cardio- thoughts?

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  • Debbe2
    Debbe2 Posts: 2,071 Member
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    Ok so I have heard from multiple people that doing any cardio over 30 mins is basically a waste. They say that your body stops resisting after 30 mins. Anyone have any thoughts supporting this or against this? I would appreciat as much feedback as I can get. I mean... who wants to do more cardio than is necessary?! :bigsmile:


    Never heard this before. I know MY HEART is pumping hard for the duration of the exercise and MY MUSCLES are working to complete it :) Intellectually I don't understand this claim. You can get great cardio benefit in 20 minute workouts... is that what you are referring to?
  • Lesa_Sass
    Lesa_Sass Posts: 2,213 Member
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    Sorry, I did not mean to offend you, but if you are open to keeping it in mind, that is great. I also did not mean it as probably as harsh as you took it, after all, we make up our own tone when reading messages on forums. :)

    Some fat is never going to go away. This is why they invented smart lipo, you may want to check into it. I have body fat that will not go away unless I get to 89 lbs, and I am not willing to do that.

    Once again, I am sorry I offended you, by all means, I come across on here way harsher than what I really intend to.
  • richmgio
    richmgio Posts: 3 Member
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    I read from Natural Hormonal Enhancement by Rob Faigin that the 30-45min workout theory has to do with the release of growth hormone, testosterone, and cortisol. All of which increase during exercise. At the 30-45 min mark, growth hormone and testosterone begin to decline while cortisol continues to rise. Cortisol is the "stress" hormone and excessive levels of it will diminish gains from your exercise, cosidering the lengthy workout "a waste".

    Personally, I do follow this and I have been getting better results at the gym versus my old 60-90 minute workouts. Everyone is different and has different preferences so do what you feel is working for you.
  • AshleyNicoleRoutson
    AshleyNicoleRoutson Posts: 25
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    As your gym partner I have seen you make really great progress so far! I am glad you have gotten out of your plateau. But you just recently changed your diet to consuming healthier options, reduced some of your cheating, and reduced how much your drinking. I think in 3 weeks you will start to see the cutting, just give it time! As far as lowering your calories I think you should do the opposite. Since we are weight training and doing HIIT. I have actually read many things from girls in a similar situation as you that upped their calories after they werent seeing the results they wanted and they actually ended up loosing more weight by eating more. You have been consuming about the same amount of calories (which has always been under 1640- your estimated daily intake) for quite some time now. Your metabolism WILL start to adjust to that and that is what causes the plateaus. My recommendation is stick with the lower carbs (rotating with 1-2 high carb days a week for the next 3 weeks) and UP your calories! As far as the cardio Just stick with the HIIT, switching up the intervals, try the Super 8's, continue with the stair stepper and incline walking on the treadmill. Also add in Plyo's. Too much cardio when you are trying to build muscle and loose body fat can be a bad thing, so dont over do it! No more than 60 mins a day (especially since you are doing the circuit training right now) You have to factor that in as cardio as well!
  • angied80
    angied80 Posts: 749
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    As your gym partner I have seen you make really great progress so far! I am glad you have gotten out of your plateau. But you just recently changed your diet to consuming healthier options, reduced some of your cheating, and reduced how much your drinking. I think in 3 weeks you will start to see the cutting, just give it time! As far as lowering your calories I think you should do the opposite. Since we are weight training and doing HIIT. I have actually read many things from girls in a similar situation as you that upped their calories after they werent seeing the results they wanted and they actually ended up loosing more weight by eating more. You have been consuming about the same amount of calories (which has always been under 1640- your estimated daily intake) for quite some time now. Your metabolism WILL start to adjust to that and that is what causes the plateaus. My recommendation is stick with the lower carbs (rotating with 1-2 high carb days a week for the next 3 weeks) and UP your calories! As far as the cardio Just stick with the HIIT, switching up the intervals, try the Super 8's, continue with the stair stepper and incline walking on the treadmill. Also add in Plyo's. Too much cardio when you are trying to build muscle and loose body fat can be a bad thing, so dont over do it! No more than 60 mins a day (especially since you are doing the circuit training right now) You have to factor that in as cardio as well!


    Thats where I run into problem with the calories. If I up them then, up goes my carbs. I can't seem to find a happy medium with keeping them down. When I do up my calories, I am way to full. I feel miserable. I tried that for awhile and it just didnt seem to work for me. Although I may not have given it enough time for my body to adjust but I wasnt feeling good.
  • AshleyNicoleRoutson
    AshleyNicoleRoutson Posts: 25
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    Yah the carbs are going to be hard to keep low, just have to find more protein options that you like to fill up your calories, like eating more of your meat at dinner and lunch, that ups your protein and your calories, but Im afraid you are undereating and have been for too long that your metabolism has adjusted to being starved, I remember right before I left for Florida you were still super tired during the workouts, just meaning your not eating enough calories. I know its going to take awhile to adjust to upping your calories because you feel stuffed but thats because your so used to not eating enough, you just have to train your body, its all mental. I think upping your calories for a bit will help, atleast shock your metabolism
  • angied80
    angied80 Posts: 749
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    Yah the carbs are going to be hard to keep low, just have to find more protein options that you like to fill up your calories, like eating more of your meat at dinner and lunch, that ups your protein and your calories, but Im afraid you are undereating and have been for too long that your metabolism has adjusted to being starved, I remember right before I left for Florida you were still super tired during the workouts, just meaning your not eating enough calories. I know its going to take awhile to adjust to upping your calories because you feel stuffed but thats because your so used to not eating enough, you just have to train your body, its all mental. I think upping your calories for a bit will help, atleast shock your metabolism

    Then is there a thing as too much protein? Rule of thumb from what I have looked up and heard is 1 gram for each 1lb, which should put me at 144 grams of protein. Which I already exceed on most days.
  • AshleyNicoleRoutson
    AshleyNicoleRoutson Posts: 25
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    Yah theres such thing as too much as everything really. But unless your willing to give up some of the stuff your eating now to hit your numbers, like switching out some of your foods , and I know you probably wont because you like your meals then I suggest upping your protein a little more instead of your carbs to get the extra calories in for the day, your carbs will go up a little but keeping them lower than the protein will help with the fat lossb (especially since most of your carbs are bread and fruit)
  • angied80
    angied80 Posts: 749
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    Yah theres such thing as too much as everything really. But unless your willing to give up some of the stuff your eating now to hit your numbers, like switching out some of your foods , and I know you probably wont because you like your meals then I suggest upping your protein a little more instead of your carbs to get the extra calories in for the day, your carbs will go up a little but keeping them lower than the protein will help with the fat lossb (especially since most of your carbs are bread and fruit)


    Ill give it a go but if I start getting fat, you have to do 100 burpees in a row. Without a water break. :happy:
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Ill give it a go but if I start getting fat, you have to do 100 burpees in a row. Without a water break. :happy:

    Wow, you are at a lot of protein already. Not too much though.

    Usually it's 1g per lb of lean body mass, not just weight. So you already are hitting that, excellent.

    With that level of activity, it may indeed be the cal's in general are too low.

    Since you gave your BF%, age, weight, I looked at your BMR estimate that uses BF% instead of height.
    http://www.exrx.net/Calculators/CalRequire.html

    Says 1529.

    So you are well above that. So that leaves the calculation of maintenance calories potentially being off, depending on how active your body is outside of the specific workouts. So that site allows you to estimate that too.

    And then your exercise burn calories could be off also. You could be eating back too much, or not eating back enough. In which case your exercise burn could be pushing your deficit below your BMR, causing metabolism to slow down to match. Not a good thing.
  • Dave198lbs
    Dave198lbs Posts: 8,810 Member
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    As your gym partner I have seen you make really great progress so far! I am glad you have gotten out of your plateau. But you just recently changed your diet to consuming healthier options, reduced some of your cheating, and reduced how much your drinking. I think in 3 weeks you will start to see the cutting, just give it time! As far as lowering your calories I think you should do the opposite. Since we are weight training and doing HIIT. I have actually read many things from girls in a similar situation as you that upped their calories after they werent seeing the results they wanted and they actually ended up loosing more weight by eating more. You have been consuming about the same amount of calories (which has always been under 1640- your estimated daily intake) for quite some time now. Your metabolism WILL start to adjust to that and that is what causes the plateaus. My recommendation is stick with the lower carbs (rotating with 1-2 high carb days a week for the next 3 weeks) and UP your calories! As far as the cardio Just stick with the HIIT, switching up the intervals, try the Super 8's, continue with the stair stepper and incline walking on the treadmill. Also add in Plyo's. Too much cardio when you are trying to build muscle and loose body fat can be a bad thing, so dont over do it! No more than 60 mins a day (especially since you are doing the circuit training right now) You have to factor that in as cardio as well!


    Thats where I run into problem with the calories. If I up them then, up goes my carbs. I can't seem to find a happy medium with keeping them down. When I do up my calories, I am way to full. I feel miserable. I tried that for awhile and it just didnt seem to work for me. Although I may not have given it enough time for my body to adjust but I wasnt feeling good.

    have you discovered the wonderful world of cheese? my favorite is cave aged gruyere...OMG...awesome...and good fat and protein....so many cheeses out there...skip the low or no fat american stuff...love cheese!
  • angied80
    angied80 Posts: 749
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    Ill give it a go but if I start getting fat, you have to do 100 burpees in a row. Without a water break. :happy:

    Wow, you are at a lot of protein already. Not too much though.

    Usually it's 1g per lb of lean body mass, not just weight. So you already are hitting that, excellent.

    With that level of activity, it may indeed be the cal's in general are too low.

    Since you gave your BF%, age, weight, I looked at your BMR estimate that uses BF% instead of height.
    http://www.exrx.net/Calculators/CalRequire.html

    Says 1529.

    So you are well above that. So that leaves the calculation of maintenance calories potentially being off, depending on how active your body is outside of the specific workouts. So that site allows you to estimate that too.

    And then your exercise burn calories could be off also. You could be eating back too much, or not eating back enough. In which case your exercise burn could be pushing your deficit below your BMR, causing metabolism to slow down to match. Not a good thing.

    Thanks. Ill have to check ths out! I appreciate everyones help!
  • nick1109
    nick1109 Posts: 174 Member
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    Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

    Agree with this. Training for a specific sport that requires endurance you obviously need to train more than 30 mins, although some short sharp interval sessions will help too. For the purpose of fat loss and retaining muscle HIIT under 30 mins and a good diet is the key with a well balanced structured weight training routine at the right intensity
  • doughnutwretch
    doughnutwretch Posts: 498 Member
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    Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

    Oh and I am in marathon training and have actually gotten stronger because I always lift weights before I run, and I have upped my protein intake to prevent muscle loss. I've definitely burned fat without losing muscle in recent weeks.

    This. Your body is still in motion and still burning calories, but unless you are training for something or wanting to set a personal goal, 20-30 minutes is adequate.

    Lifting before cardio is the best option if you're going to combine because lifting requires the use of your glycogen stores. If you do it the other way around, you'll see strength depletion. I typically do 20-25 minutes of HIIT on the treadmill after lifting or 30-60 minutes of cardio on non-lifting days. 60 minutes isn't usually intentional. I start playing basketball or volleyball and lose track of time. My personal preference.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    Funny, I increased my strength levels by 80%--while losing 60lbs in five months and gaining 5-8lbs of muscle --and I have never, ever lifted weights before doing cardio. In fact I have hit PBs for bench press and squat after doing "performance" AT cardio workouts lasting 45-60 min. And I never ate more than 20% of my total calories from protein, either.

    Wonder what I could have done if I hadn't been so "depleted"?
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Lifting before cardio is the best option if you're going to combine because lifting requires the use of your glycogen stores. If you do it the other way around, you'll see strength depletion.

    You would have to do a whole lot of cardio to deplete the glycogen stores enough to effect weight lifting, like 2 hrs or more at decent pace.
    That is the "wall" for untrained marathoners, where the glucose has gotten low enough that muscle breakdown occurs to make more glucose so fat can still be burned.

    Besides, the energy for weight lifting is the ATP in the muscle cells, and that is replenished after you stop and some seconds to pause.

    If you did a lot of HIIT (which is not cardio) first, then I could see a problem, because you will just be tired from stressing the muscles the same way weight would.
  • Dave198lbs
    Dave198lbs Posts: 8,810 Member
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  • nick1109
    nick1109 Posts: 174 Member
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    If you did a lot of HIIT (which is not cardio) first, then I could see a problem, because you will just be tired from stressing the muscles the same way weight would.


    How is HIIT not cardio? The term cardio in the exercise world is defined as an exercise that elevates the heart rate. If HIIT is done as its suppose to be it should be done at 'high intensity' which would normally see the heart rate well over 160bpm in most cases
  • CalJur
    CalJur Posts: 627 Member
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    In the words of Cuba Gooding Jr. "show me the money." What actual study or empirical data is this based upon? This he say/she say/they say is not helpful. Not the first time such things are said without any real support whatsoever.
  • REDGIA
    REDGIA Posts: 2 Member
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    I have been with my trainer who is now my friend and she looks amazing. She teaches 60 min cardio kickboxing, 60 mins of strength training classes, and so on. We have become quite close over the past few months and she has told me u need a min of 30 cardio at least every other day. You are not supposed to train the same muscle group 2 days in a row. That is because u break down the muscle when you train and it takes at least 24 hrs for it to rebuild to a stronger leaner muscle. I have been overtraining, so I have actually spent less time working out and notice that my body is responding better when I do. Im starting to lose more inches! Thought that the more you did the better, but not always. You have to find your balance. When Im not taking her classes I try to do at least 5 miles on the bike everyday. I do it to keep stress levels down

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