Paleo -- ur doin it wrong.

I'm really getting confused about this Paleo thing... it sounds like the Eat Clean diet...

So... what's the difference? Aren't they just the same thing with different names?

I'm a big advocate of eating clean~ even though I don't follow it 100%. It just makes sense to eat foods that have undergone as little processing as possible.

But even our veggies and fruits aren't 100% clean these days. They've undergone all kinds of genetic altering, not to mention the chemicals they get sprayed with. I don't think there's such a thing as a perfect diet these days but I'd wager those genetically altered veggies are better then that bag of chips I just ate...

There isn't any diff. But to he public, "just eat right stupid" isn't nearly as marketable as "so easy a caveman can do it!"

Everything's good when you put sauce on it...

I lol'd.

BUT: it's just as plausible (and as far as I know there's about as much research to support the idea) that our ancestors evolved to eat *flexibly*. That is, the people who could eat whatever was available, when it was available, and survive/procreate, were the most successful. Yes, meat and plants were what we ate most often. But that doesn't mean that's what we are evolved/designed to eat, and it doesn't mean that's the only thing we *should* eat.

I personally think that while humans can consume just about anything and live, procreate, etc. the evolution of our species cannot be ignored. You really can't replace millions of years of evolution on a hunter gatherer diet with the changes that have been made in the last 10,000 or so.

Yes, humans can live off of just about anything, and that is a testament more to the flexibility and durability of the human body more than showing that relatively modern ways of eating are better for us. We survive in spite of the junk we shovel in our faces these days. Generally nobody denys that eating more veggies, fruits, meat and nuts is bad for you, until you slap a label on it like "Paleo" or "Low Carb/Atkins", then suddenly peoples' hair catches on fire.

I'd say if the caveman at trash like Doritos and white rice all the time, I'd probably be pretty healty. Given they exercised their *kitten* off every day, trying to find food and not be eaten themselves.

It's really got nothing to do with the types of food, it's all about calories. Paleo hunter-gatherers ate an average of about 3000 calories a day, and were constantly walking and moving, lifting, hunting, and active. Modern humans eat ALMOST 3000 calories a day on average (I think it's like 2600 or somewhere around there,) while sitting on the couch, or sitting at a desk most of the day.

It's really not that hard to figure out what caused the decline in health, and rise in obesity. People are generally eating WAY TOO MUCH food for the activity levels.

After all, for every person that has a wheat intolerance, there is also a person that has a meat intolerance. Blaming one macronutrient is as farcical and short sighted as it was 30 years ago, when fat was the evil demon making everyone fat and unhealthy.

Meat intolerance or meat aversion? I've never heard of anyone that cannot consume meat, but know plenty personally that have serious health issues, and 2 that have almost died (quite literally, not being flowery for forum posting shock value) due to consumption of wheat.

Meat intolerance or meat aversion? I've never heard of anyone that cannot consume meat, but know plenty personally that have serious health issues, and 2 that have almost died (quite literally, not being flowery for forum posting shock value) due to consumption of wheat.

Thousands (probably millions) of people have meat intolerances. Do you honestly think every single vegan or vegetarian is doing it for ethical reasons, and not for health reasons?

People can be just as allergic to meat as any other food source.

Again, I've never actually heard of such as issue nor seen anything on actual meat/protein alleries. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but there seems to be a much higher likelyhood that someone would be allergic to grains or have other issues such as imflammation related to grains. I'd love to see some references to said meat intolerances, as I'm actually interested in learning more.

And while you generally come into these types of threads with a very combative tone, I'll answer your (likely rhetorical) question. I personally believe that most vegetarians and vegans eat the way they do because they have been told that it's better for their health, have ethical issues killing animals to eat them, been lured by a member of the opposite sex, or just like to feel superior and tell others how barbaric it is to kill for food. While many people that eat clean vegetarian diets do feel better, I think that's just as attributable to cutting out junk than not eating meat.

Do anti low carbers also go into the vegan/vegetarian threads and talk about "You're doing it wrong, it's all about calories in vs. calories out!" or "You know you shouldn't cut out food groups"? I've yet to see that happen, though when you're a vegan it's totally cool to cut out "food groups".

Meat intolerance or meat aversion? I've never heard of anyone that cannot consume meat, but know plenty personally that have serious health issues, and 2 that have almost died (quite literally, not being flowery for forum posting shock value) due to consumption of wheat.

Thousands (probably millions) of people have meat intolerances. Do you honestly think every single vegan or vegetarian is doing it for ethical reasons, and not for health reasons?

People can be just as allergic to meat as any other food source.

Again, I've never actually heard of such as issue nor seen anything on actual meat/protein alleries. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but there seems to be a much higher likelyhood that someone would be allergic to grains or have other issues such as imflammation related to grains. I'd love to see some references to said meat intolerances, as I'm actually interested in learning more.

And while you generally come into these types of threads with a very combative tone, I'll answer your (likely rhetorical) question. I personally believe that most vegetarians and vegans eat the way they do because they have been told that it's better for their health, have ethical issues killing animals to eat them, been lured by a member of the opposite sex, or just like to feel superior and tell others how barbaric it is to kill for food. While many people that eat clean vegetarian diets do feel better, I think that's just as attributable to cutting out junk than not eating meat.

Do anti low carbers also go into the vegan/vegetarian threads and talk about "You're doing it wrong, it's all about calories in vs. calories out!" or "You know you shouldn't cut out food groups"? I've yet to see that happen, though when you're a vegan it's totally cool to cut out "food groups".

I agree.

http://www.livestrong.com/article/357313-meat-and-a-protein-allergy/

As for examples of people who have one, Bryan Danielson, professional wrestler. He was basically forced to turn vegan after a constant skin rash and weakened immune system was caused by his body's inability to process meat proteins properly. He had just attributed it to constant wrestling and mat burns, but eventually a doctor diagnosed him and told him to eliminate all animal products.

Ok, so there are cases in which this exists, however in the same article you will see:

A meat allergy is an uncommon food allergy: Ninety percent of food allergies are related to soy, wheat, peanuts, fish, eggs, tree nuts and milk, according to MayoClinic.com. Uncommon food allergy....

Also:

Asthma and Immunology says that some people can form a meat allergy from certain carbohydrates and proteins found in some meat products. Notice the reference to MEAT PRODUCTS. They again reference carbohydrates in meat in the article, which is likely possible when you are eating processed meat products and not pure meat. I'd be willing to bet that you feed those same people a nice grass fed steak and not some processed stuff they'd probably not have the same reaction.

Further, has anyone looked at what passes for "meat" these days? Go to the store and pick up just about any packaged meat, even when it says something like "Breakfast sausage links" and see how much soy and wheat are in them. It's not only shocking, but practically criminal.

Some of our ancestors have been eating grains for far longer than others. This perhaps has something to do with how some groups of us does better long term on meat intensive diets than others (no doubt everyone can lose weight on a low/no carb diet; that's biology, and is not sustainable long-term).

While realizing that anecdote!=data, I'm resorting to anecdote. I'm from India. Our diets tend to lean vegetarian, very carb intensive. Food allergies and intolerences are practically unheard of. The immune system is a complex thing, and blaming grains (for instance) for allergies is extremely nearsighted.

I was under the impression early humans were basically scavengers. More akin to say...goats or buzzards...than a fierce predator.

bump

Throwing my two cents in here.

At least for me, I would burn out on a Paleo diet.

If you can stick with it, and you are happy, why not.

The biggest take away for me from the paleo diet is not having meat based meals. For cavemen, if you shot a deer, you got meat that night. If you didn't (which they often didn't) you didn't. They wouldn't have had meat three meals a day like we do. I generally try to keep two of my three meals a day meatless, since it just seems healthier to me, plus it encourages me to eat more fruits and vegetables. I think the emphasis paleo places on fruits and vegetables is great too.

I guess I just don't see a need to eliminate dairy or grain. Both are healthy in moderation and when you eat the right kind, so I don't see a need to eliminate them.

You think Primal or Paleo is ridiculous or crazy? Then don't eat that way! These posts and the arguments about how bad or good these lifestyles are crack me up - to each their own and who cares what the next person is doing? It's all about finding what works for you. Primal has changed my life - my weight, my labs, my health, my energy - its what works for me, but if you think it's a fad or it doesn't work for you who cares?? To each their own!

Some of us care because we are deeply disturbed by the billions of animals that are dying to feed people who *PREFER* (notice I didn't use the word "NEED") to eat this way. Not to mention the massive environmental harm the meat industry is causing to the planet we all have to share, even those of us who want nothing to do with it. The idea that what you personally prefer to eat (animal flesh) is something that shouldn't bother the rest of us compassionate citizens of this planet is absurd. It affects everyone!