Are carbs the enemy?
Replies
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So for me the answer is, if you are trying to lose weight ( a.k.a. more than 10 pounds ) you should eliminate cereals ( rice, bread, pasta, flour ) and sugar.
I guess this is true if you mean "for me" as in you individually needed to eliminate those foods - what people need to cut in their diet to create a deficit and sustainability is very individual - so that would be on a par with me saying I (and I alone) needed to address snack eating in front of the TV.
But as a general thing - No, people do not need to eliminate rice,bread, pasta, flour or sugar - I eliminated none of the above and I lost over 10 pounds and I've kept it off for 6 years.
Of course I logged any of them and kept amounts within my calorie allowance - but that goes for any foods.5 -
mariomicro wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »mariomicro wrote: »Asians in Asian eat a lot of carbs (based on income). There aren't a lot of fat Asians per capita based on population. Carbs aren't the issue. OVERCONSUMPTION IS.
Yet, despite not being overweight, they are at higher risk of becoming diabetic because they" are more likely to have less muscle and more abdominal fat, which increases insulin resistance".
https://asiandiabetesprevention.org/what-is-diabetes/why-are-asians-higher-risk
Are you saying there is nothing that individuals can do to increase their muscle and reduce abdominal fat BUT limit carbohydrates?
I don't know how you can extrapolate that from what I've said.
Bearing in mind you have dieted down to a BMI of 20 and are really dissatisfied with your body maybe a little humility might be in order?
"My current BMI is about 20, but my belly looks horrible, as there is some extra stubborn fat hanging just below the belly."
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/comment/45422999#Comment_45422999
You really are an example of someone who needs to learn rather than teach!
Your knowledge of how bodies actually work is badly flawed and seems based on total woo - Fung perhaps?17 -
How dare you insult Dr. Fung sir! That man is a Saint! The patron St. of B.S. that is.....mariomicro wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »mariomicro wrote: »Asians in Asian eat a lot of carbs (based on income). There aren't a lot of fat Asians per capita based on population. Carbs aren't the issue. OVERCONSUMPTION IS.
Yet, despite not being overweight, they are at higher risk of becoming diabetic because they" are more likely to have less muscle and more abdominal fat, which increases insulin resistance".
https://asiandiabetesprevention.org/what-is-diabetes/why-are-asians-higher-risk
Are you saying there is nothing that individuals can do to increase their muscle and reduce abdominal fat BUT limit carbohydrates?
I don't know how you can extrapolate that from what I've said.
Bearing in mind you have dieted down to a BMI of 20 and are really dissatisfied with your body maybe a little humility might be in order?
"My current BMI is about 20, but my belly looks horrible, as there is some extra stubborn fat hanging just below the belly."
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/comment/45422999#Comment_45422999
You really are an example of someone who needs to learn rather than teach!
Your knowledge of how bodies actually work is badly flawed and seems based on total woo - Fung perhaps?
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mariomicro wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »mariomicro wrote: »Asians in Asian eat a lot of carbs (based on income). There aren't a lot of fat Asians per capita based on population. Carbs aren't the issue. OVERCONSUMPTION IS.
Yet, despite not being overweight, they are at higher risk of becoming diabetic because they" are more likely to have less muscle and more abdominal fat, which increases insulin resistance".
https://asiandiabetesprevention.org/what-is-diabetes/why-are-asians-higher-risk
Are you saying there is nothing that individuals can do to increase their muscle and reduce abdominal fat BUT limit carbohydrates?
I don't know how you can extrapolate that from what I've said.
Bearing in mind you have dieted down to a BMI of 20 and are really dissatisfied with your body maybe a little humility might be in order?
"My current BMI is about 20, but my belly looks horrible, as there is some extra stubborn fat hanging just below the belly."
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/comment/45422999#Comment_45422999
You really are an example of someone who needs to learn rather than teach!
Your knowledge of how bodies actually work is badly flawed and seems based on total woo - Fung perhaps?
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@SayNoToCakes You've gotten some really good advice here. Best ever.
We all have to know when to hold 'em and know when to fold 'em. We can be down a little or down alot. If we can't spot the fish at the poker table then it's usually us. When you're playing high stakes poker with seasoned players they'll say...'Hey Joe, bring us another live one to the table' because they'll buffalo themselves right out the game. It's a learning curve and we all have to start somewhere.3 -
mariomicro wrote: »
Not if you have pre-diabetes and/or insulin resistance, which is quite common in obese people.Insulin is produced according to the natural function of the body to help nutrients get where they need to go.
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/diet/how-low-carb-diets-work.htmlInsulin is the key player. Too high levels of insulin in the body leads to insulin resistance and then prediabetes followed by type 2 diabetes.
The way to improve prediabetes and type 2 diabetes is to reduce insulin resistance and this can be achieved by reducing carbohydrate (and protein if you have a high protein diet). Reducing carb intake reduces the amount of insulin circulating in the body and this works to reduce insulin resistance.
The reason many people with type 2 diabetes are overweight is because they are producing very high levels of insulin and a key role of insulin is to store body fat.
You’ll see that insulin is therefore responsible for both weight gain and insulin resistance.
Even for someone who is pre-diabetic or insulin-resistant, it is not the perfectly natural production of insulin in response to an increase in blood sugar that is the problem. The problem is that the cells are not responding properly to the insulin.6 -
Excess carbs not used for energy are the enemy. Depends on how much you are burning everyday through activity.1
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mariomicro wrote: »Donuts and chips aren't really "carbs." They are foods that are about half carbs and half fat.
Foods that are mostly just carbs would include most fruit and a plain potato or plain sweet potato, among other things.
For the purpose of avoiding an insulin spike, it is largely irrelevant whether some foods contain only carbs or both carbs and fat. Dietary carbohydrates will convert immediately into glucose and that will trigger an insulin response, which will eventually trigger fat storage, whether taken with dietary fat or not.
Not exactly. The fact of the matter is, carbohydrates rarely convert to body fat. The studies on de novo lipogenesis show it's like 3%. What tends to happen is carbs inhibits lipolysis and blunts fat oxidation. So the fats you consume along with your carbs and/or proteins will then store more readily.
And you also talking like insulin is going thru the roof or something. There is a small to moderate increase when you consume carbs and then once the nutrients get in your cells, it will go back down. So you will have periods where lipolysis will be suppressed, but it's nothing worry about. The key to fat loss is energy balance to lipolysis > lipogenesis.
There is even another thing to consider. From an evolutionary standpoint, your body can store fat no matter how many or how little carbs you eat. High amounts of dietary fat cause your body to release enzymes such as Acylation Stimulating Protein which will inhibit Hormone Sensitive Lipase (HSL). HSL is your fat burning hormone. When you eat carbs, your pancreas does release insulin which releases the enzyme lipoprotein lipase (LPL) which also inhibits HSL. When you eat both carbs + fat, glucose-dependent insulintrophic peptide inhibits HSL. Meaning, it doesn't matter if you have high or low insulin, your body can store fat.12 -
PaulFrancis7878 wrote: »Excess carbs not used for energy are the enemy. Depends on how much you are burning everyday through activity.
No - excess CALORIES not used for energy are the enemy - (if you are trying to lose weight.)
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paperpudding wrote: »PaulFrancis7878 wrote: »Excess carbs not used for energy are the enemy. Depends on how much you are burning everyday through activity.
No - excess CALORIES not used for energy are the enemy - (if you are trying to lose weight.)
Carbs are calories.1 -
yes of course they are - so are all macros.
It isnt a unique thing to carbs.
so enemy is excess calories from any macro source - and any combined macro source since most foods are not solely one macro.8 -
And yet, the fact that you never want to discuss is that there can be no NET fat gain (insulin spikes or not) as long as the person is eating in a deficit. The body is constantly storing and breaking down fat throughout the day regardless of the mix of food that the person is eating.
It is hard to be "eating in a deficit" if you are constantly binging on high carb, high fat foods.
You're also not eating in a deficit if you're constantly binging on high protein food, or high fat food. So what? The solution is not to binge. Hence having an appropriate deficit and eating the kind of food that works for the individual person. There's no one size fits all.4 -
Depends on you health if you’ve diabeties or pcos plus lots are carb sensitive - if I eat an over loads carbs I gain lots water weight and it then takes weeks to lose all of it1
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And yet, the fact that you never want to discuss is that there can be no NET fat gain (insulin spikes or not) as long as the person is eating in a deficit. The body is constantly storing and breaking down fat throughout the day regardless of the mix of food that the person is eating.
It is hard to be "eating in a deficit" if you are constantly binging on high carb, high fat foods.
You're also not eating in a deficit if you're constantly binging on high protein food, or high fat food. So what? The solution is not to binge. Hence having an appropriate deficit and eating the kind of food that works for the individual person. There's no one size fits all.
High protein food doesn't trigger a binge. The point is, for some people, like me, some foods are trigger foods. I thought those were high carb foods, I stand corrected, they are high-carb high-fat foods. Regardless, they are trigger foods and trigger foods need to be avoided if I stand a chance to lose weight. They are the enemy. Even when I indulge in a healthy portion, it never ends well.0 -
And yet, the fact that you never want to discuss is that there can be no NET fat gain (insulin spikes or not) as long as the person is eating in a deficit. The body is constantly storing and breaking down fat throughout the day regardless of the mix of food that the person is eating.
It is hard to be "eating in a deficit" if you are constantly binging on high carb, high fat foods.
You're also not eating in a deficit if you're constantly binging on high protein food, or high fat food. So what? The solution is not to binge. Hence having an appropriate deficit and eating the kind of food that works for the individual person. There's no one size fits all.
High protein food doesn't trigger a binge. The point is, for some people, like me, some foods are trigger foods. I thought those were high carb foods, I stand corrected, they are high-carb high-fat foods. Regardless, they are trigger foods and trigger foods need to be avoided if I stand a chance to lose weight. They are the enemy. Even when I indulge in a healthy portion, it never ends well.
But this is your experience. You can't extrapolate your experience to everyone here and tell them this is what they need to do.8 -
That is not the solution, that is the problem. The solution is to identify the reason behind binge eating and address that. And that is unique for each individual. I can only offer my experience and hope it helps someone who is experiencing something similar.The solution is not to binge.
I agree.There's no one size fits all.0 -
They're the enemy of crappy performance, looking depleted and cravings. (See what I did there?) 😂4
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PaulFrancis7878 wrote: »Excess carbs not used for energy are the enemy. Depends on how much you are burning everyday through activity.
The issue isn't that they're carbohydrates, the issue is that they're calories you're not using.1 -
Thank you everyone.
I've had some really great answers here and I've learnt a lot. I'm not going to cut out carbs but to make sure that I eat the right kind of carbs and in deficit.
I didn't mean to cause a debate of any kind, so I'm sorry for that. I'm doing well so far, very early days but I'm happy that I can still eat my pasta and slim down ☺16 -
And yet, the fact that you never want to discuss is that there can be no NET fat gain (insulin spikes or not) as long as the person is eating in a deficit. The body is constantly storing and breaking down fat throughout the day regardless of the mix of food that the person is eating.
It is hard to be "eating in a deficit" if you are constantly binging on high carb, high fat foods.
You're also not eating in a deficit if you're constantly binging on high protein food, or high fat food. So what? The solution is not to binge. Hence having an appropriate deficit and eating the kind of food that works for the individual person. There's no one size fits all.
High protein food doesn't trigger a binge. The point is, for some people, like me, some foods are trigger foods. I thought those were high carb foods, I stand corrected, they are high-carb high-fat foods. Regardless, they are trigger foods and trigger foods need to be avoided if I stand a chance to lose weight. They are the enemy. Even when I indulge in a healthy portion, it never ends well.
FOR YOU. It doesn't trigger a binge for you. That doesn't mean that there aren't people out there who are triggered by high protein foods or high fat foods. A trigger food is going to be very individual.
What does any of this have to do with OP, who hasn't shared anything about having BED or even disordered eating?
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IronIsMyTherapy wrote: »They're the enemy of crappy performance, looking depleted and cravings. (See what I did there?) 😂
Someone disagrees with you
(wasn't me) 1 -
SayNoToCakes wrote: »Thank you everyone.
I've had some really great answers here and I've learnt a lot. I'm not going to cut out carbs but to make sure that I eat the right kind of carbs and in deficit.
I didn't mean to cause a debate of any kind, so I'm sorry for that. I'm doing well so far, very early days but I'm happy that I can still eat my pasta and slim down ☺
Stick around! There's a lot of good info here. There's also a lot of endless discussions, but that's part of the entertainment Good luck! You can do this 
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janejellyroll wrote: »And yet, the fact that you never want to discuss is that there can be no NET fat gain (insulin spikes or not) as long as the person is eating in a deficit. The body is constantly storing and breaking down fat throughout the day regardless of the mix of food that the person is eating.
It is hard to be "eating in a deficit" if you are constantly binging on high carb, high fat foods.
You're also not eating in a deficit if you're constantly binging on high protein food, or high fat food. So what? The solution is not to binge. Hence having an appropriate deficit and eating the kind of food that works for the individual person. There's no one size fits all.
High protein food doesn't trigger a binge. The point is, for some people, like me, some foods are trigger foods. I thought those were high carb foods, I stand corrected, they are high-carb high-fat foods. Regardless, they are trigger foods and trigger foods need to be avoided if I stand a chance to lose weight. They are the enemy. Even when I indulge in a healthy portion, it never ends well.
FOR YOU. It doesn't trigger a binge for you. That doesn't mean that there aren't people out there who are triggered by high protein foods or high fat foods. A trigger food is going to be very individual.
What does any of this have to do with OP, who hasn't shared anything about having BED or even disordered eating?
Exactly. I know I tend to defend cars as I'm a carb girl (currently eating a dinner which is over 50% carbs, and is utterly delicious. But it keeps me very full and happy. If I had a big chunk of meat I'd not feel so happy. Something very high in fat would trigger a binge because I'd still be hungry. But yeah, each their own.1 -
SayNoToCakes wrote: »Thank you everyone.
I've had some really great answers here and I've learnt a lot. I'm not going to cut out carbs but to make sure that I eat the right kind of carbs and in deficit.
I didn't mean to cause a debate of any kind, so I'm sorry for that. I'm doing well so far, very early days but I'm happy that I can still eat my pasta and slim down ☺
You didn't, so don't you worry about that. Everything about food is simple and complex at the same time.
We could talk about it until the cows come home and go back out again. The conversation will never end. If it did, we'd all go home and it would be Goodbye Kitty and that's all she wrote.
We are bent on survival. I would eat pine cones, dirt and old tennis shoes if I had to. I can throw a meal together at the local gas station. Our body is the best friend we'll ever have in this life and food is our fuel. We might as well enjoy the ride but some of us have to get off the merry-go-round at one time or another. I did.1 -
mariomicro wrote: »
OP said nothing about IR, and did not say she was obese, even.
Perhaps not jumping to conclusions and sticking to the topic of the actual thread would be helpful!
Also, lots of people with T2D and IR lose weight and go into remission without low carbing. One can only gain weight in a calorie surplus (and in that situation fat is more easily stored as fat than carbs are, not that it matters), and in a calorie deficit everyone loses fat. Period.6 -
SayNoToCakes wrote: »Thank you everyone.
I've had some really great answers here and I've learnt a lot. I'm not going to cut out carbs but to make sure that I eat the right kind of carbs and in deficit.
I didn't mean to cause a debate of any kind, so I'm sorry for that. I'm doing well so far, very early days but I'm happy that I can still eat my pasta and slim down ☺
Excellent! (And the debate is not a bad thing IMO, but also totally not your fault, don't be sorry.) Glad you are doing well and still able to eat your pasta too.2 -
Correct...mariomicro wrote: »To say the carbs are the enemy is too simplistic.
Does not matter...mariomicro wrote: »Do you need to lose weight or just fat?
Does not matter...mariomicro wrote: »Do you also do intermittent fasting?
Perfectly acceptable reason to do keto...mariomicro wrote: »Keto helped me stick to my goals
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IronIsMyTherapy wrote: »They're the enemy of crappy performance, looking depleted and cravings. (See what I did there?) 😂
Someone disagrees with you (wasn't me)
I'm sure lots of people do and that's ok. It is, and was meant to be, only my opinion (and a dash of humor) with regards to my own experience.2 -
@SayNoToCakes Don't you just love it. I do. Debates and woos, disagrees and you. It makes this place tick. We all take a lickin' and keep on tickin'. So long now.1
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And yet, the fact that you never want to discuss is that there can be no NET fat gain (insulin spikes or not) as long as the person is eating in a deficit. The body is constantly storing and breaking down fat throughout the day regardless of the mix of food that the person is eating.
It is hard to be "eating in a deficit" if you are constantly binging on high carb, high fat foods.
100% false actually. You can eat in a deficit regardless of how many of a certain macro you eat. You can even “binge” and stay within your calorie goal overall for the week if you saved calories from previous days.1
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