Saggy skin & partner support questions from a newbie

hipari wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

hipari wrote: »

One more thing - you mention struggling with portion sizes, so you might benefit from looking into the volume eaters thread somewhere in these forums (can’t find the link right now, but surely the search would find it). Basically people like you and me who struggle with portion sizes often benefit from eating things that are high in volume but low in calories to fill us up, so we can have smaller portions of the oh-so-yummy carb and main dishes but still feel satisfied. Usual tricks include drinking lots of water and a full glass before a meal, having large side salads or appetizer salads, and bulking dishes with vegetables so there are less calories per same portion sizes.

This one?

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10563959/volume-eaters-thread

Yep!

With apologies to OP for the digression: I suggested that MFP consider that thread for a stickie, since I've seen several people suggest it to others, but not have the link handy. If you agree (optional!), you might want to second that suggestion here:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10260479/nominate-posts-for-announcement-status-stickies#latest

stortina wrote: »

Hey @AnnPT77 and @hipari

I have had a look at the post you recommended and it looks like there are lots of really motivated people sharing recipes to eat large portions of veg and protein, including all sorts of fancy additives to fill themselves up. However, with respect, that's not what I'm looking for.

One of my goals at the moment is to break the habit of eating too much food in one sitting. Eating a huge bowl of veggie soup may be healthy and low calorie, however if you get used to eating that much food in one go, how do you then exercise control when it is a bowl of pasta put in front of you instead?

I need to learn to stop eating when I’m full, even if there’s still food on my plate. It doesn’t matter that it might be a bit wasteful to leave the food, it doesn’t HAVE to be eaten, it’s OK to leave some behind (this is a huge road block for me from my upbringing).

I want my stomach to get used to eating smaller, more frequent, portions. So that I'm comfortable and not hungry, so that I don't need to make a pig of myself when I eat in front of other people. I never want to be that person again.

For clarity, I'm not *recommending* that post, in the sense of it being something everyone ought to do. I was reading the thread, saw that @hipari mentioned the link, and I knew where it was, that's all.

What I *do* recommend, is that each person figure out what helps them feel full, sated. That can be quite individual. For some, more protein helps, for others more fats, sometimes specific foods are important for individuals (oatmeal or whole baked potatoes are common ones, but not universal), sometimes meal/snack timing and relative size of each will be important, reducing carbs helps some people, increasing whole foods helps some people, and - yes - some people find food volume to be important to them to feel full.

It's normal to feel hungry for the first couple of weeks on reduced calories, and realistically a few people never conquer that and need to find a way to cope with feeling it long term. Many people, though, do adapt, in part by figuring out how to "spend" calories in ways that result in less hunger or cravings. If a person can figure out how to tame hunger and cravings in their personal case, that's really useful and powerful, helps a person reach success. It's a tool that makes weight loss (and maintenance) easier and more achievable.

I won't tell you exactly how to eat to feel fuller, because I literally don't know: It's that individual, IMO. I will advise you to try to figure it out. It can even change over time, so it helps to keep paying attention. (I'm in year 5+ of maintaining a healthy weight, and I don't eat the exact things I did in year 1.)

The actual physical size or volume of the food may matter to some people, but I fear that thread may've convinced you there's something pathologically weird about it, or that that "stomach stretched out, so hungry" thing is a big factor. (I believe it's not: Hunger is about habits, expectations, and hormones, primarily, IMU.)

It's fine if you want to eat smaller, more frequent portions, and I sincerely hope that will work out great for you in satiation terms. But I truly don't believe that if people see you eat a big bowl of veggie soup, or a large salad, they're going to think you're "eating like a pig". It's healthy to eat plenty of veggies, among other reasons. Frankly, I'd encourage you to think more flexibly about food and eating, and not fall into those stereotypes, for your own sake and that of others.

Also, personally I am someone who does find volume part of satiation, both filling and *health promoting* (in the form of generous veggie servings, in my case, not "protein fluff" type concoctions). Nonetheless, I have no difficult in limiting my eating when faced with "a bowl of pasta". I can limit it if I choose to (and if the rest of my eating that day has left me feeling pretty sated, it's dead easy to do that). I can also recognize that if I *choose* to eat more of it, there's not some uncontrollable appetite monster being released, and that one indulgent meal is a drop in the ocean of my overall way of eating. (If it were just a big bowl of mostly pasta, I'd probably leave a lot of it: Not tasty or satisfying enough to spend calories on. If a friend made it, I'd eat some to be polite. In a restaurant, I wouldn't have ordered it. At home, when I make pasta - which I do fairly often - I prefer to use higher-protein types of pasta, and include it in a dish with plenty of delicious, colorful veggies. That's much more tasty and satisfying to me, and coincidentally also more nutritious and healthful.)

I hear what you're saying about wanting to lose some past misperceptions and emotions around food, such as the idea that every bit of food presented must be eaten, as if it's less wasteful to store it as unnecessary/unhealthful body fat rather than discarding it or saving it for a later meal. The idea that large portions of low calorie, healthy foods equate to "eating like a pig" is IMO also a misperception (but that doesn't mean I think you need to eat that way, either). So is the idea that sometimes or often eating that way will inherently mean a person will always crave giant portions of (whatever) at every meal.

How you should eat is going to come down to what's practical and tasty to you, as well as calorie appropriate. For best odds of success at both weight management and health, I'd encourage you to figure out what combinations/timings make it easy and practical for you, as an individual, to feel full and happy most of the time, while getting good overall nutrition within appropriate calories.

Best wishes!

@AnnPT77 and @janejellyroll are right, only you can know what works best for you. I just want to add that even if cutting portion sizes and learning portion control is a long term goal for you, you might still benefit from some of those volume eating strategies as a temporary solution to help keep calories lower *while* you learn portion control.

Based on personal experience, doing both simultaneously was very helpful when cutting carb portions. My husband and I were eating huge portions of pasta and rice, and we started replacing some of that with vegetables while reducing the portion size. After a while we no longer needed the extra veggies on the side to feel satiated, but they helped us cut calories while getting used to less.

stortina wrote: »

Thanks everyone, sorry if my comment about the volume eaters thread was snarky, I didn't mean any offence. I suppose I was just looking at it from the POV that many people such as myself, starting out in this scary new world of dieting, would call themselves 'volume eaters'. And I don't see how - on the surface - making the thread into a 'sticky', for newbies to read perhaps without any context (like I would have), would necessarily encourage over-eaters to make healthy alternate choices or change bad habits.

<shrug> that's just my POV. And it's not my place to say that the thread would or wouldn't be helpful for certain people in certain contexts. I just really want to stop being an over-eater, which I acknowledge is different to "volume eating" as a diet trend.

I suppose I have been thinking about everything in absolutes -- it's sometimes hard to think outside the box when you've been living in the box for so long.

My mum has always criticised my father and I for being overweight, whilst similtaneously maintaining that not eating everything I was given was wasteful (there are starving children in Africa, you know!). Then she would serve (sometimes) fattening, (often) large meals! My mum and sister always ate like sparrows, and my father and I were "pigs" because we ate so much more. It seems a bit hypocritical of her when I put it like that, but she wasn't being cruel, just trying to teach me self control. I suppose she just didn't want me to have to go through what I'm going through now.

I also wouldn't order pasta if I went out, but am frequently served it at my mother's house, so it's my go-to mental image of 'bad food'. She knows I love it, so she laboriously makes big platters of cheesy lasagne or creamy bechamel, and puts huge portions in front of me because that's what I used to eat. I want to be able to say, "thanks Mum, but I'm full now", and leave half the bowl behind, without feeling like I HAVE to eat the whole thing.

The other night I went out for dumplings with a close friend who loves over-eating. We have been to this restaurant many times before and each time we usually order - what feels like - one of everything. I just couldn't help myself. She kept suggesting, "oh let's get this too" and I kept saying yes. I probably ate about 3/4 of what I'd normally have eaten before my conscience kicked in. I started to panic about the amount of calories I'd just eaten, so I stopped and said I was full. I was more than satisfied, but definitely didn't eat to stomach-aching, close-to-bursting point like I would have done in the past.

I don't think I'll be able to go back to that restaurant, or even out to dinner alone with that friend, until I'm able to change my headspace around this.

Anyway, as with every big life change, there is a lot of emotional baggage that is dredged up, and this is mine... I need to keep remembering this entire situation is dynamic, keep being open to new ideas, and change my actions, goals and standards as I learn more about weight loss and my own body.

Definitely am not personally interested in "protein fluff" or any of the other unusual additives suggested in the thread. I've also found that most of the low calorie sauces, toppings, flavourings etc. suggested aren't readily available near me. 100+ pages of thread is a lot to sift through, and this was the predominant theme of the conversation over the first 10 pages or so.

I have been having a lot of veggies, either steamed with protein on the side or in salads. For example, last night we had a tofu stir fry with heaps of veg and no rice. Larger portions of veg have been my substitute for mashed potato, rice, or bread which were side dishes in the past. So yes, I can definitely see how increasing servings of vegetables makes a filling meal.

Thanks again everyone for your helpful comments. I am enjoying this chat

I have never had protein fluff and I don't buy low calorie products. No judgement towards those who enjoy them, but plenty of people using volume eating strategies are doing things like eating lots of vegetables and making soup frequently.

Again, no reason for you to do it if you're not interested. I just wanted to clarify that there are lots of ways to practice it. Good luck! It sounds like you're already figuring out some solid strategies for your meals.