Relationships and Age (May be Offensive To Some)
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Lots of responses! (Some angry too...)
Alright, I'm NOT interested in a relationship/dating or ANYTHING right now, for literally at least another decade. So that's that. I know I don't have ANY life experience, of course I wouldn't! I'm just curious to know what y'all think and so I asked this question.
I guess it all comes down to the fact that it depends on the couple themselves, and that they learn how to handle the dynamic of their respective families and the way it plays into their relationship. And I still strongly believe there's a power rule in a couple, and I don't buy into the 'We love each other and we're equal' view. Sorry.
As for me being narcissistic, or cynical, I'm just talking from what I've seen, which is very limited, since I'm not that old at all. Experiences will change me, sure, but I'm definitely willing to stand by my opinion that love has a motive.0 -
I think as we age we become more forgiving of peoples' imperfections and in that regard we may find things acceptable that were once unthinkable. I believe it's a matter of maturity and being able to correctly identify what matters most to a person in their spouse without considering superficial concerns such as looks, money and family tree.
I wouldn't say family tree is much of a superficial concern. Excessive interference in the couple's marriage is certainly something no one wants (which is what some of the wives in these couples have complained about).
I was referencing your original post where the accomplishments of in-laws was a consideration... perhaps "family tree" wasn't the right term.
Oh, in that case, let me clarify. The parents of the groom feel inferior to the parents of the bride, and there is constantly a tension to live up to their expectations, and compete with them. They act snobby around the parents of the bride, and It's quite disgusting actually.
I'm not sure who is getting married but it sounds as if you have some particular situation in mind. I would say that the problem you're describing comes primarily from a difference in class. If someone that is lower-middle class marries someone that is upper-middle class then there is often tension between families due to differences in traditions that have long been associated with the amount of money available to create them. One family may have pizza night every Friday while the other goes out for sushi every Friday. Hair dye at home from a box vs. in a salon/spa. That sort of thing... the accomplishments of one family do not outweigh the value of the other though. Some of the nicest people I've ever known have been poorer than dirt.
That was the situation with one of my relatives, and still is. I agree- accomplishments are accomplishments. But the parents of the groom don't seem to realize that, and they make things hell for the two. When I mean accomplished, I mean, the spouses should be at pretty much the same status (e.g. career, intellectual capacity, etc.). It makes it harder on the couple when there's a difference in status, so why not find a wholesome relationship without the need for such petty clashes? It's almost like you're getting yourself into such a situation that's full of problems, and you KNOW that before you make the commitment, right?
You're making it sound like you always have a choice in who you fall in love with. Not true. Not true at all. You may find yourself deeply in love with someone who you would never have imagined.0 -
I really love being single and wouldn't change it for anyone right now. So even if the hottest, richest, most accomplished person ever proposed to me, I would tell them no. It's not worth my freedom. If I am older when I meet someone I genuinely care about, and they are less accomplished and less attractive than said "hottest smartest person alive" I would not say I was settling. I would say I was looking for different things, because I met them in different stages of my life.0
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Lots of responses! (Some angry too...)
Alright, I'm NOT interested in a relationship/dating or ANYTHING right now, for literally at least another decade. So that's that. I know I don't have ANY life experience, of course I wouldn't! I'm just curious to know what y'all think and so I asked this question.
I guess it all comes down to the fact that it depends on the couple themselves, and that they learn how to handle the dynamic of their respective families and the way it plays into their relationship. And I still strongly believe there's a power rule in a couple, and I don't buy into the 'We love each other and we're equal' view. Sorry.
As for me being narcissistic, or cynical, I'm just talking from what I've seen, which is very limited, since I'm not that old at all. Experiences will change me, sure, but I'm definitely willing to stand by my opinion that love has a motive.
i think that the term "settling" is a misnomer. what actually happens as you get older is that the characteristics you value in another person change. when i was 18, it honestly didn't matter too much whether i could hold an interesting 3 hour conversation with a woman. now it does. there are all sorts of traits that you look for when you are 18 that end up not being as important when you're 30 or 40 or 50 years old, and vice versa.
so you don't "settle", you simply get wiser about the things that truly need to be there in order to find long term compatibility with somebody else.0 -
I think as we age we become more forgiving of peoples' imperfections and in that regard we may find things acceptable that were once unthinkable. I believe it's a matter of maturity and being able to correctly identify what matters most to a person in their spouse without considering superficial concerns such as looks, money and family tree.
I wouldn't say family tree is much of a superficial concern. Excessive interference in the couple's marriage is certainly something no one wants (which is what some of the wives in these couples have complained about).
I was referencing your original post where the accomplishments of in-laws was a consideration... perhaps "family tree" wasn't the right term.
Oh, in that case, let me clarify. The parents of the groom feel inferior to the parents of the bride, and there is constantly a tension to live up to their expectations, and compete with them. They act snobby around the parents of the bride, and It's quite disgusting actually.
I'm not sure who is getting married but it sounds as if you have some particular situation in mind. I would say that the problem you're describing comes primarily from a difference in class. If someone that is lower-middle class marries someone that is upper-middle class then there is often tension between families due to differences in traditions that have long been associated with the amount of money available to create them. One family may have pizza night every Friday while the other goes out for sushi every Friday. Hair dye at home from a box vs. in a salon/spa. That sort of thing... the accomplishments of one family do not outweigh the value of the other though. Some of the nicest people I've ever known have been poorer than dirt.
That was the situation with one of my relatives, and still is. I agree- accomplishments are accomplishments. But the parents of the groom don't seem to realize that, and they make things hell for the two. When I mean accomplished, I mean, the spouses should be at pretty much the same status (e.g. career, intellectual capacity, etc.). It makes it harder on the couple when there's a difference in status, so why not find a wholesome relationship without the need for such petty clashes? It's almost like you're getting yourself into such a situation that's full of problems, and you KNOW that before you make the commitment, right?
You're making it sound like you always have a choice in who you fall in love with. Not true. Not true at all. You may find yourself deeply in love with someone who you would never have imagined.
That's the thing. I think love is a stopgap of sorts. A person comes into your life at a time when you have a certain void/need and that person fills it. But if it were anyone else, you'd get attached and feel the same way. So love is really only a way of fulfilling our needs, I think. We can get attached to anyone who fulfills our needs.0 -
In my opinion, experiences influence decisions...especially as we get older however, the heart is often a strong influence sometimes confusing the need for companionship as love. People must do what they feel is best within and without a relationship. If it's right then keep at it; if it's wrong then move on.
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Lots of responses! (Some angry too...)
Alright, I'm NOT interested in a relationship/dating or ANYTHING right now, for literally at least another decade. So that's that. I know I don't have ANY life experience, of course I wouldn't! I'm just curious to know what y'all think and so I asked this question.
I guess it all comes down to the fact that it depends on the couple themselves, and that they learn how to handle the dynamic of their respective families and the way it plays into their relationship. And I still strongly believe there's a power rule in a couple, and I don't buy into the 'We love each other and we're equal' view. Sorry.
As for me being narcissistic, or cynical, I'm just talking from what I've seen, which is very limited, since I'm not that old at all. Experiences will change me, sure, but I'm definitely willing to stand by my opinion that love has a motive.
i think that the term "settling" is a misnomer. what actually happens as you get older is that the characteristics you value in another person change. when i was 18, it honestly didn't matter too much whether i could hold an interesting 3 hour conversation with a woman. now it does. there are all sorts of traits that you look for when you are 18 that end up not being as important when you're 30 or 40 or 50 years old, and vice versa.
so you don't "settle", you simply get wiser about the things that truly need to be there in order to find long term compatibility with somebody else.
In the eyes of someone else, you may be settling. But in your eyes, you're content with what you've got. It's a matter of perspective, I guess.0 -
Lots of responses! (Some angry too...)
Alright, I'm NOT interested in a relationship/dating or ANYTHING right now, for literally at least another decade. So that's that. I know I don't have ANY life experience, of course I wouldn't! I'm just curious to know what y'all think and so I asked this question.
I guess it all comes down to the fact that it depends on the couple themselves, and that they learn how to handle the dynamic of their respective families and the way it plays into their relationship. And I still strongly believe there's a power rule in a couple, and I don't buy into the 'We love each other and we're equal' view. Sorry.
As for me being narcissistic, or cynical, I'm just talking from what I've seen, which is very limited, since I'm not that old at all. Experiences will change me, sure, but I'm definitely willing to stand by my opinion that love has a motive.
It's actually normal for young people to have a somewhat narcissistic view of the world. It is what gives them the confidence to break free and go out into the world and try everything they need to. And all people go through it (to varying degrees) and all people mature and grow.
I don't think people are responding angry here. That is your perception.
I was not saying that you were narcissistic, I was just saying the scenario you described was of a world full of narcissists.
You are right that you are young, so there does seem to be a lot of misunderstanding here both in the views you are presenting and in your reaction to the responses in this thread. But, maybe this can be part of your learning experience. If you are willing to be open to listening.
Also, I don't see why you think you need to wait until you are 28 to have relationships. Go out and enjoy life and have relationships and learn about relationships through experience and learn about yourself and grow and have fun with people.
This is the internet. I don't know you. I don't understand you or what this experience with this friend with some kind of bad relationship is (honestly I've not read this whole thread closely enough or taken the time to analyze these strangers relationships that aren't even here to comment).
And you are very lucky that you had a Dad that you love and that loves you. Not everyone has been so lucky.0 -
I didn't become engaged (and planning a wedding in 2014) until I was 46 years old. I have to say that the man I'm with now is more accomplished (owns a very successful recruiting firm), and is just as good looking as the other 2 men that has proposed to me in the past (one when I was in my mid 20's and the other mid 30's).
I loved them, but I just wasn't convinced that it would last, even though at the time I was head over heels. With the man I'm with now, we've been together for 7 years, and I'm 99% sure that we will grow old together.
I think that every age group has people that settle. The younger ones settle because they don't know if something better will come along, and the older ones settle because they're just tired of being alone.
I'm happy to say that I don't belong to either...
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Well statistically speaking the more educated and older a woman is the less likely she will find a partner. So yes if yes I believe you have to settle. Combine that with biological clocks ticking in the 30's with less than attractive physical features and be happy with the crumbs life gives you. If you dont want to settle then expect being single for many years.
Then again I think getting married too young is also a bad idea. There is a happy medium and that age is 24-27.
Wow! So the older and better educated I am, the more likely I am to stay single. That doesn't really bother me now, but if someone had said that to me five years ago, I might have made a different decision about pursuing my degree. :ohwell:
You know what doing a few internet searches it seems like what I learned in Sociology 101 some years ago has completely changed in fact marriage rates for college educated women in their 30's is growing.
Looking first at women of all races, we see that after age 30 college graduates pull ahead in the percentage currently married - even though they don't catch up with the two education groups right below them in the percentage ever married until their late 30s. By age 40 college graduates are significantly ahead of the two education groups right behind them in the percentage currently married, while female high school dropouts remain way behind. About 75% of college graduates are married at age 40, compared to about 70% of those who attained high school or some college and only about 60% of those who didn't complete high school. In yet another historical reversal, women with less than a high school education are the least likely to be currently married at all ages after 30.
http://www.contemporaryfamilies.org/marriage-partnership-divorce/fact-sheet-marriage-and-education.html
I dont know anything about this organization, but it seems to be consistent with what other sources are saying
I suspect economy is to blame. It is much harder than it used to be to support a family on a single income. Men are looking for women that can pull their own weight financially. And of course, it is a given that the better educated you are, the more money you can make.
Sorry I can't find the article. But I read somewhere that while overall marriage rates are falling. Marriage rates among educated middle and upper class have actually increased. That makes sense to me. I've been married 11 years and I don't think it's a concidence that the fondest parts of our marriage were when we were financially comfortable. Economics may have more to do with mariage in 2013 that a lot of people want to admit.0 -
Well statistically speaking the more educated and older a woman is the less likely she will find a partner. So yes if yes I believe you have to settle. Combine that with biological clocks ticking in the 30's with less than attractive physical features and be happy with the crumbs life gives you. If you dont want to settle then expect being single for many years.
Then again I think getting married too young is also a bad idea. There is a happy medium and that age is 24-27.
Wow! So the older and better educated I am, the more likely I am to stay single. That doesn't really bother me now, but if someone had said that to me five years ago, I might have made a different decision about pursuing my degree. :ohwell:
This is what I think too. I find that people DO settle because who REALLY wants an equal partner? It's human nature to want to be the best and if your spouse is by your side, and has accomplished much more than you have, wouldn't it make you feel like *kitten*? One person is usually always on a pedestal in the relationship (if it's a stable one of course), and it depends on the dynamic of the two. How many times have you seen two highly accomplished people stay married for long? It always seems like they clash so much, and drift apart. Seems to me like in all the successful relationships, one is always more accomplished than the other and even if the other doesn't admit it, they certainly feel it in their heart.
If all people have narcissistic personality disorder and they don't. You have some kind of biased info and not enough life experience.
This, and WOW! someone will never have a healthy relationship until they lose this attitude! Your life partner is just that. He/ She is your equal, and you stand by one another. Seriously way off!!!
I think she was actually thinking more in terms of financial provision and has not considered what non-monetary benefits that the bride is bringing to the relationship. She's just young... cut her some slack. She's trying to understand how relationships work and doesn't have the life experience to fully grasp it.
Non-monetary benefits that the bride brings the the relationship...... WHAT!........ Monetary has nothing to do with a successful marriage.... and what if it's the bride that has the money.....successful relationships are built on trust, communication, compromise, and supporting each others decisions. The bride being the traditional lesser in the relation ship is CRAP** you are equals period.... Just b/c one person monitors the bank, and the other monitors the children,..... or one works and the other does not .... neither is superior to the other. YOUR A TEAM...it takes two to tango..... bottom line if one person is on a pedestal this is not going to bode for a healthy relationship.....Do you honestly think a millionaire who's wife stays at home is any lesser in that marriage? No she orchestrates everything at home so he does not have to worry about how the household runs so he can concentrate on work. She plans his social gatherings, manages the staff, and often children. She is his partner. He looks to her for advice, and values her opinions. She is equal to him....just a different part of the same job.... TEAM MATES. You work TOGETHER TO MAKE A WHOLE.0 -
Lots of responses! (Some angry too...)
Alright, I'm NOT interested in a relationship/dating or ANYTHING right now, for literally at least another decade. So that's that. I know I don't have ANY life experience, of course I wouldn't! I'm just curious to know what y'all think and so I asked this question.
I guess it all comes down to the fact that it depends on the couple themselves, and that they learn how to handle the dynamic of their respective families and the way it plays into their relationship. And I still strongly believe there's a power rule in a couple, and I don't buy into the 'We love each other and we're equal' view. Sorry.
As for me being narcissistic, or cynical, I'm just talking from what I've seen, which is very limited, since I'm not that old at all. Experiences will change me, sure, but I'm definitely willing to stand by my opinion that love has a motive.
i think that the term "settling" is a misnomer. what actually happens as you get older is that the characteristics you value in another person change. when i was 18, it honestly didn't matter too much whether i could hold an interesting 3 hour conversation with a woman. now it does. there are all sorts of traits that you look for when you are 18 that end up not being as important when you're 30 or 40 or 50 years old, and vice versa.
so you don't "settle", you simply get wiser about the things that truly need to be there in order to find long term compatibility with somebody else.
In the eyes of someone else, you may be settling. But in your eyes, you're content with what you've got. It's a matter of perspective, I guess.
Because at 18, you know more than someone that is 50?0 -
if anything, i have to say that the OP has a fantastic vocabulary and writes very articulately for an 18 year old. so many other young people (and folks in their 20s/30s/40s and beyond) on MFP can't seem to string a sentence together. so, yeah. three cheers for you in that department 0
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This, and WOW! someone will never have a healthy relationship until they lose this attitude! Your life partner is just that. He/ She is your equal, and you stand by one another. Seriously way off!!!
Nope I dont think there is equality in relationships someone will always make more, provide more financially, provide more emotionally, provide more sexually, or vice versa. I accept that I'm more educated and will always be the bread winner. Not that I wouldnt love being a stay at home wife, but thats not what I chose with my current partner. He will never equal me in many respects just like I wont equal him.0 -
if anything, i have to say that the OP has a fantastic vocabulary and writes very articulately for an 18 year old. so many other young people (and folks in their 20s/30s/40s and beyond) on MFP can't seem to string a sentence together. so, yeah. three cheers for you in that department
this is what i was thinking bagging on OP for being 18, but I think the OP is starting to get a pretty realistic grasp on relationships. Better than some of the flaky posts I've seen where these women are naively staying with abusive spouses.
OP its not cynicism its realism.0 -
I totally agree that it has less to with lowering expectations, and more to do with a change in what you find attractive or desireable in life. In my 20 I dated a lot. I was very attracted to the guys, but would never consider marrying them. They were fun, unpredictable and all that, but I DIDN'T want to be married. Then, in my 30s I decided that I wanted to start a family. That decision led to a gigantic shift in what I found attractive. I now cherish loyalty, kindness and stability. I wouldn't say I settled, I would say I've changed; matured.
This only much earlier then 30. Pregnancy changed my priorities real fast.0 -
And OP, since you're 18 and this topic interests you. I think you'll like this article. It's three years old, and it that last three years these trends have solidified.
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/07/the-end-of-men/308135/0 -
if anything, i have to say that the OP has a fantastic vocabulary and writes very articulately for an 18 year old. so many other young people (and folks in their 20s/30s/40s and beyond) on MFP can't seem to string a sentence together. so, yeah. three cheers for you in that department
this is what i was thinking bagging on OP for being 18, but I think the OP is starting to get a pretty realistic grasp on relationships. Better than some of the flaky posts I've seen where these women are naively staying with abusive spouses.
OP its not cynicism its realism.
Not all relationships are abusive. I grew up being abused in my mother's poor relationship choices.
For myself I chose very differently, and took the time and awareness. And it is mutual love. Not a motive. I feel sad for anyone that can not believe that.0 -
This, and WOW! someone will never have a healthy relationship until they lose this attitude! Your life partner is just that. He/ She is your equal, and you stand by one another. Seriously way off!!!
Nope I dont think there is equality in relationships someone will always make more, provide more financially, provide more emotionally, provide more sexually, or vice versa. I accept that I'm more educated and will always be the bread winner. Not that I wouldnt love being a stay at home wife, but thats not what I chose with my current partner. He will never equal me in many respects just like I wont equal him.
When I first read this I wanted so badly to attack your way of thinking. However once i really thought about what you were saying and how, im assuming, you meant it I agree.
A relationship isnt about equality it is about a partnership each individual brings something the other does not have. It is the combination of both strengths and weaknesses that make a successful partnership and therefore a successful relationship...in my opinion.0 -
Well statistically speaking the more educated and older a woman is the less likely she will find a partner. So yes if yes I believe you have to settle. Combine that with biological clocks ticking in the 30's with less than attractive physical features and be happy with the crumbs life gives you. If you dont want to settle then expect being single for many years.
Then again I think getting married too young is also a bad idea. There is a happy medium and that age is 24-27.
Wow! So the older and better educated I am, the more likely I am to stay single. That doesn't really bother me now, but if someone had said that to me five years ago, I might have made a different decision about pursuing my degree. :ohwell:
This is what I think too. I find that people DO settle because who REALLY wants an equal partner? It's human nature to want to be the best and if your spouse is by your side, and has accomplished much more than you have, wouldn't it make you feel like *kitten*? One person is usually always on a pedestal in the relationship (if it's a stable one of course), and it depends on the dynamic of the two. How many times have you seen two highly accomplished people stay married for long? It always seems like they clash so much, and drift apart. Seems to me like in all the successful relationships, one is always more accomplished than the other and even if the other doesn't admit it, they certainly feel it in their heart.
If all people have narcissistic personality disorder and they don't. You have some kind of biased info and not enough life experience.
This, and WOW! someone will never have a healthy relationship until they lose this attitude! Your life partner is just that. He/ She is your equal, and you stand by one another. Seriously way off!!!
I think she was actually thinking more in terms of financial provision and has not considered what non-monetary benefits that the bride is bringing to the relationship. She's just young... cut her some slack. She's trying to understand how relationships work and doesn't have the life experience to fully grasp it.
Non-monetary benefits that the bride brings the the relationship...... WHAT!........ Monetary has nothing to do with a successful marriage.... and what if it's the bride that has the money.....successful relationships are built on trust, communication, compromise, and supporting each others decisions. The bride being the traditional lesser in the relation ship is CRAP** you are equals period.... Just b/c one person monitors the bank, and the other monitors the children,..... or one works and the other does not .... neither is superior to the other. YOUR A TEAM...it takes two to tango..... bottom line if one person is on a pedestal this is not going to bode for a healthy relationship.....Do you honestly think a millionaire who's wife stays at home is any lesser in that marriage? No she orchestrates everything at home so he does not have to worry about how the household runs so he can concentrate on work. She plans his social gatherings, manages the staff, and often children. She is his partner. He looks to her for advice, and values her opinions. She is equal to him....just a different part of the same job.... TEAM MATES. You work TOGETHER TO MAKE A WHOLE.
Yes... that was my point... this is what the OP is grappling with considering that she has never actually been in a relationship.0
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