Food and Parenting
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you don't want your daughter to grow into her own person and to be able to support herself and be independent? So basically you just want her to be a mother and wife? Is that what you're saying?
Personally I always find it super odd when people think that way, maybe because I didn't grow up with that idea in my head, my mom really pushed to make sure I had an education and could support myself because that is what she had to do as a single mother, and she was and is extremely successful.
This is a super interesting topic.0 -
newmeadow, what sort of environment did you grow up in? do you work outside of the home?0
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tephanies1234 wrote: »
If I had a kid I'd become Amish and I'm not kidding. That's the only way to keep the world's disgustingness and toxic cultural brainwashing away from kids. Well actually I'd probably have to become Amish before the kid was born and marry an Amish husband. If he'd have me. Or at least a Mennonite.
Wouldn't you be brainwashing them by trying to keep the world away from your kids? Sounds like the Greek movie Dogtooth...lol
I had to check Wikipedia to read about that movie. It sounds kind of racy and twisted in a PG-13 kind of way.
But since I wasn't raised in either an Amish or Mennonite community myself, I can appreciate that sort of flick for the purposes of purely jaded entertainment and have watched many like it.
Yes, choosing to raise kids in a countercultural community such as the ones I mentioned that shun everything mainstream culture encourages would be a form of brainwashing. But that would be okay with me.
But it wouldn't be just me and my husband raising kids counter culturally as the movie represented. Yes, that would be a recipe for trouble, I agree, because there'd be no communal support.
But I see nothing wrong with my (imaginary - because I don't have one) daughter being raised not hearing any profanity; not learning about vile sexual stories and practices on TV, movies, from school or neighborhood kids; never being exposed to illicit drug use or anything associated with it; not playing with toys other than those hand crafted within the community; learning from an early age to cook, sew, clean, and live independently (off the land) and so forth.
Nothing wrong with being educated by rote in the basics: Reading, writing, arithmetic, geography and maybe some very fundamental scientific principals.
After that the focus is marriage, babies and hausfrauery. Doesn't matter much since almost all girls grow into women who have babies anyway. This way she'd be guaranteed to be married, supported by a husband and a like minded community, have a house of her own, take care of her baby full time and never have to worry about abandonment by community or abuse by the husband.
I know it's controversial but I'd want that for any daughter of mine.
If I had a son he'd grow up the same way and also learn master carpentry skills, master farming skills, and be instilled with the values that would make him into a man who would be both a provider and protector.
And I think A LOT of men in the big bad world would also like to be both providers and protectors but society as it is now structured makes it very difficult to do that. Not so in countercultural communities like Amish and Mennonite. Everything is set up to point the sons in that direction and make it possible. They don't need law degrees, medical degrees, MBAs or fat trust funds to be marriageable by the community standards.
And after all this blabbing, the kid(s) will still decide what they want to do and do it. As a make believe parent just daydreaming, I'd put them in a brainwashing situation that I'd feel okay about.
I feel like I need to go and hug & thank my mom & buy her some presents now.
Just no no no no no no.
Sorry just had to get that out...0 -
Trust me, amish kids know swear words. LOL.0
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They also drink and partymelimomTARDIS wrote: »Trust me, amish kids know swear words. LOL.0 -
Also, do you live by amish/mennonites? I do. They park buggies up at our (one and only) grocery store, and converse with the rest of us.
I know one man in particular pretty well, who takes the buggy to town nearly every day, to escape his wife's "b*tching".
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My sister's friend wouldn't let her kid eat any sugary treats. As soon as she was old enough to visit friends' houses, guess what she did? Gorged on junk food in secret. How is that a healthy relationship with food?
We eat healthy balanced meals as a family, but she can still have a cookie for dessert. She isn't even 5 yet, loves sushi and even sashimi, chicken stir fry is her favorite meal, fruit, veggies, and cheese are her go to snacks, but she still has McDonald's from time to time. She also swims and is learning to skate and play hockey. She wants to play hockey like Dad and play roller derby like Mom. That is how we set a good example, by letting her see us be active and choosing a good variety of healthy foods, with the occasional treat, not by banning the things her friends get to have.
PS - Everything is made up of chemicals. Water is a chemical. "Full of chemicals" is basically synonymous with existing.
How true, chemistry is LITERALLY the study of all matter.0 -
veganbettie wrote: »veganbettie wrote: »veganbettie wrote: »BrownEyedBetty wrote: »I mean to offend no one. I'm just saying I personally would not feed that stuff to my children even with a balanced diet. If they want a
cookie I will make them from stratch instead of buying the ones that come in a box is all I am saying
Ha! Just wait till your kiddies get to day care and or school. All those treats you have been not allowing them they are gonna find on their own. Best to teach moderation, IMO...
Not to mention that day care and school won't allow homemade treats most of the time.
i'm so glad that my son's preschool hasn't gone down that path...I seriously make vegan versions of all the food they serve that has meat or cheese in it. It's a pain in the *kitten*, oh the things we do to ourselves...
Today's menu was English muffin pizzas.....
on Friday they are serving chicken stuffing...what the hell is chicken stuffing? Like the stove top crap? I don't want to duplicate that crap!
oiy.
Wow that is quite the commitment... Are you trying to copy the menu so that your child is eating a similar food to the other kids? If it were me I would probably just send in whatever food your child eats that you want to make and forget about what is on the school menu, but I'm pretty lazy LOL.
exactly. My goal is to not let my kid feel left out. He is only two right now, but it's pretty important to me, I figure if I do it this way there is more of a chance of him committing to being vegan in the future.
I respect and admire your commitment to your food choice/lifestyle and wanting your son not to suffer any exclusion because of it! I do think in this day and age, there are so many food allergies/sensitivities that it seems like every time I go to one of my kid's schools (Kindergarten and Day Care) that someone in the class is drinking soy milk instead of cows milk, eating a special gluten free snack, etc. I bet the kids and teachers are pretty used to it by now so I don't know that your son would be judged, but I could be naive. Does your son eat some of the food that they serve, the fruits/veggies, and you just make the "main" dish, or is he eating a totally separate meal?
Our daycare certainly doesn't have vegan options but they serve fruits and vegetables with lunch and a fruit with breakfast every day. Often the snacks are fruit based too, although mostly crackers and string cheese I think. My other son's elementary school has several options each day and I think every day there is a vegetarian option, but again, definitely not vegan, although I think they have a fruit/veggie/salad bar?
My kid takes a lunch every day and it is usually a cheese or peanut butter sandwich or (gasp) a lunchable! I think the packed lunch kids are more prevalent than the buying lunch kids so I think once your son gets to kindergarten his food will be his food no matter what.
it is super weird how many allergies there are nowadays, when I was a kid there was maybe one child with a peanut allergy and then a few with grass allergies and that's it. Part of me wonders if the parents are just jumping on the fad bandwagon of being gluten free or what, but I do have a few friends that have kids with SERIOUS allergies, like if my kid eats flour he will die sort of thing, so I get it, but it's crazy....I wonder what is going on in this world?
Ya our preschool offers the whole healthy kids requirements, protein, veggies, and starches, so he does eat a lot of what the other kids eat, so it's not too big of a deal. but if they are eating corn dogs or what have you, I know he is going to want them too, so I do what I have to!
I can't wait until real school where I can make similar lunches, that will be exciting. lol Who knows though, at that point I think I will give him the option of eating like daddy, or eating like mommy. Not sure what he will choose once he is able to understand where it all comes from, until then he is eating like his mommy.
also. I loved luncables as a kid. remember those taco bell ones with the gross meat packets? it seriously looked like cat poop. and it was devine.
I NEVER thought I would have a kid with a peanut allergy, but my youngest wound up with one. It was pretty devastating at first because peanut butter was the one thing I could get my two older kids to eat for lunch. And it's cheap! Fortunately, his allergy reactions haven't been that severe, but I do have to carry an Epipen.
Once we found bulk Sunbutter on Amazon, life got a lot nicer.
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Ok it boggles my mind a little bit. Not everyone has the luxury to be 'supported' by her husband, and even then, assuming a girl finds a husband who makes a decent living, when the kids are in college... then what? I'm a SAHM and pretty much ended up doing what you're describing, although not really on purpose, and I'm frankly dreading it, I mean who will hire a 46yo woman with no previous experience?
Anyway, for all that to happen, you'll probably need to homeschool your kid with no access to technology or any other kid...0 -
I am obese, I have two obese children. I am working on getting healthy. I am encouraging my boys to do the same. Am I forcing them? No. Why? Because when I was a kid, my mom told me not to eat this and not to eat that or it will make you fat. SO guess what I did? When she wasnt around I ate it anyway. I need my boys to have a healthy relationship with food, not be dictated by me what to eat. I cook nutritious meals most of the time and a little junk other times. What I wont do is tell others that basically they are bad parents because they let their child have a freaking Little Debbie snack. Sheesh. Come back and talk to us when you have children of your own.0
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BrownEyedBetty wrote: »I mean to offend no one. I'm just saying I personally would not feed that stuff to my children even with a balanced diet. If they want a
cookie I will make them from stratch instead of buying the ones that come in a box is all I am saying
You may not want to feed that to your kids, but do not try to pass judgement on others for what they do - especially when you have done nothing to support your indignation or other assertions and do not know the individual circumstances.
This^0 -
It's not so difficult. My kids haven't watched any television in the past 7 days. I do have a TV in the living room, they just don't watch "filler". In December they watched Elf, and Miracle on 34th Street, and Home Alone, and The Santa Clause. Each was someone's favorite.Or did they think they'd keep the TV in the house (just in case) but not let the kid watch it?
Totally. I only tolerated cable TV three times in the past year.Kids have unfettered access to TV - and they don't watch it. Like, never. Having grown up with YouTube and Netflix, they are totally put off by the endless ads0 -
tephanies1234 wrote: »
If I had a kid I'd become Amish and I'm not kidding. That's the only way to keep the world's disgustingness and toxic cultural brainwashing away from kids. Well actually I'd probably have to become Amish before the kid was born and marry an Amish husband. If he'd have me. Or at least a Mennonite.
Wouldn't you be brainwashing them by trying to keep the world away from your kids? Sounds like the Greek movie Dogtooth...lol
I had to check Wikipedia to read about that movie. It sounds kind of racy and twisted in a PG-13 kind of way.
But since I wasn't raised in either an Amish or Mennonite community myself, I can appreciate that sort of flick for the purposes of purely jaded entertainment and have watched many like it.
Yes, choosing to raise kids in a countercultural community such as the ones I mentioned that shun everything mainstream culture encourages would be a form of brainwashing. But that would be okay with me.
But it wouldn't be just me and my husband raising kids counter culturally as the movie represented. Yes, that would be a recipe for trouble, I agree, because there'd be no communal support.
But I see nothing wrong with my (imaginary - because I don't have one) daughter being raised not hearing any profanity; not learning about vile sexual stories and practices on TV, movies, from school or neighborhood kids; never being exposed to illicit drug use or anything associated with it; not playing with toys other than those hand crafted within the community; learning from an early age to cook, sew, clean, and live independently (off the land) and so forth.
Nothing wrong with being educated by rote in the basics: Reading, writing, arithmetic, geography and maybe some very fundamental scientific principals.
After that the focus is marriage, babies and hausfrauery. Doesn't matter much since almost all girls grow into women who have babies anyway. This way she'd be guaranteed to be married, supported by a husband and a like minded community, have a house of her own, take care of her baby full time and never have to worry about abandonment by community or abuse by the husband.
I know it's controversial but I'd want that for any daughter of mine.
If I had a son he'd grow up the same way and also learn master carpentry skills, master farming skills, and be instilled with the values that would make him into a man who would be both a provider and protector.
And I think A LOT of men in the big bad world would also like to be both providers and protectors but society as it is now structured makes it very difficult to do that. Not so in countercultural communities like Amish and Mennonite. Everything is set up to point the sons in that direction and make it possible. They don't need law degrees, medical degrees, MBAs or fat trust funds to be marriageable by the community standards.
And after all this blabbing, the kid(s) will still decide what they want to do and do it. As a make believe parent just daydreaming, I'd put them in a brainwashing situation that I'd feel okay about.
I just feel the need to chime in...having grown up in Lancaster County, PA, surrounded by Amish neighbors and dealing with them on a day-to-day basis.
They are humans. They use profanity. They have pre-marital sex (not all, but they really do). Can't tell you how many times I've seen drunk Amish kids "drag racing" they're horse and buggies.
Ever hear of rumspringa? Amish parents let their kids go through that phase before deciding whether or not to join the church. During that period, the kids do EVERYTHING your typical teenager does. Crazy parties, alcohol, drugs, sex. You name it. They have cell phones now, facebooks, other social media.
On the flip side, YES, Amish are raised to work hard and live off the land. I admire them for that.
Being Amish or Mennonite won't fix anything or guarantee your kids won't be exposed to things. They will. No matter what. Train your kids to THINK before acting. Teach them morals and ethics. You don't have to join a community to teach your own kids.0 -
But I see nothing wrong with my (imaginary - because I don't have one) daughter being raised not hearing any profanity; not learning about vile sexual stories and practices on TV, movies, from school or neighborhood kids; never being exposed to illicit drug use or anything associated with it; not playing with toys other than those hand crafted within the community; learning from an early age to cook, sew, clean, and live independently (off the land) and so forth.
That community doesn't exist, anywhere.
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melimomTARDIS wrote: »Also, do you live by amish/mennonites? I do. They park buggies up at our (one and only) grocery store, and converse with the rest of us.
I know one man in particular pretty well, who takes the buggy to town nearly every day, to escape his wife's "b*tching".
I do not. I've never even seen them. What's going on here with the Amish? They're not supposed to be doing these things! Oh well. There must be some good ones who don't have their minds in the gutter or use profanity to describe their wives. I hope.
Rumspringa (Google it). They are encouraged and obligated by their religion to indulge in the "evils" of the English world. That means party, smoke & drink, sex it up, and swear to their hearts delight. The Amish are still human beings living in the same world.0 -
It's true. My 4th grade daughter is now learning simple programming by creating her own games. It's no longer just computer class, she brings her laptop to all her classes.
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veganbettie wrote: »you don't want your daughter to grow into her own person and to be able to support herself and be independent? So basically you just want her to be a mother and wife? Is that what you're saying?
Personally I always find it super odd when people think that way, maybe because I didn't grow up with that idea in my head, my mom really pushed to make sure I had an education and could support myself because that is what she had to do as a single mother, and she was and is extremely successful.
This is a super interesting topic.
I grew up to be a gal who supports herself and was not supported by anyone else. To the extreme I might add. I was forced into homelessness as a teenager (won't be going into the details) and pulled myself up by my proverbial bootstraps and never fell into any of the typical traps that homeless teenagers often fall into.
I worked two menial jobs, lived in a broken down rooming house, took the bus, saved my money and by my mid thirties was living a solidly middle class and white collar existence based on work related vocational skills alone. It was a very hard road though and I wouldn't recommend it for anyone.
I would want my daughter to live in a community and be supported by a husband who respected her and with whom she was happy. I would want my daughter to be able to be a full time mother if she wanted to be without having to worry about it.
But if my daughter wanted a formal education and a Sex In the City lifestyle, I'd say, okay dear but we can't pay for it. Go ahead. Roll the dice.
But no, it's not what I'd want for her. Yes, I'd want my daughter to just go ahead with the mother/wife focus since, like I said, she'd probably want that anyway and I think traditional structures that support this role are underrated.
very interesting.
as a woman, to strive for a husband to take care of me, and to want that sort of life sort of eebies me out, but I think it's because that's how I grew up.
To each their own I say. I just .... I like being able to take care of myself.
Granted, it's hard as hell to work full time and take care of a family, and maybe later on down the road I might change my mind, but I couldn't imagine not working. At least somewhat....
There is just so much more to life than being a mother and a wife. so much more. What happens if your child couldn't have kids? or she or he was gay? or didn't want to marry? or didn't want to have kids?
I admire your thoughts on traditional households, but I just don't think it works in this day in age, at least very well.0 -
But I see nothing wrong with my (imaginary - because I don't have one) daughter being raised not hearing any profanity; not learning about vile sexual stories and practices on TV, movies, from school or neighborhood kids; never being exposed to illicit drug use or anything associated with it; not playing with toys other than those hand crafted within the community; learning from an early age to cook, sew, clean, and live independently (off the land) and so forth.
That community doesn't exist, anywhere.
Oh well then. I'm actually glad I posted it about it here and got to read comments from people who are familiar with the communities I speak of. And yours too Mr. Knight.
Maybe these kids happen upon vile sexual stories and hear and use profanity occasionally. It would be too Utopian to imagine that never happens. But outside of Rumspringa (if I'm spelling that correctly) I don't think the party lifestyle is a hallmark of those communities. And I do think they live mostly, if not completely off the land?
Anyhow, like I said, this is all just me musing about how I'd raise my imaginary kids. I don't have any.
But at the age of 47 I still menstruate like clockwork every 28 days (sorry if that's too much information).
So I could still have a baby.
If I accidently get knocked up I really would hitch a ride on a horse and buggy to Lancaster, PA right away and sign up for the plain lifestyle. And religious classes if that was what was required. For the kid's sake. Not for me. My internet, TV, computer, designer handbags and 6 cylinder automobile suit me just fine.
I seriously get the desire for the simple life. I think it would be nice to live in a cabin in the woods and live off the land and not be bothered for anything.
OH or like Swiss Family Robinson.... I want to live in a tree.0
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