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Did You / Would You Vax Your Child?

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  • DnarulesDnarules Posts: 1,969Member Member Posts: 1,969Member Member
    earlnabby wrote: »
    tlflag1620 wrote: »
    You cannot get the flu from the flu shot. It is an inactivated virus. The nasal spray, otoh, is a live virus, and it is theoretically possible to get the flu from that, but that is very rare. More than likely, if 93% of the boys you deal with who got the flu shot also got the flu, that means either

    1. They had a really bad cold that they reported as the "flu" or
    2. They contracted the flu before their shot took effect (takes 7-14 days for influenza to incubate, and two weeks for the shot to reach full effectiveness) or
    3. They happened to get a strain of influenza that that year's shot wasn't protecting against or
    4. 78% of statistics are made up on the spot

    I'm betting on a combination of all of the above. But mostly numbers 1 and 4.

    Fwiw - I never got the flu shot until I was 28 years old. Never had the flu. Been getting the flu shot yearly since then. Still never had the flu. So long as we're doing informal "studies".

    Regarding point 3: the flu shot does not protect against every flu virus running around each year, it protects against the most virulent ones going around, ie the ones most likely to cause serious illness or death. That is a misconception about the flu shot. Many people assume it is supposed to protect against ALL influenza. You might still get the flu but you are much less likely to get a strain of flu that can kill you.

    And, the vaccine is not 100% effective. You may still get the flu even if the virus was present in the vaccine, but you are more likely to have a much milder illness. This happened to my daughter. But she still gets the vaccine.
  • DM01234DM01234 Posts: 317Member Member Posts: 317Member Member
    Absolutely 100%.. vax. non-negotiable in my eyes.
  • GaleHawkinsGaleHawkins Posts: 7,630Member Member Posts: 7,630Member Member
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.
  • chunky_pinupchunky_pinup Posts: 759Member Member Posts: 759Member Member
    Read the subject as did you/would you wax your child....I was really excited to read this discussion...
  • WinoGelatoWinoGelato Posts: 13,331Member Member Posts: 13,331Member Member
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.

    I will take my chances with something that benefits billions with the potential risk of harming one.
  • janejellyrolljanejellyroll Posts: 20,809Member Member Posts: 20,809Member Member
    shell1005 wrote: »
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.

    Is that is your standard? You need proof that a vaccine will hurt 0.00% of the population? That doesn't seem realistic.

    By this standard, most of medicine would be off-limits. Even the most helpful treatments and medicines can harm someone (an operation fails for some and the patient may die; someone may have a terrible side effect to a medicine that helps hundreds of other people).
  • janejellyrolljanejellyroll Posts: 20,809Member Member Posts: 20,809Member Member
    htimpaired wrote: »
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.

    . . . you'll have some freak accident and get hit by a car driven by a clown on the lam from the police and die tomorrow.

    And now I've got something else to worry about.
  • kgirlhartkgirlhart Posts: 3,299Member Member Posts: 3,299Member Member
    shell1005 wrote: »
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.

    Is that is your standard? You need proof that a vaccine will hurt 0.00% of the population? That doesn't seem realistic.

    By this standard, most of medicine would be off-limits. Even the most helpful treatments and medicines can harm someone (an operation fails for some and the patient may die; someone may have a terrible side effect to a medicine that helps hundreds of other people).

    My daughter is allergic to penicillin. By that logic no one should ever have a penicillin shot.

    I vaccinated my kids and neither of them have kids yet but they have already said that they will vaccinate their kids too. My dad had polio and he said that he wouldn't wish that on anyone.
  • Alyssa_Is_LosingItAlyssa_Is_LosingIt Posts: 4,684Member Member Posts: 4,684Member Member
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.

    There is risk associated with pretty much every choice we make.

    People are allergic to peanuts, but I wouldn't ban my kids from ever having peanuts just because their airways might close and kill them. Nor would I ban them from trying shellfish because they might have a similar reaction. I drive them to school every day even though we might have a wreck. We let them ride their bikes even though they might fall and paralyze themselves.

    There are people who have allergies to vaccines and react to them, sure. But those are the people who rely on those around them to make the responsible decision to vaccinate so that people who CAN'T get the vaccine will be protected.

    Just like the kids at my son's preschool are not allowed to bring nuts into school to protect those who CAN'T have nuts. That does not mean that I'm going to start an anti-nuts movement.
  • jgnatcajgnatca Posts: 14,495Member Member Posts: 14,495Member Member
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??
    WYMANT0004 wrote: »
    There is no medical proof vaccines are safe and effective.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=effectivness+of+vaccines -- 8610 articles

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=safety+of+vaccines -- 13459 articles

    Care to try again on how there is no medical proof that vaccines are safe and effective??

    Thanks for the links. I should have said there is No Medical Proof that any one vaccination will not harm one.

    You have fallen in to the logical fallacy that two opposing opinions automatically carry the same weight. This is not the first time you've done that. There is overwhelming evidence that vaccinations save millions of lives.

    OUi3FTs.jpg
  • jgnatcajgnatca Posts: 14,495Member Member Posts: 14,495Member Member
    What overwhelming looks like:
    avalanche_on_Hwy15_Nape_norway.jpg

    So if anti-vaxxers are feeling drowned out, there's a reason for that.
  • stevencloserstevencloser Posts: 8,917Member Member Posts: 8,917Member Member
    I wish I could say that I was shocked and surprised there's certain people against vaccines in here.

    But I'm really not.
  • rhtexasgalrhtexasgal Posts: 541Member Member Posts: 541Member Member
    RGv2 wrote: »
    rhtexasgal wrote: »
    I can see both sides of the vaccination equation. My kids are vaccinated but we do so on an individual shot basis rather than the combo ones now. I firmly believe that the MMR did "something" to my now 17 year old son. Before kindergarten (or around that time), he was still getting the combo shots. His personality changed afterward. He went from bubbly and inquisitive to quiet and almost mute for a while. He did not have any autistic tendencies before kindergarten and that last set of combo shots. Now, he has a formal diagnosis of Aspergers and an anxiety disorder. We finally started homeschooling him after elementary school due to too many issues. Today, he is still quiet but is somewhat normal socially (at least at first introduction). It is only when you are around him a while that you truly see something "off." We learned from his issues and stopped the combo shots with his younger brother.

    Our family does not take the flu shot. I am 44 and have never had the flu and neither have my kids. My hubby has only had the flu those times in the Navy when the flu shot was a requirement. When my mother got the shot, she got the flu. She had to get the shot when she was a teacher. 4 years ago, she retired so she stopped getting the flu shot. Guess what? She has not had the flu since! I work with a nonprofit that deals with young boys so I have been around 200+ boys each week for about 17 years. About 10 years ago, I started keeping records of when the boys got sick. It seems that a whopping 93% of the boys who got the flu shot ended up getting the flu. Yeah, this is purely anecdotal but it has been consistent for ten years now!

    I evaluate on a case by case basis and for the most part am pro-vaccine - with some caveats like the single shot at a time versus the combo shots.

    Wait...woah, woah, woah,....she got out of the petri dish of germs that is a school (or daycare) and now all of a sudden isn't getting sick? I didn't get the flu shot for about 10 years either and never missed a day of work, then I had a kid and started sending him to daycare, where conveniently enough he would bring something more than a cold home once in a while and we'd get sick.

    She is still working with children as a volunteer but is no longer required to get the shot (go figure) so she is still exposed to that petri dish of germs as you call it.
  • jgnatcajgnatca Posts: 14,495Member Member Posts: 14,495Member Member
    rhtexasgal wrote: »
    RGv2 wrote: »
    rhtexasgal wrote: »
    I can see both sides of the vaccination equation. My kids are vaccinated but we do so on an individual shot basis rather than the combo ones now. I firmly believe that the MMR did "something" to my now 17 year old son. Before kindergarten (or around that time), he was still getting the combo shots. His personality changed afterward. He went from bubbly and inquisitive to quiet and almost mute for a while. He did not have any autistic tendencies before kindergarten and that last set of combo shots. Now, he has a formal diagnosis of Aspergers and an anxiety disorder. We finally started homeschooling him after elementary school due to too many issues. Today, he is still quiet but is somewhat normal socially (at least at first introduction). It is only when you are around him a while that you truly see something "off." We learned from his issues and stopped the combo shots with his younger brother.

    Our family does not take the flu shot. I am 44 and have never had the flu and neither have my kids. My hubby has only had the flu those times in the Navy when the flu shot was a requirement. When my mother got the shot, she got the flu. She had to get the shot when she was a teacher. 4 years ago, she retired so she stopped getting the flu shot. Guess what? She has not had the flu since! I work with a nonprofit that deals with young boys so I have been around 200+ boys each week for about 17 years. About 10 years ago, I started keeping records of when the boys got sick. It seems that a whopping 93% of the boys who got the flu shot ended up getting the flu. Yeah, this is purely anecdotal but it has been consistent for ten years now!

    I evaluate on a case by case basis and for the most part am pro-vaccine - with some caveats like the single shot at a time versus the combo shots.

    Wait...woah, woah, woah,....she got out of the petri dish of germs that is a school (or daycare) and now all of a sudden isn't getting sick? I didn't get the flu shot for about 10 years either and never missed a day of work, then I had a kid and started sending him to daycare, where conveniently enough he would bring something more than a cold home once in a while and we'd get sick.

    She is still working with children as a volunteer but is no longer required to get the shot (go figure) so she is still exposed to that petri dish of germs as you call it.

    Children and their gathering places are a known vector for disease along with hospital waiting rooms, rats, mice, flies, and mosquitoes.
  • RGv2RGv2 Posts: 5,752Member Member Posts: 5,752Member Member
    jgnatca wrote: »
    rhtexasgal wrote: »
    RGv2 wrote: »
    rhtexasgal wrote: »
    I can see both sides of the vaccination equation. My kids are vaccinated but we do so on an individual shot basis rather than the combo ones now. I firmly believe that the MMR did "something" to my now 17 year old son. Before kindergarten (or around that time), he was still getting the combo shots. His personality changed afterward. He went from bubbly and inquisitive to quiet and almost mute for a while. He did not have any autistic tendencies before kindergarten and that last set of combo shots. Now, he has a formal diagnosis of Aspergers and an anxiety disorder. We finally started homeschooling him after elementary school due to too many issues. Today, he is still quiet but is somewhat normal socially (at least at first introduction). It is only when you are around him a while that you truly see something "off." We learned from his issues and stopped the combo shots with his younger brother.

    Our family does not take the flu shot. I am 44 and have never had the flu and neither have my kids. My hubby has only had the flu those times in the Navy when the flu shot was a requirement. When my mother got the shot, she got the flu. She had to get the shot when she was a teacher. 4 years ago, she retired so she stopped getting the flu shot. Guess what? She has not had the flu since! I work with a nonprofit that deals with young boys so I have been around 200+ boys each week for about 17 years. About 10 years ago, I started keeping records of when the boys got sick. It seems that a whopping 93% of the boys who got the flu shot ended up getting the flu. Yeah, this is purely anecdotal but it has been consistent for ten years now!

    I evaluate on a case by case basis and for the most part am pro-vaccine - with some caveats like the single shot at a time versus the combo shots.

    Wait...woah, woah, woah,....she got out of the petri dish of germs that is a school (or daycare) and now all of a sudden isn't getting sick? I didn't get the flu shot for about 10 years either and never missed a day of work, then I had a kid and started sending him to daycare, where conveniently enough he would bring something more than a cold home once in a while and we'd get sick.

    She is still working with children as a volunteer but is no longer required to get the shot (go figure) so she is still exposed to that petri dish of germs as you call it.

    Children and their gathering places are a known vector for disease along with hospital waiting rooms, rats, mice, flies, and mosquitoes.

    Yep...it's a petri dish, I though it was pretty commonly known honestly. I'm glad she doesn't get sick, but as pointed out above, the shot doesn't make you sick.
  • ziggy2006ziggy2006 Posts: 255Member Member Posts: 255Member Member
    rhtexasgal wrote: »
    She is still working with children as a volunteer but is no longer required to get the shot (go figure) so she is still exposed to that petri dish of germs as you call it.

    Is she volunteering for the same number of hours as she was working? Going in for a couple of mornings each week is not exactly the same exposure as teaching full time.

    As for the 100% safe and effective "argument", it is really not even worth a response. No product you use or activity you engage in is 100% safe and effective. It is absurd to insist that vaccines be held to that impossible standard.

    I would gently suggest looking into the sources from which you get your information before trusting the information that you receive is accurate and dependable. Vaccine studies done by computer scientists and authors of anti-vaccination books, for example, might be best looked at with a healthy degree of skepticism. Sites with bylines such as "News that impacts your health, that other media sources may censor" are sites one might want to be cautious about trusting. There is a lot of misleading and distorted information (along with outright lies) being propagated on the InterWebz, often by people with an agenda who are trying to sell something.
  • DeficitDuchessDeficitDuchess Posts: 3,102Member, Premium Member Posts: 3,102Member, Premium Member
    I think when one mixes $$$, personal vs. community rights, religion, medical and politics we can expect confusion.

    Doctors should know what is best but there is disagreement from that department as well it seems.

    healthimpactnews.com/2014/doctors-against-vaccines-the-other-side-of-the-story-is-not-being-told/

    Isn't Dr. Oz against vaccinations? That should be a clue to anyone, that they should be vaccinated; since he believes in cleanses.
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