SUGAR SuGAr SuGAr!!!
Replies
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mantium999 wrote: »Thanks! it's definitely not an addiction, I just can't help feeling the need to fit something sugary into my diet even though I know they're empty calories. I'm on 1400 calories a day right now, and it's easily screwed over by 100 calories here or there. I think I'll go with the Peanut Butter trick or just spend more time in the gym!
A friendly reminder, make sure to properly measure the peanut butter. It is super calorie dense. Not taking into consideration your macros, if you are looking for a treat, and calories are primary concern, 1 serving of peanut butter (2 tablespoons) is roughly 200 calories, while 3 oreos are 160 calories. Just pointing it out to show its not too hard to fit in treats, if you want them.
Someone recently pointed out that if you put the pb jar on a food scale, zero it out, then you can scoop out the grams you want on your spoon and not waste any. PB is precious (and yes, must be measured accurately!).0 -
sixfarmhicks wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
there is no such thing as sugar addiction.
craving does not equal addiction.
if you have evidence of human trials showing a correlation between sugar and addiction, please post said research.
Here is one. Not difficult at all to find evidence of scientific clinical findings on the web.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2235907/
sorry, that is an animal study. I specifically asked for human trials.
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and just for fun I will put this here: http://www.clinicalnutritionjournal.com/article/S0261-5614(09)00239-8/abstract
By considering the relevant literature a series of predictions were examined, derived from the hypothesis that addiction to sucrose consumption can develop. Fasting should increase food cravings, predominantly for sweet items; cravings should occur after an overnight fast; the obese should find sweetness particularly attractive; a high-sugar consumption should predispose to obesity. More specifically predictions based on the hypothesis that addiction to sugar is central to bingeing disorders were developed. Dieting should predate the development of bingeing; dietary style rather than psychological, social and economic factors should be predispose to eating disorders; sweet items should be preferentially consumed while bingeing; opioid antagonists should cause withdrawal symptoms; bingeing should develop at a younger age when there is a greater preference for sweetness.
Results
The above predications have in common that on no occasion was the behaviour predicted by an animal model of sucrose addiction supported by human studies.
Conclusion
There is no support from the human literature for the hypothesis that sucrose may be physically addictive or that addiction to sugar plays a role in eating disorders.
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OP, if you are looking to fit in a daily treat, at 1400 calories, I would suggest loosely following this breakdown:
Breakfast=300 calories
Lunch=350
Snack=200
Dinner=350
Treat=200
There aren't any rules, but if you know you're going to want it, find a way to budget your calories so you're left with a decent amount for anything you want.0 -
Funny about sugar addiction: a relative visiting my house said she "couldn't" eat a certain food because she's addicted to sugar and will go crazy overeating if she has one of those particular items. I looked at the food's label: 0 sugar. She assumed there was sugar because of the type of food it was, but there isn't any. She just really likes it. That is different than "addiction"!0
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nvsmomketo wrote: »there is no such thing as sugar addiction.
craving does not equal addiction.
if you have evidence of human trials showing a correlation between sugar and addiction, please post said research.
Human trials is the problem. Research in this area is in its infancy still. It takes just seconds to find something on other animals though.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2714381/
I am pretty sure that you know this though.
I know that craving does not equal addiction. A craving is a strong desire for something. I have craving for a good book or tast burger. I don't feel physically ill when I don't get those.
I may crave certain types of sugar laden food, but I believe it is the sugar I have an issue with.
I'm of the opinion that just because science doesn't say it is so yet, it does not mean that there is not an addictive like response there.
Just because the doctor said I did not have celiac disease as a child, because I was not scawny and short for my age, does not mean I didn't have it. Science caught up and I was diagnosed 30 years later.
sorry rats/rodents do not equal humans..
and most of the designs of those studies have shown to be flawed either by methodology or dosage.
Yes, I know rats do not equal humans, which is why I implied that finding human trials is a problem - we're not there yet. First we test on animals and then, when they find enough money and support, they move on to humans.
I would diasagree that most of the designs of those studies are flawed. Some are yes, but most? Not that I know of.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »there is no such thing as sugar addiction.
craving does not equal addiction.
if you have evidence of human trials showing a correlation between sugar and addiction, please post said research.
Human trials is the problem. Research in this area is in its infancy still. It takes just seconds to find something on other animals though.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2714381/
I am pretty sure that you know this though.
I know that craving does not equal addiction. A craving is a strong desire for something. I have craving for a good book or tast burger. I don't feel physically ill when I don't get those.
I may crave certain types of sugar laden food, but I believe it is the sugar I have an issue with.
I'm of the opinion that just because science doesn't say it is so yet, it does not mean that there is not an addictive like response there.
Just because the doctor said I did not have celiac disease as a child, because I was not scawny and short for my age, does not mean I didn't have it. Science caught up and I was diagnosed 30 years later.
sorry rats/rodents do not equal humans..
and most of the designs of those studies have shown to be flawed either by methodology or dosage.
Yes, I know rats do not equal humans, which is why I implied that finding human trials is a problem - we're not there yet. First we test on animals and then, when they find enough money and support, they move on to humans.
I would diasagree that most of the designs of those studies are flawed. Some are yes, but most? Not that I know of.
just review the above study that the user posted about rat model.
IT says that rates were deprived for 12 hours of food and then they were given access to a sugary substance for 12 hours a day. They then repeat this for thirty days.
What do you think the conclusion is.
Hmmm, after thirty days the rats showed signs of addictive behavior. Yea, because you deprived them of food for 12 hours a day for 30 days and gave them access to only sugar. So of course when you went back to a "normal eating pattern" they still chose the sugar, because animals act on instinct and they were trained over 30 days to feed on sugar and nothing else. So the design influenced the outcome.0 -
When I crave something sugary I have something sugary. Try to work on portion control instead of trying to restrict yourself. After tracking for a while you can get a pretty good idea of what your eating habits are. Adjust them to make room for the things you like.0
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And I have to be in because sugar threads always turn into dumpster fires and I have to put them out
And why is this? People seem very protective of their sugar around here - I was quite surprised by this when I joined.
It's not as though people are saying that no one should eat sugar. Some of us are simply saying that sugar is a problem for us. For me, it is a medical issue too. If I save a few hundred calories for Oreos or ice cream, it will negatively impact my health. I don't think anyone has said that others should restrict it.
I've tried to explain that sugar appears to cause symptoms (in me) that are associated with addiction. I know there are no human trials to prove, or disprove, this because it hasn't been done yet, as far as I know. For me, it is more than a simple craving - those are easier to handle in my experience.
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nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »And I have to be in because sugar threads always turn into dumpster fires and I have to put them out
And why is this? People seem very protective of their sugar around here - I was quite surprised by this when I joined.
It's not as though people are saying that no one should eat sugar. Some of us are simply saying that sugar is a problem for us. For me, it is a medical issue too. If I save a few hundred calories for Oreos or ice cream, it will negatively impact my health. I don't think anyone has said that others should restrict it.
I've tried to explain that sugar appears to cause symptoms (in me) that are associated with addiction. I know there are no human trials to prove, or disprove, this because it hasn't been done yet, as far as I know. For me, it is more than a simple craving - those are easier to handle in my experience.
look, if you have a medical condition then you should avoid, reduce, restrict, etc sugar.
For the rest of the population with no condition they can consume sugar, lose weight/maintain weight, and be healthy.
Just do a search of 21 day sugar challenge, or sugar detox, and you will see what we are talking about.
Also, there are a lot of newbies on this site who think that if they consume sugar it is going to make them fat, even in a deficit; or, that it is somehow unhealthy to do so. So the more experienced members are just trying to correct the record for people that are new.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »there is no such thing as sugar addiction.
craving does not equal addiction.
if you have evidence of human trials showing a correlation between sugar and addiction, please post said research.
Human trials is the problem. Research in this area is in its infancy still. It takes just seconds to find something on other animals though.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2714381/
I am pretty sure that you know this though.
I know that craving does not equal addiction. A craving is a strong desire for something. I have craving for a good book or tast burger. I don't feel physically ill when I don't get those.
I may crave certain types of sugar laden food, but I believe it is the sugar I have an issue with.
I'm of the opinion that just because science doesn't say it is so yet, it does not mean that there is not an addictive like response there.
Just because the doctor said I did not have celiac disease as a child, because I was not scawny and short for my age, does not mean I didn't have it. Science caught up and I was diagnosed 30 years later.
sorry rats/rodents do not equal humans..
and most of the designs of those studies have shown to be flawed either by methodology or dosage.
Yes, I know rats do not equal humans, which is why I implied that finding human trials is a problem - we're not there yet. First we test on animals and then, when they find enough money and support, they move on to humans.
I would diasagree that most of the designs of those studies are flawed. Some are yes, but most? Not that I know of.
just review the above study that the user posted about rat model.
IT says that rates were deprived for 12 hours of food and then they were given access to a sugary substance for 12 hours a day. They then repeat this for thirty days.
What do you think the conclusion is.
Hmmm, after thirty days the rats showed signs of addictive behavior. Yea, because you deprived them of food for 12 hours a day for 30 days and gave them access to only sugar. So of course when you went back to a "normal eating pattern" they still chose the sugar, because animals act on instinct and they were trained over 30 days to feed on sugar and nothing else. So the design influenced the outcome.
That's one study...0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
To be honest, I believe people's health would be better off without any added sugar in their lives, and by eating lower carbs, but people are going to do what they want. Many people do not become ill from sugar, but many do.
I ate sugar until it became the devil for me. LOL If it hadn't become a health issue (prediabetes and exacerbating autoimmune issues), I would still be drinking my colas and saving a few calories for candy.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
My favorite claim is still "sugar causes cancer." Or the ever present boogey man of "your fine now, but in 20 years sugar will wreck your health."0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
My favorite claim is still "sugar causes cancer." Or the ever present boogey man of "your fine now, but in 20 years sugar will wreck your health."
I haven't seen the sugar causes cancer yet. I personally have been told that in 20 years sugar will make me look like I am in my 70's.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »there is no such thing as sugar addiction.
craving does not equal addiction.
if you have evidence of human trials showing a correlation between sugar and addiction, please post said research.
Human trials is the problem. Research in this area is in its infancy still. It takes just seconds to find something on other animals though.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2714381/
I am pretty sure that you know this though.
I know that craving does not equal addiction. A craving is a strong desire for something. I have craving for a good book or tast burger. I don't feel physically ill when I don't get those.
I may crave certain types of sugar laden food, but I believe it is the sugar I have an issue with.
I'm of the opinion that just because science doesn't say it is so yet, it does not mean that there is not an addictive like response there.
Just because the doctor said I did not have celiac disease as a child, because I was not scawny and short for my age, does not mean I didn't have it. Science caught up and I was diagnosed 30 years later.
sorry rats/rodents do not equal humans..
and most of the designs of those studies have shown to be flawed either by methodology or dosage.
Yes, I know rats do not equal humans, which is why I implied that finding human trials is a problem - we're not there yet. First we test on animals and then, when they find enough money and support, they move on to humans.
I would diasagree that most of the designs of those studies are flawed. Some are yes, but most? Not that I know of.
just review the above study that the user posted about rat model.
IT says that rates were deprived for 12 hours of food and then they were given access to a sugary substance for 12 hours a day. They then repeat this for thirty days.
What do you think the conclusion is.
Hmmm, after thirty days the rats showed signs of addictive behavior. Yea, because you deprived them of food for 12 hours a day for 30 days and gave them access to only sugar. So of course when you went back to a "normal eating pattern" they still chose the sugar, because animals act on instinct and they were trained over 30 days to feed on sugar and nothing else. So the design influenced the outcome.
That's one study...
Ok - and I used it to prove my point.
show me any Rat study and you will see that most of them are designed that way.
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nvsmomketo wrote: »It's not as though people are saying that no one should eat sugar.
It's because people frequently say ridiculous, unscientific things about sugar and weight loss that should be corrected, and then they claim that anyone who eats sugar must not eat anything but donuts (or sometimes Twinkies). Thus, no good discussion is had.
Sometimes it's not just sugar, but carbs in general.
Good times.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
To be honest, I believe people's health would be better off without any added sugar in their lives, and by eating lower carbs, but people are going to do what they want. Many people do not become ill from sugar, but many do.
I ate sugar until it became the devil for me. LOL If it hadn't become a health issue (prediabetes and exacerbating autoimmune issues), I would still be drinking my colas and saving a few calories for candy.
funny I eat added sugar and carbs and my blood work is nearly perfect and I maintain anywhere from 12 to 15% body fat...0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
My favorite claim is still "sugar causes cancer." Or the ever present boogey man of "your fine now, but in 20 years sugar will wreck your health."
Often from people who eat almost no vegetables. Amusing.0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
My favorite claim is still "sugar causes cancer." Or the ever present boogey man of "your fine now, but in 20 years sugar will wreck your health."
I haven't seen the sugar causes cancer yet. I personally have been told that in 20 years sugar will make me look like I am in my 70's.
oh it is out there...
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diannethegeek wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
My favorite claim is still "sugar causes cancer." Or the ever present boogey man of "your fine now, but in 20 years sugar will wreck your health."
I haven't seen the sugar causes cancer yet. I personally have been told that in 20 years sugar will make me look like I am in my 70's.
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diannethegeek wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
My favorite claim is still "sugar causes cancer." Or the ever present boogey man of "your fine now, but in 20 years sugar will wreck your health."
I haven't seen the sugar causes cancer yet. I personally have been told that in 20 years sugar will make me look like I am in my 70's.
oh it is out there...
Oh I'm sure it is. Nothing seems to surprise me anymore
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nvsmomketo wrote: »And I have to be in because sugar threads always turn into dumpster fires and I have to put them out
And why is this? People seem very protective of their sugar around here - I was quite surprised by this when I joined.
It's not as though people are saying that no one should eat sugar. Some of us are simply saying that sugar is a problem for us. For me, it is a medical issue too. If I save a few hundred calories for Oreos or ice cream, it will negatively impact my health. I don't think anyone has said that others should restrict it.
I've tried to explain that sugar appears to cause symptoms (in me) that are associated with addiction. I know there are no human trials to prove, or disprove, this because it hasn't been done yet, as far as I know. For me, it is more than a simple craving - those are easier to handle in my experience.
We aren't protective over sugar. We argue against the fear mongering that happens with all sugar threads. If you would actually follow any of us OGs you would see we all preach similar ideas, that one should try to get 80 to 90% of their calories from whole food sources and the rest can be something you enjoy/treat. Now if said certain treats are triggers for you (i.e. a sleeve of thin mints) then you should abstain from that trigger food until you can learn control.
The rest of the argument is semantics (is it sugar addiction, is it a behavoiral/emotional disorder, etc..). And what generally happens someone will come in with extreme examples (all broccoli vs sugar ) to compare it for health. And overall ignoring context of diet. And the better scientific studies i have seen would suggest hyperpalatble foods arent physically addiction but rather they are emotional reward.
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The rest of the argument is semantics (is it sugar addiction, is it a behavoiral/emotional disorder, etc..). And what generally happens someone will come in with extreme examples (all broccoli vs sugar ) to compare it for health. And overall ignoring context of diet. And the better scientific studies i have seen would suggest hyperpalatble foods arent physically addiction but rather they are emotional reward.
Sweeps in for the save. Nice! 0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
To be honest, I believe people's health would be better off without any added sugar in their lives, and by eating lower carbs, but people are going to do what they want. Many people do not become ill from sugar, but many do.
I ate sugar until it became the devil for me. LOL If it hadn't become a health issue (prediabetes and exacerbating autoimmune issues), I would still be drinking my colas and saving a few calories for candy.
And that is your belief. There are bigger things that will have an impact of your health, genetics being a big one.
Interesting enough i read something recently regarding jack lalanne and his brother. Jack was into health and wellness his whole life while his brother wasnt. Guess who died first?
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nvsmomketo wrote: »
Actually, it's because people like you derail these threads with either nonsense, or (in this case) personal anecdotal evidence that has nothing to do with the original post. Then people like us have to make sure that newbies know that this isn't the case for most people, and that they are not 'addicted' to sugar.
OP, glad you have the right attitude I keep little 10g chocolate animals in my cupboard. 57 calories and kills the craving for anything bigger. 0 -
@psulemon I dont know if you should use Jack Lalanne as an example. I just read this. I am making light of it and dont know how true this is. But thought it was interesting.
Sugar-Addicted Juvenile Delinquent
Jack LaLanne was a self-described sugarholic kid, hooked on junk food:
“As a kid,” he flatly states, “I was a sugarholic and a junk food junkie! It made me weak and it made me mean. It made me so sick I had boils, pimples and suffered from nearsightedness. Little girls used to beat me up. My mom prayed… the Church prayed.”
He blamed his bad diet for attacking his brother with an axe and setting the family house on fire. At 15, his mother took him to see a talk by nutritionist Paul Bragg, and Jack reformed his eating habit and became interested in fitness.0 -
nvsmomketo wrote: »nvsmomketo wrote: »
There have been numerous threads that have popped up basically saying "sugar is the devil" and it should be avoided.
That being said, if someone is craving something sweet, I fully believe in trying to incorporate into the diet some how rather than making it a restriction. (pending medical conditions of course)
To be honest, I believe people's health would be better off without any added sugar in their lives, and by eating lower carbs, but people are going to do what they want. Many people do not become ill from sugar, but many do.
I ate sugar until it became the devil for me. LOL If it hadn't become a health issue (prediabetes and exacerbating autoimmune issues), I would still be drinking my colas and saving a few calories for candy.
And that is your belief. There are bigger things that will have an impact of your health, genetics being a big one.
Yep. Another big one being exercise. And an overall healthy diet.
Macro percentages are pretty irrelevant if you compare traditional diets.0 -
i have a post workout protein shake. chocolate protein powder, vanilla almond milk, and PB2. it takes care of my sweet tooth sometimes.0
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You call it being protective, I call it being rational...nvsmomketo wrote: »And I have to be in because sugar threads always turn into dumpster fires and I have to put them out
And why is this? People seem very protective of their sugar around here - I was quite surprised by this when I joined.
It's not as though people are saying that no one should eat sugar. Some of us are simply saying that sugar is a problem for us. For me, it is a medical issue too. If I save a few hundred calories for Oreos or ice cream, it will negatively impact my health. I don't think anyone has said that others should restrict it.
I've tried to explain that sugar appears to cause symptoms (in me) that are associated with addiction. I know there are no human trials to prove, or disprove, this because it hasn't been done yet, as far as I know. For me, it is more than a simple craving - those are easier to handle in my experience.
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This discussion has been closed.
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