How To Start Off Wrong (from member experiences)
NovusDies
Posts: 8,940 Member
How have YOU failed?
These are as many of mine as I can think of at the moment:
1) Assumed that I must eat healthy food.
2) Do the same diet my wife is doing.
3) Meal replacement shakes
4) Pills - prescription and OTC
5) Eating very little food
6) Exercise the pounds away mentality
7) Picked a diet because a friend or coworker lost some weight doing it
8) Picked a diet because of internet or similar research
9) Ate foods to speed up my metabolism or fat burning (go grapefruit power!)
10) Ate more often to speed up my metabolism.
11) Believed some scheme because I was told my weight gain was not my fault
12) Believed fat was the enemy
13) Believed a doctor
14) Thought I needed to start off behaving like all the healthy weight people I knew
15) Had cheat meals
These are as many of mine as I can think of at the moment:
1) Assumed that I must eat healthy food.
2) Do the same diet my wife is doing.
3) Meal replacement shakes
4) Pills - prescription and OTC
5) Eating very little food
6) Exercise the pounds away mentality
7) Picked a diet because a friend or coworker lost some weight doing it
8) Picked a diet because of internet or similar research
9) Ate foods to speed up my metabolism or fat burning (go grapefruit power!)
10) Ate more often to speed up my metabolism.
11) Believed some scheme because I was told my weight gain was not my fault
12) Believed fat was the enemy
13) Believed a doctor
14) Thought I needed to start off behaving like all the healthy weight people I knew
15) Had cheat meals
33
Replies
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My biggest ones-
Believed the “starvation mode” myth, AND that I couldn’t have a single carb or “I’d gain weight for sure!”. I lost over 10 years to that crap. 🙄14 -
These run the range from age 16-mid 30s (when I finally began calorie counting)
1. "Kickstart" with an all liquid diet
2. Any kind of plan that encouraged the thinking that the day was "ruined" if I had the wrong foods or ate at the wrong time
3. Less than 1,000 calories a day
4. Eliminating caffeine just because I thought it would keep me from losing weight
5. Raw veganism
6. Extremely low fat diet
7. Exercise as punishment
8. IF to manage weight while ignoring calories consumed or how it fit my preferences/lifestyle
9. Slimfast
10. "Smoking is an appetite suppressant, right?"16 -
Stopped logging food once I hit my calorie limit27
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My list:
1) Cheat meals - undoing an entire week of dieting in an hour.
2) The slippery slope of perfectionism, aka "black or white" thinking.
By which I mean:
Going a few hundred calories over quota and thinking, "Well, the day's no longer perfectly compliant, so I'll just shoot for break even ... which entitles me to another 300 calories", which leads to eating 3 of 7 cookies in the pantry, and then "it's no longer a diet day, so I guess I'll have the last 4 cookies", which leads to "Now I'm over maintenance, I'll just restart tomorrow," which leads to eating everything in the house, which goes past midnight, which leads to waking up the next day thinking that that day too is shot because it already started badly at 12:01 am, which leads to ... 2 years later, starting all over from a much higher weight.
Lesson I learned: If it's either diet perfection or insane binging, the diet is already dead. Gotta learn to be happy with "did fairly well today". A B+ day is still a B+ not an F.
3) Trying to make up for overeating with excessive exercise, instead of addressing my weight issues at the source: the food that goes into my mouth.
4) Making too big a deal about food even while successfully dieting - such as, spending hours or chunks of hours planning out and talking about the next meal - thus never breaking that obese person habit of thinking/planning/dreaming/wanting/craving/needing food constantly. Even while successfully dieting, spending the whole day thinking about the next meal, very understandable given the often-a-little-hungry nature of dieting, contains the seeds of a future diet breakdown.
5) Keeping garbage foods in the house because "I've got everything under control; I've proven myself, so why shouldn't I have a bag of chocolate fudge cookies for when I want ONE cookie". Works great until it doesn't work. Replace with grapes LOL
And finally ...
6) Thinking I was "cured" of obesity behavior because I'd lost a bunch of weight. The opposite is the truth - I am an obese person by nature and if I weighed 140 pounds I'd still be one. Learning that was a huge epiphany for me. You don't suddenly get to some weight and then voila, you're a different person and don't need to log/count/self-monitor/exercise/eat carefully anymore. It's like an alcoholic who hasn't had a drink in a year thinking he isn't an alcoholic anymore so he can just go into a bar and just get a Diet Coke. All my best laid plans about counting calories, eating right, blah blah, can come unwound in 5 minutes if I forget that just having lost weight does not mean I am immune to obesity. Sit me down in an Italian restaurant, put a bottle of wine and an extra large pizza with extra cheese and pepperoni in front of me, and guess what, it's like I was never on a diet - I can revert to my true self in seconds. Constant vigilance is needed and will always be needed, forever.59 -
Calorie counting "diet" meant eating 700 calories a day. This went on my entire childhood.
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It's been a while, but I bought into the frequent small meals/snacks thing. I was never satiated and I just ended up eating regular meals and smaller meals and snacks on top of that, eating more instead of less.8
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Thinking that eating "healthy food" was the solution to being overweight, without realising that the volume on my plate still meant I was eating far more calories than my 5'1" female self needed.10
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Oh man, I have a few of these from over the years!
1. Jumping in too quickly and trying to do ALL of the things at once - track calories, eat only healthy foods, exercise intensely for an hour a day etc. etc. - I've now learned that baby steps are much more manageable for me and I need to make changes slowly over time so that they become habit.
2. Not giving my efforts time to have an effect before giving up - I ate under range yesterday and I exercised and my scale still reads the same! No fair! Apparently you gotta give it time!
3. Lying to myself about how much I'm eating - by eyeballing measurements or forgetting to log (sometimes on purpose).
4. Thinking I can go from eating 2,500 calories a day to 1,200 a day just like that.
5. Shakes and other fad diets - yeah, they work, in the short term!
6. Negative self-talk. These days I'm all about the positivity!
7. Approaching it as a diet rather than a lifestyle change. This isn't something I can just do for a while. If I go back to my old habits, I will gain the weight back and I don't want that. So I need to make sure the changes I make are sustainable for the rest of my life. If it means a lifetime without pizza or nachos? Probably not gonna happen. But if it means having those foods only once in a while and eating a smaller portion of them? That's more sustainable to me.
8. Not being consistent - I can't count the number of diets or workout programs I've started and never finished. I'll do it for a week, maybe two, then life gets in the way and I have to break the routine for a day or two and I lose my momentum. Kinda links back to number 1, and number 2.
9. Having a perfectionist attitude. Like life, weight loss isn't all black and white. It's ok to sometimes go above your calories as long as you don't do it all the time. You don't have to "make up for it" the next day. You just write that day off as a day where things didn't go to plan, and you start again tomorrow as normal.16 -
My list:
4) Making too big a deal about food even while successfully dieting - such as, spending hours or chunks of hours planning out and talking about the next meal - thus never breaking that obese person habit of thinking/planning/dreaming/wanting/craving/needing food constantly. Even while successfully dieting, spending the whole day thinking about the next meal, very understandable given the often-a-little-hungry nature of dieting, contains the seeds of a future diet breakdown.
This is where I'm at, even after a year, maybe not hours, maybe not constant, but yes, this hits a chord.
How do you move past it?1 -
Thinking that since all those Biggest Loser contestants can lose double digits of weight per weight, I should be able to lose two pounds per week, EASY!10
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Oh, probably trying to overcome my deep and well-established self-indulgent hedonist bent by overcoming it through sheer willpower, instead of trying to work with it or game it. Heh.
I'm really bad at willpower, besides. 😆10 -
I only eat 1400 calories per day. Thus I can't be gaining weight. (hint: I did!). That was before I came here.4
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teresadannar wrote: »
4) Making too big a deal about food even while successfully dieting - such as, spending hours or chunks of hours planning out and talking about the next meal - thus never breaking that obese person habit of thinking/planning/dreaming/wanting/craving/needing food constantly. Even while successfully dieting, spending the whole day thinking about the next meal, very understandable given the often-a-little-hungry nature of dieting, contains the seeds of a future diet breakdown.
This is where I'm at, even after a year, maybe not hours, maybe not constant, but yes, this hits a chord.
How do you move past it?
I don't think there's an easy answer to this. My wife and I (we've been dieting together for 14 months) decided, first, to stop talking about food so much, and later, to really try not to talk about food at all LOL Other than the bare minimum, like "what do we want for dinner tonight"? That's really helped.
But the main thing we did was to stop treating every meal like some big "OHH MY GOD WE GET TO EAT AGAIN!!! WE'RE STARRRRVVVVIIIIINNNNNNGGGGG" event where we spend hours discussing, preparing, and cooking the food like we were two starving people in a dessert who just happened upon an oasis. At least a few times a week, we have very quick, prepared foods, like mac and cheese out of a box, just to get our focus off fine cuisine and off making the meal the centerpiece of the day. That actually has worked pretty well. I can spend allllllll day debating the fine points of Beef Bourgoinoin vs Lasagne for dinner, but really how excited can you get and how much time can you spend thinking about whether you're going to have a little cardboard box of mac and cheese vs a pre-made burrito? Both suck, either will fill up your stomach, and you're done eating in 5-10 minutes and that's the end of that. Doing that a few times a week has helped both of us stop looking forward to dinner as some major event in our lives, and I think that's helped. We are both amateur chefs and it was quite painful to let go of dinner as the spiritual cornerstone of our day, but doing so made a difference.
Like I said, no easy answer, but at least for me, it's been really important not just to eat less but to stop having my life so dominated by food - because I know where that leads, if not today, then eventually.19 -
teresadannar wrote: »
4) Making too big a deal about food even while successfully dieting - such as, spending hours or chunks of hours planning out and talking about the next meal - thus never breaking that obese person habit of thinking/planning/dreaming/wanting/craving/needing food constantly. Even while successfully dieting, spending the whole day thinking about the next meal, very understandable given the often-a-little-hungry nature of dieting, contains the seeds of a future diet breakdown.
This is where I'm at, even after a year, maybe not hours, maybe not constant, but yes, this hits a chord.
How do you move past it?
I don't think there's an easy answer to this. My wife and I (we've been dieting together for 14 months) decided, first, to stop talking about food so much, and later, to really try not to talk about food at all LOL Other than the bare minimum, like "what do we want for dinner tonight"? That's really helped.
But the main thing we did was to stop treating every meal like some big "OHH MY GOD WE GET TO EAT AGAIN!!! WE'RE STARRRRVVVVIIIIINNNNNNGGGGG" event where we spend hours discussing, preparing, and cooking the food like we were two starving people in a dessert who just happened upon an oasis. At least a few times a week, we have very quick, prepared foods, like mac and cheese out of a box, just to get our focus off fine cuisine and off making the meal the centerpiece of the day. That actually has worked pretty well. I can spend allllllll day debating the fine points of Beef Bourgoinoin vs Lasagne for dinner, but really how excited can you get and how much time can you spend thinking about whether you're going to have a little cardboard box of mac and cheese vs a pre-made burrito? Both suck, either will fill up your stomach, and you're done eating in 5-10 minutes and that's the end of that. Doing that a few times a week has helped both of us stop looking forward to dinner as some major event in our lives, and I think that's helped. We are both amateur chefs and it was quite painful to let go of dinner as the spiritual cornerstone of our day, but doing so made a difference.
Like I said, no easy answer, but at least for me, it's been really important not just to eat less but to stop having my life so dominated by food - because I know where that leads, if not today, then eventually.
Please don't take this as disagreemnt, because it's not.
It's interesting to me how very different all of us are, in what works.
For me, I think I do spend more time thinking about food now, and started doing so while losing weight, and that's been a positive and pleasurable thing, for me.
I mentioned my inner hedonist a few posts back. While obese (and exaggerating slightly, perhaps 😆), I had been shoveling foods into my mouth pretty indiscrimately, if it's available, eat it, and eat alllll of it. Since my husband died (which had been some years back at that point), I'd greatly cut back on cooking, relying more on quick foods, some frozen dinners and such. (I'd decided that, as a cook, I seemed to need some audience appreciation, to bother.)
When I decided my hedonist needed a calorie budget, so future Ann could also have a good life, that changed the equation. I started seeking out truly tasty ingredients (calorie-efficient and nutrition-efficient ones 😉), wanting to try new foods to find more of them, researching recipes, going to farmers markets, and generally spending much more time, happily thinking about food, and then spending more time on preparing things from scratch. My inner hedonist became the audience, in a sense.
I don't feel obsessed by food, but I think I do spend more time thinking/planning/prepping it than I used to, as a pleasure-increasing strategy. Obese me leaned more toward unthinking, indiscrimate volume as a satisfier. Thin me wants all the yummy and nutrition, as the new satisfier. I play calorie/nutrition Tetris, for treats, even.
Different people, different paths. So interesting!
The more I read other people's stories and post - especially ones that are vividly written, as yours are - the more I think that understanding our own inclinations and personality is a key to making weight management work - personalization. 🙂
Thanks for the insight into your process!34 -
TwistedSassette wrote: »Oh man, I have a few of these from over the years!
2. Not giving my efforts time to have an effect before giving up - I ate under range yesterday and I exercised and my scale still reads the same! No fair! Apparently you gotta give it time!
Oh my goodness, yes! I forgot this one.
"I dieted for two whole days and my pants feel the same - I guess it's impossible for me to lose weight!"
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teresadannar wrote: »My list:
4) Making too big a deal about food even while successfully dieting - such as, spending hours or chunks of hours planning out and talking about the next meal - thus never breaking that obese person habit of thinking/planning/dreaming/wanting/craving/needing food constantly. Even while successfully dieting, spending the whole day thinking about the next meal, very understandable given the often-a-little-hungry nature of dieting, contains the seeds of a future diet breakdown.
This is where I'm at, even after a year, maybe not hours, maybe not constant, but yes, this hits a chord.
How do you move past it?
I think it is common to put food on a pedestal but does it really belong there? It might help to gain perspective by making a list of all the ways that the food experience sucks. The goal is not to be anti-food but to have some mental ammunition to shoot down unhelpful thoughts. When I made my list I got quite mad... but I got over it.1 -
Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!5 -
AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
For many of us, the problem isn't the objective experience of eating healthy foods, it's the assigning all foods into categories of either "good" or "bad" and feeling guilty if we eat (or even want to eat) foods in the latter category.
Nobody is saying there is anything wrong with eating healthy. The issue is feeling guilt, stress, and unhappiness when you fail to live up to how you think you "should" eat. And I will say it is personally very unhelpful and even destructive to classify what many people eat as "crap" or consider eating something that I need to "train" myself to do in order to achieve my goals (that is to say, I'm glad it's helpful for you, but it's an approach that is absolutely toxic to me).
If you've never been outside of a normal weight range, it may be useful for you to spend some time listening to those of us who have been and appreciate what life might look like from that perspective.
When you say "This is what people should strive for!", please appreciate that striving for this literally led me to binge and purge and letting go of it has led me to several years of successful weight management while eating tons of nutrient-dense foods.25 -
The "healthy foods" comment is likely that one thinks that is ALL you can have to be successful. And that you can't touch "unhealthy foods" then, and it's a mental pummeling if you do.
As many have proved - you can overeat "healthy" or "clean" or "whatever" type foods.
And you can lose fat on foods with terrible nutritional value.
But there's nothing wrong if you can fulfill nutritional needs with "healthy" foods, and still have what might be considered by others as unhealthy if it fills out the rest of your calories.15 -
AliciaHollywood wrote: »I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems.
[...]
There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
No one is saying it's wrong to eat healthy, but it's not helpful or sustainable to force ourself to eat only 'healthy' food and ban all foods not considered healthy, if it means depriving ourself of foods that we enjoy.
PS it is most certainly possible to weight too much while only eating nutritious foods, all it takes is eating more than you burn.13 -
My list:
6) Thinking I was "cured" of obesity behavior because I'd lost a bunch of weight. The opposite is the truth - I am an obese person by nature and if I weighed 140 pounds I'd still be one. Learning that was a huge epiphany for me. You don't suddenly get to some weight and then voila, you're a different person and don't need to log/count/self-monitor/exercise/eat carefully anymore. It's like an alcoholic who hasn't had a drink in a year thinking he isn't an alcoholic anymore so he can just go into a bar and just get a Diet Coke. All my best laid plans about counting calories, eating right, blah blah, can come unwound in 5 minutes if I forget that just having lost weight does not mean I am immune to obesity. Sit me down in an Italian restaurant, put a bottle of wine and an extra large pizza with extra cheese and pepperoni in front of me, and guess what, it's like I was never on a diet - I can revert to my true self in seconds. Constant vigilance is needed and will always be needed, forever.
well said!7 -
janejellyroll wrote: »AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
For many of us, the problem isn't the objective experience of eating healthy foods, it's the assigning all foods into categories of either "good" or "bad" and feeling guilty if we eat (or even want to eat) foods in the latter category.
Nobody is saying there is anything wrong with eating healthy. The issue is feeling guilt, stress, and unhappiness when you fail to live up to how you think you "should" eat. And I will say it is personally very unhelpful and even destructive to classify what many people eat as "crap" or consider eating something that I need to "train" myself to do in order to achieve my goals (that is to say, I'm glad it's helpful for you, but it's an approach that is absolutely toxic to me).
If you've never been outside of a normal weight range, it may be useful for you to spend some time listening to those of us who haven't been and appreciate what life might look like from that perspective.
When you say "This is what people should strive for!", please appreciate that striving for this literally led me to binge and purge and letting go of it has led me to several years of successful weight management while eating tons of nutrient-dense foods.
I guess you’re right. The mentality of wanting to put food you know is unhealthy into your body is foreign to me as is smoking cigarettes. I think there are other psychological reasons behind it. It’s not really about food but something else deeper. Filling a hole, a sense of comfort, relief from stress, using it as a main source of joy, distraction, eating unhealthy food because other people around you are, perhaps even unconsciously wanting to be overweight to protect oneself from unwanted sexual attention... Overeating, I believe, has as many psychological issues involved as anorexia and both can be equally dangerous and may require the help of a therapist. If you feel guilty about overeating and then purge, I think therapy or hypnotherapy is a good idea. Instead of feeling bad about what you ate, you should figure out WHY you ate it. What immediate benefit did it give you? Why did you need that benefit at that time? And you CAN train your brain to naturally crave and desire healthy food and be disgusted with dangerously unhealthy food. And I occasionally do binge, but on things like granola or home made low fat/low fat frozen yogurt (with added flaxseed meal, sunflower seeds and chia seeds) but I don’t even feel guilty because although I overdid calories, at least they weren’t unhealthy calories (except the sugar in granola, I try to get low sugar granola!) Or I get TraderJoes organic popcorn kernels and pop in the microwave with no oil, then just dribble on a little healthy extra virgin olive oil with garlic and a dash of Himalayan pink salt and other spices. You can binge on a lot of things that aren’t unhealthy and actually provide many nutrients!
If you go over your calories with these foods once in a while, at least they are providing healthy nutrients for your body and hopefully you wouldn’t purge!
For me, I truly enjoy eating healthy food because I research nutrition and know all the benefits these nutrients can provide. I don’t want to age prematurely. I want healthy skin and hair. I’m vain lol. I want a strong immune system. I also take extra supplements. For me it just feels good to know I’m taking care of my body as best as I can. I admit, I HATE exercise, I have some personal block against that, so it’s much easier for me to eat less than exercise. But every time I eat a piece of fruit, I really savor it, I love the taste and it feels so good to know that it is giving me health. I love veggies too! Nature is amazing. It created these things that grow on a tree or in the ground that give me all the nutrients I need so I can survive and protects me from free radicals, pollutants, and diseases! And I love spices! I add healthy spices to foods to make them even more delicious and healthy. I cut up pieces of an apple and sprinkle on cinnamon and ginger. Yum! I look at food as delicious medicine, which it ultimately is!
I’m not saying that I NEVER eat unhealthy food, I do like the occasional pizza (extra thin crust with veggie toppings) or Thai food (spicy shrimp Pad Thai) but take half home for the next day. I’ll try a taste or two of a really interesting appetizer or special dessert at a catered event. I do drink socially, but not alone, mostly white wine or tequila, but I do like the occasional sweet drink (Baileys & Malibu!) and LOVE champagne. I know alcohol isn’t good for you, but I do keep it in moderation and never drink alone. That’s usually what makes me gain weight, food & alcohol at parties. But even then, I pay attention to what I’m eating/drinking and if I gain 5 lbs or more, I immediately try to correct it before it goes too far. But I know at catered events how to fill my plate so it’s as healthy as possible. The thing is, if I know something is really unhealthy, it literally grosses me out. I won’t even drink Diet Coke, not because of calories, but because it’s putting poison in my body. 100% fruit juice has more calories but is supplying nutrients (but still should be consumed in moderation due to high sugar.) I read all labels in the supermarket and won’t eat anything with chemicals or high fructose corn syrup. Why put poison in my body? That’s how I look at it I guess. Fried food disgusts me, I can’t even look at it without wanting to throw up. But fresh organic fruit? It just looks beautiful to me. It tastes amazing to me. And has the benefit of all those nutrients! And I do believe people can train their brains to crave healthy food and be disgusted by unhealthy food just the way people can quit smoking. Hypnotherapy can help too for both issues. Once you can divide foods into either foods that will sustain your body and provide disease fighting nutrients or foods that can literally kill you, it becomes pretty easy...2 -
AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
I do not believe anything good comes from living in an extreme. Especially one with such vague promises and rules. How much longer will you live? Will you actually enjoy the time you gain? How much less life will I have if I eat a Snickers bar?
I refuse to believe that the percentage of food one needs to "eat healthy" needs to be 100 percent nutrition packed foods. Your body can only use so much nutrition in a day.
Nope. I am not interested in all or nothing thinking. Been there. Done that. Eating healthier is a worthwhile aspiration, eating whatever the latest definition of "healthy" might be is not.
Also, your stomach doesn't shrink without surgery.
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AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
I got fat and then obese eating primarily healthy foods - was obese for around 30 years. I've been vegetarian for 46 years. Some healthy foods are very calorie dense, easy to over-eat. I stayed obese eating the same way, for over a decade, while working out quite intensely most days, become fit enough (even while obese) to compete as an athlete (and not always unsuccessfully, though fat or thin I was not blessed with the natural athleticism to be a star, even if I put in the work.)
I still eat pretty much the same things, just in different proportions and portion sizes. Some people who've looked at my diary have accused me of "eating clean" (which I think is an incorrect and even laughable description, not to mention a term so diversely defined as to be nearly meaningless).
I won't claim to have gotten fat eating *only* healthy foods, because I'm quite careful about overclaiming. IME, most people who claim to eat "only healthy foods" eat the occasional cookie or have a glass of wine once in a while, or some such thing (which is fine, dietarily, BTW, IMO - but still an overclaim.)
There is nothing wrong with eating healthy, - it's a good plan - but part of "healthy" is "at an appropriate calorie level". Appropriate calories can happen intuitively, and "healthy foods" help some people do that; or appropriate calories can happen by counting or other means. Food choice is not the solution to everything all by itself for everyone.
Though it rarely happens, it's possible to be undernourished, possibly even malnourished, while eating healthy foods (in inappropriate combinations). It's definitely possible to be fat or obese, eating only healthy foods.
There is nothing wrong with eating healthy. Different people do define "eating healthy" in different ways, but I think there's nothing wrong with it by any mainstream definition.
I'm glad that "eating healthy" however you define it has been perfect for you, and has kept you at a healthy weight long term, plus feeling great and being healthy. It doesn't work that way for everyone.15 -
Mistakes I've definitely made:
Deciding that all I have to do is eat nutrient dense foods
Overestimating my calorie burn
Not weighing my food
Not logging or keeping track of what I eat
Playing the "I blew it, so I might as well just start over tomorrow, next week, next month, never" game
Eating extra based on the thought that "I'll work out more later to make up for this"
This time around I haven't done those things much, if at all. Maybe that's why I'm succeeding this time.
Regarding good and bad food:
I do sometimes think of foods as "good" or "bad" however it's more based on whether it will trigger my body to be overly hungry, or if it's not worth the calories for the small amount I'll be able to have, or if it'll have some bad effect on my digestion. For example I stay away from high sugar foods because they have bad effects and make it really hard to stay on plan. So I avoid them, and if it's something I really crave I find a less impactful way to have it, or a better version of it with more nutritional value and less of the problematic ingredients. Example: I love chocolate, and I don't want to live the rest of my life without it, but instead of having a bag of heavily flavored chocolates I'll have a square or two, eaten slowly, of really high quality, high cacao percentage chocolate. Result: better nutrition, no blood sugar spikes, and no deprivation. So I guess I categorize food by effect more than by "good" or "bad."7 -
AliciaHollywood wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
For many of us, the problem isn't the objective experience of eating healthy foods, it's the assigning all foods into categories of either "good" or "bad" and feeling guilty if we eat (or even want to eat) foods in the latter category.
Nobody is saying there is anything wrong with eating healthy. The issue is feeling guilt, stress, and unhappiness when you fail to live up to how you think you "should" eat. And I will say it is personally very unhelpful and even destructive to classify what many people eat as "crap" or consider eating something that I need to "train" myself to do in order to achieve my goals (that is to say, I'm glad it's helpful for you, but it's an approach that is absolutely toxic to me).
If you've never been outside of a normal weight range, it may be useful for you to spend some time listening to those of us who haven't been and appreciate what life might look like from that perspective.
When you say "This is what people should strive for!", please appreciate that striving for this literally led me to binge and purge and letting go of it has led me to several years of successful weight management while eating tons of nutrient-dense foods.
I guess you’re right. The mentality of wanting to put food you know is unhealthy into your body is foreign to me as is smoking cigarettes. I think there are other psychological reasons behind it. It’s not really about food but something else deeper. Filling a hole, a sense of comfort, relief from stress, using it as a main source of joy, distraction, eating unhealthy food because other people around you are, perhaps even unconsciously wanting to be overweight to protect oneself from unwanted sexual attention... Overeating, I believe, has as many psychological issues involved as anorexia and both can be equally dangerous and may require the help of a therapist. If you feel guilty about overeating and then purge, I think therapy or hypnotherapy is a good idea. Instead of feeling bad about what you ate, you should figure out WHY you ate it. What immediate benefit did it give you? Why did you need that benefit at that time? And you CAN train your brain to naturally crave and desire healthy food and be disgusted with dangerously unhealthy food. And I occasionally do binge, but on things like granola or home made low fat/low fat frozen yogurt (with added flaxseed meal, sunflower seeds and chia seeds) but I don’t even feel guilty because although I overdid calories, at least they weren’t unhealthy calories (except the sugar in granola, I try to get low sugar granola!) Or I get TraderJoes organic popcorn kernels and pop in the microwave with no oil, then just dribble on a little healthy extra virgin olive oil with garlic and a dash of Himalayan pink salt and other spices. You can binge on a lot of things that aren’t unhealthy and actually provide many nutrients! If you go over your calories with these foods once in a while, at least they are providing healthy nutrients for your body and hopefully you wouldn’t purge!
For me, I truly enjoy eating healthy food because I research nutrition and know all the benefits these nutrients can provide. I don’t want to age prematurely. I want healthy skin and hair. I’m vain lol. I want a strong immune system. I also take extra supplements. For me it just feels good to know I’m taking care of my body as best as I can. I admit, I HATE exercise, I have some personal block against that, so it’s much easier for me to eat less than exercise. But every time I eat a piece of fruit, I really savor it, I love the taste and it feels so good to know that it is giving me health. I love veggies too! Nature is amazing. It created these things that grow on a tree or in the ground that give me all the nutrients I need so I can survive and protects me from free radicals, pollutants, and diseases! And I love spices! I add healthy spices to foods to make them even more delicious and healthy. I cut up pieces of an apple and sprinkle on cinnamon and ginger. Yum! I look at food as delicious medicine, which it ultimately is!
I’m not saying that I NEVER eat unhealthy food, I do like the occasional pizza (extra thin crust with veggie toppings) or Thai food (spicy shrimp Pad Thai) but take half home for the next day. I’ll try a taste or two of a really interesting appetizer or special dessert at a catered event. I do drink socially, but not alone, mostly white wine or tequila, but I do like the occasional sweet drink (Baileys & Malibu!) and LOVE champagne. I know alcohol isn’t good for you, but I do keep it in moderation and never drink alone. That’s usually what makes me gain weight, food & alcohol at parties. But even then, I pay attention to what I’m eating/drinking and if I gain 5 lbs or more, I immediately try to correct it before it goes too far. But I know at catered events how to fill my plate so it’s as healthy as possible. The thing is, if I know something is really unhealthy, it literally grosses me out. I won’t even drink Diet Coke, not because of calories, but because it’s putting poison in my body. 100% fruit juice has more calories but is supplying nutrients (but still should be consumed in moderation due to high sugar.) I read all labels in the supermarket and won’t eat anything with chemicals or high fructose corn syrup. Why put poison in my body? That’s how I look at it I guess. Fried food disgusts me, I can’t even look at it without wanting to throw up. But fresh organic fruit? It just looks beautiful to me. It tastes amazing to me. And has the benefit of all those nutrients! And I do believe people can train their brains to crave healthy food and be disgusted by unhealthy food just the way people can quit smoking. Hypnotherapy can help too for both issues. Once you can divide foods into either foods that will sustain your body and provide disease fighting nutrients or foods that can literally kill you, it becomes pretty easy...
I know that you're responding to a particular poster's comments, when you talk about the psychology of obesity or overeating. But if you've never been overweight, and have not made a long academic study of the psychology of obesity, It might be a bit of over-reach to speculate about it.
There are many ways people try to gain a sense of control, in an universe that doesn't let us control much. Overeating is one way, sure. But overeating isn't the only way people act that out psychologically, and not everyone who overeats does so for that reason. Are you familiar with the term "orthorexia" for example?
BTW, I'm curious: What do you consider unhealthy about shrimp pad Thai? Noodles? Sodium? The bit of sugar in many recipes for it?18 -
AliciaHollywood wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
For many of us, the problem isn't the objective experience of eating healthy foods, it's the assigning all foods into categories of either "good" or "bad" and feeling guilty if we eat (or even want to eat) foods in the latter category.
Nobody is saying there is anything wrong with eating healthy. The issue is feeling guilt, stress, and unhappiness when you fail to live up to how you think you "should" eat. And I will say it is personally very unhelpful and even destructive to classify what many people eat as "crap" or consider eating something that I need to "train" myself to do in order to achieve my goals (that is to say, I'm glad it's helpful for you, but it's an approach that is absolutely toxic to me).
If you've never been outside of a normal weight range, it may be useful for you to spend some time listening to those of us who haven't been and appreciate what life might look like from that perspective.
When you say "This is what people should strive for!", please appreciate that striving for this literally led me to binge and purge and letting go of it has led me to several years of successful weight management while eating tons of nutrient-dense foods.
I guess you’re right. The mentality of wanting to put food you know is unhealthy into your body is foreign to me as is smoking cigarettes. I think there are other psychological reasons behind it. It’s not really about food but something else deeper. Filling a hole, a sense of comfort, relief from stress, using it as a main source of joy, distraction, eating unhealthy food because other people around you are, perhaps even unconsciously wanting to be overweight to protect oneself from unwanted sexual attention... Overeating, I believe, has as many psychological issues involved as anorexia and both can be equally dangerous and may require the help of a therapist. If you feel guilty about overeating and then purge, I think therapy or hypnotherapy is a good idea. Instead of feeling bad about what you ate, you should figure out WHY you ate it. What immediate benefit did it give you? Why did you need that benefit at that time? And you CAN train your brain to naturally crave and desire healthy food and be disgusted with dangerously unhealthy food. And I occasionally do binge, but on things like granola or home made low fat/low fat frozen yogurt (with added flaxseed meal, sunflower seeds and chia seeds) but I don’t even feel guilty because although I overdid calories, at least they weren’t unhealthy calories (except the sugar in granola, I try to get low sugar granola!) Or I get TraderJoes organic popcorn kernels and pop in the microwave with no oil, then just dribble on a little healthy extra virgin olive oil with garlic and a dash of Himalayan pink salt and other spices. You can binge on a lot of things that aren’t unhealthy and actually provide many nutrients! If you go over your calories with these foods once in a while, at least they are providing healthy nutrients for your body and hopefully you wouldn’t purge!
For me, I truly enjoy eating healthy food because I research nutrition and know all the benefits these nutrients can provide. I don’t want to age prematurely. I want healthy skin and hair. I’m vain lol. I want a strong immune system. I also take extra supplements. For me it just feels good to know I’m taking care of my body as best as I can. I admit, I HATE exercise, I have some personal block against that, so it’s much easier for me to eat less than exercise. But every time I eat a piece of fruit, I really savor it, I love the taste and it feels so good to know that it is giving me health. I love veggies too! Nature is amazing. It created these things that grow on a tree or in the ground that give me all the nutrients I need so I can survive and protects me from free radicals, pollutants, and diseases! And I love spices! I add healthy spices to foods to make them even more delicious and healthy. I cut up pieces of an apple and sprinkle on cinnamon and ginger. Yum! I look at food as delicious medicine, which it ultimately is!
I’m not saying that I NEVER eat unhealthy food, I do like the occasional pizza (extra thin crust with veggie toppings) or Thai food (spicy shrimp Pad Thai) but take half home for the next day. I’ll try a taste or two of a really interesting appetizer or special dessert at a catered event. I do drink socially, but not alone, mostly white wine or tequila, but I do like the occasional sweet drink (Baileys & Malibu!) and LOVE champagne. I know alcohol isn’t good for you, but I do keep it in moderation and never drink alone. That’s usually what makes me gain weight, food & alcohol at parties. But even then, I pay attention to what I’m eating/drinking and if I gain 5 lbs or more, I immediately try to correct it before it goes too far. But I know at catered events how to fill my plate so it’s as healthy as possible. The thing is, if I know something is really unhealthy, it literally grosses me out. I won’t even drink Diet Coke, not because of calories, but because it’s putting poison in my body. 100% fruit juice has more calories but is supplying nutrients (but still should be consumed in moderation due to high sugar.) I read all labels in the supermarket and won’t eat anything with chemicals or high fructose corn syrup. Why put poison in my body? That’s how I look at it I guess. Fried food disgusts me, I can’t even look at it without wanting to throw up. But fresh organic fruit? It just looks beautiful to me. It tastes amazing to me. And has the benefit of all those nutrients! And I do believe people can train their brains to crave healthy food and be disgusted by unhealthy food just the way people can quit smoking. Hypnotherapy can help too for both issues. Once you can divide foods into either foods that will sustain your body and provide disease fighting nutrients or foods that can literally kill you, it becomes pretty easy...
I think it can be really misleading to compare food to cigarettes, a substance that is clearly associated with harm and for which there appears to be no safe level on consumption. But if I decide to eat [food x] at a level consistent with my calorie goals and in the context of a diet that is meeting my nutritional needs, is it accurate to compare that to smoking a cigarette? I am not aware of any foods for which there is clear evidence that is true (except for maybe human-created trans fats, which most of us here agree we should try to avoid).
I don't need your suggestions on what to binge or how to avoid purging. Thanks to my approach, the desire to binge is pretty much absent from my life. It's easier to eat one ounce of tortilla chips and salsa than it is to eat vast amounts of granola (I mean, I understand your approach may work better for YOU, but it wouldn't really make me happy). It's easier, it's healthier for me (I feel better afterwards and I easily stay within my calorie goals), and it makes me happier. So what's the drawback?
I accept your intentions are good, but I find your comments about figuring out what "hole" I'm trying to fill condescending and unhelpful. Maybe I just like to have a serving of candy because . . . candy is tasty? There's no deep meaning, it's just that it is okay to sometimes have things that give us pleasure.
I will also add, you seem to be using "binge" in the sense of simply "eating a lot of food." That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about excessive restriction triggering actual binges, situations where people experience reduced ability to control the foods they're eating. It's not like you can say "Now I'm going to binge on granola because I only like healthy food." It's that relating to food in a way that is UNHEALTHY FOR ME will trigger a state of mind where I do not always feel fully in control of what I am eating or the quantities I'm choosing. There is no saying "I'll just do popcorn with organic olive oil." Avoiding those triggers is a key part of my mental health - I'm stressing this because I don't think you get it.
When I relate to food in a way that is healthy FOR ME, I can crave certain flavors and figure out ways to incorporate them - or not -- into my planned meals. I can crave them the way I desire other physically or emotionally pleasant experiences. For example: I can crave listening to beautiful music. I can crave a delicious risotto. As long as I'm keeping these desires in their proper context and not letting them rule me, what's the harm of sometimes indulging?
I love exercise. There are clear benefits to us when we exercise. Does this mean I have figured out life to an extent that you haven't? I think it would be profoundly silly for me to think so. It's a difference in our frequency of physical activity, not a moral or emotional difference. It's the same way with food. You like fruit, the very sight of fried food makes you ill. I like fruit, I also sometimes eat french fries. You like Bailey's, sweet alcohol is disgusting to me. What does it mean? Nothing more than the fact that we probably shouldn't order for each other at a bar.
A life where even viewing certain foods makes me want to vomit . . . I don't really identify, it doesn't sound desirable to me. No judgment to you, I'm sure you experience your life as great. But it's ONE WAY to live life. It isn't the BEST WAY to live life.
You're not the only one who has studied nutrition. There are lots of people here who are very well-read on the subject and spend a great deal of time thinking about it and still sometimes choose to have a slice of cake or a corn dog.32 -
AliciaHollywood wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
For many of us, the problem isn't the objective experience of eating healthy foods, it's the assigning all foods into categories of either "good" or "bad" and feeling guilty if we eat (or even want to eat) foods in the latter category.
Nobody is saying there is anything wrong with eating healthy. The issue is feeling guilt, stress, and unhappiness when you fail to live up to how you think you "should" eat. And I will say it is personally very unhelpful and even destructive to classify what many people eat as "crap" or consider eating something that I need to "train" myself to do in order to achieve my goals (that is to say, I'm glad it's helpful for you, but it's an approach that is absolutely toxic to me).
If you've never been outside of a normal weight range, it may be useful for you to spend some time listening to those of us who haven't been and appreciate what life might look like from that perspective.
When you say "This is what people should strive for!", please appreciate that striving for this literally led me to binge and purge and letting go of it has led me to several years of successful weight management while eating tons of nutrient-dense foods.
I guess you’re right. The mentality of wanting to put food you know is unhealthy into your body is foreign to me as is smoking cigarettes. I think there are other psychological reasons behind it. It’s not really about food but something else deeper. Filling a hole, a sense of comfort, relief from stress, using it as a main source of joy, distraction, eating unhealthy food because other people around you are, perhaps even unconsciously wanting to be overweight to protect oneself from unwanted sexual attention... Overeating, I believe, has as many psychological issues involved as anorexia and both can be equally dangerous and may require the help of a therapist. If you feel guilty about overeating and then purge, I think therapy or hypnotherapy is a good idea. Instead of feeling bad about what you ate, you should figure out WHY you ate it. What immediate benefit did it give you? Why did you need that benefit at that time? And you CAN train your brain to naturally crave and desire healthy food and be disgusted with dangerously unhealthy food. And I occasionally do binge, but on things like granola or home made low fat/low fat frozen yogurt (with added flaxseed meal, sunflower seeds and chia seeds) but I don’t even feel guilty because although I overdid calories, at least they weren’t unhealthy calories (except the sugar in granola, I try to get low sugar granola!) Or I get TraderJoes organic popcorn kernels and pop in the microwave with no oil, then just dribble on a little healthy extra virgin olive oil with garlic and a dash of Himalayan pink salt and other spices. You can binge on a lot of things that aren’t unhealthy and actually provide many nutrients! If you go over your calories with these foods once in a while, at least they are providing healthy nutrients for your body and hopefully you wouldn’t purge!
For me, I truly enjoy eating healthy food because I research nutrition and know all the benefits these nutrients can provide. I don’t want to age prematurely. I want healthy skin and hair. I’m vain lol. I want a strong immune system. I also take extra supplements. For me it just feels good to know I’m taking care of my body as best as I can. I admit, I HATE exercise, I have some personal block against that, so it’s much easier for me to eat less than exercise. But every time I eat a piece of fruit, I really savor it, I love the taste and it feels so good to know that it is giving me health. I love veggies too! Nature is amazing. It created these things that grow on a tree or in the ground that give me all the nutrients I need so I can survive and protects me from free radicals, pollutants, and diseases! And I love spices! I add healthy spices to foods to make them even more delicious and healthy. I cut up pieces of an apple and sprinkle on cinnamon and ginger. Yum! I look at food as delicious medicine, which it ultimately is!
I’m not saying that I NEVER eat unhealthy food, I do like the occasional pizza (extra thin crust with veggie toppings) or Thai food (spicy shrimp Pad Thai) but take half home for the next day. I’ll try a taste or two of a really interesting appetizer or special dessert at a catered event. I do drink socially, but not alone, mostly white wine or tequila, but I do like the occasional sweet drink (Baileys & Malibu!) and LOVE champagne. I know alcohol isn’t good for you, but I do keep it in moderation and never drink alone. That’s usually what makes me gain weight, food & alcohol at parties. But even then, I pay attention to what I’m eating/drinking and if I gain 5 lbs or more, I immediately try to correct it before it goes too far. But I know at catered events how to fill my plate so it’s as healthy as possible. The thing is, if I know something is really unhealthy, it literally grosses me out. I won’t even drink Diet Coke, not because of calories, but because it’s putting poison in my body. 100% fruit juice has more calories but is supplying nutrients (but still should be consumed in moderation due to high sugar.) I read all labels in the supermarket and won’t eat anything with chemicals or high fructose corn syrup. Why put poison in my body? That’s how I look at it I guess. Fried food disgusts me, I can’t even look at it without wanting to throw up. But fresh organic fruit? It just looks beautiful to me. It tastes amazing to me. And has the benefit of all those nutrients! And I do believe people can train their brains to crave healthy food and be disgusted by unhealthy food just the way people can quit smoking. Hypnotherapy can help too for both issues. Once you can divide foods into either foods that will sustain your body and provide disease fighting nutrients or foods that can literally kill you, it becomes pretty easy...
I know that you're responding to a particular poster's comments, when you talk about the psychology of obesity or overeating. But if you've never been overweight, and have not made a long academic study of the psychology of obesity, It might be a bit of over-reach to speculate about it.
There are many ways people try to gain a sense of control, in an universe that doesn't let us control much. Overeating is one way, sure. But overeating isn't the only way people act that out psychologically, and not everyone who overeats does so for that reason. Are you familiar with the term "orthorexia" for example?
BTW, I'm curious: What do you consider unhealthy about shrimp pad Thai? Noodles? Sodium? The bit of sugar in many recipes for it?
In an obesogenic enviroment (where I am convinced many of us now live), I would argue that many of us are trying to gain control over food OR actively evading thoughts about trying to gain control over it (to me, the unhealthier approach).
These methods, IMO, are only dysfunctional if they are harming our health, damaging our relationships, or preventing us from functioning well (in other words, if they're pathological in some way).
I don't deny that I'm trying to gain a sense of control over food (said control being well established now and most days are pretty much on auto-pilot due to years of effective strategy development).
When I decide to not bring home crackers from the grocery store because I don't do a good job regulating my consumption of them, that's a form of control.
When I pre-roast a bunch of vegetables on Sunday evening to get a jump start on meal prep for the week, that's a form of control.
When I scope out the menu prior to going out to eat to pre-determine what I'm going to order, that's a form of control.
When I say no to a glass of fruit juice because I know that eight ounces will just make me want to drink more and more, that's a form of control.
I am not upset or bothered by the obvious observation that I'm using strategies to control and regulate my relationship with food -- I would argue that many of us have to learn to do this to having a fighting chance in this particular culture. What concerns me is the suggestion that tactics like this are inferior to other tactics that involve a different set of regulations/restrictions (which might work well for other people but would not work well for me). I think weight management is very individual and when someone says that they know something will be a trigger for them, we should generally trust them.13 -
janejellyroll wrote: »AliciaHollywood wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AliciaHollywood wrote: »Doing 3-5 day water only fasts. Did absolutely nothing! EXCEPT it did make my stomach “shrink” so I was eating less after that and was extremely mindful of what I ate, eating ONLY super nutritious foods. But now I realize I can just stick to low cal super nutritious foods without a 5 day fast!
I’m shocked that you put eating healthy food as a negative! I really enjoy eating healthy food, it makes me feel good about myself and I enjoy the taste better than all the crap a lot of people eat. Once you train yourself to eat only nutritious food, you will no longer have weight problems. I’ve never been above the lower end of ”normal” weight because of that. I’m only here to lose extra vanity pounds to get to the lowest safe weight for my height because they’ve proven that thin people who eat healthy with nutrition packed foods live longer and are less likely to get other diseases like diabetes, heart problems and even cancer (unless genetic.) There is NOTHING WRONG WITH EATING HEALTHY! This is what people should strive for!
For many of us, the problem isn't the objective experience of eating healthy foods, it's the assigning all foods into categories of either "good" or "bad" and feeling guilty if we eat (or even want to eat) foods in the latter category.
Nobody is saying there is anything wrong with eating healthy. The issue is feeling guilt, stress, and unhappiness when you fail to live up to how you think you "should" eat. And I will say it is personally very unhelpful and even destructive to classify what many people eat as "crap" or consider eating something that I need to "train" myself to do in order to achieve my goals (that is to say, I'm glad it's helpful for you, but it's an approach that is absolutely toxic to me).
If you've never been outside of a normal weight range, it may be useful for you to spend some time listening to those of us who haven't been and appreciate what life might look like from that perspective.
When you say "This is what people should strive for!", please appreciate that striving for this literally led me to binge and purge and letting go of it has led me to several years of successful weight management while eating tons of nutrient-dense foods.
I guess you’re right. The mentality of wanting to put food you know is unhealthy into your body is foreign to me as is smoking cigarettes. I think there are other psychological reasons behind it. It’s not really about food but something else deeper. Filling a hole, a sense of comfort, relief from stress, using it as a main source of joy, distraction, eating unhealthy food because other people around you are, perhaps even unconsciously wanting to be overweight to protect oneself from unwanted sexual attention... Overeating, I believe, has as many psychological issues involved as anorexia and both can be equally dangerous and may require the help of a therapist. If you feel guilty about overeating and then purge, I think therapy or hypnotherapy is a good idea. Instead of feeling bad about what you ate, you should figure out WHY you ate it. What immediate benefit did it give you? Why did you need that benefit at that time? And you CAN train your brain to naturally crave and desire healthy food and be disgusted with dangerously unhealthy food. And I occasionally do binge, but on things like granola or home made low fat/low fat frozen yogurt (with added flaxseed meal, sunflower seeds and chia seeds) but I don’t even feel guilty because although I overdid calories, at least they weren’t unhealthy calories (except the sugar in granola, I try to get low sugar granola!) Or I get TraderJoes organic popcorn kernels and pop in the microwave with no oil, then just dribble on a little healthy extra virgin olive oil with garlic and a dash of Himalayan pink salt and other spices. You can binge on a lot of things that aren’t unhealthy and actually provide many nutrients! If you go over your calories with these foods once in a while, at least they are providing healthy nutrients for your body and hopefully you wouldn’t purge!
For me, I truly enjoy eating healthy food because I research nutrition and know all the benefits these nutrients can provide. I don’t want to age prematurely. I want healthy skin and hair. I’m vain lol. I want a strong immune system. I also take extra supplements. For me it just feels good to know I’m taking care of my body as best as I can. I admit, I HATE exercise, I have some personal block against that, so it’s much easier for me to eat less than exercise. But every time I eat a piece of fruit, I really savor it, I love the taste and it feels so good to know that it is giving me health. I love veggies too! Nature is amazing. It created these things that grow on a tree or in the ground that give me all the nutrients I need so I can survive and protects me from free radicals, pollutants, and diseases! And I love spices! I add healthy spices to foods to make them even more delicious and healthy. I cut up pieces of an apple and sprinkle on cinnamon and ginger. Yum! I look at food as delicious medicine, which it ultimately is!
I’m not saying that I NEVER eat unhealthy food, I do like the occasional pizza (extra thin crust with veggie toppings) or Thai food (spicy shrimp Pad Thai) but take half home for the next day. I’ll try a taste or two of a really interesting appetizer or special dessert at a catered event. I do drink socially, but not alone, mostly white wine or tequila, but I do like the occasional sweet drink (Baileys & Malibu!) and LOVE champagne. I know alcohol isn’t good for you, but I do keep it in moderation and never drink alone. That’s usually what makes me gain weight, food & alcohol at parties. But even then, I pay attention to what I’m eating/drinking and if I gain 5 lbs or more, I immediately try to correct it before it goes too far. But I know at catered events how to fill my plate so it’s as healthy as possible. The thing is, if I know something is really unhealthy, it literally grosses me out. I won’t even drink Diet Coke, not because of calories, but because it’s putting poison in my body. 100% fruit juice has more calories but is supplying nutrients (but still should be consumed in moderation due to high sugar.) I read all labels in the supermarket and won’t eat anything with chemicals or high fructose corn syrup. Why put poison in my body? That’s how I look at it I guess. Fried food disgusts me, I can’t even look at it without wanting to throw up. But fresh organic fruit? It just looks beautiful to me. It tastes amazing to me. And has the benefit of all those nutrients! And I do believe people can train their brains to crave healthy food and be disgusted by unhealthy food just the way people can quit smoking. Hypnotherapy can help too for both issues. Once you can divide foods into either foods that will sustain your body and provide disease fighting nutrients or foods that can literally kill you, it becomes pretty easy...
I know that you're responding to a particular poster's comments, when you talk about the psychology of obesity or overeating. But if you've never been overweight, and have not made a long academic study of the psychology of obesity, It might be a bit of over-reach to speculate about it.
There are many ways people try to gain a sense of control, in an universe that doesn't let us control much. Overeating is one way, sure. But overeating isn't the only way people act that out psychologically, and not everyone who overeats does so for that reason. Are you familiar with the term "orthorexia" for example?
BTW, I'm curious: What do you consider unhealthy about shrimp pad Thai? Noodles? Sodium? The bit of sugar in many recipes for it?
In an obesogenic enviroment (where I am convinced many of us now live), I would argue that many of us are trying to gain control over food OR actively evading thoughts about trying to gain control over it (to me, the unhealthier approach).
These methods, IMO, are only dysfunctional if they are harming our health, damaging our relationships, or preventing us from functioning well (in other words, if they're pathological in some way).
I don't deny that I'm trying to gain a sense of control over food (said control being well established now and most days are pretty much on auto-pilot due to years of effective strategy development).
When I decide to not bring home crackers from the grocery store because I don't do a good job regulating my consumption of them, that's a form of control.
When I pre-roast a bunch of vegetables on Sunday evening to get a jump start on meal prep for the week, that's a form of control.
When I scope out the menu prior to going out to eat to pre-determine what I'm going to order, that's a form of control.
When I say no to a glass of fruit juice because I know that eight ounces will just make me want to drink more and more, that's a form of control.
I am not upset or bothered by the obvious observation that I'm using strategies to control and regulate my relationship with food -- I would argue that many of us have to learn to do this to having a fighting chance in this particular culture. What concerns me is the suggestion that tactics like this are inferior to other tactics that involve a different set of regulations/restrictions (which might work well for other people but would not work well for me). I think weight management is very individual and when someone says that they know something will be a trigger for them, we should generally trust them.
I hope you don't think I disagree with anything you wrote, Jane, because I don't.
In the post to which I replied, there was quite a laundry list of reasons people might overeat. I mentioned the control issue because I see it as a psychological thread that could pull a person in many different directions, if taken to an obsessive level - overeating, anorexia, orthorexia, possibly others.
Of course we control what we eat in various non-obsessive ways, as well . . . and that's psychologically healthy behavior. It's hard to tell whether something is psychologically healthy vs. obsessive, without the ability to look inside someone's thinking. (And healthy vs. obsessive is only one of many possible analytic axes besides, in a context where control motivations are only one element.)
I'm not a professional psychologist, either. 😉 Rank amateur. 😉8 -
Re: the ”eat healthy foods only” discussion. Like others, I’m one of those people who eat mostly what you’d probaby class as ”healthy” foods. I just eat too much of them. It still doesn’t mean I binge. I don’t have binge eating disorder, nor have I ever really experienced a full-on binge. I simply eat a little too much every day. This has continues consistently since my late teenage years: when I stopped growing taller, I just continued eating calories needed for growth and started growing wider instead.
I don’t eat most things people usually classify as ”junk” food. I hate candy, potato chips, french fries (unless drunk), can’t have donuts, cakes or other baked goods unless it’s gluten free, and so on. For most foods I eat I can name nutritional benefits. Still, there are other health benefits to food than good nutrition. Some examples include enjoyment, relaxation and social aspects. All are huge for mental health.
There are certain foods that make me want to vomit, but that’s based on a visceral reaction to the taste or smell, not rational information about nutritional values. Examples of foods and drinks that gross me out are: liquorice, mince meat pies, kebab meat, olives, capers, Dr. Pepper soda, tequila, fennel. Some veeery different nutritional values here.6
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