losing fat/ gaining muscle mass simutaneously

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  • Springfield1970
    Springfield1970 Posts: 1,945 Member
    edited February 2015
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    I've done both. I did Lyle MacDonalds amazing Ultimate Diet where you cut for half the week and bulk for half the week. It's INSANELY difficult, your blood sugar is everywhere, dizzy, fatigued, the workouts are very difficult and you may as well shut yourself off from the world for the weeks that you do it. I recomped. Measurements went down in the right places, and up in the right places, weight dropped a little. There's no way I could have done any triathlon training and it was time consuming. I shudder thinking about the depletion workouts on day three. Awful.

    As for a long term recomp, I'm far beyond that now, but now I'm in training for summer I'm at maintenance, so I'll see what happens. Thing is, it's very hard to calculate, if you drop/add inches, stay the same weight, then are you recomping or just losing fat and getting more muscle definition? So you up your maintenance figure...it's just not easy to tell if it's working. It's a tricky one to monitor.

    Bulking and cutting was by far the easiest and most satisfying method I've used yet. My body absolutely thrived on the bulk, I felt everything get a blast of growth hormone, and my body was amazing at the end. Totally different shape, like an athlete. It is also easy to do the maths, easy to see and track results, and best of all you can incorporate the into normal life better. No it's not an exact science either but it's the closest one for me to get the right results. You just have to have your eye on the ball and be able to pack a little body fat on.

  • maccarossi1
    maccarossi1 Posts: 58 Member
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    You can do both at the same time, essentially you'll be building muscle and decreasing your body fat, so far I have lost 26kg's and certainly gained plenty of muscle along the way through most of my exercise being heavy weights coupled with a high protein diet. Still eating at a deficit to lose fat which means the muscle gains aren't as efficient as those on a genuine bulk but it's still certainly happening.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,811 Member
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    My personal view is that the advice for people to follow bulk cut cycles has become overstated and it's gone from a niche technique for competitive body builders to general advice for everyone in my (admittedly long...) training lifespan.
    Possibly due to the emphasis changing over the years from mainly strength to physique goals?

    So much depends on personal targets and the context of where people are with their training status and body composition.

    This is worth a read:
    http://bretcontreras.com/to-bulk-and-cut-or-not/

    I'm not anti bulk/cut cycles at all by the way, it's just got a bit silly with people making blanket statements and recommending it for everyone.
  • dym123
    dym123 Posts: 1,670 Member
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    Alassonde wrote: »
    I have been working on recomping for a few months now (profile pic is not current!) and I just have my goals set to maintain. It seems to be working for me.

    This is what I've been doing. Scoobyworkshop does actually have a setting for Lose Fat/Build Muscle on their calorie calculator, but their macros did not work for me, high carbs, low fat, so for the past few months I've been doing the opposite, low carbs, high fat and after a year of no progress, I'm finally seeing some change. It's not easy, you'll have to play with your calories and be very very patient.

  • maccarossi1
    maccarossi1 Posts: 58 Member
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    MrM27 wrote: »
    maccarossi1 wrote: »
    You can do both at the same time, essentially you'll be building muscle and decreasing your body fat, so far I have lost 26kg's and certainly gained plenty of muscle along the way through most of my exercise being heavy weights coupled with a high protein diet. Still eating at a deficit to lose fat which means the muscle gains aren't as efficient as those on a genuine bulk but it's still certainly happening.

    In a straight deficit you could see small noob gains but you are not building "plenty of muscle" as you put it. You need a surplus as proper training for that. You might say that you see it in the mirror but it's an optical illusion. You're losing weight, your muscles are retaining water and are looking more full therefore giving you the illusion that you are building plenty of muscle.

    Yeah sorry may have put that a bit more enthusiastically than I should have, strength gains have been quite huge personally (on squat, DL, Bench) but as far as muscle goes I'm sure there has been some but at the same time it may just be becoming more defined as I lose weight.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    MoiAussi93 wrote: »
    TheVirgoddess wrote: »
    As far as I know, you can't do both.

    To lose fat, you need to eat at a deficit.

    To gain muscle, you need to eat at a surplus.

    They don't go together. You can work on strengthening the muscles you have, of course. But you can't build muscle out of thin air - you need something (the extra calories) with which to build them.
    I don't understand this...I thought strengthening muscle was the result of building muscle. Isn't that how they get stronger? You work them hard, microtears occur, the body then rebuilds it stronger and bigger than before to adapt?

    This is a serious question. I don't understand how you get stronger without building muscle. I am not a body builder and haven't researched this.

    strength gains do not equal muscle gains..

    you can train a muscle to be more efficient and lift more, but that does not mean you are building new muscle.
  • irongrinder
    irongrinder Posts: 202 Member
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    http://youtu.be/Bz3AG-oCXTE
  • yopeeps025
    yopeeps025 Posts: 8,680 Member
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    JimFsfitnesspal wrote: »
    It's a lie. You CAN build muscle and cut fat at the same time. The muscle burns calories faster anyway. It's not rocket science. Ignore the noise.

    What does that have to do with losing fat and building muscle. I mean like how you do these goals because it seems you don't know?
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
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    ^ OP sounds like you have all the answers….why did you even start this thread?
  • irongrinder
    irongrinder Posts: 202 Member
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    so, doing some research, I found the answer I was looking for, but that doesn't help me with setting my weight goals accordingly
  • yopeeps025
    yopeeps025 Posts: 8,680 Member
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    love2lift247 wrote: »
    so, doing some research, I found the answer I was looking for, but that doesn't help me with setting my weight goals accordingly

    Usually people do lose fat till you get to the body fat you want. Bulk phase to add muscle which will add fat. Cut phase to remove fat while maintain LBM or as much as you can.

  • AliceDark
    AliceDark Posts: 3,886 Member
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    Just tell MFP you want to maintain your weight. Or manually set your goal to your TDEE.
  • VeryKatie
    VeryKatie Posts: 5,953 Member
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    Pretty much what I've heard is that you eat at maintenance and lift heavy... and two years later you may be where you want to be. It's called a recomp.
  • RHSheetz
    RHSheetz Posts: 268 Member
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    OK, so I am in the process of doing this. I try and eat to maintenance level. My lifting creates a deficit, and I eat ALOT of protein. According to my body comps, I am losing fat and slowly adding muscle.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,811 Member
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    AliceDark wrote: »
    Just tell MFP you want to maintain your weight. Or manually set your goal to your TDEE.

    This ^

    What is the issue? If you want to maintain at your current weight eat at a calorie level that achieves that over time (weeks not days!).
    Some experimentation may be required as all estimates are averages and your logging accuracy will have an impact.

    BTW - How come your profile says "3lbs lost, 20lbs to go"?
  • Springfield1970
    Springfield1970 Posts: 1,945 Member
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    RHSheetz wrote: »
    OK, so I am in the process of doing this. I try and eat to maintenance level. My lifting creates a deficit, and I eat ALOT of protein. According to my body comps, I am losing fat and slowly adding muscle.

    Sorry, but you're technically on a cut. You'll see more definition and that will give the illusion you're adding muscle. Are your measurements going up? Biceps etc...


  • allaboutemgains
    allaboutemgains Posts: 1 Member
    edited February 2015
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    springfield1970 wrote:
    Sorry, but you're technically on a cut. You'll see more definition and that will give the illusion you're adding muscle. Are your measurements going up? Biceps etc...

    U can't add mass and lose weight at same time impossible. If u just eat protein your body can only digest so much and u will end up pissing the rest out and end up in the doctors. and u would probably stay same size for about 3 years before u added any #gains noticeable anyway if u done research correct like every body builder on the planet eat big get big cut the fat maintain LBM and u will be bigger in no Time getting big. takes time iv been gaining size for 2 years added 3 st now 13st and 14%body fat when I was 10st I was 7% ripped up just didn't work need if u can eat clean will happen fast but I'm bad at diet and u cant out train a bad diet

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