All pills are not snake oil
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Alluminati wrote: »Alluminati wrote: »This turned into my favorite thread. It's been awhile.
There's one way to make it better ....
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NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.0 -
I don't know what repels bears but I know it's not beets. Fact. Bears eat beets.
That's great information! I love beets, but not in bear country (not anymore). Sometimes knowing what not to do is more important than knowing what to do (kinda like this thread). :laugh:nutmegoreo wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
It. Doesn't. Work. There is as much conversation to be had as there is about the tiger repelling prowess of skittles.
I have nothing constructive to add, which is sad considering I wasted precious minutes of my life reading this thing.
To make it productive I feel I must ask... If skittles repel tigers, what will repel bears? I am going camping in bear country in the coming weeks, and would like to know what I can safely take to protect myself. Would I eat the skittles as a preventive measure, or throw them at the creature during an attack?
Maybe I should just stay home with my shiny silver hat
I think skittles could make a decent tiger and bear repellent. Bengal tigers attack their prey by sneaking up from behind, which is why people working in the areas where tigers live will wear masks on the backs of their heads to repel tigers. So you should be able to construct a decent tiger repellent "mask" by gluing skittles to the back of your head in the shape of a face. Maybe you could use snake oil as the glue? To repel bears, I recommend you construct a noisemaker out of your skittles so the bears hear you coming and you don't accidentally sneak up on a bear and surprise them.
Fortunately, I am clumsy enough that I'm not likely to sneak up on any bear.
Unfortunately, I am not very artistic, and my snake oil/skittle face would likely look a lot like this:
Would that work?0 -
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strong_curves wrote: »
Alien, Predator, The Thing (I don't even recognize the other failed attempt and fell asleep in the theater) - all favs.
When I was stationed at McMurdo during a winter over we lost comms with one of the outlying stations - and yes, a camp of Norwegian scientists. We demanded flamethrowers before starting any Search and Rescue mission. The entire sortie was nothing but The Thing quotes.0 -
And be sure the cookies are each individually weighed and all the macros written on the container.UltimateRBF wrote: »NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Oh there's totally a cult. Didn't you get the group text? We're doing a ceremony at midnight tonight under the light of the moon. Bring cookies.0 -
UltimateRBF wrote: »NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Oh there's totally a cult. Didn't you get the group text? We're doing a ceremony at midnight tonight under the light of the moon. Bring cookies.
This is especially hilarious since it's a new moon tonight...0 -
I guess that's the one scenario in which Holy Grail and Airplane quotes would rightfully take a back seat. Unless it was something like, "Looks like I picked the wrong week to get possessed by an alien" or "Are you suggesting Things migrate?"strong_curves wrote: »
Alien, Predator, The Thing (I don't even recognize the other failed attempt and fell asleep in the theater) - all favs.
When I was stationed at McMurdo during a winter over we lost comms with one of the outlying stations - and yes, a camp of Norwegian scientists. We demanded flamethrowers before starting any Search and Rescue mission. The entire sortie was nothing but The Thing quotes.
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UltimateRBF wrote: »NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Oh there's totally a cult. Didn't you get the group text? We're doing a ceremony at midnight tonight under the light of the moon. Bring cookies.
Don't forget the goat.0 -
That's the keto cult.UltimateRBF wrote: »NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Oh there's totally a cult. Didn't you get the group text? We're doing a ceremony at midnight tonight under the light of the moon. Bring cookies.
Don't forget the goat.
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Stop telling the truth you vicious b*stards!!
It's not fair that you're trying to stop people going through the same mistakes you did. Why should they have an easy ride?!
OP, if you really want to discuss pills, I suggest you join bodybuilding.com They would happily inject stuff in their eyeballs if someone says it's good. You'll fit right in.0 -
UltimateRBF wrote: »NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Oh there's totally a cult. Didn't you get the group text? We're doing a ceremony at midnight tonight under the light of the moon. Bring cookies.
I will bring the double stuff oreos.. but generally, they don't allows mods to come.. Apparently, we don't play well with others.
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UltimateRBF wrote: »NoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Oh there's totally a cult. Didn't you get the group text? We're doing a ceremony at midnight tonight under the light of the moon. Bring cookies.
Can I come if I bring some Talenti?0 -
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That's myNoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Yea that's my point. This thread wasn't about specific supplements people just somehow assumed that was my agenda.0 -
Cico cult? Gee, I wonder who could've called it that
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That's myNoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Yea that's my point. This thread wasn't about specific supplements people just somehow assumed that was my agenda.0 -
UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
You can be disturbed if you want to. The number of prescription meds my brother was given for lupus and the damage it caused is even more disturbing. So is the accident my friend got in when she didn't know she was driving while on ambien. And so is the fact that people think if it's prescribed it's automatically ok. Michael Jackson thought the same thing.0 -
And don't get me stUltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
And don't get me started on methadone. You have no clue.0 -
That's myNoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Yea that's my point. This thread wasn't about specific supplements people just somehow assumed that was my agenda.
Within the entire 15 pages of your rant, you never clearly defined what you mean by pills. And in those 15 pages, many of us explained which supplements work (and are proven by science - caffeine, creatine, whey, vitamins associated with deficiencies) and which ones don't work (green tea extracts, fat burners, etc..). The issue is, you continuously put all pills in categories. Which is wrong.
And at this point, I don't even know what the point of this thread is anymore as nothing was ever clearly defined. But if you want to clarify any of the 50 unanswered questions, we would love to listen.
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And oh my God close supervision? You nwUltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
And oh my God, close supervision? You better damn well trust your doc with your life like Michael did. you HAVE to know there are tons of docs that overprescribe. I used to think people with medical marijuana cards had terminal illnesses only. Ha! That's naivety at it's finest.0 -
UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
You can be disturbed if you want to. The number of prescription meds my brother was given for lupus and the damage it caused is even more disturbing. So is the accident my friend got in when she didn't know she was driving while on ambien. And so is the fact that people think if it's prescribed it's automatically ok. Michael Jackson thought the same thing.
So the solution for that is to ensure that people are educated on the risks of prescription drugs -- not to block access to those drugs for people who could truly benefit from them. My brother has an anxiety disorder. Prescription drugs, along with therapy, allowed him to resume his normal life. He shouldn't have them because Michael Jackson was a drug addict who paid doctors to bend the rules for him?0 -
UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
You can be disturbed if you want to. The number of prescription meds my brother was given for lupus and the damage it caused is even more disturbing. So is the accident my friend got in when she didn't know she was driving while on ambien. And so is the fact that people think if it's prescribed it's automatically ok. Michael Jackson thought the same thing.
No, people understand the risk associated with perscription drugs. It's literally on the bottle or included in the package you get. That same thing is NOT applied to supplements. My friend is a pediatric cardiologist and she can't even begin to tell you how many of her patients come into the practice because they developed heart issues taking supplements. So yea, supplements are just as bad.
0 -
UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.UltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
You can be disturbed if you want to. The number of prescription meds my brother was given for lupus and the damage it caused is even more disturbing. So is the accident my friend got in when she didn't know she was driving while on ambien. And so is the fact that people think if it's prescribed it's automatically ok. Michael Jackson thought the same thing.
No, people understand the risk associated with perscription drugs. It's literally on the bottle or included in the package you get. That same thing is NOT applied to supplements. My friend is a pediatric cardiologist and she can't even begin to tell you how many of her patients come into the practice because they developed heart issues taking supplements. So yea, supplements are just as bad.
Not to mention the people who may harm themselves taking supplements (due to false promises/advertising) instead of seeking proper medical care.0 -
My supplement of choice
0 -
And oh my God close supervision? You nwUltimateRBF wrote: »discretekim wrote: »I think the problem is many of them are dangerous and people don't always realize it as they are not regulated by the Fda. Why do they have jaundice warnings?? A healthy diet is much safer. And does work. People can do suppliments but they should be adequately informed. And why take the risk if you don't need to
Most if the drugs you see class actions for were sold to, i mean regulated by, the fda at one point. Frankly I'd be less bothered by a loved one taking green tea extract than adipex, xanax, ambien, methadone, dilaudid, etc. They push prescription pills like mad with horrible side effects.
Xanax, Ambien, methadone, Dilaudid and the like have risks, absolutely. They are prescribed under a Dr's close supervision.
But they're actual medications that have been actually proven to work for treating actual legitimate serious health conditions.
The fact you'd rather see a family member waste their time with useless green tea pills or something but wouldn't want them to see relief from say, crippling anxiety or insomnia or severe pain or opiate addiction because-Oh No, Big Pharma!
Is disturbing.
And oh my God, close supervision? You better damn well trust your doc with your life like Michael did. you HAVE to know there are tons of docs that overprescribe. I used to think people with medical marijuana cards had terminal illnesses only. Ha! That's naivety at it's finest.
Are you honestly using Michael Jackson to support why people should not take prescription drugs? Really?0 -
I've alrrwThat's myNoIdea101NoIdea wrote: »
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
How is saying "abc doesn't work, save your money", condescending?
If they followed your method, they'd be upset by being told abc doesn't work, you can lose weight for free just by eating at a deficit.
Plus, we have had these conversations so, so many times. Would it also be condescending to tell the OP to just use the search function? Can guarantee that none of our opinions on the several hundred threads about it would have changed!
I don't think there's in conversation in here that hasn't been had. But you're dammed if you do damned if you don't unless you're posting a "how hot is the person above you" thread apparently. If you post on an old topic they're like "we had this conversation already look it up" but if you do that and comment they're like "why are you reopening this old thread" smh apparently the boards have to go only the exact way certain people say.
I take solace in all the private messages from people, which I just discovered you can get today, who agree with me and have been put off by the bullying and negative attitudes. "Cico cult" as someone called it, that's a new one but made me laugh. But wouldn't encourage them to post their concerns publicly they know they'll just be called obese snake oil salesman or made up friends. It's okay though. People are more comfortable around like minded people and it's easier to push away people who disagree than to be accepting of differences so i can't expect better from such a large group.
There isn't a CICO cult. CICO is a mathematical equation that all bodies abide by. But what many of us understand, that science suggest that most pills are absolutely worthless. If you actually posted a thread regarding specific supplements or provided any type of scientific proof, this thread would be much different.
Yea that's my point. This thread wasn't about specific supplements people just somehow assumed that was my agenda.
Within the entire 15 pages of your rant, you never clearly defined what you mean by pills. And in those 15 pages, many of us explained which supplements work (and are proven by science - caffeine, creatine, whey, vitamins associated with deficiencies) and which ones don't work (green tea extracts, fat burners, etc..). The issue is, you continuously put all pills in categories. Which is wrong.
And at this point, I don't even know what the point of this thread is anymore as nothing was ever clearly defined. But if you want to clarify any of the 50 unanswered questions, we would love to listen.
I've already said i don't support any supplements. I don't know enough about them to make any claims. I don't claim to be an expert like people have said i do. I have had success with adipex and metabolife but don't recommend due to the risks and side effects. I think people could have a different approach to their advising if they really care about new people listening. I think it's reckless to comment on things you're not informed about.
Other than that what question do you feel is unanswered?0 -
"All pills are not snake oil." That's the title of this thread. Did anyone else have to take a basic logic course in college? Because if "all pills are not snake oil" is true, then we can reason that there are no pills that are snake oil. Except that the OP seems to think that there are pills that are snake oil; she just believes that they're the kind prescribed by doctors and supplements are safe and okay. And now I'm confused and thinking that this thread is headed into very dangerous advice territory.0
This discussion has been closed.
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