Welcome to Debate Club! Please be aware that this is a space for respectful debate, and that your ideas will be challenged here. Please remember to critique the argument, not the author.
Apple Cider Vinegar
Replies
-
It will also work as a laxative, therefore clearing out your GI. So it would make it seem like you are losing weight when really you are just emptied out.
I personally love vinegar on all sorts of food for the flavor. I grew up putting salt and white vinegar on french fries down at the Old Orchard Beach pier in Maine.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »Science says if a natural remedy works it gets used in actual medicine. If it isn't that's a pretty sure sign that any potential benefit to it is too small to matter. Science says there is no property to vinegar that makes you lose weight. Science says anything ACV might be able to do, any other vinegar would do the same, as would most other acidic things.
Yet you say "well, scientists were wrong before, maybe it isn't like that actually".
Yet you tell someone to stop saying body frames are mostly the same because of science. What would you do if she told you "well scientists were wrong before."?
No. science has nothing to do with it. There are about 3 pages of people saying they have a bigger or smaller bone structure than their friend or sister whatever. People know their bone structure, if they have or have had low body fat yet still had large wrists or shoulders or hips etc then they know that their bones are larger. Same as some people I know have teeny weeny little wrists no matter how much fat they have, they still have smaller hips/ shoulders/ wrists
I don't need a scientist to tell me that we all have different sized bones to each other0 -
johnnygizmo wrote: »It will also work as a laxative, therefore clearing out your GI. So it would make it seem like you are losing weight when really you are just emptied out.
I personally love vinegar on all sorts of food for the flavor. I grew up putting salt and white vinegar on french fries down at the Old Orchard Beach pier in Maine.
Growing up, we had a small bottle of distilled ("white") vinegar that would come out once a year to dye Easter eggs. We also had a large bottle of ACV that got used in all kinds of foods, especially hot bacon dressing for spinach or wilted lettuce salads and a homemade cooked salad dressing that we always used instead of mayo or Miracle Whip for deviled eggs, potato salad, etc. My Mom's deviled eggs were always requested at neighborhood or family picnics because of that dressing and the lovely flavor it got from the ACV. I make a pasta salad with that same dressing that is frequently requested.0 -
Sometimes I feel that people on here are so set in their mind of what science says is right that they close their mind to other possibilities. Look once scientists swore the earth was flat and anyone who said otherwise was mocked and ridiculed, then they discovered they were wrong.
Said no scientist ever.
Aristotle showed that the earth was spherical around 330 BCE and Eratothcenes measured the circumference around 50 years later.Once scientists said the atom was the smallest thing in the world and look how that turned out.
Do you have any examples that don't date back to ancient Greece?
Maybe some of this stuff is "woo" as seems to be the popular term on here, but what if it there is more to some of these things. Also don't forget there's a lot of scientific evidence that is not released because let's face it, big pharma want customers not cures, that's how they make their money
I find this hilarious since real doctors don't sell the pharmaceuticals they prescribe, but most naturopaths sell their own snake oil
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that actually works?And for the people who laugh at the suggestion of alternative remedies, they were around way before pharmaceuticals and have successfully treated many ailments, so you might say western medication is the alternative. St. John's wort has treated depression for many years, aloe Vera is one of the most effective treatments for abrasions, stings and burns, lavender can ease headaches and muscular aches plus help sleep etc.
open your minds a little, calling anything and everything woo isn't cool, and you're missing out on a lot of really valid treatment options
Medicine.
0 -
Well I love the stuff and sometimes drink it neat and it's never done me any harm. But it's not magical, I just really like vinegar0
-
Does anyone know where this dietary fad started, anyway?
Personally, I think it's because there are some nutritional merits...like unpasteurized ACV (and fermented foods in general) are beneficial for gut flora...ACV has also shown to be beneficial for diabetics in controlling blood sugar levels (so does a glass of wine with dinner), etc, etc, etc...but for whatever reason people tend to extrapolate out nutritional benefits to mean "weight loss"...probably because people are so focused on that one singular aspect without understanding that not everything regarding health and being healthy and getting nutrition is about weight loss.0 -
Sometimes I feel that people on here are so set in their mind of what science says is right that they close their mind to other possibilities. Look once scientists swore the earth was flat and anyone who said otherwise was mocked and ridiculed, then they discovered they were wrong. Once scientists said the atom was the smallest thing in the world and look how that turned out.
Maybe some of this stuff is "woo" as seems to be the popular term on here, but what if it there is more to some of these things. Also don't forget there's a lot of scientific evidence that is not released because let's face it, big pharma want customers not cures, that's how they make their money
And for the people who laugh at the suggestion of alternative remedies, they were around way before pharmaceuticals and have successfully treated many ailments, so you might say western medication is the alternative. St. John's wort has treated depression for many years, aloe Vera is one of the most effective treatments for abrasions, stings and burns, lavender can ease headaches and muscular aches plus help sleep etc.
open your minds a little, calling anything and everything woo isn't cool, and you're missing out on a lot of really valid treatment options
Actually, knowledgeable people have known the earth is curved for a long time. You can't build something as large as the pyramids without being away the earth has a curve to it.
Also, the idea that science has been wrong before is not an excuse to substitute your own opinion or anecdotal experience. You know what disproved all the previous wrong science? It was better done science, not people being discuss the time they did something and got results similar to just waiting or worse results than using actual known efficacious treatment.0 -
Heartisalonelyhunter wrote: »Well I love the stuff and sometimes drink it neat and it's never done me any harm. But it's not magical, I just really like vinegar
Have you tried kombucha? Especially home-brewed where you can make it even more "vinegar-y" than the commercial stuff.0 -
I use organic apple cider vinegar (with the mother). I put a tsp or two in a cup of water everyday. I had an overgrowth of yeast and it helped rid me of that. I also use it to control acne breakouts.0
-
Woo0
-
Cider vinegar is high in salicylate acid as are garlic, olive oil and many herbs. Many plants use salicylate to protect themselves from moulds and mildews. Consuming a diet rich in fruits and veg with high salicylate values help us maintain good gut flora with many benefits to our bodies by making use of plant biology.
You darling, darling sensible person. But, let's get back to the sparring!!0 -
I've read plenty of articles claiming what ACV can and cannot do and honestly I've used it for homemade cosmetics/creams and it has helped with dry, itchy skin especially when my eczema flairs up. I also used it in a few recipes from time to time and it adds a nice flavor boost but that's about all I would vouch for it.
But hey if its working in some other way for someone else...To each their own. I personally wouldn't drink it for weight loss or keeping worms out of my body. But a good rinse for my hair or facial mask/toner no problem.0 -
DancingDarl wrote: »Not woo, just common knowledge. Apple cider vinegar was the topic and I responded accordingly with my opinion based on FACT. It is known to deter parasites. It is also widely used to deter them.DancingDarl wrote: »This is actually really good for me. I agree with your sister and it helping alkalinity(not sure if that is even a word) of the water. It also kills invasive parasites which let's face it are a huge problem in relation to weight loss and these are the exact measurement U read to drink in water every day to deter parasites like worms surviving in body(they can live in brain too) worms and all kinds parasites survive on sugary acidic conditions. Look into it. Thanks for reminding me I am picking some up today-I use it on my hair too
This section of the forum is where we debate the science of nutrition, not spread woo about parasites, alkalinity and such. If you have some scientific links pointing to invasive parasites and how they affect weight loss (lol), I'm sure everybody would be all ears.
Citation needed0 -
FunkyTobias wrote: »DancingDarl wrote: »Not woo, just common knowledge. Apple cider vinegar was the topic and I responded accordingly with my opinion based on FACT. It is known to deter parasites. It is also widely used to deter them.DancingDarl wrote: »This is actually really good for me. I agree with your sister and it helping alkalinity(not sure if that is even a word) of the water. It also kills invasive parasites which let's face it are a huge problem in relation to weight loss and these are the exact measurement U read to drink in water every day to deter parasites like worms surviving in body(they can live in brain too) worms and all kinds parasites survive on sugary acidic conditions. Look into it. Thanks for reminding me I am picking some up today-I use it on my hair too
This section of the forum is where we debate the science of nutrition, not spread woo about parasites, alkalinity and such. If you have some scientific links pointing to invasive parasites and how they affect weight loss (lol), I'm sure everybody would be all ears.
Citation needed
Agreed.
You're entitled to your own opinion, but you're not entitled to your own facts.0 -
DancingDarl wrote: »Agreed totally and it has been deemed valid :-p forpCider vinegar is high in salicylate acid as are garlic, olive oil and many herbs. Many plants use salicylate to protect themselves from moulds and mildews. Consuming a diet rich in fruits and veg with high salicylate values help us maintain good gut flora with many benefits to our bodies by making use of plant biology.
By whom?
And please stop top-posting0 -
I've not bothered to place any citations because any would come from alternative sites. I fear doing so would only stoke the boilers of opposition to "folk and alternative medicine" rather than add to this conversation. You obviously have not read the links given on the first page of this debate. I found the one presented by a school science competition really interesting.
I could direct you to the SCD site, this comes from a more, Functional Perspective, taking a whole body view not fragmented as in general medicine, so, also decried by many. Search, Selective Carbohydrate Diet. I believe it to be rather didactic in its approach, not everything is right for all, one needs to do what is right for ones self. Only "you" know what feels right for yourself.
Sorry OP. acv can work in many ways if you "need" it to. You will probably only hear from those who have experienced benefits for themselves or have been close to someone who has benefited. Responders are self selecting, those who did not benefit would not necessarily reply.
Tart or sharp foods in the diet are known to improve digestive health. Any mas dietary advice hints towards this.0 -
I've not bothered to place any citations because any would come from alternative sites. I fear doing so would only stoke the boilers of opposition to "folk and alternative medicine" rather than add to this conversation. You obviously have not read the links given on the first page of this debate. I found the one presented by a school science competition really interesting.
I could direct you to the SCD site, this comes from a more, Functional Perspective, taking a whole body view not fragmented as in general medicine, so, also decried by many. Search, Selective Carbohydrate Diet. I believe it to be rather didactic in its approach, not everything is right for all, one needs to do what is right for ones self. Only "you" know what feels right for yourself.
Sorry OP. acv can work in many ways if you "need" it to. You will probably only hear from those who have experienced benefits for themselves or have been close to someone who has benefited. Responders are self selecting, those who did not benefit would not necessarily reply.
Tart or sharp foods in the diet are known to improve digestive health. Any mas dietary advice hints towards this.
Again, plenty of people use it for skin care and very specific issues. However the OP was asking how it could aid in weight loss and I know of no credible source that has proven that acv can improve weight loss in humans. It's very strange extrapolations.0 -
Weight loss is there in the school work if you read far enough.0
-
johnnygizmo wrote: »It will also work as a laxative, therefore clearing out your GI. So it would make it seem like you are losing weight when really you are just emptied out.
I personally love vinegar on all sorts of food for the flavor. I grew up putting salt and white vinegar on french fries down at the Old Orchard Beach pier in Maine.
Growing up, we had a small bottle of distilled ("white") vinegar that would come out once a year to dye Easter eggs. We also had a large bottle of ACV that got used in all kinds of foods, especially hot bacon dressing for spinach or wilted lettuce salads and a homemade cooked salad dressing that we always used instead of mayo or Miracle Whip for deviled eggs, potato salad, etc. My Mom's deviled eggs were always requested at neighborhood or family picnics because of that dressing and the lovely flavor it got from the ACV. I make a pasta salad with that same dressing that is frequently requested.
Ooooh! Share recipes please!0 -
-
0
-
-
The citation I particular like is on the first page of all this. It was a very, very long one to follow. The other links are also well placed and again interesting. I strongly suggest you nay sayers go back and read those links on the first page properly.
May I suggest Tobias has found his place?
I'm out. except for meal suggestions.0 -
The citation I particular like is on the first page of all this. It was a very, very long one to follow. The other links are also well placed and again interesting. I strongly suggest you nay sayers go back and read those links on the first page properly.
May I suggest Tobias has found his place?
I'm out. except for meal suggestions.
What a coincidence. My favorite citation is also on the first page.Wetcoaster wrote: »http://junkfoodscience.blogspot.ca/2008/04/houston-we-have-problem-apple-cider.html
While apple cider vinegar is relatively harmless for most people as normally consumed, believing it can cure, prevent or treat health problems also puts people at risk who are deterred from seeking needed medical care for serious health issues. M.D. Anderson, according to Natural Standard Monograph (2007), also warns that theoretically, long-term use could diminish bone mineral density and interact with and increase the risk of toxicity of cardiac glycoside prescriptions, such as digoxin; and potentiate the potassium-lowering effects of insulin, laxatives and diuretics, such as Lasix.
0 -
FunkyTobias wrote: »
I see what you did there. Let me get Prostetnic Jeltz on the phone to get that re-filed for you. Hope you like poetry.0 -
It works well for a lot of different things. Just have to remember that it's not a magic drink that will make someone lose weight, but if used in combination with an already healthy nutrition and exercise plan it can assist. Also it's great for cooking! I found a local product called Fire Cider. It's apple cider vinegar mixed with a host of other natural ingredients and it's got a nice kick to it. Yum as salad dressing! Years ago I was suffering terribly with arthritis in my hands. I could barely open a door. The pain and swelling along with spasms were horrible! I worked for a long time with my doctor on pain management, anti-inflammatories, etc. Medicated America! Anyway, through a lot of research of alternative meds I found information on the benefits of 'Just black cherry juice' working wonders for my type of arthritis. Despite it having over the top sugar I followed what I read and began taking one shot of the juice every morning. It took a little over two months to start working but it did. I've been fine ever since. That's the other problem with these types of things, people think they're going to work in one or two days or one or two weeks. Some of these old-school medicinal things can take months to start working. Anyway... I love the taste of vinegar and only use rice vinegar on my salads so I have no problem chugging it down. It doesn't hurt and it sure does give me a nice kick in the pants in the morning
0 -
cushman5279 wrote: »It works well for a lot of different things. Just have to remember that it's not a magic drink that will make someone lose weight, but if used in combination with an already healthy nutrition and exercise plan it can assist. Also it's great for cooking! I found a local product called Fire Cider. It's apple cider vinegar mixed with a host of other natural ingredients and it's got a nice kick to it. Yum as salad dressing! Years ago I was suffering terribly with arthritis in my hands. I could barely open a door. The pain and swelling along with spasms were horrible! I worked for a long time with my doctor on pain management, anti-inflammatories, etc. Medicated America! Anyway, through a lot of research of alternative meds I found information on the benefits of 'Just black cherry juice' working wonders for my type of arthritis. Despite it having over the top sugar I followed what I read and began taking one shot of the juice every morning. It took a little over two months to start working but it did. I've been fine ever since. That's the other problem with these types of things, people think they're going to work in one or two days or one or two weeks. Some of these old-school medicinal things can take months to start working. Anyway... I love the taste of vinegar and only use rice vinegar on my salads so I have no problem chugging it down. It doesn't hurt and it sure does give me a nice kick in the pants in the morning
If it took 2 months for you to see a bettering it could have been ANYTHING you did during those 2 months.
This is a perfect example for the post hoc fallacy. 2 months after you started doing something, something else happened and you are attributing it to the thing you want it to be.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »cushman5279 wrote: »It works well for a lot of different things. Just have to remember that it's not a magic drink that will make someone lose weight, but if used in combination with an already healthy nutrition and exercise plan it can assist. Also it's great for cooking! I found a local product called Fire Cider. It's apple cider vinegar mixed with a host of other natural ingredients and it's got a nice kick to it. Yum as salad dressing! Years ago I was suffering terribly with arthritis in my hands. I could barely open a door. The pain and swelling along with spasms were horrible! I worked for a long time with my doctor on pain management, anti-inflammatories, etc. Medicated America! Anyway, through a lot of research of alternative meds I found information on the benefits of 'Just black cherry juice' working wonders for my type of arthritis. Despite it having over the top sugar I followed what I read and began taking one shot of the juice every morning. It took a little over two months to start working but it did. I've been fine ever since. That's the other problem with these types of things, people think they're going to work in one or two days or one or two weeks. Some of these old-school medicinal things can take months to start working. Anyway... I love the taste of vinegar and only use rice vinegar on my salads so I have no problem chugging it down. It doesn't hurt and it sure does give me a nice kick in the pants in the morning
If it took 2 months for you to see a bettering it could have been ANYTHING you did during those 2 months.
This is a perfect example for the post hoc fallacy. 2 months after you started doing something, something else happened and you are attributing it to the thing you want it to be.
And never underestimate our ability and propensity to find correlation where none exists. We're wired to do that which is why good defensible research is so valuable to our understanding of what is truly happening.0 -
jofjltncb6 wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »cushman5279 wrote: »It works well for a lot of different things. Just have to remember that it's not a magic drink that will make someone lose weight, but if used in combination with an already healthy nutrition and exercise plan it can assist. Also it's great for cooking! I found a local product called Fire Cider. It's apple cider vinegar mixed with a host of other natural ingredients and it's got a nice kick to it. Yum as salad dressing! Years ago I was suffering terribly with arthritis in my hands. I could barely open a door. The pain and swelling along with spasms were horrible! I worked for a long time with my doctor on pain management, anti-inflammatories, etc. Medicated America! Anyway, through a lot of research of alternative meds I found information on the benefits of 'Just black cherry juice' working wonders for my type of arthritis. Despite it having over the top sugar I followed what I read and began taking one shot of the juice every morning. It took a little over two months to start working but it did. I've been fine ever since. That's the other problem with these types of things, people think they're going to work in one or two days or one or two weeks. Some of these old-school medicinal things can take months to start working. Anyway... I love the taste of vinegar and only use rice vinegar on my salads so I have no problem chugging it down. It doesn't hurt and it sure does give me a nice kick in the pants in the morning
If it took 2 months for you to see a bettering it could have been ANYTHING you did during those 2 months.
This is a perfect example for the post hoc fallacy. 2 months after you started doing something, something else happened and you are attributing it to the thing you want it to be.
And never underestimate our ability and propensity to find correlation where none exists. We're wired to do that which is why good defensible research is so valuable to our understanding of what is truly happening.
I find this aspect of our cognitive function absolutely amazing and the fact that so few people are aware of it even more so.0 -
BecomingBane wrote: »FunkyTobias wrote: »
I see what you did there. Let me get Prostetnic Jeltz on the phone to get that re-filed for you. Hope you like poetry.
Frood.0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 393.6K Introduce Yourself
- 43.8K Getting Started
- 260.3K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.9K Food and Nutrition
- 47.5K Recipes
- 232.6K Fitness and Exercise
- 431 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.6K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153K Motivation and Support
- 8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.8K MyFitnessPal Information
- 24 News and Announcements
- 1.1K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.6K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions