms of how it will work that's different.
Threats of "if you don't do X, I'm going to do Y" are not okay.
I think the first part might be coming from a more patriarchal culture. (Correct me if I'm wrong @777Gemma888 ) Those of us in more Western cultures don't think it's ok, but it really wasn't long ago that this was very common in Western cultures too. And it was very likely an unspoken rule. Kind of like not agreeing to an open marriage but overlooking cheating as long as it isn't blatant or causes embarrassment. I would almost appreciate the heads up - at least they are clearly communicating expectations. If I think the expectations are *kitten*, I can always walk... In Western cultures anyway.2 -
LaDispute57 wrote: »I am a divorce attorney. Statistically, about half of you will be in to see me despite your protestations to the contrary.
that "half of you" as in 50% - wasn't this disproved as in a wrong datum ?
I believe so. I think the actual statistic is that less than 50% of first marriages end in divorce, but the overall average gets driven up by the divorce rate for second and subsequent marriages, which is greater than 50% (North America).0 -
LaDispute57 wrote: »I am a divorce attorney. Statistically, about half of you will be in to see me despite your protestations to the contrary.
that "half of you" as in 50% - wasn't this disproved as in a wrong datum ?
“There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies and statistics.”3 -
sugaraddict4321 wrote: »777Gemma888 wrote: »I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
First bit - that's messed up imo and does not show any commitment on the part of the husband. A marriage is about more than "a piece of paper" or about the sex. If partner A chooses to travel for work, there should not be any obligation on partner B to show up and "service the needs" within 2 weeks or else partner A cheats. What if both partners work to support the family? What if partner A is away for work and partner B ends up in hospital with an accident? Oh, sorry but you weren't here to service me so I cheated on you. That's absolute rubbish, sorry.
Second bit - If a couple opts for an open marriage and agree to the terms of how it will work that's different.
Threats of "if you don't do X, I'm going to do Y" are not okay.
There are always threats-not spoken ones or outright declarations but there always are. In almost any kind of relationship there are. There are no "selfless" relations. Especially when it comes to marriage.
In a marriage they are- support family , pay bills, be there in need, put others' needs before yours, sacrifice/compromise/cooperate, work/life balance etc - these are just the basic ones. If someone falls short- marriages end or points start piling up and then eventually therapy, counselling, attorney or extra marital affairs.
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sugaraddict4321 wrote: »777Gemma888 wrote: »I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
First bit - that's messed up imo and does not show any commitment on the part of the husband. A marriage is about more than "a piece of paper" or about the sex. If partner A chooses to travel for work, there should not be any obligation on partner B to show up and "service the needs" within 2 weeks or else partner A cheats. What if both partners work to support the family? What if partner A is away for work and partner B ends up in hospital with an accident? Oh, sorry but you weren't here to service me so I cheated on you. That's absolute rubbish, sorry.
Second bit - If a couple opts for an open marriage and agree to the terms of how it will work that's different.
Threats of "if you don't do X, I'm going to do Y" are not okay.
You're looking at it from a Western culture viewpoint. There's other cultures, and it isn't necessarily wrong for this to occur due to distance and duration of them being in another country halfway around the world.
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Btw I took a difference approach to this- as in "Why won't you get married" as in why not?
For me - when I commit to something I give my 100% even if it tears me apart from within I just cannot quit.
For example- This new job of mine- I knew it would be SO RISKY- as in I would have to work for almost free until I make this business venture profitable and sell it- I could've taken a comfortable approach but I didn't because I like chaos and I have basically zero expenses so I took upon it and it was going to take a year but I was able to put in 16 hour days and 6 months in -we are at a point that it's for sale now. If I had a family that would be a big no-no. People say work-life balance - What balance? if I don't mind doing what I am doing but I won't have this option otherwise.
Total freedom,
Even now -sometimes some things that would make me happy I don't do them because they won't generally workout because I'm in a family and I think about all of them. One example- Not buying a two door sports car because we are a family right now- so I bought 4 door instead of 2 door.
Travel freely,
Die freely lol
What do I even need a kid for?
I have other reasons as well lol-actually this approach cleared somethings for me.
I love this!!! Well said!! 👍🏼1 -
A covenant to each other & to God. It kept us together thru richer/poorer, for better/worse, in sickness & in health.
Through good times, hard times. If we didn't get married & made a commitment before God, it would have been an "out" through some of those hard times & we would have missed out on growing together & getting closer. It's been 4 kids & 46 years now
Love it!!! Congratulations!!!1 -
I was in love and would have ceased to exist if I couldn't be with him forever,
a wedding was just the next logical step.
That's what my thinking was at the time.
I was 19.1 -
To prove to everyone else that we were in love at 17 & 19 years old, we been married 42 years now and inceperable..2
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Isn't open relationship enough for this? why "marriage" with those parameters ?
Again OP, here’s another delineating point between your culture and mine … Traditional marital boundaries, permissable access and markers of conservatism (“towing the line”) obviously differ via interpretation. What matters to the public (ie extended family and community) - one’s public face doesn’t necessarily translate to your marital bed. A married couple observes the Christian morals of the dictates of marriage, publicly. Privately, we are tasked with “handling the spouse,” however he or she comes, gender and exposure determined. It is a traditional tribal union; 9 times out of 10, he or she does not meet the Western romantised ideals of girl meets boy, woman meets man. No. There is an underlying gain for the man. Always. The woman is a booster. To help you understand, using the Indian Dowry Culture, the woman comes with her dowry, but is set apart from her dowry. She is still woman and the dowry are the assets. Comparatively, in my culture, the woman was part of the dowry, She was tradeable. We were currency before Christianity (Catholicism, Methodism, Anglicanism).
Open relationships within a marital union, in my opinion is too liberal with laxity, which easily can lead to sloppiness and mishandling. An open relationship in or outside a marital contract, with full disclosure is different. Consent with notification is paramount. Any plus one is vetted by the spouse. Rules and boundaries need to be adhered to. These aren’t always necessarily the case with open relationships. Oftentimes, it is a free for all; A panacea to sex addicts, really. What Person A (you) calls an open relationship, isn’t necessarily a qualifier for a definitive open marriage to me. When I do get married, how I define and maintain my marriage is between me and my husband, sans the labels. For some people, sex isn’t a priority. For others it is, needing thorough tabulation, even if to outside eyes and ears, it resembles an open relationship. Then one has to ask, who are we to cast judgement that a married couple desire pleasure, leisure and not just be sandbagged via the procreative decency rhetoric? When did the wife become the nominated prude? When did she become the sex withholding tyrant? When did the woman in a marital union become the anti-sex advocate? Why neuter a wife - why deny the woman in an open relationship the right to contractual marriage if that is what she desires, if he asks? When did the wife become the slated bore, so as to meet your statement - “Isn't open relationship enough for this? why "marriage" with those parameters?” Again - why can’t she be wedded? Are you indirectly castigating her to a lesser-woman state because she is not a virgin to the marital bed? Purity before marriage? How many women today, were virgins to their husbands?1 -
sugaraddict4321 wrote: »777Gemma888 wrote: »I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
First bit - that's messed up imo and does not show any commitment on the part of the husband. A marriage is about more than "a piece of paper" or about the sex. If partner A chooses to travel for work, there should not be any obligation on partner B to show up and "service the needs" within 2 weeks or else partner A cheats. What if both partners work to support the family? What if partner A is away for work and partner B ends up in hospital with an accident? Oh, sorry but you weren't here to service me so I cheated on you. That's absolute rubbish, sorry.
Second bit - If a couple opts for an open marriage and agree to the terms of how it will work that's different.
Threats of "if you don't do X, I'm going to do Y" are not okay.
You are a dear Sugar! Initially, both my sister and I were shocked despite our very accommodating heritage with matters of the heart and marriage. I hail from a background and Western exposure knowing men who were very active with their wives fairly regularly, where their children complain, self included. Regularity is normal, like daily frequency. For families to have codes for decency’s sake isn’t a peculiarity.
Eg
A: “Where’s Mum & Dad?”
B: “Oh - Dad called for the code - Hand stitch.
A: “ Let’s give them space.”
Hand stitch = Sexy time.
I do understand where you’re coming from, knowing of the above-example. However, with my buddies who’d come to mind, upon sharing what I did with the OP, one would assume that they were cheaters. You’d be surprised. They had to be that aggressive with their wives because their stay-at-home Mum Wives, are the cheaters. They are women of leisure whose husbands have them want for nothing. If you were to know these gentlemen I speak of, it wouldn’t even compute. How does this happen? They’re not unattractive. For the husbands, their first choice to bed, are their wives. The wives however, would much prefer their alternatives first, of both genders. Therein comes the test when you’re the friend to one of the 2. Understand and love them as they are and as they come, without judgment. We can’t deny anyone their pleasures, however they define it, however they need it. They are the mothers of their children - what matters! Priority focus always is - protect the primary. Keep it together, even if, “she” is to be forced or bribed to make it to the fortnightly meet.
Precisely@open arrangement.2 -
sugaraddict4321 wrote: »777Gemma888 wrote: »I have friends who let their wives know that if they are physically apart for 2 weeks, and she fails to make an attempt to join him, where he is earning money for their family ... She knows the consequences of not being present.
Disclosure! Disclosure! Disclosure!
ETA: Some of us are not opposed to playing with our men. Or play at the same time with set rules and boundaries.
If my husband wants to cheat, I have the right to watch them together, inasmuch as I would permit him the same access. I am his equal, his other half, his reflection. What he authorises for himself, are the very same liberties he allows me.
First bit - that's messed up imo and does not show any commitment on the part of the husband. A marriage is about more than "a piece of paper" or about the sex. If partner A chooses to travel for work, there should not be any obligation on partner B to show up and "service the needs" within 2 weeks or else partner A cheats. What if both partners work to support the family? What if partner A is away for work and partner B ends up in hospital with an accident? Oh, sorry but you weren't here to service me so I cheated on you. That's absolute rubbish, sorry.
Second bit - If a couple opts for an open marriage and agree to the terms of how it will work that's different.
Threats of "if you don't do X, I'm going to do Y" are not okay.
I think the first part might be coming from a more patriarchal culture. (Correct me if I'm wrong @777Gemma888 ) Those of us in more Western cultures don't think it's ok, but it really wasn't long ago that this was very common in Western cultures too. And it was very likely an unspoken rule. Kind of like not agreeing to an open marriage but overlooking cheating as long as it isn't blatant or causes embarrassment. I would almost appreciate the heads up - at least they are clearly communicating expectations. If I think the expectations are *kitten*, I can always walk... In Western cultures anyway.
It is interesting that you should highlight this as it happens. Only 2 days ago now, during a funeral, 2 factions came to head over the result of such by-your-leaves. Despite wife 2 being wedded albeit years after wife 1 passed on, the generational stain of the term which was hurled at the 2nd unit from the same man, is that they have no right of access to mourn as their mother had loose nethers. They cheated without wife 1 consenting. The persons who’d involved themselves, have all passed on. The descendants arriving to mourn were drawn and quartered military style - think officers Vs non commissioned officers Vs regular infantry Vs civilians. Horrendous. Had to rewatch the Violence. The result of sloppiness. When couples play with no regard to its side-effects.
On one side of my family - it is patriarchal (paternal). On my mother’s side who are more Polynesian - we’re predominantly matriarchal, for over 6 generations but for the present, where my maternal grandmother chose to give the title/seat to her paternal grand-nephew and not my mother. Things get more confusing, if I was to address the liberties I could take as my mother’s child. You have spotlit the foundation of why we are consistently at loggerheads and behave in a manner more likened to Women’s Liberation, to combat and equate, so as to avoid being subjected to female humiliation. You’re either pampered (and do nothing) or humiliated, there is no middle. The abuse is more severe than what was portrayed in the movie “Coming to America” - the woof woof scene. Imagine crawling to your husband, in front of primary gathered guests and foreign dignitaries and sitting at his side, on the floor, like a dog would - eyes cast down.
I couldn't agree more slessofme, as I too would much prefer being looped in VS the alternative. Who wouldn't want to be "read in" with regards to his thoughts, considerations and intentions.0 -
xFunctionalStrengthx wrote: »You're looking at it from a Western culture viewpoint. There's other cultures, and it isn't necessarily wrong for this to occur due to distance and duration of them being in another country halfway around the world.
It’s very astute of you and slessofme to discern that our friends much like my sister and I aren’t all modern Western cultured individuals. The reason I say that is, that my male friends are NW Europeans, 1st generation Americans. I think inasmuch as we are nurtured by what is our cultural norms and adaptations with how we handle/mishandle our Western (American) loves, our friends are pretty much guilty of the same folley, where their European cultures might have lent diagnostic approaches to their marriages. It is difficult in my opinion for an outsider to think to control what 2 people who have elected to spend and build their lives together, cemented by the marital contract, to cast judgment with how such couples choose to “handle” what they allow in their marital bed.
Many I think are detached from having to address the issue of separation because of a job. I hail from a country, with a youth majority, most of whom when employed are contracted overseas. One of the 2 is in the islands, the other abroad and it’s not even deployment as an American military spouse would understand. He or she is based in a foreign country. He or she and the children are in the Pacific. They have to discuss sex. They have to discuss boundaries. You have to step over lines you wouldn’t want to consider, had you worked in the same city. As a former Marine, you would be aware of the stress your deployments had on your ex-wife and your children(?) It’s never easy because when you’d returned, they had you with them at home. How often did you get work leaves? (They only get to go home then). There always is a lot of loneliness on all sides. Someone has to give.0 -
777Gemma888 wrote: »Isn't open relationship enough for this? why "marriage" with those parameters ?
Again OP, here’s another delineating point between your culture and mine … Traditional marital boundaries, permissable access and markers of conservatism (“towing the line”) obviously differ via interpretation. What matters to the public (ie extended family and community) - one’s public face doesn’t necessarily translate to your marital bed. A married couple observes the Christian morals of the dictates of marriage, publicly. Privately, we are tasked with “handling the spouse,” however he or she comes, gender and exposure determined. It is a traditional tribal union; 9 times out of 10, he or she does not meet the Western romantised ideals of girl meets boy, woman meets man. No. There is an underlying gain for the man. Always. The woman is a booster. To help you understand, using the Indian Dowry Culture, the woman comes with her dowry, but is set apart from her dowry. She is still woman and the dowry are the assets. Comparatively, in my culture, the woman was part of the dowry, She was tradeable. We were currency before Christianity (Catholicism, Methodism, Anglicanism).
Open relationships within a marital union, in my opinion is too liberal with laxity, which easily can lead to sloppiness and mishandling. An open relationship in or outside a marital contract, with full disclosure is different. Consent with notification is paramount. Any plus one is vetted by the spouse. Rules and boundaries need to be adhered to. These aren’t always necessarily the case with open relationships. Oftentimes, it is a free for all; A panacea to sex addicts, really. What Person A (you) calls an open relationship, isn’t necessarily a qualifier for a definitive open marriage to me. When I do get married, how I define and maintain my marriage is between me and my husband, sans the labels. For some people, sex isn’t a priority. For others it is, needing thorough tabulation, even if to outside eyes and ears, it resembles an open relationship. Then one has to ask, who are we to cast judgement that a married couple desire pleasure, leisure and not just be sandbagged via the procreative decency rhetoric? When did the wife become the nominated prude? When did she become the sex withholding tyrant? When did the woman in a marital union become the anti-sex advocate? Why neuter a wife - why deny the woman in an open relationship the right to contractual marriage if that is what she desires, if he asks? When did the wife become the slated bore, so as to meet your statement - “Isn't open relationship enough for this? why "marriage" with those parameters?” Again - why can’t she be wedded? Are you indirectly castigating her to a lesser-woman state because she is not a virgin to the marital bed? Purity before marriage? How many women today, were virgins to their husbands?
Comparing to your writing skills mine seems like elementary level so bare with me if I misinterpreted something.
What I feel like is- you and I are on the same line of thought however, you don't mind all of that being part of "marriage" however, I feel like -it shouldn't be called marriage because we have had our brains washed as to what a "marriage" should be and that's why I asked you that. Now it is apparent, I was wrong and you were/are right.
If I look at my ancestors or my lineage. (Way back in time) Most had two "wives" - and they were "married" to both. Equal love on all sides. Kids did not have any resentment or hatred towards anyone because this was "normal".
There are been "stories" or "mythology" where woman also had more than 1 husband. Now I'm treading in uncharted territory so I'm unsure if it's mythology or true story.
About "Indian women and dowry" -so lol -this is how outside world views it eh- funny. Although it started with the fact that- in Hindu religion- boy and girl were both treated equally- little more power was given to women because they were considered the stabilizing energy vs men who were considered raw energy. When a woman was being married off- she would get her "share" or "part" of the will. Back in the day -boy's family used to send expensive gifts and jewelry to girl's parents. Showing that- "please allow us to bring your daughter home as a bride and look we can take care of her".
With times, things changed, infiltration of culture - now they show off- dude's education or income stream and parties have started "requesting" gifts. Now it's so bad that greed has totally taken over some families that from outside view it looks like "women came with dowry". BTW When a man and woman marry here- two income streams join together -don't they?
I, agree with you. Since marriage is our concept then why can we not dictate "what's included" in it. Who's to say marriage means 1 man and 1 woman. It could be 1 man with several women or 1 woman with several men. It could also mean man and woman plus the occasional partner. We created "marriage" we can dictate what goes in it.
Obviously we need a partner who is down for all that-however, since we have been "brain-washed" with the "concept" of marriage and what is means- it seems very "weird" talking about all these things under the umbrella of "marriage". People just choose to have multiple partners outside of "marriage" so as to avoid miscellaneous questions.
Look how humanely and calmly everyone is discussing all this here- versus what an uproar would be if one chooses to indulge in an argument like this in real life. (I will try it during my family reunion though haha)
We have been on the same line of thought however, I was just not phrasing it right. Also, I was just talking about the same parameters however you spoke from a culture which accepted that and I am speaking from my present culture which is western not ancestral one.
I, need to take some writing classes.0
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