Aren't you a little tired of the "Obesity Epidemic"?

BinaryPulsar

BMI does take frame size into account. That's why there are ranges.

No, it doesn't. BMI takes only *2* factors into account. Height & Weight. That's it. Period.

Matt_Wild

This thread is full of semantics - you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

In my lifetime it has gone from the odd person I remember being over weight, to nearly half of the people I see. Heck in the school yard there was usually just one or two overweight kids. Now you you go in and there is huge numbers.

And of course, MFP is full of people looking to do something about it, but usually when shopping I see huge amounts of junk going into peoples trolleys... what you are doing and eating doesn't apply to the general populace. Peoples shopping baskets/trolleys show this. And the supermarkets have this data to back it up.

The shelves are full of junk too - because thats what people are buying - they stock what will sell. Its a fact, not a made up issue.

barboryte1

It's sad how everything is turning out. I used to be healthy weight and now I am considered obese. I am stunned at how I was able to go from size 2 to size 12 in 5 years. I was stunned when my trainer showed me the fat layers, the increased health risks and level of obesity. All we can do, is use this as motivation for ourselves: eat healthy, exercise and change your attitude. One person one day at a time.

coreyreichle

BMI does take frame size into account. That's why there are ranges.

No, it doesn't. BMI takes only *2* factors into account. Height & Weight. That's it. Period.

If that was true, as you say, they would be no ranges for "healthy", "overweight", and "obese".

It does take "frame sizes" into account, which is why a BMI of 18.5-14.9is healthy. If it didn't take frame size into account, it would be: BMI of 22 is healthy. Everything else is bad.

belinus

If that was true, as you say, they would be no ranges for "healthy", "overweight", and "obese".

If it was not true, it would ask for other measurements besides height and weight.

CrazyTrackLady

This thread is full of semantics - you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

In my lifetime it has gone from the odd person I remember being over weight, to nearly half of the people I see. Heck in the school yard there was usually just one or two overweight kids. Now you you go in and there is huge numbers.

And of course, MFP is full of people looking to do something about it, but usually when shopping I see huge amounts of junk going into peoples trolleys... what you are doing and eating doesn't apply to the general populace. Peoples shopping baskets/trolleys show this. And the supermarkets have this data to back it up.

The shelves are full of junk too - because thats what people are buying - they stock what will sell. Its a fact, not a made up issue.

I live in an area in the US where there is a high rate of obesity. It's alarming. And being a teacher, I see it more and more among the young children, from kindergarten up and through middle school (I teach in a k-8). One of the subjects I teach is health. I have the kids spend an entire month working on a project where they compare the nutritional information of similar fast food menu items. They then have to report their findings to the rest of the class. They learn about fat, sodium, sugar and caloric content. They learn maximum and minimum requirements. They learn that it isn't what you eat as much as it is how much you eat. They learn that exercise is important.

I'm trying very hard to educate my 6th grade students and build in them an understanding that right now, at THEIR age, is the time when their bodies begin to change. And the decisions and choices they make today will come back to affect them in the future. As much influence as I might have, it simply boils down to this: parents need to be the change they want in their kids. Without parental buy in, support and modeling, today's chubby kids will be tomorrow's obese adults.

Gearjammer71

The crux of the issue is that the vast majority of obese people know they are obese, know they eat too much, know they exercise too little; and yet don't care.

Why don't they care? Because everyone assumes they are a special snowflake, and we've been pounding some notion that it's ok to be fat, just to love yourself.

That was me! I was going to be the fat guy that nothing bad was going to happen to. When I was in my 30's I was arrogant enough to think that I was a "healthy fat-person". Great blood pressure, super low cholesterol, everything was just great. When I hit 40, things went South in a hurry. I had to start wearing a cpap mask to sleep, and take pills to keep my blood pressure down. Now I have a new pill to keep my blood sugar in check. Great! I let myself go from being a 30 year-old to a 60 year-old, just like that.

shannashannabobana

The BMI standards, unlike the blood pressure and diabetes standards, have not been changed at all.

They were upped in 98. Many people have posted links on this.

In my experience, it's quite hard to convince a parent that there is _anything_ wrong with their kids.

Most of my family members are the exact opposite of this, as far as health is concerned.

you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

THIS. So much.

allisonrinkel

I hope we all know that part of the reason that "Everyone is overweight" is that they changed the standards of the BMI -- I think around 2000 --- so that all these people who were considered average were now overweight.

I didn't know that but, yep, I just loooked it up. They changed it in 1998. I've never paid that much attention to mine. I use a mirror. If I look fat, I figure I probably am.

I'm very fortunate, though. I didn't get the little genetic particle that makes people care what other people think or say to them. I used to get comments that I was overweight. Now I get them that I'm too skinny. That's their problem.

You're awesome.

Yup!

allisonrinkel

This thread is full of semantics - you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

In my lifetime it has gone from the odd person I remember being over weight, to nearly half of the people I see. Heck in the school yard there was usually just one or two overweight kids. Now you you go in and there is huge numbers.

And of course, MFP is full of people looking to do something about it, but usually when shopping I see huge amounts of junk going into peoples trolleys... what you are doing and eating doesn't apply to the general populace. Peoples shopping baskets/trolleys show this. And the supermarkets have this data to back it up.

The shelves are full of junk too - because thats what people are buying - they stock what will sell. Its a fact, not a made up issue.

I live in an area in the US where there is a high rate of obesity. It's alarming. And being a teacher, I see it more and more among the young children, from kindergarten up and through middle school (I teach in a k-8). One of the subjects I teach is health. I have the kids spend an entire month working on a project where they compare the nutritional information of similar fast food menu items. They then have to report their findings to the rest of the class. They learn about fat, sodium, sugar and caloric content. They learn maximum and minimum requirements. They learn that it isn't what you eat as much as it is how much you eat. They learn that exercise is important.

I'm trying very hard to educate my 6th grade students and build in them an understanding that right now, at THEIR age, is the time when their bodies begin to change. And the decisions and choices they make today will come back to affect them in the future. As much influence as I might have, it simply boils down to this: parents need to be the change they want in their kids. Without parental buy in, support and modeling, today's chubby kids will be tomorrow's obese adults.

I believe health should be taught to all kids everywhere so that we can grow a society of kids who know the dangers of an unhealthy diet and what that means for your body. Kids don't get obese on their own, because usually it's not the 6 y/o doing the groceries! Education is power.

BinaryPulsar

BMI does take frame size into account. That's why there are ranges.

No, it doesn't. BMI takes only *2* factors into account. Height & Weight. That's it. Period.

If that was true, as you say, they would be no ranges for "healthy", "overweight", and "obese".

It does take "frame sizes" into account, which is why a BMI of 18.5-14.9is healthy. If it didn't take frame size into account, it would be: BMI of 22 is healthy. Everything else is bad.

This is correct, on average, and by keeping the chart within that range it is a safe range for most people. Some people will fall .1 or more out of the range and it's no reason to freak out. The doctor evaluates it based on the individual: how they look, what their blood tests say, body composition, past history of their size, family history of size to account for genetics.

xinit0

I hope we all know that part of the reason that "Everyone is overweight" is that they changed the standards of the BMI -- I think around 2000 --- so that all these people who were considered average were now overweight. Part of the reason I don't like all this talk is that it doesn't take into consideration the "why" rather than the "how."

I'm sure it's been mentioned already...

"In 1998, the U.S. National Institutes of Health and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention brought U.S. definitions into line with World Health Organization guidelines, lowering the normal/overweight cut-off from BMI 27.8 to BMI 25." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index

This didn't magically CHANGE people - it changed the classification of a population. The CDC and the NIH certainly didn't do it on a whim, either. I'm sure there are people who would have pushed to have the cut-off raised to 30, but so what? It's a number.

CrazyTrackLady

This thread is full of semantics - you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

In my lifetime it has gone from the odd person I remember being over weight, to nearly half of the people I see. Heck in the school yard there was usually just one or two overweight kids. Now you you go in and there is huge numbers.

And of course, MFP is full of people looking to do something about it, but usually when shopping I see huge amounts of junk going into peoples trolleys... what you are doing and eating doesn't apply to the general populace. Peoples shopping baskets/trolleys show this. And the supermarkets have this data to back it up.

The shelves are full of junk too - because thats what people are buying - they stock what will sell. Its a fact, not a made up issue.

I live in an area in the US where there is a high rate of obesity. It's alarming. And being a teacher, I see it more and more among the young children, from kindergarten up and through middle school (I teach in a k-8). One of the subjects I teach is health. I have the kids spend an entire month working on a project where they compare the nutritional information of similar fast food menu items. They then have to report their findings to the rest of the class. They learn about fat, sodium, sugar and caloric content. They learn maximum and minimum requirements. They learn that it isn't what you eat as much as it is how much you eat. They learn that exercise is important.

I'm trying very hard to educate my 6th grade students and build in them an understanding that right now, at THEIR age, is the time when their bodies begin to change. And the decisions and choices they make today will come back to affect them in the future. As much influence as I might have, it simply boils down to this: parents need to be the change they want in their kids. Without parental buy in, support and modeling, today's chubby kids will be tomorrow's obese adults.

I believe health should be taught to all kids everywhere so that we can grow a society of kids who know the dangers of an unhealthy diet and what that means for your body. Kids don't get obese on their own, because usually it's not the 6 y/o doing the groceries! Education is power.

You're preaching to the choir, darlin'. :flowerforyou:

Unfortunately, we need the parents to buy into this idea. Parents are a child's FIRST and MOST POWERFUL influence in regards to behavior and habits. Teachers can only do so much. And the nano-second a parent is told by ANYONE that what they're feeding their child is "bad", the first response given is "it's none of YOUR business what I feed MY kid". So, mandating healthy eating won't work, and we all know government needs to stay out of our personal choices, right?

No adult wants to be told what to do - that's a fact. So, they continue to participate in destructive behaviors, and they procreate and raise their children "as best they can or know", and then the vicious cycle continues again and again and again.

And then decades later, voila -- a society of morbidly obese adults and obese children -- who are wondering "How did we get to this place?" and a government that wants us to do something about it, but won't mandate it for fear of lost votes and accusations of "being too into our business".

It's a real Catch-22, isn't it?

coreyreichle

If that was true, as you say, they would be no ranges for "healthy", "overweight", and "obese".

If it was not true, it would ask for other measurements besides height and weight.

Let me guess? You're another special snowflake, who is a "healthy fat"?

Hexahedra

This thread is full of semantics - you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

In my lifetime it has gone from the odd person I remember being over weight, to nearly half of the people I see. Heck in the school yard there was usually just one or two overweight kids. Now you you go in and there is huge numbers.

And of course, MFP is full of people looking to do something about it, but usually when shopping I see huge amounts of junk going into peoples trolleys... what you are doing and eating doesn't apply to the general populace. Peoples shopping baskets/trolleys show this. And the supermarkets have this data to back it up.

The shelves are full of junk too - because thats what people are buying - they stock what will sell. Its a fact, not a made up issue.

I live in an area in the US where there is a high rate of obesity. It's alarming. And being a teacher, I see it more and more among the young children, from kindergarten up and through middle school (I teach in a k-8). One of the subjects I teach is health. I have the kids spend an entire month working on a project where they compare the nutritional information of similar fast food menu items. They then have to report their findings to the rest of the class. They learn about fat, sodium, sugar and caloric content. They learn maximum and minimum requirements. They learn that it isn't what you eat as much as it is how much you eat. They learn that exercise is important.

I'm trying very hard to educate my 6th grade students and build in them an understanding that right now, at THEIR age, is the time when their bodies begin to change. And the decisions and choices they make today will come back to affect them in the future. As much influence as I might have, it simply boils down to this: parents need to be the change they want in their kids. Without parental buy in, support and modeling, today's chubby kids will be tomorrow's obese adults.

I believe health should be taught to all kids everywhere so that we can grow a society of kids who know the dangers of an unhealthy diet and what that means for your body. Kids don't get obese on their own, because usually it's not the 6 y/o doing the groceries! Education is power.

You're preaching to the choir, darlin'. :flowerforyou:

Unfortunately, we need the parents to buy into this idea. Parents are a child's FIRST and MOST POWERFUL influence in regards to behavior and habits. Teachers can only do so much. And the nano-second a parent is told by ANYONE that what they're feeding their child is "bad", the first response given is "it's none of YOUR business what I feed MY kid". So, mandating healthy eating won't work, and we all know government needs to stay out of our personal choices, right?

No adult wants to be told what to do - that's a fact. So, they continue to participate in destructive behaviors, and they procreate and raise their children "as best they can or know", and then the vicious cycle continues again and again and again.

And then decades later, voila -- a society of morbidly obese adults and obese children -- who are wondering "How did we get to this place?" and a government that wants us to do something about it, but won't mandate it for fear of lost votes and accusations of "being too into our business".

It's a real Catch-22, isn't it?

Part of the role of government is to regulate people's behavior when it becomes more detrimental than beneficial to our society. Think of the speed limit on the highway and seat belt requirements for cars. I'm sure somebody at some point argues that people should be free to drive as fast as they want (because they paid for the car with their own money) with or without seat belt, but considering the number of accident casualties on the road it's obvious that many people can't be trusted with the freedom to drive over 70 mph.

The fact that a third of us are obese and another third overweight shows that we aren't doing well with this freedom, and there's a cost to it. The more people get hospitalized for obesity-related illnesses, the more all of us pay for health insurance.

BinaryPulsar

If that was true, as you say, they would be no ranges for "healthy", "overweight", and "obese".

If it was not true, it would ask for other measurements besides height and weight.

Let me guess? You're another special snowflake, who is a "healthy fat"?

Could you try making your points without resorting to using a phrase that makes you sound like a special douche flake?

CrazyTrackLady

This thread is full of semantics - you don't need a BMI scale to see when someone is overweight/obese.

In my lifetime it has gone from the odd person I remember being over weight, to nearly half of the people I see. Heck in the school yard there was usually just one or two overweight kids. Now you you go in and there is huge numbers.

And of course, MFP is full of people looking to do something about it, but usually when shopping I see huge amounts of junk going into peoples trolleys... what you are doing and eating doesn't apply to the general populace. Peoples shopping baskets/trolleys show this. And the supermarkets have this data to back it up.

The shelves are full of junk too - because thats what people are buying - they stock what will sell. Its a fact, not a made up issue.

I live in an area in the US where there is a high rate of obesity. It's alarming. And being a teacher, I see it more and more among the young children, from kindergarten up and through middle school (I teach in a k-8). One of the subjects I teach is health. I have the kids spend an entire month working on a project where they compare the nutritional information of similar fast food menu items. They then have to report their findings to the rest of the class. They learn about fat, sodium, sugar and caloric content. They learn maximum and minimum requirements. They learn that it isn't what you eat as much as it is how much you eat. They learn that exercise is important.

I'm trying very hard to educate my 6th grade students and build in them an understanding that right now, at THEIR age, is the time when their bodies begin to change. And the decisions and choices they make today will come back to affect them in the future. As much influence as I might have, it simply boils down to this: parents need to be the change they want in their kids. Without parental buy in, support and modeling, today's chubby kids will be tomorrow's obese adults.

I believe health should be taught to all kids everywhere so that we can grow a society of kids who know the dangers of an unhealthy diet and what that means for your body. Kids don't get obese on their own, because usually it's not the 6 y/o doing the groceries! Education is power.

You're preaching to the choir, darlin'. :flowerforyou:

Unfortunately, we need the parents to buy into this idea. Parents are a child's FIRST and MOST POWERFUL influence in regards to behavior and habits. Teachers can only do so much. And the nano-second a parent is told by ANYONE that what they're feeding their child is "bad", the first response given is "it's none of YOUR business what I feed MY kid". So, mandating healthy eating won't work, and we all know government needs to stay out of our personal choices, right?

No adult wants to be told what to do - that's a fact. So, they continue to participate in destructive behaviors, and they procreate and raise their children "as best they can or know", and then the vicious cycle continues again and again and again.

And then decades later, voila -- a society of morbidly obese adults and obese children -- who are wondering "How did we get to this place?" and a government that wants us to do something about it, but won't mandate it for fear of lost votes and accusations of "being too into our business".

It's a real Catch-22, isn't it?

Part of the role of government is to regulate people's behavior when it becomes more detrimental than beneficial to our society. Think of the speed limit on the highway and seat belt requirements for cars. I'm sure somebody at some point argues that people should be free to drive as fast as they want (because they paid for the car with their own money) with or without seat belt, but considering the number of accident casualties on the road it's obvious that many people can't be trusted with the freedom to drive over 70 mph.

The fact that a third of us are obese and another third overweight shows that we aren't doing well with this freedom, and there's a cost to it. The more people get hospitalized for obesity-related illnesses, the more all of us pay for health insurance.

Unfortunately, this is a topic that won't get much government intervention because of backlash. Look what happened in NY with the whole "supersized soda" issue -- it was met with angry mobs demanding the mayor's resignation for being so bold as to tell people they can't get big sodas anymore. How DARE HE???

There are a lot of suggestions out there to change school system lunches. While this is great, it won't work either because the kids will just refuse to eat the healthier foods and resort to bringing their crap from home.

PARENTS need to step it up and make better choices for their children and enforce better eating habits. We need to cut this monster off at its' head, and that head is the one who sits at the head of the table.

stardancer7

When you see documentary footage shot in the fifties and sixties, people look skinny. The two things I noticed immediately when looking at 'mission control' footage for example--not a woman in sight and skinny men wearing ties.

aliencheesecake

It's tempting to blame society instead of examining our own issues. The BMI model is more relevant at the population level, which is why you can have very muscular people with a BMI that indicates they are overweight or obese. However, most people are not that muscular. And when you look at the BMI of your average American, it is too high.

I think it's reasonable to ask whether a high BMI is inherently a bad thing. That's what nutritional science has to establish, which it has. A BMI of 30 or above is linked to numerous health issues and a shorter lifespan, while a BMI of 25 or less leads to much better outcomes. That's good enough to conclude that being obese is not good for your health and has little to do with aesthetic reasons, such as not wanting to see fat people.

Thank you. As tired as I am of women (and men too, but especially women) being held to ridiculous body standards, I'm also tired of ppl not owning their behavior. There is such a thing as going to far with the idea of "loving and accepting" your body. It's not meant to be an excuse to be complacent about health. There is a reason we are warned not to be overweight or obese by our doctors, and it goes beyond aesthetics. It's bad for your joints, your heart, and a host of every fat perso othern body symptoms. Why SHOULD they change the standards of weight and size, just because a larger number of people are an unhealthy weight? I know it's hard to lose weight, but denying it by saying it's "normal" to be bi

BinaryPulsar

I just want to say that I have mentioned that people can fall slightly outside of the "healthy range" of the BMI, on either end, and still be both fit and healthy. There are many factors (as have been discussed extensively on mfp). But, you can tell by looking at oneself if you are over-fat or underweight (plus the evaluations by the doctor that I mentioned above). Sometimes in my adult life I have fallen below what is considered to be the conventionally understood "healthy range". I am small framed and have always been fit and active as a dancer (and never ate a low calorie diet). And all my doctors have said that I am extremely healthy, not underweight, and that I am healthier slightly below than if I were to be slightly above. Because I do have a very small frame. The upper limit of the healthy BMI is not a healthy limit for me as an individual. And that is the reason there is a wide range on the BMI range. It's not intended for one person, it is intended for people of different frames and various other factors. But, it's not a perfect science that applies fully to all people. People with an extra small frame can fall below and people with a larger from can fall above (and I mean slightly). It is a guideline, not the absolute be all and end all to be applied without common sense.