Good or Bad Food?
Options
Replies
-
cwolfman13 wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I do understand what you are asking. I quit logging a while back because cake was less calories than walnuts and I thought that was ridiculous. I wish there were a way to determine the health factors of each food.
Calories are a unit of energy measurement. You need a certain amount of calories to maintain your present physical form and any and all activity you perform each day. If you eat that amount your weight will stay the same. If you eat more your body will store some of it. If you eat less your body will use stored energy to make up the difference.
The amount of calories found in a walnut is the amount of energy it can provide you. It is not an indication of quality. Understanding that walnuts carry a big calorie price tag is very helpful in weight management. Many people make the mistake of thinking "healthy" food will provide healthy results. It does not work that way. Everything needs to be portion controlled. The funny thing is that a person who doesn't log and is trying to lose weight may be safer with cake because it is generally understood you need a very small portion. That same person may be snacking on way too many walnuts and failing to lose weight or possibly even gaining.
I get you. Calories aside, I just don't think cake should be considered same as walnuts. Maybe I'm wrong. Ok. It's my opinion. Idk about you but I have a hard time eating a small portion of cake. I don't eat a whole bag of walnuts either. I never thought in a million years I'd have these many disagrees over my opinion of cake
How do you figure cake is being considered the same as walnuts? I doubt many would consider cake the be an optimally nutritious food...but that has zero to do with calories. Your convoluting calories with nutrition...they aren't the same thing. Calories are just a unit of measure like an inch or mile or watt or whatever.
and for that matter, why does it have to be one or the other...?3 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I do understand what you are asking. I quit logging a while back because cake was less calories than walnuts and I thought that was ridiculous. I wish there were a way to determine the health factors of each food.
Calories are a unit of energy measurement. You need a certain amount of calories to maintain your present physical form and any and all activity you perform each day. If you eat that amount your weight will stay the same. If you eat more your body will store some of it. If you eat less your body will use stored energy to make up the difference.
The amount of calories found in a walnut is the amount of energy it can provide you. It is not an indication of quality. Understanding that walnuts carry a big calorie price tag is very helpful in weight management. Many people make the mistake of thinking "healthy" food will provide healthy results. It does not work that way. Everything needs to be portion controlled. The funny thing is that a person who doesn't log and is trying to lose weight may be safer with cake because it is generally understood you need a very small portion. That same person may be snacking on way too many walnuts and failing to lose weight or possibly even gaining.
I get you. Calories aside, I just don't think cake should be considered same as walnuts. Maybe I'm wrong. Ok. It's my opinion. Idk about you but I have a hard time eating a small portion of cake. I don't eat a whole bag of walnuts either. I never thought in a million years I'd have these many disagrees over my opinion of cake
How do you figure cake is being considered the same as walnuts? I doubt many would consider cake the be an optimally nutritious food...but that has zero to do with calories. Your convoluting calories with nutrition...they aren't the same thing. Calories are just a unit of measure like an inch or mile or watt or whatever.
and for that matter, why does it have to be one or the other...?
Yup...my wife made chocolate chip cookies over the weekend and I'm having one for desert tonight. I'm pretty sure it isn't going to unwind the rest of the nutrition I had for the day or negate my spin class this evening.4 -
Duck_Puddle wrote: »In fact, MFP congratulated me for meeting my fiber goal when I logged m&m’s
m&ms have fiber? Guess I deserve a little pat on the back, then
Well done! According to the label (at the time anyway) they have 1g fiber per serving. #healthfoood
5 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
No it doesnt.
not the ones I eat anyway.
(and I do love carrot cake)
new question: is cake healthier than carrots? - who cares, combine them in carrot cake! Win win!
5 -
BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I think the original post has been answered, but to chime in. I don't believe MFP is geared toward nutrition or health, from what I've seen of the free version it is just about calories and macros - however you use that information is up to you.
@BuffaloChixSalad, don't take these forums and any seeming push-back seriously. Everyone communicates differently and written communication has it's challenges from both a writer and reader perspective. I'm always impressed with certain user's essays because it just shows they put in a lot of effort to be clear and precise. I am more of a cognitive shortcut and cut to the chase type person so "good" or "bad" works fine for me even if it isn't 100% accurate in every scenario.
It was only an opinion. How I view food. What's in my mind. I never thought it would have gotten so heated. I never said I had facts. Never said that I am a nutritionist or macro expert. Solely my view.
That opinion has led some of us down a path that led to failure. Some of what you are detecting is likely to be concern that you are headed there too. That is not to say that it is your fate. If this is a mental trick you need to do because you have so much cake in the house and it does not affect your overall relationship with food it might be fine. I don't know what others need to do to make it from one day to the next I only know what I need to do.
What I have learned is aside from anything medical like allergies there is no such thing as junk/bad/unhealthy food and if I try to deprive myself based on labels it ends badly. If I need to segregate a food item like my addictive rice krispie treats, all joking aside, I label it as "tough to moderate." Even that label is not necessarily permanent. I have also learned that things you moderate easily normally can become tough in certain situations. It is fun trying to navigate the mental aspects of weight loss.
4 -
paperpudding wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
No it doesnt.
not the ones I eat anyway.
(and I do love carrot cake)
new question: is cake healthier than carrots? - who cares, combine them in carrot cake! Win win!
Blasphemy!! Carrot cake should have walnuts both in it, and sprinkled on top of the lemon cream cheese icing.
As to carrots vs cake, the answer is 'it depends on context' :P. But obviously putting the carrots into the cake covers your bases. Adding walnuts tips it over to being a superfood.6 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
Ew. Gross. Not when *I* bake it!
I like cake. Walnuts are gross. <-opinion.2 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
No it doesnt.
not the ones I eat anyway.
(and I do love carrot cake)
new question: is cake healthier than carrots? - who cares, combine them in carrot cake! Win win!
Blasphemy!! Carrot cake should have walnuts both in it, and sprinkled on top of the lemon cream cheese icing.
As to carrots vs cake, the answer is 'it depends on context' :P. But obviously putting the carrots into the cake covers your bases. Adding walnuts tips it over to being a superfood.
But I'z allergic! I haz the sadz when carrot cake has walnuts in it2 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
No it doesnt.
not the ones I eat anyway.
(and I do love carrot cake)
new question: is cake healthier than carrots? - who cares, combine them in carrot cake! Win win!
Blasphemy!! Carrot cake should have walnuts both in it, and sprinkled on top of the lemon cream cheese icing.
As to carrots vs cake, the answer is 'it depends on context' :P. But obviously putting the carrots into the cake covers your bases. Adding walnuts tips it over to being a superfood.
But I'z allergic! I haz the sadz when carrot cake has walnuts in it
You're excused from the walnut carrot cake then
0 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
No it doesnt.
not the ones I eat anyway.
(and I do love carrot cake)
new question: is cake healthier than carrots? - who cares, combine them in carrot cake! Win win!
Blasphemy!! Carrot cake should have walnuts both in it, and sprinkled on top of the lemon cream cheese icing.
As to carrots vs cake, the answer is 'it depends on context' :P. But obviously putting the carrots into the cake covers your bases. Adding walnuts tips it over to being a superfood.
But I'z allergic! I haz the sadz when carrot cake has walnuts in it
You're excused from the walnut carrot cake then
But I want carrot cake. And everyone ruins it with walnuts. Except @paperpudding, apparently.1 -
quiksylver296 wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »I'm just going to point out that carrot cake has walnuts in it.
No it doesnt.
not the ones I eat anyway.
(and I do love carrot cake)
new question: is cake healthier than carrots? - who cares, combine them in carrot cake! Win win!
Blasphemy!! Carrot cake should have walnuts both in it, and sprinkled on top of the lemon cream cheese icing.
As to carrots vs cake, the answer is 'it depends on context' :P. But obviously putting the carrots into the cake covers your bases. Adding walnuts tips it over to being a superfood.
But I'z allergic! I haz the sadz when carrot cake has walnuts in it
You're excused from the walnut carrot cake then
But I want carrot cake. And everyone ruins it with walnuts. Except @paperpudding, apparently.
I would suggest an arrangement with @paperpudding to supply you with walnut-free carrot cake then. You'll need to get her to add something else to make it a superfood though, otherwise you'll never meet your goalz.4 -
NovusDies, I believe you are correct. Likely a heuristic: mental shortcut that eases the cognitive load of making a decision.
Lemurcat2, I don't see that much information in my view (below). Is this something I setup? I do see slightly more info in the Reports tab - thanks try2again, I never viewed this tab. I always thought micro was for premium.
You can switch out sodium and sugar (the 2 non macro options) for other nutrients you are more interested in (I think fiber is a better option than either of those for most people). More significantly, you can use the reports, and when you input the foods you can look at the nutrition that they have.
If you want more than that, there are better sites, as I noted, but I think that's actually quite a lot.2 -
NovusDies, I believe you are correct. Likely a heuristic: mental shortcut that eases the cognitive load of making a decision.
Lemurcat2, I don't see that much information in my view (below). Is this something I setup? I do see slightly more info in the Reports tab - thanks try2again, I never viewed this tab. I always thought micro was for premium.
The app shows full details for all the nutrients that can be entered in mfp. The web only shows the ones you’ve selected.2 -
Duck_Puddle wrote: »NovusDies, I believe you are correct. Likely a heuristic: mental shortcut that eases the cognitive load of making a decision.
Lemurcat2, I don't see that much information in my view (below). Is this something I setup? I do see slightly more info in the Reports tab - thanks try2again, I never viewed this tab. I always thought micro was for premium.
The app shows full details for all the nutrients that can be entered in mfp. The web only shows the ones you’ve selected.
You can find the rest under "Reports" on the website.1 -
Duck_Puddle wrote: »NovusDies, I believe you are correct. Likely a heuristic: mental shortcut that eases the cognitive load of making a decision.
Lemurcat2, I don't see that much information in my view (below). Is this something I setup? I do see slightly more info in the Reports tab - thanks try2again, I never viewed this tab. I always thought micro was for premium.
The app shows full details for all the nutrients that can be entered in mfp. The web only shows the ones you’ve selected.
You can find the rest under "Reports" on the website.
That too.
I was thinking the app because it shows them all at once. Where the web only shows the selected ones at once.
1 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I do understand what you are asking. I quit logging a while back because cake was less calories than walnuts and I thought that was ridiculous. I wish there were a way to determine the health factors of each food.
Calories are a unit of energy measurement. You need a certain amount of calories to maintain your present physical form and any and all activity you perform each day. If you eat that amount your weight will stay the same. If you eat more your body will store some of it. If you eat less your body will use stored energy to make up the difference.
The amount of calories found in a walnut is the amount of energy it can provide you. It is not an indication of quality. Understanding that walnuts carry a big calorie price tag is very helpful in weight management. Many people make the mistake of thinking "healthy" food will provide healthy results. It does not work that way. Everything needs to be portion controlled. The funny thing is that a person who doesn't log and is trying to lose weight may be safer with cake because it is generally understood you need a very small portion. That same person may be snacking on way too many walnuts and failing to lose weight or possibly even gaining.
I get you. Calories aside, I just don't think cake should be considered same as walnuts. Maybe I'm wrong. Ok. It's my opinion. Idk about you but I have a hard time eating a small portion of cake. I don't eat a whole bag of walnuts either. I never thought in a million years I'd have these many disagrees over my opinion of cake
How do you figure cake is being considered the same as walnuts? I doubt many would consider cake the be an optimally nutritious food...but that has zero to do with calories. Your convoluting calories with nutrition...they aren't the same thing. Calories are just a unit of measure like an inch or mile or watt or whatever.
and for that matter, why does it have to be one or the other...?
Yup...my wife made chocolate chip cookies over the weekend and I'm having one for desert tonight. I'm pretty sure it isn't going to unwind the rest of the nutrition I had for the day or negate my spin class this evening.
Be careful out there... just in case
0 -
rheddmobile wrote: »
So, did you think MFP made it up that walnuts have fewer calories than cake? (Depending on the cake!) It’s physics. Ignore it if you want, but it is what it is. Most cake is primarily carbs. Walnuts are primarily fat. And carbs have fewer calories per gram than fat, so the same weight of most types of cake probably has fewer calories than the equivalent weight in walnuts. That doesn’t mean you should eat cake. It doesn’t mean you should eat walnuts! It means you have to use your brain to figure out which food will help you meet your nutritional goal and your calorie goal.BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I do understand what you are asking. I quit logging a while back because cake was less calories than walnuts and I thought that was ridiculous. I wish there were a way to determine the health factors of each food.
Not in my experience, as plenty of cakes have as much fat, or nearly as much fat, as carbs. For example, a piece of Portillo's chocolate cake (just because it is easy to find the nutrition information) has 329 cals from fat, and 344 from carbs. Pretty close. That's consistent with the kind of breakdown I see in dessert type items I make at home, for the most part (although there are exceptions that are disproportionately fat or carb). Of course, if you buy these at the grocery store it is sometimes the case that they are lower fat to try and lower cals, but usually those are all that tasty by comparison.
I otherwise agree with your point, but it is a personal mission to stop people from stereotyping most high fat dessert foods as simply "carbs"--too often they (although not you, of course) go on to claim that carbs are therefore the problem in everyone's diet and are unhealthy and the devil, blah, blah.
Anyway, great post, I just had to be nitpicky since it's my hobby horse.
I was looking at a piece of so called prepackaged cake the other day. When I did the math of the calorie density, it wasn't much less than what walnuts are. lol3 -
I think the original post has been answered, but to chime in. I don't believe MFP is geared toward nutrition or health, from what I've seen of the free version it is just about calories and macros - however you use that information is up to you.
@BuffaloChixSalad, don't take these forums and any seeming push-back seriously. Everyone communicates differently and written communication has it's challenges from both a writer and reader perspective. I'm always impressed with certain user's essays because it just shows they put in a lot of effort to be clear and precise. I am more of a cognitive shortcut and cut to the chase type person so "good" or "bad" works fine for me even if it isn't 100% accurate in every scenario.
To the bolded: Agreed. And that seems empowering, to me. (I get that you say you differ, and that's fine.)BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I think the original post has been answered, but to chime in. I don't believe MFP is geared toward nutrition or health, from what I've seen of the free version it is just about calories and macros - however you use that information is up to you.
@BuffaloChixSalad, don't take these forums and any seeming push-back seriously. Everyone communicates differently and written communication has it's challenges from both a writer and reader perspective. I'm always impressed with certain user's essays because it just shows they put in a lot of effort to be clear and precise. I am more of a cognitive shortcut and cut to the chase type person so "good" or "bad" works fine for me even if it isn't 100% accurate in every scenario.
It was only an opinion. How I view food. What's in my mind. I never thought it would have gotten so heated. I never said I had facts. Never said that I am a nutritionist or macro expert. Solely my view.
Heated? Heh. Eye of the observer, I guess.
Nothing wrong with your opinions, applied to you. And, to me, it's interesting to interact with you.
When you offer advice or feedback to others (like the OP (original poster)), it seems OK - to me - to offer other views.
I empathize with him. This nutrition thing is kind of complicated and detailed (in a context where modern life as a totality is way too complex for most of us: Health, environment, finance, more - so much complicated stuff!).
We wish it were simple (bad/good, red/yellow/green). It's not super complicated, in reality, if one learns more, step by step. But it not that simple, mostly, under the covers.
When sources simplify complex things into simple rules for us, they're implicitly making decisions for us. Speaking only for myself, I like to make my own decisions (tradeoffs). That's the sense in which I find MFP empowering.11 -
Heartless snipping till:
When sources simplify complex things into simple rules for us, they're implicitly making decisions for us. Speaking only for myself, I like to make my own decisions (tradeoffs). That's the sense in which I find MFP empowering.
This. Absolutely. And echoes a conversation I was having just the other day.
Not least because I can't think of anyone whose version of 'good' and 'bad' I would be willing to absolutely buy into (not even @AnnPT77 !)
5 -
BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »BuffaloChixSalad wrote: »I do understand what you are asking. I quit logging a while back because cake was less calories than walnuts and I thought that was ridiculous. I wish there were a way to determine the health factors of each food.
Why is that ridiculous? Calories are calories. If you eat a surplus of calories from walnuts, you will gain weight. If you eat a deficit of calories from cake, you will lose weight. That's how weight loss works. MFP didn't make that up.
Nutrition is another issue, but MFP gives you plenty of tools there. You can track all your macro nutrients and some micronurtients. So you can make plenty of nutrition based decisions from that.
However for most people who are overweight or obese, the healthiest thing they can do for themselves is lost weight and get to a normal weight. Eating cake at a normal weight is healthier than nuts of you are obese. One of the great things from this app is it frees you of unhelpful moral judgements about food being "good" or "bad". Good food is food that helps you stay in your calorie goal, bad food is food that makes it difficult to stay in your calorie goal.
It's an opinion. Not scripture. Cake has less health benefits than walnuts.
On one hand you say it's an opinion. Then you follow it up with the bolded, an absolute statement of fact.4
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 391.3K Introduce Yourself
- 43.4K Getting Started
- 259.6K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.6K Food and Nutrition
- 47.3K Recipes
- 232.3K Fitness and Exercise
- 387 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.7K Motivation and Support
- 7.8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.2K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.2K MyFitnessPal Information
- 22 News and Announcements
- 913 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.3K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions