Recomposition: Maintaining weight while losing fat
Replies
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Wow great thread! Would you guys recommend recomping if I am 20 years old, a male, and at a healthy weight (I am 5'6" and weigh 144lbs) but have a body fat percentage in the high teens? I have been lifting heavy for about a year. Currently I am cutting. I definitely want to add muscle mass when the time comes but currently I fear I have to much body fat to bulk.0
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Are there any guidelines/information/steps on how to find my maintenance?
Have you currently been losing weight?
Need valid log in days over a 4 wk block of time. Don't want starting diet big water weight drop, or started lifting big water weight gain, or big sodium day before weigh-in, or really low prior.
Take that 4 wk worth of average eating level, so you need good stats - no skipped days or several meals - get as accurate as possible.
Lbs lost over the 4 wks x 3500 / 28 days = deficit to TDEE you must have had for whatever your average activity level was.
If that 4 wks was really different and not likely to be repeated activity level - then can't use it go forward, because that was TDEE for then, not now.
If it is a routine and daily activity you'll be going forward with - there you go.
Average eaten + deficit = TDEE
After that, adjust as needed, taking in to account water weight gains don't mean you should adjust calorie levels.0 -
ILiftHeavyAcrylics wrote: »I don't have any research, but I'll post my results here. I've been recomping for about 2 years. I have chronic illness and eating at a deficit can be too much stress on my system.
On the left I was 125 lbs, 24% body fat according to the Eat, Train, Progress body fat estimation thread. On the right I'm still 125 lbs but 2 sizes smaller.
Seriously amazing job!
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ILiftHeavyAcrylics wrote: »I don't have any research, but I'll post my results here. I've been recomping for about 2 years. I have chronic illness and eating at a deficit can be too much stress on my system.
On the left I was 125 lbs, 24% body fat according to the Eat, Train, Progress body fat estimation thread. On the right I'm still 125 lbs but 2 sizes smaller.
dam gurl u fyne
props!1 -
Second that.rageginger wrote: »@usmcmp thank you so much for this! I have been looking for recomp info, as I'm preparing to transition to maintenance and focus on recomp at that point. You break things down so simply, cutting away all the fluff that really comes down to personal preference, and it really clears up so much confusion. Thank you thank you thank you!
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I found the thread for me!
After two slow years of gaining I'm finally back at my old weight and a healthy bmi (20.5). Unfortunatly, gaining the weight also resulted in increases in my waist. So basically right now I want to decrease my bf to look more fit without losing weight.
I only recently started lifting in the form of body pump, but want to add some trx to my program as well.
1) Is it possible to do maintenance through body pump and trx without any "real" lifting? (It will probably be slow, but I just really like group classes)
2) Any non meat proteine ideas? I seem to be unable to have enough of those in my diet.0 -
2. You can buy vital wheat gluten for fairly cheap and make your own seitan with it. The only thing is gluten is low in the amino acid lysine, so you need to pair with another food like soybeans, or supplement license (you can buy lysine supplements).I found the thread for me!
After two slow years of gaining I'm finally back at my old weight and a healthy bmi (20.5). Unfortunatly, gaining the weight also resulted in increases in my waist. So basically right now I want to decrease my bf to look more fit without losing weight.
I only recently started lifting in the form of body pump, but want to add some trx to my program as well.
1) Is it possible to do maintenance through body pump and trx without any "real" lifting? (It will probably be slow, but I just really like group classes)
2) Any non meat proteine ideas? I seem to be unable to have enough of those in my diet.
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1) Is it possible to do maintenance through body pump and trx without any "real" lifting? (It will probably be slow, but I just really like group classes)
Maintenence, sure, but a true recomp, probably not. Last year, I did lower my body fat but maintain my weight by doing body pump and TRX but didn't see significant muscle increase until I started lifting heavier than that.
2) Any non meat proteine ideas? I seem to be unable to have enough of those in my diet.
Greek yogurt, protein bars and powders, eggs, cottage cheese, tofu.0 -
I've been tracking this thread on and off because I'm not "there" yet but hope to be... but a thought just occurred to me. Perhaps it has already been asked and answered. If so, sorry I missed it.
Here's my question: Does one's body composition affect one's calorie requirements? I seem to remember that muscle burns more calories. But when I go to online calculators, they always give me how many calories I need to sustain my current weight without worrying about how much of the weight is muscle and how much is fat.
So, a related question: Doesn't that mean these calculators are inaccurate for some people?
thanks0 -
The answer is Yes to both. The calculators are a starting point. Adjust as you have to. From what I understand you want to try to remain at the same weight and have a progressive overload weight training program as well during your recomp. Recomps take a long time. Measuring yourself will help you track the results.I've been tracking this thread on and off because I'm not "there" yet but hope to be... but a thought just occurred to me. Perhaps it has already been asked and answered. If so, sorry I missed it.
Here's my question: Does one's body composition affect one's calorie requirements? I seem to remember that muscle burns more calories. But when I go to online calculators, they always give me how many calories I need to sustain my current weight without worrying about how much of the weight is muscle and how much is fat.
So, a related question: Doesn't that mean these calculators are inaccurate for some people?
thanks
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I'm starting my recomp about now...
This time on purpose. 0 -
I've been tracking this thread on and off because I'm not "there" yet but hope to be... but a thought just occurred to me. Perhaps it has already been asked and answered. If so, sorry I missed it.
Here's my question: Does one's body composition affect one's calorie requirements? I seem to remember that muscle burns more calories. But when I go to online calculators, they always give me how many calories I need to sustain my current weight without worrying about how much of the weight is muscle and how much is fat.
So, a related question: Doesn't that mean these calculators are inaccurate for some people?
thanks
If you know your body fat than the calculators will be a bit more accurate as it uses the Katch McArdle formula. But even with the best calculators, they are still estimates. Track for 4 to 6 weeks and you should be able to figure out your tdee.
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Is it really that recomp takes a long time or that bulking and cutting offers more novelty? I could do a cut to get to 18-20%, that would take approx 2-3 months? Then a bulk and that would take about 8 months...then another cut say 3 months. Or I could train like a badass for a year and a half. Would the bulk and cut give me a better physique or would it just keep me more occupied because the goals would change more frequently? Serious question. Everyone says recomp is slow...is it slow or are the changes just less obvious and dramatic with a similar endpoint?
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Is it really that recomp takes a long time or that bulking and cutting offers more novelty? I could do a cut to get to 18-20%, that would take approx 2-3 months? Then a bulk and that would take about 8 months...then another cut say 3 months. Or I could train like a badass for a year and a half. Would the bulk and cut give me a better physique or would it just keep me more occupied because the goals would change more frequently? Serious question. Everyone says recomp is slow...is it slow or are the changes just less obvious and dramatic with a similar endpoint?
Time-wise - it is considered to be more effective/efficient, if you can accept the caveats that go along with it that have been discussed.
Part of the difference between methods though has to do with your experience as lifter.
If pretty new, you can make some great gains even at maintenance.
If experienced, gains even when bulking can be slow.
What you could accomplish with that example above then would depend on your experience lifting already, but normally would be more with good bulk/cut routine.
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I've been tracking this thread on and off because I'm not "there" yet but hope to be... but a thought just occurred to me. Perhaps it has already been asked and answered. If so, sorry I missed it.
Here's my question: Does one's body composition affect one's calorie requirements? I seem to remember that muscle burns more calories. But when I go to online calculators, they always give me how many calories I need to sustain my current weight without worrying about how much of the weight is muscle and how much is fat.
So, a related question: Doesn't that mean these calculators are inaccurate for some people?
thanks
The difference near healthy weight isn't that great between BMR calcs like Mifflin and Katch.
Muscle at rest is figured to be about 6 cal/lb/day, fat is 2 cal/lb/day.
Your metabolically active organs account for biggest part of BMR.
Shoot, the body even has to expend energy dealing with water in the cells and attached to glucose.
What makes the biggest difference is what you are doing with it when it's not resting.
And damage / repair can use up a lot if diet allows it.0 -
Okay so I know this is going to sound ridiculous but I'm just trying to get some answers.
Do I need to try and eat at maintenance or would it be more beneficial to eat less and continue to hit the gym (hoping to get the same measurement gains all around)?
Given that I actually have to try to meet my "maintenance goal" given by online calculators and MFP.0 -
hoppertaylor wrote: »Okay so I know this is going to sound ridiculous but I'm just trying to get some answers.
Do I need to try and eat at maintenance or would it be more beneficial to eat less and continue to hit the gym (hoping to get the same measurement gains all around)?
Given that I actually have to try to meet my "maintenance goal" given by online calculators and MFP.
Well, if you're eating below maintenance then you'd be in a deficit by definition... so you'd be "cutting". I suppose it depends on the severity of the deficit however.0 -
this thread continues to be legit and I link to it in other threads
jus sayin
u gaiz 0 -
hoppertaylor wrote: »Okay so I know this is going to sound ridiculous but I'm just trying to get some answers.
Do I need to try and eat at maintenance or would it be more beneficial to eat less and continue to hit the gym (hoping to get the same measurement gains all around)?
Given that I actually have to try to meet my "maintenance goal" given by online calculators and MFP.
It depends on where you are. I preferred to start my recomp once I felt I was slim/my body fat was down a bit lower. I had great results lifting in a small deficit up until that point. If you're ready for the recomp though, you should just eat at maintenance. You want to try to build a little bit of muscle.0 -
I'm on week 8 of weight lifting since i started a new gym. Initially my goal was to try and drop some weight and hope that the lifting alongside adequate macros would work. I have dropped 6 pounds of scale weight(142 to 136) in those 8 weeks but have noticed big improvements in my shape and the inches/bf lost. I started at around 27% bf (using callipers) and right now i'm around 23%. It has quickly dawned on me that the scale means nothing to me now. I'm at a healthy weight and bf% and want my focus to now be lifting heavier and heavier. I get a buzz more from upping that compared to what I get losing scale weight. I'm upping my calories from a deficit of -500 from tdee to -250 or even maintenance. If I want to continue my journey of looking better(drop bf) while getting stronger is there a specific rep range i should be aiming for? I currently have been going for the 12 rep range of exercises such as squat,dead lift and bench as well as any accessory work on machines/dumbells. Thanks 0
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I'm on week 8 of weight lifting since i started a new gym. Initially my goal was to try and drop some weight and hope that the lifting alongside adequate macros would work. I have dropped 6 pounds of scale weight(142 to 136) in those 8 weeks but have noticed big improvements in my shape and the inches/bf lost. I started at around 27% bf (using callipers) and right now i'm around 23%. It has quickly dawned on me that the scale means nothing to me now. I'm at a healthy weight and bf% and want my focus to now be lifting heavier and heavier. I get a buzz more from upping that compared to what I get losing scale weight. I'm upping my calories from a deficit of -500 from tdee to -250 or even maintenance. If I want to continue my journey of looking better(drop bf) while getting stronger is there a specific rep range i should be aiming for? I currently have been going for the 12 rep range of exercises such as squat,dead lift and bench as well as any accessory work on machines/dumbells. Thanks
A MFP friend gave me this link and I would like to share it with you. Very helpful. The link will give you a great explanation on strength programs.
http://powerathletehq.com/2014/07/28/prilepins-chart/
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I'm on week 8 of weight lifting since i started a new gym. Initially my goal was to try and drop some weight and hope that the lifting alongside adequate macros would work. I have dropped 6 pounds of scale weight(142 to 136) in those 8 weeks but have noticed big improvements in my shape and the inches/bf lost. I started at around 27% bf (using callipers) and right now i'm around 23%. It has quickly dawned on me that the scale means nothing to me now. I'm at a healthy weight and bf% and want my focus to now be lifting heavier and heavier. I get a buzz more from upping that compared to what I get losing scale weight. I'm upping my calories from a deficit of -500 from tdee to -250 or even maintenance. If I want to continue my journey of looking better(drop bf) while getting stronger is there a specific rep range i should be aiming for? I currently have been going for the 12 rep range of exercises such as squat,dead lift and bench as well as any accessory work on machines/dumbells. Thanks
Does your routine bake in progressive overload? How many times a week are you lifting? Is it full body or a split?
Generally, a 12 rep range is good for hypertrophy - but it also depends on how many sets and how many times you are working that muscle group per week (which includes assistance work).0 -
Are there any tips for best transitioning into maintenance calories for re-comp? I have only been on a 200- 250 deficit most days, but I hit goal as of this morning .
ETA: Also, do macro goals need to shift? I've been focusing on protein, letting the others just kind of fall where they may.
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I'm on week 8 of weight lifting since i started a new gym. Initially my goal was to try and drop some weight and hope that the lifting alongside adequate macros would work. I have dropped 6 pounds of scale weight(142 to 136) in those 8 weeks but have noticed big improvements in my shape and the inches/bf lost. I started at around 27% bf (using callipers) and right now i'm around 23%. It has quickly dawned on me that the scale means nothing to me now. I'm at a healthy weight and bf% and want my focus to now be lifting heavier and heavier. I get a buzz more from upping that compared to what I get losing scale weight. I'm upping my calories from a deficit of -500 from tdee to -250 or even maintenance. If I want to continue my journey of looking better(drop bf) while getting stronger is there a specific rep range i should be aiming for? I currently have been going for the 12 rep range of exercises such as squat,dead lift and bench as well as any accessory work on machines/dumbells. Thanks
Does your routine bake in progressive overload? How many times a week are you lifting? Is it full body or a split?
Generally, a 12 rep range is good for hypertrophy - but it also depends on how many sets and how many times you are working that muscle group per week (which includes assistance work).
Thanks for replying. I lift 4 times a week consisting of:
Upper(Barbell squat, stiff leg DL, barbell lunges,calf raises, leg curls/ extension etc)
Lower(Barbell bench press, military oh press and some dumbell accessories like oh shoulder press)
Rest or some hiit
Upper as above
Lower as above
Always doing 3 sets of 12 and have been adding weight as the last 2 reps get easier. It is really great seeing progress when it comes to upping weight. I just wondered if there was a 'sweet spot' regarding reps so to speak that meant you got the best of both worlds i.e increasing strength as best as I can but still getting the hypertrophy effect.
Thanks again0 -
mattyc772014 wrote: »I'm on week 8 of weight lifting since i started a new gym. Initially my goal was to try and drop some weight and hope that the lifting alongside adequate macros would work. I have dropped 6 pounds of scale weight(142 to 136) in those 8 weeks but have noticed big improvements in my shape and the inches/bf lost. I started at around 27% bf (using callipers) and right now i'm around 23%. It has quickly dawned on me that the scale means nothing to me now. I'm at a healthy weight and bf% and want my focus to now be lifting heavier and heavier. I get a buzz more from upping that compared to what I get losing scale weight. I'm upping my calories from a deficit of -500 from tdee to -250 or even maintenance. If I want to continue my journey of looking better(drop bf) while getting stronger is there a specific rep range i should be aiming for? I currently have been going for the 12 rep range of exercises such as squat,dead lift and bench as well as any accessory work on machines/dumbells. Thanks
A MFP friend gave me this link and I would like to share it with you. Very helpful. The link will give you a great explanation on strength programs.
http://powerathletehq.com/2014/07/28/prilepins-chart/
Will check this out. Thank you 0 -
So I'm not especially good at getting in my protein. I'm closer to .5/.6g per lb body weight rather than the recommended .8. Does that make a difference whether or not I should recomp vs cut?
I've been maintaining for 2+ years, but have really been thinking that I'd really like to lose a bit more body fat. Problem is my upper body is pretty lean, so I've started SL 5X5, thinking a recomp and more muscle on my chest (and hopefully less fat on my lower half) will give me the look I'm wanting. While maintaining I was doing more of a circuits sort of weight training.
Given I don't eat as much protein as I should though, am I just treading water trying a recomp? Maybe if I cut, what I lose will magically come from the place I'm hoping it will come from and I won't end up looking like Skeletor...
Sorry I'm sort of rambling, but hopefully my basic question is clear: if I'm at the low end for protein, can I still benefit from a recomp rather than a cut?0 -
WestCoastJo82 wrote: »So I'm not especially good at getting in my protein. I'm closer to .5/.6g per lb body weight rather than the recommended .8. Does that make a difference whether or not I should recomp vs cut?
I've been maintaining for 2+ years, but have really been thinking that I'd really like to lose a bit more body fat. Problem is my upper body is pretty lean, so I've started SL 5X5, thinking a recomp and more muscle on my chest (and hopefully less fat on my lower half) will give me the look I'm wanting. While maintaining I was doing more of a circuits sort of weight training.
Given I don't eat as much protein as I should though, am I just treading water trying a recomp? Maybe if I cut, what I lose will magically come from the place I'm hoping it will come from and I won't end up looking like Skeletor...
Sorry I'm sort of rambling, but hopefully my basic question is clear: if I'm at the low end for protein, can I still benefit from a recomp rather than a cut?
It's .8g per pound of lean mass, not total body weight. Your .5/.6g per pound of total body weight is probably very close to the .8g per pound of lean mass.
You need more protein on a cut than a recomp.0 -
WestCoastJo82 wrote: »So I'm not especially good at getting in my protein. I'm closer to .5/.6g per lb body weight rather than the recommended .8. Does that make a difference whether or not I should recomp vs cut?
I've been maintaining for 2+ years, but have really been thinking that I'd really like to lose a bit more body fat. Problem is my upper body is pretty lean, so I've started SL 5X5, thinking a recomp and more muscle on my chest (and hopefully less fat on my lower half) will give me the look I'm wanting. While maintaining I was doing more of a circuits sort of weight training.
Given I don't eat as much protein as I should though, am I just treading water trying a recomp? Maybe if I cut, what I lose will magically come from the place I'm hoping it will come from and I won't end up looking like Skeletor...
Sorry I'm sort of rambling, but hopefully my basic question is clear: if I'm at the low end for protein, can I still benefit from a recomp rather than a cut?
It's .8g per pound of lean mass, not total body weight. Your .5/.6g per pound of total body weight is probably very close to the .8g per pound of lean mass.
You need more protein on a cut than a recomp.
Great, thanks - I thought it was 1g for lean, .8g for total, so I guess I'm not as far off as I should be. Continuing with my recomp I go!
Again, thanks for responding.
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I am totally not following any particular program right now and haven't really studied the science. What is working for me right now is sticking with my tri coach's workouts (tri specific challenging cardio) and hitting the weight room hard 3x per week (machines only), progressively increasing my weights, and eating what I want (lots of carbs...needed for activity level, and sufficient protein, adequate fats). I am really happy with my progress so far and think this is the permanent way forward for me. Cutting was too hard!0
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I am totally not following any particular program right now and haven't really studied the science. What is working for me right now is sticking with my tri coach's workouts (tri specific challenging cardio) and hitting the weight room hard 3x per week (machines only), progressively increasing my weights, and eating what I want (lots of carbs...needed for activity level, and sufficient protein, adequate fats). I am really happy with my progress so far and think this is the permanent way forward for me. Cutting was too hard!
Doing machines only means you are missing out on the stabilization requirements of free weights. Using machines also means less motor unit recruitment (less bang for your buck).0
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