Sugar and keto
mirandafinch
Posts: 24 Member
Hi all- I’m new to the keto diet, 2nd week in- macros are 10%carbs/ 50 fat and 40 protein roughly- can I ask does it matter what my carbs are made up of- the reason I ask is I totally crave and miss white coffee with one sugar- I’d limit myself to one a day and if I count this in my macros is it ok? Thanks in advance!
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Replies
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Nope. Sugar is sugar regardless of the source. Some metabolize quicker than others but that isnt a huge deal. You could always slowly transition to nutritional sweeteners to save calories later on if you prefer to save the calories3
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How many coffees a day and do you drink it black? If it was one black coffee a day with a one teaspoon (not heaped) of sugar it probably would be fine
I would think that you want to try and use a lot of your carbs for non starchy veg where possible.
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To reach ketosis internet research suggests that you should probably be aiming for a 20-50 grams of carbs and just one tsp of sugar has 5g carbs. However, I see you're actually setting your diary at 800 calories a day, which sounds to me like it cannot possibly be enough to sustain your bodies basic functions for any length of time and surely is not enjoyable.
Also the whole point of a true ketogenic diet is that instead of relying on sugar (glucose) that comes from carbohydrates (such as grains, legumes, vegetables, fruits - and yes, white sugar) in your diet, it relies on ketone bodies, which your liver produces from fat. So eating white sugar really defies to point, even if it does fit your macros.
From what I understand, ketogenic is a short term and extreme diet which shouldn't be undertaken lightly.10 -
OP, why is your calorie intake set for only 800 calories a day?! That's a very low calorie amount and you're setting yourself up for all sorts of health problems by hitting that consistently. Where did you get that number from? Are you doing a VLCD under a doctor's supervision?6
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To reach ketosis you should probably be aiming for a max of around 40 grams of carbs and 75 grams of protein per 2000 daily cals, and just one tsp of sugar has 5g carbs. However, I see you're actually setting your diary at 800 calories a day, which sounds to me like it cannot possibly be enough to sustain your bodies basic functions for any length of time and surely is not enjoyable.
Also the whole point of a true ketogenic diet is that instead of relying on sugar (glucose) that comes from carbohydrates (such as grains, legumes, vegetables, fruits - and yes, white sugar) in your diet, it relies on ketone bodies, which your liver produces from fat. So eating white sugar really defies to point, even if it does fit your macros.
From what I understand, ketogenic is a short term and extreme diet which shouldn't be undertaken lightly.
Ketosis can certainly happen at higher rates of carbs, especially if it's coming from fibrous sources, and that is completely false about protein. It takes insane amounts of protein to have an effect and the people spouting that non sense don't have evidence to support their claims. If anything, it might have a minor effect on short term ketone production, but what is more important is protein supports muscle retention, metabolism and overall health.
I certainly agree on the calorie thing. 800 calories is going to be bad for overall health, could lead to deficiencies, and is a great opportunity to lose muscle.3 -
@psuLemon my comment wasn't supposed to be any note on OPs protein intake and is likely the only thing making 800cals a day remotely satisfying! Now edited
My general point was regarding sugar and that while 'keto' is often a buzzword/fad diet looking into the science behind why it works and what it's for may be helpful, perhaps I should have just said that.1 -
Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃4
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mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃
Op, what are your stats? 800 calories is a really bad idea unless you're morbidly obese and doing a supervised plan under a doctor.
I used to respect Mosley but he's really gone off the deep end with his new plan. 800 calories a day, every day, is a horrible idea and it's just setting people up for failure and health problems.5 -
mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃
Unless you are supervised by a doctor, 800 calories is not a good choice. It is extremely easy to get a deficiency at those levels and regular blood work is required to monitor your progress.5 -
mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃
Op, what are your stats? 800 calories is a really bad idea unless you're morbidly obese and doing a supervised plan under a doctor.
I used to respect Mosley but he's really gone off the deep end with his new plan. 800 calories a day, every day, is a horrible idea and it's just setting people up for failure and health problems.
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I’m 5’3 and weigh 11 stone 11lbs. According to the Nhs guidelines I’m overweight verging on obese!!!0
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800 calories is drastically under eating and can lead to possible health issues. There is no need to take such drastic measures to lose weight unless medically supervised/required.
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10569458/why-eating-too-little-calories-is-a-bad-idea/p13 -
mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃
Unless you are supervised by a doctor, 800 calories is not a good choice. It is extremely easy to get a deficiency at those levels and regular blood work is required to monitor your progress.
Agree.
I think the calories thing is more important, but on the carbs -- 10% at 800 is 20 g carbs. If you use 5 of those for sugar, you are really not leaving yourself much for vegetables (especially if you also consume some nuts or dairy or avocado). So I'd personally not use the carbs in that way if I had so few of them.
The specific diet isn't "working," it is that you have a calorie deficit that is working (as it does regardless of the way of eating), but such a high calorie deficit is obviously not healthy unless under doctor's supervision, and is absolutely not needed to lose weight. You are only 165 lbs -- yes, at 5'3 it's good to lose weight at that weight, but 0 need for some kind of crash diet absent some medical reason and the diet being prescribed and monitored by a doctor.5 -
mirandafinch wrote: »Hi all- I’m new to the keto diet, 2nd week in- macros are 10%carbs/ 50 fat and 40 protein roughly- can I ask does it matter what my carbs are made up of- the reason I ask is I totally crave and miss white coffee with one sugar- I’d limit myself to one a day and if I count this in my macros is it ok? Thanks in advance!
If doing keto, the coffee with sugar might come at the expense of nutrients found in fruits and veggies. It's only an issue since your doing keto. You only have so much to spend on carbs...3 -
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mirandafinch wrote: »Hi all- I’m new to the keto diet, 2nd week in- macros are 10%carbs/ 50 fat and 40 protein roughly- can I ask does it matter what my carbs are made up of- the reason I ask is I totally crave and miss white coffee with one sugar- I’d limit myself to one a day and if I count this in my macros is it ok? Thanks in advance!
@mirandafinch having be free of white sugar since back in 2014 when I went Keto by accident I think you will find most who have the ability to do Keto long term will say YES it does matter what makes up our carb sources.
Clearly one teaspoon of sugar (5 grams of carbs) is just 10% of a 50 gram carb limit that I do to stay in ketosis so it should not keep you from doing Keto if you decide it is for you long term.
Major carb sources for me since 2014 are almonds (6 grams of carbs/3 grams of dietary fiber), Coconut flakes (3 grams of carbs/2 grams of dietary fiber) and 100% chocolate bars (4 grams of carbs/3 gram of dietary fiber) per serving. While I eat way more than one serving most days you can see how I use my 50 grams of carbs to get as much fiber as possible plus straight sugar increases my level of joint pain and offers no fiber for my gut microbiome to feed on.
The best way to do Keto is the way at works best for you. That took me about a year of tweaking in my case so time is on your side.
Best of success in finding out what works for you. Advice from others may be your friend or keto enemy.
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mirandafinch wrote: »I’m 5’3 and weigh 11 stone 11lbs. According to the Nhs guidelines I’m overweight verging on obese!!!
Can you exercise? You could eat more then, then exercise it off.6 -
@mirandafinch --
You could have a bigger cup of coffee with lower amounts of sugar. Do that for a bit, until you can wing your self off of sugar.
Could you take sugar substitute.0 -
Hi, yeah I do exercise, spin twice a week and a couple of resistance workouts. I’ve tried sugar substitutes before but can’t stand the taste. I can spot fake sugar a mile off 😃1
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I would exercise more --- Just enough for you to burn off the sugar.
so if you consumed 50 extra grams of sugar for coffee, then go for a walk to burn it off., on that day.
If is too short not to enjoy your coffee9 -
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mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃
This is a really bad, unhealthy plan, unless under very close medical supervision. It's even worse that you're doing not only daily life stuff, but exercising as well, while you eat so very little. (Sugar is the least of the problem.)7 -
Commander_Keen wrote: »I would exercise more --- Just enough for you to burn off the sugar.
so if you consumed 50 extra grams of sugar for coffee, then go for a walk to burn it off., on that day.
If is too short not to enjoy your coffee
OP is only eating 800 calories. She doesn't need to exercise more to eat more, she needs to just eat more. Whether she were eating 800 calories or netting 800 calories, that's WAY too little nourishment and fuel.
ETA: It's also important to keep in mind that it can be unhealthy to fall into a pattern of "I need to exercise more to earn a food I want to eat". Many of us choose to increase our activity to increase our TDEE in general, but viewing more exercise solely as a way to earn calories can become disordered. More exercise is not always the answer, and I'd argue it's seldom the right answer when someone isn't losing.9 -
mirandafinch wrote: »I’m 5’3 and weigh 11 stone 11lbs. According to the Nhs guidelines I’m overweight verging on obese!!!
I'm morbidly obese and eat closer to 1600 calories a day, that's twice as much as you. I'm still averaging 3lbs per week which is technically too fast. You should definitely spend some time reading through the message boards here and reading about too-low calorie diets. You are seriously setting yourself up for failure.
And to answer your original question, if your goal is simply ketosis, then technically you'd still be able to achieve that using Sugar in your coffee, however*, if you are looking towards keto to help with blood sugar regulation, and based on the current "diet" you are following you probably are, then you should be avoid sweeteners all together, both table sugar as well as artifical sweeteners. I'd even go so far as to recommend avoiding fruits in the beginning until you get to a point where you are better able to regulate your blood glucose.
I follow a Whole Foods Keto Diet and really enjoy my way of eating and it is a fantastic tool to help control my cravings and stay within my daily calorie goals.
*Keto has been shown to help improve blood sugar numbers and even reverse Type II Diabetes/Pre-Diabetes/Insulin Resistance. If these Dx don't apply to you, then there is no reason for you to follow Keto for blood sugar regulation.3 -
WholeFoods4Lyfe wrote: »mirandafinch wrote: »I’m 5’3 and weigh 11 stone 11lbs. According to the Nhs guidelines I’m overweight verging on obese!!!
I'm morbidly obese and eat closer to 1600 calories a day, that's twice as much as you. I'm still averaging 3lbs per week which is technically too fast. You should definitely spend some time reading through the message boards here and reading about too-low calorie diets. You are seriously setting yourself up for failure.
And to answer your original question, if your goal is simply ketosis, then technically you'd still be able to achieve that using Sugar in your coffee, however*, if you are looking towards keto to help with blood sugar regulation, and based on the current "diet" you are following you probably are, then you should be avoid sweeteners all together, both table sugar as well as artifical sweeteners. I'd even go so far as to recommend avoiding fruits in the beginning until you get to a point where you are better able to regulate your blood glucose.
I follow a Whole Foods Keto Diet and really enjoy my way of eating and it is a fantastic tool to help control my cravings and stay within my daily calorie goals.
*Keto has been shown to help improve blood sugar numbers and even reverse Type II Diabetes/Pre-Diabetes/Insulin Resistance. If these Dx don't apply to you, then there is no reason for you to follow Keto for blood sugar regulation.
A bit of a side trail, but this is a pretty neat video where they test various sugar substitutes. A couple of the artificial sweeteners had no effect on blood sugar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYfqvTZWilw&feature=youtu.be 3 -
WholeFoods4Lyfe wrote: »mirandafinch wrote: »I’m 5’3 and weigh 11 stone 11lbs. According to the Nhs guidelines I’m overweight verging on obese!!!
I'm morbidly obese and eat closer to 1600 calories a day, that's twice as much as you. I'm still averaging 3lbs per week which is technically too fast. You should definitely spend some time reading through the message boards here and reading about too-low calorie diets. You are seriously setting yourself up for failure.
And to answer your original question, if your goal is simply ketosis, then technically you'd still be able to achieve that using Sugar in your coffee, however*, if you are looking towards keto to help with blood sugar regulation, and based on the current "diet" you are following you probably are, then you should be avoid sweeteners all together, both table sugar as well as artifical sweeteners. I'd even go so far as to recommend avoiding fruits in the beginning until you get to a point where you are better able to regulate your blood glucose.
I follow a Whole Foods Keto Diet and really enjoy my way of eating and it is a fantastic tool to help control my cravings and stay within my daily calorie goals.
*Keto has been shown to help improve blood sugar numbers and even reverse Type II Diabetes/Pre-Diabetes/Insulin Resistance. If these Dx don't apply to you, then there is no reason for you to follow Keto for blood sugar regulation.
A bit of a side trail, but this is a pretty neat video where they test various sugar substitutes. A couple of the artificial sweeteners had no effect on blood sugarhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYfqvTZWilw&feature=youtu.be
Honestly, the jury is still out, and you can google either opinion and will find results to match with your own position. My practice focuses on Blood Sugar Regulation and having been previously diagnosed with Metabolic Syndrome myself, I tend to lean towards the belief that if you are already Insulin Resistant or Diabetic, that all sweeteners, artificial and otherwise, should be avoided. For someone without pre-existing issues that might not be a problem, but I prefer to err on the side of caution. I did also state that my comments applied to those with blood sugar disregulation issues.8 -
OP do you have any medical reason to restrict carbs/follow a keto diet?
What is the appeal of the "blood sugar" diet for you?
Generally, named diets, particularly ones that cut calories so low, even for a finite period of time, are strongly discouraged as they tend to create false expectations of rapid success that people find difficult to maintain over a longer period of time in order to successfully and healthfully lose weight and transition to maintenance.
If weight loss is your goal - you need nothing more than a calorie deficit. You can achieve that eating any type of diet you enjoy - one that includes not only the single cup of coffee with sugar, but multiple cups of coffee with sugar, if it fits within the context of your calorie deficit and an overall balanced diet. You don't need low carb in order to lose weight.
Have you read the stickied most helpful forum posts here? They have a lot of great information:
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10300331/most-helpful-posts-getting-started-must-reads#latest
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10260499/i-like-old-posts-and-i-cannot-lie/p1
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1080242/a-guide-to-get-you-started-on-your-path-to-sexypants
Also, for what it's worth - I'm 5'2 and started about 10 lbs lower than where you are today. I lost my weight, down to a maintenance level of ~120 lbs, eating b/w 1600-1900 calories per day. That's DOUBLE what you are eating.
800 calories isn't enough for a toddler to thrive on, let alone a grown, active woman.6 -
mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day- after that time you up things. I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working but I still crave coffee and sugar- I used to have about 8 cups a day 😱 but would be happy with one at the moment! 🤔😬😃
What's working is the calorie deficit. You are seriously undereating. That's going to set you up for failure or malnutrition / hair loss / muscle loss.
What Are the Risks of Rapid Weight Loss?
Rapid weight loss creates physical demands on the body. Possible serious risks include:- Gallstones, which occur in 12% to 25% of people losing large amounts of weight over several months
- Dehydration, which can be avoided by drinking plenty of fluids
- Malnutrition, usually from not eating enough protein for weeks at a time
- Electrolyte imbalances, which rarely can be life threatening
Other side effects of rapid weight loss include:- Headaches
- Irritability
- Fatigue
- Dizziness
- Constipation
- Menstrual irregularities
- Hair loss
- Muscle loss
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800 calories a day for 8 weeks is in no way a good idea...mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day
You have successfully lost a little water and a lot of muscle. Probably very little fat if any...mirandafinch wrote: »I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working5 -
800 calories a day for 8 weeks is in no way a good idea...mirandafinch wrote: »Thanks all for your replies! I’ve been following the blood sugar diet and it’s an 8 week plan at 800 cals a day
You have successfully lost a little water and a lot of muscle. Probably very little fat if any...mirandafinch wrote: »I’ve lost 11 pounds in 2 weeks so it’s working
If one loses weight/fat at a deficit -- which she is, why does it matter if she is eating 800 calories, or at 1500? A deficit is a deficit, so why does 400, or 700 calories make a difference?14
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