Humans are not designed to drink cows milk
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I say everyone drink human milk, if we SO need milk... I bet that would gross you out! LMAO! Exactly. That's what I thought.
I have a weird desire to try human milk one day.......0 -
I find it odd that people have no issues with eating the muscle tissue of a cow, yet suddenly there are issues with its' milk? Please.
It's like people have turned their dietary preferences into some exclusive religion.
There's a joke going around ... How do you know if somebody is a <insert various food disorder/diet here>? Don't worry, they'll tell you.
We know what we're supposed to eat. We've always known it. Always. Don't listen to the media. Ignore studies. If you really want to know what you're supposed to eat, ask a few of the oldest people you know what they ate when they were kids. Then, eat that. Diet truly is simple. People make it so complicated.0 -
but we were designed top make sure that our opinion is the right one, no matter what anyone else says and then we were designed to spread our own views .... crap I am doing it right now ..... curse you intelligent designer who made me like this!!!0
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Gahhhh! Where is the Tasty cake thead?0
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Gahhhh! Where is the Tasty cake thead?
THIS!!! I have been waiting most patiently...I'm taking matters into my own hands...0 -
What I saw was a good portion of pictures without context that could be sad or benign depending on the actual context.
Thinking for yourself does nobody any good. Now stop it and drink some SOY JUICE!
/I prefer almond never liked the taste of moocowmilk
lol!!!! don't drink too much soy! THAT can put boobs on a man and make all his hair on his legs and arms disappear! too much estrogen.0 -
Did you know that in order for a cow to produce milk she must be pregnant. The cows are KEPT pregnant year round to produce it. The girl calves are kept to raise as new cows & the cycles starts again. The boy calves are killed as young as 5 days old as they become useless to milk production. 5 days old. Separated from their mother & killed because they are a boy.
Think about THAT when having your cows milk. The dairy industry won't tell you that either.
Proof please?
I worked on a dairy farm for 4 months out of the year for almost 15 years and never saw this.
The general public needs the truth. We all want to enjoy our food with a clean conscience. Those who believe cows are treated fairly drink milk, those who do not, do not drink milk.
As a dairy farmer, what was your personal experience and what everyone wants to know is, did the cows suffer pain or abuse?
Thanks in advance.
My opinion is that people do not have enough facts to make a true judgement. I don't drink milk because I like the idea of eating food raw and from nature and I'd personally never approach a cow in a field and suckle it. And having dairy causes me skin and respiratory allergies.
Pain or abuse? Absolutely not
Does it happen? I am sure at some dairy farms it does, but the many that I have worked on, it does not.
I don't know about you, but I have a difficult time taking serious any conversation that includes the terms "girl" and/or "boy" when referring to young cattle. The terms "boy" and "girl" refer to the human species, not to bovines.
Also, I don't think the lactation process differs greatly between species of mammals. Pregnancy stimulates the hormones necessary to begin lactation (esp oxytocin which generates "milk-letdown"), but once lactation begins, it is the continual stimulation of the breast (or teat for bovine) that continues the milk production - not pregnancy.
Wait so there are no boy or girl animals? Only in HUMANS? I have 2 GIRL dogs. Yeah they are female. Girl or boy refers to YOUNG female or male.... regardless of what animal they are. :noway:0 -
I say everyone drink human milk, if we SO need milk... I bet that would gross you out! LMAO! Exactly. That's what I thought.
I have a weird desire to try human milk one day.......
Human milk is kind of like sweet skim milk, at least to me anyway. They do make human milk cheese too, though never had the opportunity to try it0 -
So all of you crying BS... watch this video.
What? Faked? Photoshopped?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzS8p727gvM
explain it.
enjoy your milk.
Thank you. I am enjoying it very much.
But wait...I thought I was full of crap & was ignorant. Seems as though I'm not the only one who actually knows the truth & can prove it.
BTW message me again like that.
So where's this "proof" you allude to?0 -
I think I'm entitled to more than an apology right about now. Ignorant my :mad:
Enjoy your friggen milk. It came at the expense of some more animals that DID have to suffer.0 -
I could really care less what other people eat/drink. I know what I provide for my family and teach my kids to eat. Heck, the way I see it, if it wasn't for MFP and the members here, I wouldn't have as much knowledge of what foods to avoid.
I joined this site not to lose weight, but to see what other people were eating to bring them here to lose weight. It has helped me purchase and grow better food.
So to the unhealthy eaters, I thank you for providing me with your open diaries and being part of the statistics I am trying to avoid.
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I think I'm entitled to more than an apology right about now. Ignorant my :mad:
Enjoy your friggen milk. It came at the expense of some more animals that DID have to suffer.
Time out.
What are you talking about?0 -
Try the link I posted, try really searching for it. Not hard to find proof at all. For anyone who does give a damn.
The link to the propaganda site with the factual errors about cows being kept constantly pregnant? That's only proof of the author's vivid imagination and/or lack of knowledge surrounding lactation.
You're the one making the wild and factually erroneous assertions....the burden of proof is on you......
Have you ever even been on a dairy farm?0 -
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I say everyone drink human milk, if we SO need milk... I bet that would gross you out! LMAO! Exactly. That's what I thought.
I have a weird desire to try human milk one day.......
I've got three sisters who can hook you up...what are ya offering? :laugh:0 -
Gahhhh! Where is the Tasty cake thead?
THIS!!! I have been waiting most patiently...I'm taking matters into my own hands...
errr so am i0 -
Not taking a side here, just gonna defend my beloved almond milk. If you blend up almonds and water then pour the puree through cheesecloth to strain it, BAM! Almond milk.
I also use my cheesecloth to strain plain yogurt into greek yogurt! Just want people to know no black magic goes into the making of almond milk
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Right, because water certainly isn't a chemical...so unnatural, do you think cows put out 1% and 2% milk? NO it's processed, probably with chemicals
Wait. Didnt you say you drank almond milk? How did the milk get from the almond to the carton? If it wasnt processed then its just magic?
They are dissolved in water, no chemicals needed0 -
Excuse me, but my father worked his *kitten* off for years as a dairy farmer making milk for AMERICA.
That milk is made to make not only milk, but yogurt, cheese, and countless other products you eat.
How about you spend a day with my dad, on your knees putting milkers on cows at LEAST twice a day, getting kicked, being hot and sweaty, doing your JOB, and making a living?
Excuse me while I go THANK my farmer of a father.
I don't drink milk but I eat cheese and yogurt!
I LOVE THIS COMMENT!!!!!!! Thanks to your dad, from sk_pirate!! :drinker:0 -
P.S. The apple comment is completely irrelevant. Apples don't grow 15 feet up and if you can't reach, look down.. there's plenty on the ground for you :laugh:
I was assuming almost all the fruit on a tree that has not been grafted onto a smaller rootstock (i.e. it is naturally 20-30 feet tall) would be out of reach, and that the e coli on the apples that have fallen to the ground was relevant since milk debates generally include a mention of raw milk vs pasteurised and that we're neither that tall nor immune to food poisoning. Apples also contain sugar and without toothbrushes and dentists our teeth would fall out.
We're not "designed" for a lot of things (i.e. have genetic adaptations that allow us to do them) unless you include our intelligence. Pasteurisation, toothbrushes, knifes, QWERTY (although one could argue English speakers were designed to use DVORAK keyboards), etc.
Unlike in the Neolithic Era when no-one in northern Europe could drink milk, 90% of people today with north European ancestry have the gene that produces lactase. My point was (unlike in one of the previous threads where I pointed out all the animals that drink milk from other animals) that we have a genetic adaptation that allows us to drink milk which we did not have a few thousand years ago, and although we have grown taller in that time we have had to make apple trees shorter so we can pick them.
It comes down to what is meant by "designed". Modern humans are not the same as early humans. Should us men be running after and killing our food instead of going to shops because we were designed with a greater lung capacity? Cattle domestication somehow gave us a gene that allowed us to tolerate lactose and Wikipedia suggests natural selection favoured cow milk drinkers. We may have been wearing clothes for as long as 650,000 years, and we started becoming less hairy 240,000 years ago - were we (modern humans) designed to wear clothes?
Philosophically, if our ancestors did something long enough and that caused a genetic adaptation that gave us a greater chance of survival if we continued what they started, were we designed to do that? "We" have been using tools for 2.5 million years and possibly didn't before then - were "we" designed to have the ability to use tools or did our ancestors cause an adaptation? Were we designed to walk upright? Diverge from fish (and thus being designed not to swim)? Be carbon based?
People say I should stay away from philosophy because it makes their heads hurt when they try to work out how I got from one thing to another and their ears hurt when I explain (I obviously failed at my attempt of a less verbose post). Looking at the previous thread I am not the only person to bring up the lactase gene or what is meant by designed (last page of previous thread includes a definition of human) but I suppose I may have been wrong in assuming my milk/apple comparison without a complete explanation of my thought process (including human intelligence and genetic adaptations) would be understood by everyone (and I should probably explain here that I have Asperger's and that I don't understand some connections others make and assume others understand the connections I make).0 -
Try the link I posted, try really searching for it. Not hard to find proof at all. For anyone who does give a damn.
The link to the propaganda site with the factual errors about cows being kept constantly pregnant? That's only proof of the author's vivid imagination and/or lack of knowledge surrounding lactation.
You're the one making the wild and factually erroneous assertions....the burden of proof is on you......
Have you ever even been on a dairy farm?
Want some more 'propaganda' sites then?
http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/dairy-industry.aspx (PETS is highly regarded I assume?)
http://www.all-creatures.org/articles/ar-pregnancy.html (Same as this I also assume)
http://www.worldanimalfoundation.net/farm_animals.html (Scroll down to the MILK section & read)
I can produce HUNDREDS of such sites with proof. Yet I'm still being called a liar? But that's ok....people know the truth. It's those who are ignorant or blind that don't want to know or don't believe it cause they can't see it happening in front of them.
BTW that Animals Australia one is high up here in Australia. In fact I think they are one of the best & have brought to light a whole lot of animal welfare problems that are being changed.
As for being on a dairy farm....I live in the City..... tell me where I can walk to one.0 -
Try the link I posted, try really searching for it. Not hard to find proof at all. For anyone who does give a damn.
The link to the propaganda site with the factual errors about cows being kept constantly pregnant? That's only proof of the author's vivid imagination and/or lack of knowledge surrounding lactation.
You're the one making the wild and factually erroneous assertions....the burden of proof is on you......
Have you ever even been on a dairy farm?
Want some more 'propaganda' sites then?
http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/dairy-industry.aspx (PETS is highly regarded I assume?)
http://www.all-creatures.org/articles/ar-pregnancy.html (Same as this I also assume)
http://www.worldanimalfoundation.net/farm_animals.html (Scroll down to the MILK section & read)
I can produce HUNDREDS of such sites with proof. Yet I'm still being called a liar? But that's ok....people know the truth. It's those who are ignorant or blind that don't want to know or don't believe it cause they can't see it happening in front of them.
BTW that Animals Australia one is high up here in Australia. In fact I think they are one of the best & have brought to light a whole lot of animal welfare problems that are being changed.
As for being on a dairy farm....I live in the City..... tell me where I can walk to one.
While I appreciate what animal rights activists are trying to do, because there ARE terrible practises out there for the rearing of animals, the solution that they propose - stop drinking or eating animal products altogether, isn't practical or realistic. Instead of just 'reducing the demand for animal products by not buying them', a more effective solution would be to INCREASE the demand for animal products from animals that have been reared in safe and comfortable conditions.0 -
"While I appreciate what animal rights activists are trying to do, because there ARE terrible practises out there for the rearing of animals, the solution that they propose - stop drinking or eating animal products altogether, isn't practical or realistic. Instead of just 'reducing the demand for animal products by not buying them', a more effective solution would be to INCREASE the demand for animal products from animals that have been reared in safe and comfortable conditions. "
agreed - a step in the right direction. I doubt there is a meat or dairy consumer here who really deep down wouldn't care about the welfare of farm animals if they were faced with it.
The problem is that many of us are so urbanised that we have become separated from the realitiy of where our food comes from and the ethical and environmental implications of it's production from seed to shelf; flesh and plant foods alike.0 -
Also, I don't think the lactation process differs greatly between species of mammals. Pregnancy stimulates the hormones necessary to begin lactation (esp oxytocin which generates "milk-letdown"), but once lactation begins, it is the continual stimulation of the breast (or teat for bovine) that continues the milk production - not pregnancy.
Very true! This is how wet nurses can still breastfeed as well as attachment-happy parents that are breast-feeding their kid until their 3. If you don't use it, you lose it.0 -
Try the link I posted, try really searching for it. Not hard to find proof at all. For anyone who does give a damn.
The link to the propaganda site with the factual errors about cows being kept constantly pregnant? That's only proof of the author's vivid imagination and/or lack of knowledge surrounding lactation.
You're the one making the wild and factually erroneous assertions....the burden of proof is on you......
Have you ever even been on a dairy farm?
Want some more 'propaganda' sites then?
http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/dairy-industry.aspx (PETS is highly regarded I assume?)
http://www.all-creatures.org/articles/ar-pregnancy.html (Same as this I also assume)
http://www.worldanimalfoundation.net/farm_animals.html (Scroll down to the MILK section & read)
I can produce HUNDREDS of such sites with proof. Yet I'm still being called a liar? But that's ok....people know the truth. It's those who are ignorant or blind that don't want to know or don't believe it cause they can't see it happening in front of them.
BTW that Animals Australia one is high up here in Australia. In fact I think they are one of the best & have brought to light a whole lot of animal welfare problems that are being changed.
As for being on a dairy farm....I live in the City..... tell me where I can walk to one.
I can produce several articles and websites that prove eating dirt is natural and acceptable. Your point is? It's the internet, welcome!
Which city? I'm sure one of us would gladly point you in the right direction
Pardon me while I go log my low-calorie dirt.0 -
Try the link I posted, try really searching for it. Not hard to find proof at all. For anyone who does give a damn.
The link to the propaganda site with the factual errors about cows being kept constantly pregnant? That's only proof of the author's vivid imagination and/or lack of knowledge surrounding lactation.
You're the one making the wild and factually erroneous assertions....the burden of proof is on you......
Have you ever even been on a dairy farm?
Want some more 'propaganda' sites then?
http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/dairy-industry.aspx (PETS is highly regarded I assume?)
http://www.all-creatures.org/articles/ar-pregnancy.html (Same as this I also assume)
http://www.worldanimalfoundation.net/farm_animals.html (Scroll down to the MILK section & read)
I can produce HUNDREDS of such sites with proof. Yet I'm still being called a liar? But that's ok....people know the truth. It's those who are ignorant or blind that don't want to know or don't believe it cause they can't see it happening in front of them.
BTW that Animals Australia one is high up here in Australia. In fact I think they are one of the best & have brought to light a whole lot of animal welfare problems that are being changed.
As for being on a dairy farm....I live in the City..... tell me where I can walk to one.
I can produce several articles and websites that prove eating dirt is natural and acceptable. Your point is? It's the internet, welcome!
Which city? I'm sure one of us would gladly point you in the right direction
Pardon me while I go log my low-calorie dirt.
Melbourne Australia. I don't drive...so unless there is one damn close then I aint getting to it....... oh wait.... there isnt one. Not for at least 221km away.
Like I said...it does not just happen in Australia this practice for cows milk. You have the proof from PETA ffs. You think they are going to lie to you about it now? Nope...I think the dairy industry would rather hide it just so people keep buying. Otherwise there goes their $$$.
Sorry if to me other things are more important.0 -
This anger is not helping the debate.
I hope other folks don't think all vegans are as angry as this. Change starts with agreement; not conflict.0 -
Melbourne Australia. I don't drive...so unless there is one damn close then I aint getting to it....... oh wait.... there isnt one. Not for at least 221km away.
Like I said...it does not just happen in Australia this practice for cows milk. You have the proof from PETA ffs. You think they are going to lie to you about it now? Nope...I think the dairy industry would rather hide it just so people keep buying. Otherwise there goes their $$$.
Sorry if to me other things are more important.
PETA make a LOT of money. I don't trust them as a non biased source on animal welfare.0 -
This anger is not helping the debate.
I hope other folks don't think all vegans are as angry as this. Change starts with agreement; not conflict.
I'm not vegan at all. But I don't stand for cruel practices towards animals.0 -
Melbourne Australia. I don't drive...so unless there is one damn close then I aint getting to it....... oh wait.... there isnt one. Not for at least 221km away.
Like I said...it does not just happen in Australia this practice for cows milk. You have the proof from PETA ffs. You think they are going to lie to you about it now? Nope...I think the dairy industry would rather hide it just so people keep buying. Otherwise there goes their $$$.
Sorry if to me other things are more important.
PETA make a LOT of money. I don't trust them as a non biased source on animal welfare.
So you would not trust the Salvation Army or Red cross either? They make a lot of money. So does World Vision.0
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