Welcome to Debate Club! Please be aware that this is a space for respectful debate, and that your ideas will be challenged here. Please remember to critique the argument, not the author.
Fast food and obesity
Replies
-
Ultimately fast food restaurants are just buisnesses. They are ominpresent only because they provide a service that our culture in its current state seems to really want. If you truly want to change that the answer isn't to demonize fast food, it is to change the culture to value healthy eating habits a little more and working so hard you don't get adequate rest or have time to eat properly a little bit less.
After all, if you somehow banned fast food all that would happen is that people would eat packaged chips or other fast convinient foods instead and nothing would really change.
People proritize what they deem important and what they deem important is largely influenced by their upbringing which is largely influenced by the culture. Best way to change that is to live that change yourself, get adequate rest, value your eating habits and nutrition, and don't brag about it just answer people who (in seeing your health or physique) inquire about it. Things will only really change if the culture values food and the time required to prepare food more.
Blaming fast food is just trying to create a bad-guy external to us when really its ourselves we have to blame if anything.9 -
What kind of crappy salad would I make that would rival a big mac fries and coke??? One with a pound of bacon?3
-
Packerjohn wrote: »
No need to apologise but Steff46 summed it up in her way.
People arent taught about nutrition in schools and it's not emphasised much on TV unless theres some sort of agenda.
I know plenty of people who know absolutely zilch about calories.
I know people who think weight loss ONLY comes from eating salads and other "natural" foods.
..but countries like America who have a big consumer market dedicated to junk/high calorie food at a low cost, do you blame the poor everyday person for knowing any different?
I mean your national dish is Hamburgers. 'nuff said. (and I think you have a few other national dishes too)
No, we do not have a "national dish." Any more than we have an official language. Education > stereotyping.6 -
The series Superfat to Superskinny was one. At least I think thats what it was called.
They took obese UK people over to the US and had them see Americans homhad been obese for years, were undergoing surgery and all the problems like, wheelchairs, special medical teams and beds for the obese etc.
It did seem to help th UK people get the motivation to lose weight before it got any worse.
I saw one episode of that and definitely thought it came across as people in the US are mostly morbidly obese and that the people shown were representative, when they are not.
But hey, we do that on our reality TV too, we just mostly pick on US subcultures or individuals. I think it's kind of weird to get off on pointing and staring at the (supposed) average American.
(And no, not denying that there's a problem with obesity and overweight in the US, as there obviously is.)
Beyond that I do find it weird that some seem to think that we in the US are never told about healthful eating, or warned about sugar or sat fat or sodium (arguably too much vs. discussion of calories and an overall healthful diet), that we are in the process of pushing pizza hut into the schools (here there's a ton of effort into making lunches and breakfasts more healthful, as they are free and important for poor kids, and stuff like soda machines have been banned from public schools for some time), and so on.
Facts are: people like food, food is really convenient and cheap currently, and we don't move nearly as much as we used to in daily life, on average. Learning to deal with a food environment where food is convenient and cheap (i.e., taking personal responsibility) seems much better than deciding we were better off when food was more expensive and difficult to obtain. I like choice, even if it poses more difficulties sometimes (like I can never seem to decide what to read next!).
And this rant was added on to my post to you, Gamliela, absolutely not directed at you as if you were arguing to the contrary.2 -
I'd so much rather have a good salad than a pound of bacon (a little bacon on the salad, sure, maybe).
That good salad may or may not be low cal, though.2 -
What kind of crappy salad would I make that would rival a big mac fries and coke??? One with a pound of bacon?
I could make a totally awesome salad that could come close to those calories, and it wouldn't have a pound of bacon. I guess it depends on your idea of what crappy means.1 -
-
Packerjohn wrote: »
No need to apologise but Steff46 summed it up in her way.
People arent taught about nutrition in schools and it's not emphasised much on TV unless theres some sort of agenda.
I know plenty of people who know absolutely zilch about calories.
I know people who think weight loss ONLY comes from eating salads and other "natural" foods.
..but countries like America who have a big consumer market dedicated to junk/high calorie food at a low cost, do you blame the poor everyday person for knowing any different?
I mean your national dish is Hamburgers. 'nuff said. (and I think you have a few other national dishes too)
I'd hesitate to call the hamburger the national dish...and I'd also hesitate to call a hamburger "junk food"...a hamburger can be made as healthfully or unhealthfully as you wish...and those things they call burgers at fast food joints aren't burgers...I don't know what they are, but they aren't a hamburger...the lean deliciousness I pull off my grill and throw some grilled onions, lettuce, and tomato on and serve with a couple of pickle spears is a hamburger...3 -
Packerjohn wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
'good' or not is a different matter, but eating mcdonalds doesn't make someone obese... eating too many calories does.
Understand, that was why my example was of a 1500 calorie + lunch. A Big Mac side salad (light on dressing) and Diet Coke not so bad. It's how much one eats. And I would be pretty sure most people know the 2 Big Mac lunch in my example is too much.
Why diet coke as opposed to normal coke?
You are kidding - sugar is a killer0 -
lisamerrison wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
'good' or not is a different matter, but eating mcdonalds doesn't make someone obese... eating too many calories does.
Understand, that was why my example was of a 1500 calorie + lunch. A Big Mac side salad (light on dressing) and Diet Coke not so bad. It's how much one eats. And I would be pretty sure most people know the 2 Big Mac lunch in my example is too much.
Why diet coke as opposed to normal coke?
You are kidding - sugar is a killer
Um no2 -
lisamerrison wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
'good' or not is a different matter, but eating mcdonalds doesn't make someone obese... eating too many calories does.
Understand, that was why my example was of a 1500 calorie + lunch. A Big Mac side salad (light on dressing) and Diet Coke not so bad. It's how much one eats. And I would be pretty sure most people know the 2 Big Mac lunch in my example is too much.
Why diet coke as opposed to normal coke?
You are kidding - sugar is a killer
Nope.1 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
No need to apologise but Steff46 summed it up in her way.
People arent taught about nutrition in schools and it's not emphasised much on TV unless theres some sort of agenda.
I know plenty of people who know absolutely zilch about calories.
I know people who think weight loss ONLY comes from eating salads and other "natural" foods.
..but countries like America who have a big consumer market dedicated to junk/high calorie food at a low cost, do you blame the poor everyday person for knowing any different?
I mean your national dish is Hamburgers. 'nuff said. (and I think you have a few other national dishes too)
I'd hesitate to call the hamburger the national dish...and I'd also hesitate to call a hamburger "junk food"...a hamburger can be made as healthfully or unhealthfully as you wish...and those things they call burgers at fast food joints aren't burgers...I don't know what they are, but they aren't a hamburger...the lean deliciousness I pull off my grill and throw some grilled onions, lettuce, and tomato on and serve with a couple of pickle spears is a hamburger...
Why aren't they hamburgers?0 -
lisamerrison wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »TavistockToad wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
'good' or not is a different matter, but eating mcdonalds doesn't make someone obese... eating too many calories does.
Understand, that was why my example was of a 1500 calorie + lunch. A Big Mac side salad (light on dressing) and Diet Coke not so bad. It's how much one eats. And I would be pretty sure most people know the 2 Big Mac lunch in my example is too much.
Why diet coke as opposed to normal coke?
You are kidding - sugar is a killer
No, Ted Bundy was a killer.
Sugar is sugar. Yes, it's easy to overeat, but overeating anything is no bueno.8 -
The problem is that you are right CI/CO but unfortunately we live in a world where everything has been supersized! A McDonalds Meal, or KFC for that matter comes in at a lot of calories. The recommended daily average calorie intake for men is 2,500, and for women it's 2,000. This means if I waltz into a McD's for lunch and order a Chicken Legend with medium fries and a milkshake, A man would be consuming 51.4% of his recommended daily calories. For a me, a woman, the percentage would rise to 64.25%. Which means it don't leave a lot for breakfast and dinner.
The least calorific main meal would be six chicken nuggets with no dip (boo!), a garden side salad and a bottle of water or a medium black coffee, which would result in a man consuming 10.4% of his daily intake and a woman chowing down 13% of her recommended daily average. For me, I can think of far more foods that would fill me up and be less calorie dense which means that I am not going to go hungry. chicken nuggets and a garden salad from Maccy D's - who does it!!1 -
lisamerrison wrote: »The problem is that you are right CI/CO but unfortunately we live in a world where everything has been supersized! A McDonalds Meal, or KFC for that matter comes in at a lot of calories. The recommended daily average calorie intake for men is 2,500, and for women it's 2,000. This means if I waltz into a McD's for lunch and order a Chicken Legend with medium fries and a milkshake, A man would be consuming 51.4% of his recommended daily calories. For a me, a woman, the percentage would rise to 64.25%. Which means it don't leave a lot for breakfast and dinner.
The least calorific main meal would be six chicken nuggets with no dip (boo!), a garden side salad and a bottle of water or a medium black coffee, which would result in a man consuming 10.4% of his daily intake and a woman chowing down 13% of her recommended daily average. For me, I can think of far more foods that would fill me up and be less calorie dense which means that I am not going to go hungry. chicken nuggets and a garden salad from Maccy D's - who does it!!
Everyone has different calorie goals.2 -
Chef_Barbell wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
No need to apologise but Steff46 summed it up in her way.
People arent taught about nutrition in schools and it's not emphasised much on TV unless theres some sort of agenda.
I know plenty of people who know absolutely zilch about calories.
I know people who think weight loss ONLY comes from eating salads and other "natural" foods.
..but countries like America who have a big consumer market dedicated to junk/high calorie food at a low cost, do you blame the poor everyday person for knowing any different?
I mean your national dish is Hamburgers. 'nuff said. (and I think you have a few other national dishes too)
I'd hesitate to call the hamburger the national dish...and I'd also hesitate to call a hamburger "junk food"...a hamburger can be made as healthfully or unhealthfully as you wish...and those things they call burgers at fast food joints aren't burgers...I don't know what they are, but they aren't a hamburger...the lean deliciousness I pull off my grill and throw some grilled onions, lettuce, and tomato on and serve with a couple of pickle spears is a hamburger...
Why aren't they hamburgers?
Because I'm a food snob...
Also, for me a hamburger has to be more than like 1/8 inch thick...
Not a burger....
A burger...8 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »
No need to apologise but Steff46 summed it up in her way.
People arent taught about nutrition in schools and it's not emphasised much on TV unless theres some sort of agenda.
I know plenty of people who know absolutely zilch about calories.
I know people who think weight loss ONLY comes from eating salads and other "natural" foods.
..but countries like America who have a big consumer market dedicated to junk/high calorie food at a low cost, do you blame the poor everyday person for knowing any different?
I mean your national dish is Hamburgers. 'nuff said. (and I think you have a few other national dishes too)
I'd hesitate to call the hamburger the national dish...and I'd also hesitate to call a hamburger "junk food"...a hamburger can be made as healthfully or unhealthfully as you wish...and those things they call burgers at fast food joints aren't burgers...I don't know what they are, but they aren't a hamburger...the lean deliciousness I pull off my grill and throw some grilled onions, lettuce, and tomato on and serve with a couple of pickle spears is a hamburger...
Why aren't they hamburgers?
Because I'm a food snob...
Ahh.0 -
-
lisamerrison wrote: »The problem is that you are right CI/CO but unfortunately we live in a world where everything has been supersized! A McDonalds Meal, or KFC for that matter comes in at a lot of calories. The recommended daily average calorie intake for men is 2,500, and for women it's 2,000. This means if I waltz into a McD's for lunch and order a Chicken Legend with medium fries and a milkshake, A man would be consuming 51.4% of his recommended daily calories. For a me, a woman, the percentage would rise to 64.25%. Which means it don't leave a lot for breakfast and dinner.
The least calorific main meal would be six chicken nuggets with no dip (boo!), a garden side salad and a bottle of water or a medium black coffee, which would result in a man consuming 10.4% of his daily intake and a woman chowing down 13% of her recommended daily average. For me, I can think of far more foods that would fill me up and be less calorie dense which means that I am not going to go hungry. chicken nuggets and a garden salad from Maccy D's - who does it!!
I go once every other week or two. I usually order the cheeseburger (300 cals.) and a large diet coke (negligible) for lunch. Fills me up for hours! Some of my lowest calorie/highest weight loss days have included McDs.
(Down about 95lbs. now since I had heart surgery 3 years ago. Blood markers are excellent. Workouts increasing in intensity and frequency. Still dropping fat.)2 -
At 112lbs and being a regular costumer of McDonald's, Hard Rock Cafe, and Starbucks, I can say that people really need to stop blaming everybody else for being fat.
Like... you can eat fast food or have your super caloric coffee without getting fat as long as you plan around it, and don't care that much about macros.5 -
What kind of crappy salad would I make that would rival a big mac fries and coke??? One with a pound of bacon?
Not even...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/11/portion-sizes-salad-calories-ingredients_n_2719726.html0 -
Suddenly I'm interested! If it's gonna be *that* tasty, I might make the indulgence and use your salad recipe on an intense gym day. So a certain amount of bacon, some kind of cheese, and... ? *gets out note pad*1 -
Suddenly I'm interested! If it's gonna be *that* tasty, I might make the indulgence and use your salad recipe on an intense gym day. So a certain amount of bacon, some kind of cheese, and... ? *gets out note pad*
Houmous, edamame beans....1 -
I do love hummus. I have never put it in a salad. I eat that with raw veg or pita. My salads at home are usually the veggie part of a meal. Suppose I eat 4 oz of chicken breast and half a cup of rice, and then my veggie is a salad that has leaf lettuce, tomato, raw onion sliced, some bell pepper, cucumber, and 2 tbsp light dressing (so the dressing comes to about 80 cal with the brand I like) and the salad itself is not gonna be over 100 cal in the veggies. It looks like people are throwing in tons of fruit, cheese, mayo, (blerg, mayo in salads?) and bits and bobs of fried stuff and high cal meat. If I were going to splurge I would put some crumbled bacon and some bleu cheese in there and probably some other stuff depending what looked good in the produce section.
Also, I legit do feel sick if I eat fast food. When my system is totally unaccustomed to it any more, and then I go on a road trip and eat fast food because I forgot the protein bars/fruit/portable noms, BLARRRRGH! It probably doesn't help that I'm pushing 50. I'm not so adaptable any more. I have trouble even just eating "normal" stuff at restaurants because I am unaccustomed to the heavy fare. I do much better with a 6 inch turkey sub (not doused in mayo) and water than a burger/fries/soda though. Not gonna feel sick in 30 minutes.0 -
I do love hummus. I have never put it in a salad. I eat that with raw veg or pita. My salads at home are usually the veggie part of a meal. Suppose I eat 4 oz of chicken breast and half a cup of rice, and then my veggie is a salad that has leaf lettuce, tomato, raw onion sliced, some bell pepper, cucumber, and 2 tbsp light dressing (so the dressing comes to about 80 cal with the brand I like) and the salad itself is not gonna be over 100 cal in the veggies. It looks like people are throwing in tons of fruit, cheese, mayo, (blerg, mayo in salads?) and bits and bobs of fried stuff and high cal meat. If I were going to splurge I would put some crumbled bacon and some bleu cheese in there and probably some other stuff depending what looked good in the produce section.
Also, I legit do feel sick if I eat fast food. When my system is totally unaccustomed to it any more, and then I go on a road trip and eat fast food because I forgot the protein bars/fruit/portable noms, BLARRRRGH! It probably doesn't help that I'm pushing 50. I'm not so adaptable any more. I have trouble even just eating "normal" stuff at restaurants because I am unaccustomed to the heavy fare. I do much better with a 6 inch turkey sub (not doused in mayo) and water than a burger/fries/soda though. Not gonna feel sick in 30 minutes.
I love taco salad, and I make it a lot. I cook down bell pepper, onions, and mushrooms, add it to spinach, chicken, and I call it a day with some salsa (ok, like a lot of salsa) for dressing. It clocks in relatively low at about 450 calories (with almost half of those due to the chicken). But, depending on my calories for the day, I'll add some shredded cheese and guacamole (a 100 cal snack pack). I also used to enjoy black beans and corn on it. Nothing in that salad is particularly crazy, but if I add everything, it's more like 800 calories. And growing up, taco salads were topped with fritos...2 -
I do love hummus. I have never put it in a salad. I eat that with raw veg or pita. My salads at home are usually the veggie part of a meal. Suppose I eat 4 oz of chicken breast and half a cup of rice, and then my veggie is a salad that has leaf lettuce, tomato, raw onion sliced, some bell pepper, cucumber, and 2 tbsp light dressing (so the dressing comes to about 80 cal with the brand I like) and the salad itself is not gonna be over 100 cal in the veggies. It looks like people are throwing in tons of fruit, cheese, mayo, (blerg, mayo in salads?) and bits and bobs of fried stuff and high cal meat.
Yeah, even a simple Greek salad, you have cheese, olives and olive oil. Salads can be pretty scary sometimes, that's why I trust a burger more than a salad as the "safe choice" calorie-wise if I had no access to nutrition info.2 -
The series Superfat to Superskinny was one. At least I think thats what it was called.
They took obese UK people over to the US and had them see Americans homhad been obese for years, were undergoing surgery and all the problems like, wheelchairs, special medical teams and beds for the obese etc.
It did seem to help th UK people get the motivation to lose weight before it got any worse.
To me, that's a pretty clever use of people's innate tendency toward stereotyping and tribalism to achieve a positive (ish) propagandistic end.
The implicit "they" live like gluttons to their horrific end, vs. "we" can be better than that - kinda genius.
It would not have the same effect to use bad examples in the UK, though they doubtless exist. That chart on page 1 of this thread puts UK very near US in obesity/overweight percents (that doesn't clarify degree of obesity, of course - but still).
P.S. I'm a USA-ian from birth. I'll bet using some other nationality we stereotype as "unhealthy" would have a similar impact here.2 -
before mfp, i honestly didn't know the calorie content of most foods. Shortly after joining I went to lunch with a friend to a salad/soup place we like. I had cesar salad & when i got home i logged it in & couldn't believe how high the calorie was, cause of the dressing they already have mixed in. Now a days if i want a hamburger, which i love, I make the patty at home & if i do use bread i use the thin bread with 1 tbl of lite mayo, lots of onions. It taste good0
-
lisamerrison wrote: »The problem is that you are right CI/CO but unfortunately we live in a world where everything has been supersized!
No they haven't, as shown by the fact that you have to supersize the McD's meal for it to be supersized. You can still get small fries and a regular burger. (I almost never eat that kind of fast food, but I stopped at Culvers this summer and got a burger and small fries for a lunch not much more than my normal lunch calories -- around 500 or so. This was after 5 hours biking hills, so I felt I probably could have justified more, actually.)The least calorific main meal would be six chicken nuggets with no dip (boo!), a garden side salad and a bottle of water or a medium black coffee, which would result in a man consuming 10.4% of his daily intake and a woman chowing down 13% of her recommended daily average. For me, I can think of far more foods that would fill me up and be less calorie dense which means that I am not going to go hungry. chicken nuggets and a garden salad from Maccy D's - who does it!!
Why would you want to limit lunch or dinner to 13% of your recommended intake? My goal is around 1600-1700, and I usually have 500+ calories for at least one of those, maybe both depending on breakfast and whether I snack (I often don't snack at all, so meals can be larger or I have some kind of dessert after dinner). And my maintenance is a lot more than 1600-1700 -- doing that I can have a dinner out over the weekend for a lot more if I want. (I wouldn't waste them at McD's or KFC, but again, personal preference.)1
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 393.4K Introduce Yourself
- 43.8K Getting Started
- 260.2K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.9K Food and Nutrition
- 47.4K Recipes
- 232.5K Fitness and Exercise
- 427 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153K Motivation and Support
- 8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.7K MyFitnessPal Information
- 24 News and Announcements
- 1.1K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.6K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions