Recomposition: Maintaining weight while losing fat
Replies
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@jillstreett
Question 1: Can I still eat at a slight deficit from TDEE during this phase, it would be a 250 cal deficit putting me at 1650 cals per day.
Yes recomp doesn't just happen at precisely maintenance calories. Whether -250 cals works you won't know until you try. It's only 4 weeks to get to goal weight so pretty irrelevant in the long term.
Question 2: should I drop back on the cardio? I am currently doing roughly 4 hours a week of intense HIIT style dance classes.
Dance classes being true HIIT is very unlikely.
Does your cardio stop you eating enough? Does your cardio interfere with your strength training or recovery?
If you are looking to build muscle (if that's what you mean by "tone all over") then dance classes aren't the way to do it.
Cut down to allow you to do three strength sessions a week might well be sensible.
Question 3: Can I do a full body session each time? Or should it be broken up by upper and lower body?
As a beginner (I'm assuming...) then body parts splits are probably sub-optimal. Yes you can do full body workouts x3 a week.
I plan on lifting in the gym at my new office location during my 1 hour lunch break, probably 2x a week. So I don't have the luxury of endless time and I don't want to be terribly sweaty and gross.
If you are only lifting twice a week then definitely don't do body part splits, do full body.
For the majority of my lifting lifetime twice a week training has been effectively strength and muscle mass maintenance not growth. As a beginner then x2 might be enough for some growth but think about what your goals and priorities are.
If it's CV fitness then focus on cardio - if it's muscle building then focus on lifting.
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Your TDEE with all that activity is only 1900?
My BMR is calculated at roughly 1400 and I do the light activity multiplier - 250. I feel most weeks I could do the moderate multiplier because in addition to work outs, I walk my dog and get out and about on the weekends and try to move as much as I can in general, but I do have a desk job. So, I use the light multiplier at the risk of overestimating my allowance.
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@jillstreett
Question 1: Can I still eat at a slight deficit from TDEE during this phase, it would be a 250 cal deficit putting me at 1650 cals per day.
Yes recomp doesn't just happen at precisely maintenance calories. Whether -250 cals works you won't know until you try. It's only 4 weeks to get to goal weight so pretty irrelevant in the long term.
Question 2: should I drop back on the cardio? I am currently doing roughly 4 hours a week of intense HIIT style dance classes.
Dance classes being true HIIT is very unlikely.
Does your cardio stop you eating enough? Does your cardio interfere with your strength training or recovery?
If you are looking to build muscle (if that's what you mean by "tone all over") then dance classes aren't the way to do it.
Cut down to allow you to do three strength sessions a week might well be sensible.
Question 3: Can I do a full body session each time? Or should it be broken up by upper and lower body?
As a beginner (I'm assuming...) then body parts splits are probably sub-optimal. Yes you can do full body workouts x3 a week.
I plan on lifting in the gym at my new office location during my 1 hour lunch break, probably 2x a week. So I don't have the luxury of endless time and I don't want to be terribly sweaty and gross.
If you are only lifting twice a week then definitely don't do body part splits, do full body.
For the majority of my lifting lifetime twice a week training has been effectively strength and muscle mass maintenance not growth. As a beginner then x2 might be enough for some growth but think about what your goals and priorities are.
If it's CV fitness then focus on cardio - if it's muscle building then focus on lifting.
This is great. Thank you. I was nervous about writing "HIIT style" in the dance class description because it is probably not exactly that in it's truest form, but it is a cyclical class with heart rate raising and then lowering dances. It's essentially Zumba but in a calculated way that has the short spurts of high followed by low, repetitively for an hour. I know people will read "Zumba" and think its easy, but I purposely sought this teacher out because of how intense her classes are. 48 pounds down, so it's not a passive dance class!
I will start with 2 days and see how I feel. I could add a third, but as you stated, see how the first 4 weeks goes.
Thanks!1 -
Your TDEE with all that activity is only 1900?
1 - Sure you can eat at a deficit. The balance between having really strong workouts to transform the body, and eating in deficit to still lose fat weight is something you decide.
2 - No recomp without giving the body a reason to build more muscle via resistance training. HIIT is not. (you have mentioned a routine that I can finally agree could be done for long and steady, or interval in nature - though I'd be curious what that appears like. Most misapply the HIIT term now)
3 - Depends on your time - 3 x weekly full body will give best response for time & effort. If you have 6 days available to you, 3 x upper & lower can work too and hit that goal with less time spent.
Thank you this is helpful!0 -
Understood.jillstreett wrote: »@jillstreett
Question 1: Can I still eat at a slight deficit from TDEE during this phase, it would be a 250 cal deficit putting me at 1650 cals per day.
Yes recomp doesn't just happen at precisely maintenance calories. Whether -250 cals works you won't know until you try. It's only 4 weeks to get to goal weight so pretty irrelevant in the long term.
Question 2: should I drop back on the cardio? I am currently doing roughly 4 hours a week of intense HIIT style dance classes.
Dance classes being true HIIT is very unlikely.
Does your cardio stop you eating enough? Does your cardio interfere with your strength training or recovery?
If you are looking to build muscle (if that's what you mean by "tone all over") then dance classes aren't the way to do it.
Cut down to allow you to do three strength sessions a week might well be sensible.
Question 3: Can I do a full body session each time? Or should it be broken up by upper and lower body?
As a beginner (I'm assuming...) then body parts splits are probably sub-optimal. Yes you can do full body workouts x3 a week.
I plan on lifting in the gym at my new office location during my 1 hour lunch break, probably 2x a week. So I don't have the luxury of endless time and I don't want to be terribly sweaty and gross.
If you are only lifting twice a week then definitely don't do body part splits, do full body.
For the majority of my lifting lifetime twice a week training has been effectively strength and muscle mass maintenance not growth. As a beginner then x2 might be enough for some growth but think about what your goals and priorities are.
If it's CV fitness then focus on cardio - if it's muscle building then focus on lifting.
This is great. Thank you. I was nervous about writing "HIIT style" in the dance class description because it is probably not exactly that in it's truest form, but it is a cyclical class with heart rate raising and then lowering dances. It's essentially Zumba but in a calculated way that has the short spurts of high followed by low, repetitively for an hour. I know people will read "Zumba" and think its easy, but I purposely sought this teacher out because of how intense her classes are. 48 pounds down, so it's not a passive dance class!
I will start with 2 days and see how I feel. I could add a third, but as you stated, see how the first 4 weeks goes.
Thanks!
HIIT is interval training but only a very small subset of interval training. I could call a 5hr very hilly cycle ride interval training but I couldn't call it HIIT.
Although the class will be good for your fitness and calorie burns it's not really going to contribute towards recomposition past a certain and very limited point. Just like the dozens of hours a month I cycle - great for fitness and enjoyment but I'm not going to add much muscle from it unless I find higher and higher hills to climb.
That's where strength/weight training is different - it's easy to progressively overload your current muscular abilities and that's the impetus for growth.
Enjoyment and fitness are great goals of course and recomp doesn't have to be a standalone goal - it can just be a nice bonus byproduct from your training/exercise.
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jillstreett wrote: »I
Question 1: Can I still eat at a slight deficit from TDEE during this phase, it would be a 250 cal deficit putting me at 1650 cals per day.
Question 2: should I drop back on the cardio? I am currently doing roughly 4 hours a week of intense HIIT style dance classes.
Question 3: Can I do a full body session each time? Or should it be broken up by upper and lower body?
I plan on lifting in the gym at my new office location during my 1 hour lunch break, probably 2x a week. So I don't have the luxury of endless time and I don't want to be terribly sweaty and gross.
Thanks!
I've been in recomp mode since 2016 so just giving my experience below.
1) That sounds about right. I eat 1600 (my maintenance seems to be somewhere around 1800-1900). If I stick to 1600, I slowly lose. I have "cheat" meals pretty regularly so my weight doesn't change much. Really, it's just moderation--eat sensibly 85% of the time.
My body has changed A LOT since I started recomping. One friend thinks I lost 20lbs; I lost 8. Another asked the other day: "What exercise routine have you been doing?!" The answer: lifting moderately heavy weights 2 times a week and changing up the routine; walking 3-4 miles a day; and doing 1-2 HIIT workouts w/weights 1-2 times a week. I lift every other day. Go by your measurements, not the scale, to assess your progress. And eat enough protein.
2) I used to do more cardio. Now I focus more on weight training. HIIT is great for fat-burning (which is part of the recomp process). Doing it 1-2 a week for an hour at a time hasn't slowed me down. I would focus more on the weights though.
3) I only do full body. I take a few minutes to plan out the exercises I'll do each session ahead of time so I'm not doing the same exercises every time--a balance of upper and lower. If I do lunges on Mon, for instance, I'll do squats on Weds. I can do my weight-lifting routine in 45 min so under an hour is do-able. Bring a protein shake to have when you're finished. If you're lifting right, you're probably going to sweat (even in AC). I'm not really seeing a way around that, if I'm honest. Maybe try to schedule your lunch break for later in the day? I workout at work too, but I'm a teacher so it's easy for me to go to gym after my last class and then go back to my desk and grade/prep for a few hours (in my sweating gym clothes). I felt kind of bad for a colleague who had to catch a ride how with me yesterday--I know I stunk!
Hope this helps and good luck!
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I do want to add that the leaner your body, the slower the changes. As to be expected, I saw the fastest results in my first six months. Now I don't really see anything, so again, you have to measure.2
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candicew70 wrote: »jillstreett wrote: »I
Question 1: Can I still eat at a slight deficit from TDEE during this phase, it would be a 250 cal deficit putting me at 1650 cals per day.
Question 2: should I drop back on the cardio? I am currently doing roughly 4 hours a week of intense HIIT style dance classes.
Question 3: Can I do a full body session each time? Or should it be broken up by upper and lower body?
I plan on lifting in the gym at my new office location during my 1 hour lunch break, probably 2x a week. So I don't have the luxury of endless time and I don't want to be terribly sweaty and gross.
Thanks!
I've been in recomp mode since 2016 so just giving my experience below.
1) That sounds about right. I eat 1600 (my maintenance seems to be somewhere around 1800-1900). If I stick to 1600, I slowly lose. I have "cheat" meals pretty regularly so my weight doesn't change much. Really, it's just moderation--eat sensibly 85% of the time.
My body has changed A LOT since I started recomping. One friend thinks I lost 20lbs; I lost 8. Another asked the other day: "What exercise routine have you been doing?!" The answer: lifting moderately heavy weights 2 times a week and changing up the routine; walking 3-4 miles a day; and doing 1-2 HIIT workouts w/weights 1-2 times a week. I lift every other day. Go by your measurements, not the scale, to assess your progress. And eat enough protein.
2) I used to do more cardio. Now I focus more on weight training. HIIT is great for fat-burning (which is part of the recomp process). Doing it 1-2 a week for an hour at a time hasn't slowed me down. I would focus more on the weights though.
3) I only do full body. I take a few minutes to plan out the exercises I'll do each session ahead of time so I'm not doing the same exercises every time--a balance of upper and lower. If I do lunges on Mon, for instance, I'll do squats on Weds. I can do my weight-lifting routine in 45 min so under an hour is do-able. Bring a protein shake to have when you're finished. If you're lifting right, you're probably going to sweat (even in AC). I'm not really seeing a way around that, if I'm honest. Maybe try to schedule your lunch break for later in the day? I workout at work too, but I'm a teacher so it's easy for me to go to gym after my last class and then go back to my desk and grade/prep for a few hours (in my sweating gym clothes). I felt kind of bad for a colleague who had to catch a ride how with me yesterday--I know I stunk!
Hope this helps and good luck!
This is fantastic as well. I am feeling even better about my preliminary strategy and will tweak as seen fit. I am glad to hear that eating at maintenance is not necessarily a key component because I simply do not want to eat that much most days. The protein shake I will have to ensure I do because while I make every effort to get enough protein, I feel I could always use more. Do you have a protein shake suggestion? Low in sugar, not artificial sweeteners, and maybe like 200 calories? Also, should I avoid ones that you mix with milk? I know that the protein in milk is great, but I personally feel like it is so dang sweet!
Thank you!1 -
This is fantastic as well. I am feeling even better about my preliminary strategy and will tweak as seen fit. I am glad to hear that eating at maintenance is not necessarily a key component because I simply do not want to eat that much most days. The protein shake I will have to ensure I do because while I make every effort to get enough protein, I feel I could always use more. Do you have a protein shake suggestion? Low in sugar, not artificial sweeteners, and maybe like 200 calories? Also, should I avoid ones that you mix with milk? I know that the protein in milk is great, but I personally feel like it is so dang sweet!
Thank you!
I hope it helps! I like Premiere Protein. It's 160 calories, 30 grams of protein, 1 gram of fat (I think)--not sure how many carbs but very few. I blend a carton of this with some frozen fruit. You can buy single shakes or the powder. I drink one of these after every weight lifting session. I don't like super sweet either and to me it's just right.
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I'm trying to decide if recomposition is the right plan for me... I am 5'7" and 140lb. My original plan was to lose 10lb because I am just a bit flabbier than I would like, but I really want to get more muscular and I am really sick of cardio. I had never heard of recomp until this post. I have used weight machines in the past and done squats with a bar but I am still very new to weight lifting and not sure how to start. I'm currently eating 1400-1600 calories per day and doing 45min-1hr of cardio 5 days a week, and I haven't lost anything yet but I've only been on this plan for a week and a half. for recomp if I eat at TDEE how often and for how long should I do strength training? and how often should I work each muscle group? should I be doing cardio such as HIIT as well?1
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I'm trying to decide if recomposition is the right plan for me... I am 5'7" and 140lb. My original plan was to lose 10lb because I am just a bit flabbier than I would like, but I really want to get more muscular and I am really sick of cardio. I had never heard of recomp until this post. I have used weight machines in the past and done squats with a bar but I am still very new to weight lifting and not sure how to start. I'm currently eating 1400-1600 calories per day and doing 45min-1hr of cardio 5 days a week, and I haven't lost anything yet but I've only been on this plan for a week and a half. for recomp if I eat at TDEE how often and for how long should I do strength training? and how often should I work each muscle group? should I be doing cardio such as HIIT as well?
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you
Yes to serious lifting plan needed - progressive overload - body needs a reason to make more muscle.
TDEE constantly, at least when viewed from a weekly average - nailing it daily not required.
HIIT (when truly HIIT not the faddish called workouts now) is as close as you can get to lifting with a cardio workout.
If lifting - skip the HIIT, just do the lifting.4 -
I'm trying to decide if recomposition is the right plan for me... I am 5'7" and 140lb. My original plan was to lose 10lb because I am just a bit flabbier than I would like, but I really want to get more muscular and I am really sick of cardio. I had never heard of recomp until this post. I have used weight machines in the past and done squats with a bar but I am still very new to weight lifting and not sure how to start. I'm currently eating 1400-1600 calories per day and doing 45min-1hr of cardio 5 days a week, and I haven't lost anything yet but I've only been on this plan for a week and a half. for recomp if I eat at TDEE how often and for how long should I do strength training? and how often should I work each muscle group? should I be doing cardio such as HIIT as well?
I think you're in a perfect spot to try to recomp. As a beginner, following a full-body, 3x/week program will be best. This will allow you to hit all your muscle groups multiple times per week to build a good base of strength. Starting Strength, Strong Curves, and New Rules of Lifting for Women are all highly recommended programs. If you want to do cardio on non-lifting days that's up to you. These programs usually take about 1 hour per session, give or take. Focus on nailing form and getting strong in the main compound lifts.3 -
@hmkiesel
To add to the chorus....
I'm trying to decide if recomposition is the right plan for me... I am 5'7" and 140lb. - Sounds perfect.
I am really sick of cardio. - Is there no activity, sport or pastime that elevates your HR that you enjoy? It doesn't have to be in a gym either. Most of my 240 hours of cardio this year has been outside in beautiful countryside.
I had never heard of recomp - before it gained a name people just called it getting in shape. An entirely reasonable expectation from someone exercising/training.
very new to weight lifting and not sure how to start - A beginner program will guide you. Typically they are x3 a week and full body to give you three cycles or stressing your muscles, repair/recovery and growth.
should I be doing cardio such as HIIT as well? - Yes to cardio for health and fitness (and hopefully enjoyment!) but true HIIT would be a really poor choice. It's unpleasant, very fatiguing and needs recovery time. As a beginner to weights you will need your recovery from the lifting. Low to moderate intensity cardio should be fine and can even be helpful.
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I weigh 130 in both. Mainly focusing on buildings quads and glutes and losing some fat still/looking less flappy. Giving my body a break by eating at maintenance and just strength training has really shown itself out both physically and mentally!
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https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you
Yes to serious lifting plan needed - progressive overload - body needs a reason to make more muscle.
TDEE constantly, at least when viewed from a weekly average - nailing it daily not required.
HIIT (when truly HIIT not the faddish called workouts now) is as close as you can get to lifting with a cardio workout.
If lifting - skip the HIIT, just do the lifting.I think you're in a perfect spot to try to recomp. As a beginner, following a full-body, 3x/week program will be best. This will allow you to hit all your muscle groups multiple times per week to build a good base of strength. Starting Strength, Strong Curves, and New Rules of Lifting for Women are all highly recommended programs. If you want to do cardio on non-lifting days that's up to you. These programs usually take about 1 hour per session, give or take. Focus on nailing form and getting strong in the main compound lifts.@hmkiesel
To add to the chorus....
I'm trying to decide if recomposition is the right plan for me... I am 5'7" and 140lb. - Sounds perfect.
I am really sick of cardio. - Is there no activity, sport or pastime that elevates your HR that you enjoy? It doesn't have to be in a gym either. Most of my 240 hours of cardio this year has been outside in beautiful countryside.
I had never heard of recomp - before it gained a name people just called it getting in shape. An entirely reasonable expectation from someone exercising/training.
very new to weight lifting and not sure how to start - A beginner program will guide you. Typically they are x3 a week and full body to give you three cycles or stressing your muscles, repair/recovery and growth.
should I be doing cardio such as HIIT as well? - Yes to cardio for health and fitness (and hopefully enjoyment!) but true HIIT would be a really poor choice. It's unpleasant, very fatiguing and needs recovery time. As a beginner to weights you will need your recovery from the lifting. Low to moderate intensity cardio should be fine and can even be helpful.
Thank you! I should have been more specific. I don't mind cardio, I used to Irish Dance for 10+ hours a week and I loved it. I gave it up a few years ago because I was in college full time and working; I couldn't keep up with the hours and was injuring myself. but I recently joined a Taekwondo club that meets twice a week for 1.5 hours and I really enjoy that. I mainly just don't like cardio machines at the gym or running outside. But I've decided to start full body weight training M,W,F, with my taekwondo class as cardio T,Th. Gonna take it slow to start but I'll definitely look into a beginner weight lifting program.
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I'm trying to decide if recomposition is the right plan for me... I am 5'7" and 140lb. My original plan was to lose 10lb because I am just a bit flabbier than I would like, but I really want to get more muscular and I am really sick of cardio. I had never heard of recomp until this post. I have used weight machines in the past and done squats with a bar but I am still very new to weight lifting and not sure how to start. I'm currently eating 1400-1600 calories per day and doing 45min-1hr of cardio 5 days a week, and I haven't lost anything yet but I've only been on this plan for a week and a half. for recomp if I eat at TDEE how often and for how long should I do strength training? and how often should I work each muscle group? should I be doing cardio such as HIIT as well?
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you
Yes to serious lifting plan needed - progressive overload - body needs a reason to make more muscle.
TDEE constantly, at least when viewed from a weekly average - nailing it daily not required.
HIIT (when truly HIIT not the faddish called workouts now) is as close as you can get to lifting with a cardio workout.
If lifting - skip the HIIT, just do the lifting.
I am annoyed by what is called HIIT. Mostly it is because I can't do real HIIT; it's just too hard. But when I say that, people take it that I can't handle a "HIIT dance class" or whatever.
My understanding is that HIIT was "invented" by a college track coach who had his distance runners cross train with his sprinters and then incorporate intervals of that into their workouts. They were world class athletes running practice miles in 5-6 minutes and doing some 400 meter sprints in about a minute. They were doing their miles as fast as most of us sprint then kicking it up a notch or two every now and then. They started losing weight on their carefully controlled diets and in the testing that ensued they figured out that they kept the high metabolic rate long after they stopped when they did the HIIT. The Slightly Harder Interval Training offered in most gum classes doesn't have this effect.5 -
@hmkiesel That's where I am, too. 5'7 and 140. I was in a very ugly gain/loose/gain cycle with having two kids and just last year lost 35 to get back to 140. Over that year, I've been recomping (I actually tried bulking and cutting, but found it wasn't for me) and now I am fitting into clothes that were snug when I was at 130 just because of the new distribution of my body weight. It blew my mind! I do cardio 2x/week and lift 3x.7
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Still sitting at 130ish, and my waist has gotten slightly smaller. I notice a lot of my pants/leggings go higher.
Seeing slight changes here and there are helping cuz not being in a deficit is something I’m still struggling with when I was so used to dropping sizes/weight vs being the same!
Also my legs are definitely getting a lot more defined & slightly smaller (esp inner thighs).
Still a work in progress, but overall I’m fairly happy
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Sorry for the post again - but I thought it would be important to share for the people (like myself) who were afraid to increase calories to maintenance.
I haven’t even checked the scale - last I was 130, which I’m probably still around that range but I’ve decided to go more so by how I look and feel as body recomp can sometimes be tricky when it comes to scale numbers. I don’t wanna be discouraged.
I’ve been enjoying the feeling of just feeling strong, and not being in a deficit has helped with my performance while working out as well. Sometimes it’s still a mental struggle but so far, so good19
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