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Switching to veggie for health benefits
Spitspot81
Posts: 208 Member
I have, for years, suffered from an extremely lazy bowel. I have never found a root cause....I do restrict my calorie intake a lot and often wonder if this could be a reason. I get very bloated and uncomfortable.
I have also found over the years that I enjoy eating more vegetarian food over a lot of meats.
Has anyone ever changed to a vegetarian diet and noticed a benefit in health and well-being?
I have also found over the years that I enjoy eating more vegetarian food over a lot of meats.
Has anyone ever changed to a vegetarian diet and noticed a benefit in health and well-being?
1
Replies
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Have you been able to narrow down any trigger foods for your issue, or is it just in general that you're dealing with it? Perhaps eating vegetarian will at least help you determine if it was meat that was doing it.1
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RelCanonical wrote: »Have you been able to narrow down any trigger foods for your issue, or is it just in general that you're dealing with it? Perhaps eating vegetarian will at least help you determine if it was meat that was doing it.
No I have never been able to pin point any foods that help or hinder me. I do wonder if I am too restrictive. Sometimes if I chill out a bit on a Saturday night and have a good meal along with a drink or 2 I notice that on a Sunday morning I have no tummy issues.
I don’t eat a huge amount of fairly products either. I guess giving it a go will give me the answer. I just wondered if anyone else had experience?
1 -
Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
For most, plant based diets are about the person's personal perceived ethics - correct or not - concerning eating animal based protein, not health. Both are considered luxuries of the modern world/countries where the amount of food available allows one to choose what to, or not to, eat based on personal ethics vs. survival.8 -
grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.9 -
i'd recommend you log your food - especially on those nights you are lazy and then have less bowel issues the following day - it could be fiber you ate; it could be an increase in fats which helped to move things along5
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Have you seen a gastrointestinalogist about your issues? That would be a better place to start than from changing your diet right away. I have IBS, and I have stronger negative stomach reactions to vegetables in general than I do to meats.9
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Spitspot81 wrote: »I have, for years, suffered from an extremely lazy bowel. I have never found a root cause....I do restrict my calorie intake a lot and often wonder if this could be a reason. I get very bloated and uncomfortable.
I have also found over the years that I enjoy eating more vegetarian food over a lot of meats.
Has anyone ever changed to a vegetarian diet and noticed a benefit in health and well-being?
It's correlation in my case. I never had any tests done. I never even saw a doctor to get a diagnosis on the condition. It could've been eczema (I've had it on other parts of me) or dandruff or psoriasis. Probably not that last, since it's not exactly curable but whatever. I had "scabs on my scalp". You couldn't see them to look at me; my hair hid them, but if I reached up to scratch my head, they were there.
I cut meat, fish, and poultry out of my diet and the condition cleared up completely. In the 28-odd years since I've gone veg, I've had maybe one mild (lasted less than a week) flare up.
Now, maybe I've got a mild allergy to one of the above three animal proteins. Maybe it's something more specific, like beef/chicken/tuna. I don't know; I never experimented. Maybe it would have gone away on its own, even if I hadn't gone veg. Like I said, never saw a doctor, never had a diagnosis.
But I don't have that condition anymore either.1 -
You need to consult your doctor about your digestive concerns before making any dietary changes. Depending on what you eat instead of meat, you may wind up significantly increasing your fiber intake, which can make some digestive issues worse. Some fruits and vegetables may also irritate certain digestive issues.
A vegetarian diet is not necessarily going to fix heath problems, and I say this as a 14 year vegetarian. I have been an obese vegetarian, am now an optimal BMI vegetarian, and being vegetarian played absolutely zero role in my weight loss. Being vegetarian or vegan does not naturally create a calorie deficit and is not guaranteed to address any medical problem. If your own personal preferences, morals, etc. inspire you to stop eating meat, then that is a fine reason to be vegetarian. Certain health conditions may benefit from going vegetarian, but you should not expect a vegetarian diet to be a cure all.6 -
asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
Vegans and vegetarians are pretty under-represented in the population overall; I'm not sure they're more under-represented among the obese.
I was an obese vegetarian - went from thin to fat to obese as a vegetarian (over a period of 30-some years). For the last 10+ years of obesity, I even stayed obese while vegetarian and working out hard 6 days most weeks, including competing for several years as a masters athlete (rowing). It takes surprisingly few excess calories to get and stay obese, if one consumes them consistently, and vegetable calories work fine for that (especially nuts, nut butters, starchy veg, fruit, etc.) .
OP, there's nothing magic at all health-wise about being vegetarian. (I've been vegetarian for nearly 45 years, so I'm not shilling for "big meat" here.)
People can eat a healthy vegan diet, a healthy vegetarian diet, or a healthy omnivorous diet. Purely from a health standpoint, I'd guess an omnivorous diet has the highest health potential: It doesn't require you to eat masses of red meat necessarily (if you don't want it), but it doesn't restrict you from meat either; and you have access to all of the healthy foods that vegans and vegetarians eat, besides. More options for healthy food: I don't think that could be wrong, health-wise.
Of course it's possible for certain people to have food allergies or sensitivities or triggers, and to therefore do better if they avoid those foods, whatever they may be. A referral from your doctor to a Registered Dietician (RD) could help you investigate that possibility.
A tendency toward slower bowel function can be a genetic issue, or related to a health condition (even an undiagnosed one). Or it can be diet-related.
The most common factors in slowed elimination/constipation are:
* Not enough fiber
* Not enough hydration (water or other fluids)
* Not enough fat intake (often the key issue for people restricting calories, if they over-restrict fats)
* Sub-optimal exercise (moving the body, especially the middle, can help)
* Suboptimal amounts of certain micronutrients (magnesium is a common suspect)
* . . . or a combination.
For some people, it seems to be helpful to regularly eat a variety of probiotic foods (natural kefir or yogurt, kombucha, miso, raw sauerkraut/kim chi or other fermented veggies, etc.) in addition to the prebiotic (fiber-intense) ones.
You mention doing better after you "chill out and have a big meal and 1-2 drinks". There are hints in there, perhaps, to 2 possibilities.
One is the question of fat or fiber intake: Do you get more fats or fiber than usual in those meals? If so, experiment with increasing fats or fiber on other days, within your calorie goal, and see if that helps.
The other is the "chill out": It's possible for stress and tension to be a contributor, in some cases. If that's possible in your case, perhaps experiment with other relaxation techniques for a while to see if they help (warm aromatherapy bubblebaths, stretching/yoga, maybe a simple non-religious meditation like the relaxation response (http://www.relaxationresponse.org/steps/) or a meditation app, or exercise if you find that to be a de-stressor).
Of course, if you're over-restricting calories to an extreme, trying to lose weight more rapidly than sensible for your current size, that could be a contributing factor, too.
Just as background, I was diagnosed with IBS-C at one point, and rarely have symptoms anymore. For me, hydration was a big factor, and exercise (for stress reduction as well as the movement itself). But it can vary for others.
Best wishes!13 -
Does this happen more when you are restricting your food intake?
It's possible that you are restricting your fat intake too much. Too little fat causes less movement in the bowels. You state that after a good meal, you feel better. It may be increased fat intake.
Try adding some fat to your diet too see if that helps.3 -
Whole plant based diets have proven beneficial for many diseases. A couple of books you may find helpful, China Study and How not to Die. It has helped me tremendously, and I am believer it will help others as well. Read the book, or listen to it as I did. Its worth the $7, or even better, get a free trial on audible and try it.14
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I have noticed some health benefits since cutting out most animal products, namely better cholesterol levels and increased energy.5
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Spitspot81 wrote: »RelCanonical wrote: »Have you been able to narrow down any trigger foods for your issue, or is it just in general that you're dealing with it? Perhaps eating vegetarian will at least help you determine if it was meat that was doing it.
No I have never been able to pin point any foods that help or hinder me. I do wonder if I am too restrictive. Sometimes if I chill out a bit on a Saturday night and have a good meal along with a drink or 2 I notice that on a Sunday morning I have no tummy issues.
I don’t eat a huge amount of fairly products either. I guess giving it a go will give me the answer. I just wondered if anyone else had experience?
Before changing your diet completely, particularly adding more restrictions to what you suggest is already a restricted diet at times, perhaps look into the 'chill out' bit. Ease up on the restrictions, eat in moderation, and find ways to chill - meditation, yoga or other such activities.
It's amazing how stress and our own mental health can cause issues with our gut.
5 -
Sportguru01166583 wrote: »Whole plant based diets have proven beneficial for many diseases. A couple of books you may find helpful, China Study and How not to Die. It has helped me tremendously, and I am believer it will help others as well. Read the book, or listen to it as I did. Its worth the $7, or even better, get a free trial on audible and try it.
If you have a public library card, you can often get audiobooks using the libby app.0 -
asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
Vegans and vegetarians are pretty under-represented in the population overall; I'm not sure they're more under-represented among the obese.
Several studies, including some larger ones, have found that vegans tend to have a lower BMI than non-vegans.
https://veganhealth.org/cardiovascular-disease-markers-in-vegans/#bmi
This, of course, doesn't tell us anything about what will happen to *individuals* who choose to go vegan. I would still recommend that people who want to lose weight focus on what matters (calories), because it would be very easy to go vegan and still not reduce the number of calories one is consuming overall. Anecdotally, I've heard dozens and dozens of stories from people who went vegan and didn't lose weight and even people who gained weight.
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asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
This is really not true, especially for vegetarians. Meat in and of itself isn't necessarily high cal at all, and some can be quite low cal (shrimp, white fish, turkey or chicken breast, among others). Many also find protein filling. Most of the foods that bump up my cals, traditionally, are perfectly vegetarian, including cheese, olive oil, and the many starchy foods that can be easily overeaten by many, especially when combined with some kind of fat. It's not difficult to find vegetarian sweets either.
For vegan, I think it's more true, although it's not that tough to find substitutes. Since I love dairy (including cheese), it does naturally force me to eat lower cal, and if you are focused on eating sufficient protein, that takes more cals and might tend to push you toward more filling choices and naturally cut calories (whole grains and beans and lentils and the like vs. more refined options). It also just makes it hard to impulse eat, since so often available choices won't be vegan. A friend of mine is, and we usually have to go to a place that is intentionally vegan or vegan friendly for there to be a dessert option available at a restaurant or cafe, and it's much harder to find vegan options than veg in general (I'm not a vegetarian but I have been at times in the past, and I've eaten 100% plant-based for periods of time).
I think vegans (and maybe vegetarian) are less likely to be overweight (to the extent that's true -- IME, it's likely true with vegans and I'm more skeptical about vegetarians), because they are more likely to be health conscious on average and, especially, because it's harder to eat completely mindlessly and you may lack high cal options unless you actually cook it yourself in many cases.
For what it's worth, the first time I tried eating 100% plant-based (it was for Lent one year), I did lose weight without trying. Every time since then I don't, I maintain and don't find it easier than when eating meat.
Anyway, I guess this gets me back to the question -- not personally, no. I respect eating vegetarian for ethical reasons, but I've never felt particularly better or worse doing it. I've never really had symptoms related to what I eat, however, and I eat lots of vegetables whether veg or not. My sister had a lot of issues with IBS when younger, and for her finding the trigger foods was crucial, but they were all vegetarian -- certain raw veg (cruciferous veg) that she can have cooked, avocado, and melon. Some people have issues with dairy, that's a common one, but again vegetarian although not vegan.6 -
asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
I was an overweight vegetarian, even when I also was younger and playing sports year-round (in fall and in spring, I played on two different footy teams simultaneously). It does happen, especially for veggies/vegans who bulk up on breads and pastas and cheeses (for the veggies, anyway) instead of veg.
OP - A sudden switch to a diet that contains mostly plant-based ingredients has a high chance of making your intestinal issues worse, at least initially. There's a lot of cellulose in there, and our body isn't very good at digesting it. Legumes will make anyone gassy, too, but especially if you suddenly up your concentration. =]
You may want to consider a slow adjustment to your new diet, give your microbiota and your intestines time to adjust.
Considering what you've said about how changing how much you eat seems to have an effect, I'd recommend also chasing that thread. Your enterocytes - the cells that line your gut, that are responsible for maintaining the health of your gut lining and your gut microbiota - are unique in that they absorb nutrients directly from your intestines (our other cells get nutrients from our blood). Part of what you're doing when you eat is feeding your enterocytes. If they aren't getting enough, they can't function the way they ought to, and part of what they do is help maintain the microbial gut population - so maybe that's contributing to the signs you're seeing? Maybe they're happier when you eat more. *shrug*5 -
asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
This is really not true, especially for vegetarians. Meat in and of itself isn't necessarily high cal at all, and some can be quite low cal (shrimp, white fish, turkey or chicken breast, among others). Many also find protein filling. Most of the foods that bump up my cals, traditionally, are perfectly vegetarian, including cheese, olive oil, and the many starchy foods that can be easily overeaten by many, especially when combined with some kind of fat. It's not difficult to find vegetarian sweets either.
For vegan, I think it's more true, although it's not that tough to find substitutes. Since I love dairy (including cheese), it does naturally force me to eat lower cal, and if you are focused on eating sufficient protein, that takes more cals and might tend to push you toward more filling choices and naturally cut calories (whole grains and beans and lentils and the like vs. more refined options). It also just makes it hard to impulse eat, since so often available choices won't be vegan. A friend of mine is, and we usually have to go to a place that is intentionally vegan or vegan friendly for there to be a dessert option available at a restaurant or cafe, and it's much harder to find vegan options than veg in general (I'm not a vegetarian but I have been at times in the past, and I've eaten 100% plant-based for periods of time).
I think vegans (and maybe vegetarian) are less likely to be overweight (to the extent that's true -- IME, it's likely true with vegans and I'm more skeptical about vegetarians), because they are more likely to be health conscious on average and, especially, because it's harder to eat completely mindlessly and you may lack high cal options unless you actually cook it yourself in many cases.
For what it's worth, the first time I tried eating 100% plant-based (it was for Lent one year), I did lose weight without trying. Every time since then I don't, I maintain and don't find it easier than when eating meat.
Anyway, I guess this gets me back to the question -- not personally, no. I respect eating vegetarian for ethical reasons, but I've never felt particularly better or worse doing it. I've never really had symptoms related to what I eat, however, and I eat lots of vegetables whether veg or not. My sister had a lot of issues with IBS when younger, and for her finding the trigger foods was crucial, but they were all vegetarian -- certain raw veg (cruciferous veg) that she can have cooked, avocado, and melon. Some people have issues with dairy, that's a common one, but again vegetarian although not vegan.
The thing about veganism (in my experience) is that you're cutting down a lot of opportunities for eating (the cookies a co-worker brings into work, adding dessert to your dinner at most restaurants, etc), but it's not that difficult to still eat excess calories either due to making stuff yourself or (for many people now) through specially made vegan options. I had absolutely zero problems becoming overweight as a vegan, it was attention to calories that reversed that.
So reducing impulse eating, there is certainly an impact. If I want, say, a milkshake, it's going to take a bit more effort than it would if I was non-vegan. So many times, I'm just going to skip it. But veganism isn't going to do anything to stop me from taking extra servings of dinner or doubling my french fry order when I'm going out to eat. I've still got to do that myself.6 -
I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?7 -
asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
Unless you just manage to do it intuitively there is a learning curve to vegetarianism and veganism so that you know how to get proper nutrition. I have seen some jump into it without this knowledge that ended up quite ill.
I don't think it is far-fetched to say that many people gain weight because they don't understand their nutritional needs so it stands to reason that people who study it may be less at risk. That doesn't exclude a person from eating too much for a number of other reasons though.
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amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...0 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.7 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?1 -
janejellyroll wrote: »asliceofjackie wrote: »grinning_chick wrote: »Plenty of overweight to obese vegetarians and vegans in the world. As such the idea they lead to better health and well-being, and the common implication of those words mean, is incorrect.
Do you have any statistics and/or source?
My personal experience is that vegetarians and vegans are way underrepresented in terms of being overweight or obese (not counting those who are overweight and obese and go vegan after to stifle it, which will skew the numbers). Losing weight is all about creating a calorie deficit, and going vegetarian/vegan is an easy way to change your diet in a direction that will almost naturally create a calorie deficit due to the low calorier/volume ratio of vegetarian food.
I'll agree with you though, most vegetarians and definitely most vegans I meet do it for ethical reasons.
This is really not true, especially for vegetarians. Meat in and of itself isn't necessarily high cal at all, and some can be quite low cal (shrimp, white fish, turkey or chicken breast, among others). Many also find protein filling. Most of the foods that bump up my cals, traditionally, are perfectly vegetarian, including cheese, olive oil, and the many starchy foods that can be easily overeaten by many, especially when combined with some kind of fat. It's not difficult to find vegetarian sweets either.
For vegan, I think it's more true, although it's not that tough to find substitutes. Since I love dairy (including cheese), it does naturally force me to eat lower cal, and if you are focused on eating sufficient protein, that takes more cals and might tend to push you toward more filling choices and naturally cut calories (whole grains and beans and lentils and the like vs. more refined options). It also just makes it hard to impulse eat, since so often available choices won't be vegan. A friend of mine is, and we usually have to go to a place that is intentionally vegan or vegan friendly for there to be a dessert option available at a restaurant or cafe, and it's much harder to find vegan options than veg in general (I'm not a vegetarian but I have been at times in the past, and I've eaten 100% plant-based for periods of time).
I think vegans (and maybe vegetarian) are less likely to be overweight (to the extent that's true -- IME, it's likely true with vegans and I'm more skeptical about vegetarians), because they are more likely to be health conscious on average and, especially, because it's harder to eat completely mindlessly and you may lack high cal options unless you actually cook it yourself in many cases.
For what it's worth, the first time I tried eating 100% plant-based (it was for Lent one year), I did lose weight without trying. Every time since then I don't, I maintain and don't find it easier than when eating meat.
Anyway, I guess this gets me back to the question -- not personally, no. I respect eating vegetarian for ethical reasons, but I've never felt particularly better or worse doing it. I've never really had symptoms related to what I eat, however, and I eat lots of vegetables whether veg or not. My sister had a lot of issues with IBS when younger, and for her finding the trigger foods was crucial, but they were all vegetarian -- certain raw veg (cruciferous veg) that she can have cooked, avocado, and melon. Some people have issues with dairy, that's a common one, but again vegetarian although not vegan.
The thing about veganism (in my experience) is that you're cutting down a lot of opportunities for eating (the cookies a co-worker brings into work, adding dessert to your dinner at most restaurants, etc), but it's not that difficult to still eat excess calories either due to making stuff yourself or (for many people now) through specially made vegan options. I had absolutely zero problems becoming overweight as a vegan, it was attention to calories that reversed that.
So reducing impulse eating, there is certainly an impact. If I want, say, a milkshake, it's going to take a bit more effort than it would if I was non-vegan. So many times, I'm just going to skip it. But veganism isn't going to do anything to stop me from taking extra servings of dinner or doubling my french fry order when I'm going out to eat. I've still got to do that myself.
Yeah, that's basically what I was thinking. It's not that vegan food isn't high cal; there are plenty of examples of high cal vegan food. But the high cal food you happen to get offered or see when stuck at an airport (my life lately!) and the like is unlikely to be vegan, and for those who have in the past fallen into bad habits about that kind of stuff, it can be helpful for a time. But it's still possible to buy a pint of vegan ice cream and eat it all. ;-)
(That said, I ate a stupid amount of salted nuts in the airport not that long ago.)4 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?
Lose weight while maintaining muscle. My allowance is not that high compared to recommendations. I'm even slightly lower than I need to be for sustainability reasons. I try to eat at least 80 grams of it daily. Even with a good serving of beans, I don't get anywhere near that unless I have multiple servings of plant proteins, and I don't feel like eating beans every day. A typical day for me without focusing on protein ends up at about 40 grams at most.0 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?
Lose weight while maintaining muscle. My allowance is not that high compared to recommendations. I'm even slightly lower than I need to be for sustainability reasons. I try to eat at least 80 grams of it daily. Even with a good serving of beans, I don't get anywhere near that unless I have multiple servings of plant proteins, and I don't feel like eating beans every day. A typical day for me without focusing on protein ends up at about 40 grams at most.
I make up a 10 serving meal in my instant pot every week, with Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Brown Rice, Tofu, Veggies, Veg Broth, and spices. It usually has about 40g+ of carbs, around 10g or less of fat, and a little over 30g protein per server. I eat one of those per day. I also have 1 smoothie per day with 2 scoops of plant protein with strawberries and bananas, which has a little over 40g protein in it.
Just those 2 alone, put me close to 80g protein, please other stuff I eat during the day. I find it very easy doing this to get a little over 100g protein per day, I shoot for 120g and I'm 190 lbs.
I have been losing weight and gaining a little bit of muscle and strength.1 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?
Lose weight while maintaining muscle. My allowance is not that high compared to recommendations. I'm even slightly lower than I need to be for sustainability reasons. I try to eat at least 80 grams of it daily. Even with a good serving of beans, I don't get anywhere near that unless I have multiple servings of plant proteins, and I don't feel like eating beans every day. A typical day for me without focusing on protein ends up at about 40 grams at most.
I make up a 10 serving meal in my instant pot every week, with Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Brown Rice, Tofu, Veggies, Veg Broth, and spices. It usually has about 40g+ of carbs, around 10g or less of fat, and a little over 30g protein per server. I eat one of those per day. I also have 1 smoothie per day with 2 scoops of plant protein with strawberries and bananas, which has a little over 40g protein in it.
Just those 2 alone, put me close to 80g protein, please other stuff I eat during the day. I find it very easy doing this to get a little over 100g protein per day, I shoot for 120g and I'm 190 lbs.
I have been losing weight and gaining a little bit of muscle and strength.
It's good that you found what works for you. A diet focused on protein is not sustainable for me, let alone one that needs extra effort to achieve. I don't see myself dedicating time, effort, and calories to something that I can get easily elsewhere. As I said, the highest source of plant protein I have access to is kidney beans. That's 1200 calories for 80 grams. I do much better eating whatever I have an appetite for. I tried a protein focused diet in the beginning and it was too stressful and not sustainable at all. I basically eat whatever, while incorporating protein wherever I can without stressing too much about it, then by the end of the day if I need more I'll just open a can of tuna, boil half a chicken breast, or have a protein shake.7 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?
Lose weight while maintaining muscle. My allowance is not that high compared to recommendations. I'm even slightly lower than I need to be for sustainability reasons. I try to eat at least 80 grams of it daily. Even with a good serving of beans, I don't get anywhere near that unless I have multiple servings of plant proteins, and I don't feel like eating beans every day. A typical day for me without focusing on protein ends up at about 40 grams at most.
I make up a 10 serving meal in my instant pot every week, with Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Brown Rice, Tofu, Veggies, Veg Broth, and spices. It usually has about 40g+ of carbs, around 10g or less of fat, and a little over 30g protein per server. I eat one of those per day. I also have 1 smoothie per day with 2 scoops of plant protein with strawberries and bananas, which has a little over 40g protein in it.
Just those 2 alone, put me close to 80g protein, please other stuff I eat during the day. I find it very easy doing this to get a little over 100g protein per day, I shoot for 120g and I'm 190 lbs.
I have been losing weight and gaining a little bit of muscle and strength.
It's good that you found what works for you. A diet focused on protein is not sustainable for me, let alone one that needs extra effort to achieve. I don't see myself dedicating time, effort, and calories to something that I can get easily elsewhere. As I said, the highest source of plant protein I have access to is kidney beans. That's 1200 calories for 80 grams. I do much better eating whatever I have an appetite for. I tried a protein focused diet in the beginning and it was too stressful and not sustainable at all. I basically eat whatever, while incorporating protein wherever I can without stressing too much about it, then by the end of the day if I need more I'll just open a can of tuna, boil half a chicken breast, or have a protein shake.
I don't focus my diet on protein, I was just letting you know how I get it easily. I have been eating 100% plant based for a little over 2 months now. As far as dedicating time, the meal I make in the instant pot, takes me about 10 - 15 minutes to prep, then I let it go for 30 minutes in the instant pot, i then turn it off and let it sit for another 30 minutes. I add all the ingredients and create a meal in my fitness pal, and then weigh the entire meal which usually comes out to 4000 - 4500 grams total. I then divide that by 10, and put it into contains to make it easier to log and eat. So for about 30 minutes of work every 7 - 10 days, that takes care of 10 serving pretty easy.
The smoothie I make every day takes me about 5 minutes to make, plus another couple of minutes rinsing out the blender.
I used to eat meat and always followed the myth of around 0.8 - 1g+ of protein per pound of body weight. After doing a lot more research about being Vegan and protein, I have dropped that down to about 0.5 - 0.6g per lb of body weight. I am still maintaining strength and muscle doing this, and losing about 0.5 lbs of weight per week.
1 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?
Lose weight while maintaining muscle. My allowance is not that high compared to recommendations. I'm even slightly lower than I need to be for sustainability reasons. I try to eat at least 80 grams of it daily. Even with a good serving of beans, I don't get anywhere near that unless I have multiple servings of plant proteins, and I don't feel like eating beans every day. A typical day for me without focusing on protein ends up at about 40 grams at most.
I make up a 10 serving meal in my instant pot every week, with Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Brown Rice, Tofu, Veggies, Veg Broth, and spices. It usually has about 40g+ of carbs, around 10g or less of fat, and a little over 30g protein per server. I eat one of those per day. I also have 1 smoothie per day with 2 scoops of plant protein with strawberries and bananas, which has a little over 40g protein in it.
Just those 2 alone, put me close to 80g protein, please other stuff I eat during the day. I find it very easy doing this to get a little over 100g protein per day, I shoot for 120g and I'm 190 lbs.
I have been losing weight and gaining a little bit of muscle and strength.
It's good that you found what works for you. A diet focused on protein is not sustainable for me, let alone one that needs extra effort to achieve. I don't see myself dedicating time, effort, and calories to something that I can get easily elsewhere. As I said, the highest source of plant protein I have access to is kidney beans. That's 1200 calories for 80 grams. I do much better eating whatever I have an appetite for. I tried a protein focused diet in the beginning and it was too stressful and not sustainable at all. I basically eat whatever, while incorporating protein wherever I can without stressing too much about it, then by the end of the day if I need more I'll just open a can of tuna, boil half a chicken breast, or have a protein shake.
I don't focus my diet on protein, I was just letting you know how I get it easily. I have been eating 100% plant based for a little over 2 months now. As far as dedicating time, the meal I make in the instant pot, takes me about 10 - 15 minutes to prep, then I let it go for 30 minutes in the instant pot, i then turn it off and let it sit for another 30 minutes. I add all the ingredients and create a meal in my fitness pal, and then weigh the entire meal which usually comes out to 4000 - 4500 grams total. I then divide that by 10, and put it into contains to make it easier to log and eat. So for about 30 minutes of work every 7 - 10 days, that takes care of 10 serving pretty easy.
The smoothie I make every day takes me about 5 minutes to make, plus another couple of minutes rinsing out the blender.
I used to eat meat and always followed the myth of around 0.8 - 1g+ of protein per pound of body weight. After doing a lot more research about being Vegan and protein, I have dropped that down to about 0.5 - 0.6g per lb of body weight. I am still maintaining strength and muscle doing this, and losing about 0.5 lbs of weight per week.
Effortless for you, not for me. Trying to force myself to eat beans (as much as I love them) when what I really want is cabbage and potatoes is a losing fair. Preparing something to eat every day of the week is a recipe for rebellion in my case because I will almost certainly reach for something else no matter how much I love that meal. By time, I mean time spent obsessing about protein, because that's what I tend to do.
I'm just saying that just because something is doable (even easily doable for some people), doesn't mean it's a good strategy for everyone.7 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »I'm not 100% vegetarian, but I eat far less meat than the average omnivore because I don't like it all that much. I eat more meat now because I find it hard to eat enough protein without animal sources. I was morbidly obese and the top 5 contributors to my calories were 100% plant based (and no, not ultra processed "junk"). Calorie dense foods that are easy to overeat exist in every single diet.
If you think "eating more vegetables" will help you control your weight, you can do that on the vast majority of diets without going full on vegetarian.
"How Not to Die" is one of the most overreaching books I have ever read. Cherry picks, extrapolates results that aren't there, makes up stuff, all in order to say "animal based foods are the source of every human ailment".
To OP:
When you relax your eating, do you eat more fat? Do you eat a bigger volume? When you restrict, do you eat too few calories?
If you don't think you are getting enough protein as a Vegan, then you may not be eating right. Are you getting in Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Pea Protein, etc? You can easily get protein being Vegan. Just an fyi...
I know I can, but it's not the most efficient way for me. Most of my calories would need to be dedicated to protein given that the highest source of plant protein I have is beans. I eat them, but I also like eating other things. Getting protein from animal sources gets it out of the way and allows me to eat whatever I want beyond that.
What exactly are you trying to do, gain muscle? lose weight? what do you weigh and how much protein are you trying to get?
Lose weight while maintaining muscle. My allowance is not that high compared to recommendations. I'm even slightly lower than I need to be for sustainability reasons. I try to eat at least 80 grams of it daily. Even with a good serving of beans, I don't get anywhere near that unless I have multiple servings of plant proteins, and I don't feel like eating beans every day. A typical day for me without focusing on protein ends up at about 40 grams at most.
I make up a 10 serving meal in my instant pot every week, with Quinoa, Lentils, Beans, Brown Rice, Tofu, Veggies, Veg Broth, and spices. It usually has about 40g+ of carbs, around 10g or less of fat, and a little over 30g protein per server. I eat one of those per day. I also have 1 smoothie per day with 2 scoops of plant protein with strawberries and bananas, which has a little over 40g protein in it.
Just those 2 alone, put me close to 80g protein, please other stuff I eat during the day. I find it very easy doing this to get a little over 100g protein per day, I shoot for 120g and I'm 190 lbs.
I have been losing weight and gaining a little bit of muscle and strength.
It's good that you found what works for you. A diet focused on protein is not sustainable for me, let alone one that needs extra effort to achieve. I don't see myself dedicating time, effort, and calories to something that I can get easily elsewhere. As I said, the highest source of plant protein I have access to is kidney beans. That's 1200 calories for 80 grams. I do much better eating whatever I have an appetite for. I tried a protein focused diet in the beginning and it was too stressful and not sustainable at all. I basically eat whatever, while incorporating protein wherever I can without stressing too much about it, then by the end of the day if I need more I'll just open a can of tuna, boil half a chicken breast, or have a protein shake.
I don't focus my diet on protein, I was just letting you know how I get it easily. I have been eating 100% plant based for a little over 2 months now. As far as dedicating time, the meal I make in the instant pot, takes me about 10 - 15 minutes to prep, then I let it go for 30 minutes in the instant pot, i then turn it off and let it sit for another 30 minutes. I add all the ingredients and create a meal in my fitness pal, and then weigh the entire meal which usually comes out to 4000 - 4500 grams total. I then divide that by 10, and put it into contains to make it easier to log and eat. So for about 30 minutes of work every 7 - 10 days, that takes care of 10 serving pretty easy.
The smoothie I make every day takes me about 5 minutes to make, plus another couple of minutes rinsing out the blender.
I used to eat meat and always followed the myth of around 0.8 - 1g+ of protein per pound of body weight. After doing a lot more research about being Vegan and protein, I have dropped that down to about 0.5 - 0.6g per lb of body weight. I am still maintaining strength and muscle doing this, and losing about 0.5 lbs of weight per week.
Effortless for you, not for me. Trying to force myself to eat beans (as much as I love them) when what I really want is cabbage and potatoes is a losing fair. Preparing something to eat every day of the week is a recipe for rebellion in my case because I will almost certainly reach for something else no matter how much I love that meal. By time, I mean time spent obsessing about protein, because that's what I tend to do.
I'm just saying that just because something is doable (even easily doable for some people), doesn't mean it's a good strategy for everyone.
I give up, good luck.5
This discussion has been closed.
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