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Spot Reducing...This Should Be Interesting...
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xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
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VintageFeline wrote: »
I don't see the retraction of anything. I can't be emphatic enough when I tell you this: please look above and look at what was actually written. He wanted some "Men's Health" type comparison nonsense. I'm sure there's plenty of before and after shots of these on the internet to view if he's that desperate.
nope, I said since you are so sure that you can spot reduce, why don't you take these compounds and show us that one can spot reduce by showing before and after pictures?
I have nothing to prove that studies before me haven't already done.
A case study is specific. A group study and years of research is better. But hey - who am I to judge what you yourself think is more valid...... I just know what the research community would prefer when using it as evidence.0 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.0 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?1 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
"Slow Clap" I'm glad you're able to find some humor in this day, I hope it continues for you. Cheers!1 -
VintageFeline wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »trigden1991 wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Oh lookie, neither of the two things you sent me in the PMs actually showed spot reduction, just fat loss induced because one is a steroid and the other is hgh.
Care to share which miracle "spot reduction" things these are?
Oxandrolone and HGH. Really this secrecy crap stinks to high heavens. There's no reason to not write it public unless being afraid of being shown to be wrong.
I should think the legalities of using them in this context may have something to do with the reluctance. It was mentioned openly in previous discussions but he's choosing now to be cagey. No doubt there are reasons for this.
Yeah - to be honest I didn't want specific names brought up in the thread (edit) because it would lead people to assume some condoning of use but he decided to bring about it public. Would have been better to grandstand referring to them as O or H. There's others out there like Intaleukin 3, 6, 8 and 15 and all sorts of cytokines which are disputable as to their pros and cons and rarely used in connection with fat/health/muscle/performance but I'd never discuss anything that wasn't a medicine or prescription based chemical with a USE for that particular topic. I.e. these things are used for these purposes.
If you're referring to off-label use then this interpretation is incorrect. A producer of a drug or device is strictly prohibited from use outside the label. A medical practitioner on the other hand is not only authorized, but expected to serve the best interests of the patient. If that means using product outside the labeling they may do so, but they do this under their license. Legal savvy practitioners would do so under their respective risk assessment system, but as for internet advice? There is no issue.1 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
Because..... people.
Because.... "humans be humans".
They are prescribed often enough to those who need them. Just because something is effective doesn't mean it is something that should be publicly available or even a first/second even third option for those seeking a certain goal?
Example:
gammahydroxybutyrate acid releases a lot of important chemicals and triggers 3-4 hours of REM sleep but is only used for cataplexy linked to narcolepsy where we are. In other countries it's used for sleep disorders with circadian rhythm problems. Those who have sleeping problems do not automatically start on that, do they? They get referred to antihistamines like diphenhydramine, followed by things like zopiclone 3.75 then 7.5 and it continues.
The OP had a question. The answer is naturally no, chemically yes. Just because it works doesn't mean your FDA will approve it for widespread Walmart availability? 0 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
apparently, there is a legality issue with said compounds.
Not to mention that fact that said person has produced zero proof that they actually spot reduce.3 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
Because..... people.
Because.... "humans be humans".
They are prescribed often enough to those who need them. Just because something is effective doesn't mean it is something that should be publicly available or even a first/second even third option for those seeking a certain goal?
Example:
gammahydroxybutyrate acid releases a lot of important chemicals and triggers 3-4 hours of REM sleep but is only used for cataplexy linked to narcolepsy where we are. In other countries it's used for sleep disorders with circadian rhythm problems. Those who have sleeping problems do not automatically start on that, do they? They get referred to antihistamines like diphenhydramine, followed by things like zopiclone 3.75 then 7.5 and it continues.
The OP had a question. The answer is naturally no, chemically yes. Just because it works doesn't mean your FDA will approve it for widespread Walmart availability?
What is the criteria for getting a prescription for these compounds? Is it not legal to use them for fat reduction? If so, why? If I were obese and went to you requesting this treatment, what would you say?1 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
Because..... people.
Because.... "humans be humans".
They are prescribed often enough to those who need them. Just because something is effective doesn't mean it is something that should be publicly available or even a first/second even third option for those seeking a certain goal?
Example:
gammahydroxybutyrate acid releases a lot of important chemicals and triggers 3-4 hours of REM sleep but is only used for cataplexy linked to narcolepsy where we are. In other countries it's used for sleep disorders with circadian rhythm problems. Those who have sleeping problems do not automatically start on that, do they? They get referred to antihistamines like diphenhydramine, followed by things like zopiclone 3.75 then 7.5 and it continues.
The OP had a question. The answer is naturally no, chemically yes. Just because it works doesn't mean your FDA will approve it for widespread Walmart availability?
What is the criteria for getting a prescription for these compounds? Is it not legal to use them for fat reduction? If so, why? If I were obese and went to you requesting this treatment, what would you say?
I know one of them is a banned substance for athletes (not of the bodybuilding sort unless they do natty comps). I assume anything in the steroid family would be too.
As for the legalities of prescribing HGH off label for vanity spot reduction, I don't know but I would certainly hope it's not approved, especially here where the NHS is already under great strain from long term underfunding.1 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
apparently, there is a legality issue with said compounds.
Not to mention that fact that said person has produced zero proof that they actually spot reduce.
Can I personally ask you how you came across this site?
University of Southern California 2004 is a good place to start.
http://jap.physiology.org/content/96/3/1055
http://jap.physiology.org/content/96/3/1055.figures-only
Oxandrolone reduced total (-1.9 ± 1.0 kg) and trunk fat (-1.3 ± 0.6 kg; P < 0.001), and these decreases were greater (P < 0.001) than placebo. Twelve weeks after oxandrolone was discontinued (week 24), the increments in LBM and muscle strength were no longer different from baseline (P > 0.15). However, the decreases in total and trunk fat were sustained (-1.5 ± 1.8, P = 0.001 and -1.0 ± 1.1 kg, P < 0.001, respectively). Thus oxandrolone induced short-term improvements in LBM, muscle area, and strength, while reducing whole body and trunk adiposity. Anabolic improvements were lost 12 wk after discontinuing oxandrolone, whereas improvements in fat mass were largely sustained.
Among other research:
Oh brother here let me do it for you since this appears to be going around in circles:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14578370
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25899102 (for older women)
Oxandrolone treatment augmented increases in lean tissue for the whole body (2.6 kg; 95% confidence interval (CI), 1.0-4.2 kg; P = 0.003), arms (0.3 kg; 95% CI, 0.1-0.5 kg; P = 0.001), legs (0.8 kg; 95% CI, 0.1-1.4 kg; P = 0.018), and trunk (1.4 kg; 95% CI, 0.4-2.3 kg; P = 0.004). Oxandrolone also augmented loss of fat tissue of the whole body (-1 kg; 95% CI, -1.6 to -0.4; P = 0.002), arms (-0.2 kg; 95% CI, -0.5 to -0.02 kg; P = 0.032), legs (-0.4 kg; 95% CI, -0.6 to -0.1; P = 0.009), and tended to reduce trunk fat (-0.4 kg; 95% CI, -0.9 to 0.04; P = 0.07). Improvements in muscle strength and power, chair stand, and dynamic balance were all significant over time (P < 0.05) but not different between groups (P > 0.05).
CONCLUSIONS:
Oxandrolone improves body composition adaptations to PRT in older women over 12 wk without augmenting muscle function or functional performance beyond that of PRT alone.
As for GH:
https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article-lookup/doi/10.1210/jcem.83.2.4594
"In vitro and in vivo studies have shown that GH is anabolic, lipolytic, and has an antinatriuretic action (8–10). Each of these properties has an impact on body composition. Most of the studies investigating body composition have referred to a two-compartment model consisting of fat mass and lean body mass (LBM)."
. Fat mass. GH replacement therapy has resulted in a mean reduction in fat mass of approximately 4–6 kg in GH-deficient adults (6, 7, 12–17, 21, 26–32). A recent study suggests that this reduction occurs similarly in both CO and AO GH deficiency (33). Anthropometric measurements indicate that the most important change occurs in the abdominal region (6). In addition, studies using CT (12) and MRI (13) have shown that the reduction in abdominal fat mass is mainly due to a reduction in visceral fat mass.1 -
VintageFeline wrote: »xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
Because..... people.
Because.... "humans be humans".
They are prescribed often enough to those who need them. Just because something is effective doesn't mean it is something that should be publicly available or even a first/second even third option for those seeking a certain goal?
Example:
gammahydroxybutyrate acid releases a lot of important chemicals and triggers 3-4 hours of REM sleep but is only used for cataplexy linked to narcolepsy where we are. In other countries it's used for sleep disorders with circadian rhythm problems. Those who have sleeping problems do not automatically start on that, do they? They get referred to antihistamines like diphenhydramine, followed by things like zopiclone 3.75 then 7.5 and it continues.
The OP had a question. The answer is naturally no, chemically yes. Just because it works doesn't mean your FDA will approve it for widespread Walmart availability?
What is the criteria for getting a prescription for these compounds? Is it not legal to use them for fat reduction? If so, why? If I were obese and went to you requesting this treatment, what would you say?
I know one of them is a banned substance for athletes (not of the bodybuilding sort unless they do natty comps). I assume anything in the steroid family would be too.
As for the legalities of prescribing HGH off label for vanity spot reduction, I don't know but I would certainly hope it's not approved, especially here where the NHS is already under great strain from long term underfunding.
I was figuring as much. I guess I just don't get why it was even brought up as a viable option when it isn't.7 -
VintageFeline wrote: »xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
Because..... people.
Because.... "humans be humans".
They are prescribed often enough to those who need them. Just because something is effective doesn't mean it is something that should be publicly available or even a first/second even third option for those seeking a certain goal?
Example:
gammahydroxybutyrate acid releases a lot of important chemicals and triggers 3-4 hours of REM sleep but is only used for cataplexy linked to narcolepsy where we are. In other countries it's used for sleep disorders with circadian rhythm problems. Those who have sleeping problems do not automatically start on that, do they? They get referred to antihistamines like diphenhydramine, followed by things like zopiclone 3.75 then 7.5 and it continues.
The OP had a question. The answer is naturally no, chemically yes. Just because it works doesn't mean your FDA will approve it for widespread Walmart availability?
What is the criteria for getting a prescription for these compounds? Is it not legal to use them for fat reduction? If so, why? If I were obese and went to you requesting this treatment, what would you say?
I know one of them is a banned substance for athletes (not of the bodybuilding sort unless they do natty comps). I assume anything in the steroid family would be too.
As for the legalities of prescribing HGH off label for vanity spot reduction, I don't know but I would certainly hope it's not approved, especially here where the NHS is already under great strain from long term underfunding.
I was figuring as much. I guess I just don't get why it was even brought up as a viable option when it isn't.
Moralistic viewpoints when it comes to factual science is by the by. They asked a question and got a factual answer. Others then started with the: No you can't oh no you can't nuh huh mentality and decided to blurt it out without any tact. The names of them shouldn't have been blurted out by that individual in public where it didn't belong.0 -
VintageFeline wrote: »xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
Because..... people.
Because.... "humans be humans".
They are prescribed often enough to those who need them. Just because something is effective doesn't mean it is something that should be publicly available or even a first/second even third option for those seeking a certain goal?
Example:
gammahydroxybutyrate acid releases a lot of important chemicals and triggers 3-4 hours of REM sleep but is only used for cataplexy linked to narcolepsy where we are. In other countries it's used for sleep disorders with circadian rhythm problems. Those who have sleeping problems do not automatically start on that, do they? They get referred to antihistamines like diphenhydramine, followed by things like zopiclone 3.75 then 7.5 and it continues.
The OP had a question. The answer is naturally no, chemically yes. Just because it works doesn't mean your FDA will approve it for widespread Walmart availability?
What is the criteria for getting a prescription for these compounds? Is it not legal to use them for fat reduction? If so, why? If I were obese and went to you requesting this treatment, what would you say?
I know one of them is a banned substance for athletes (not of the bodybuilding sort unless they do natty comps). I assume anything in the steroid family would be too.
As for the legalities of prescribing HGH off label for vanity spot reduction, I don't know but I would certainly hope it's not approved, especially here where the NHS is already under great strain from long term underfunding.
I was figuring as much. I guess I just don't get why it was even brought up as a viable option when it isn't.
My point as well. Thanks for articulating that better than I could in the moment.3 -
xmichaelyx wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Why am I not surprised you don't like people linking to the WHO?
The WHO wasn't the issue - the complete shock of the irrelevance of your 'research' was the issue. Anyway that's another thread. I just sent you two messages with two examples. You want some more messages with other examples? I also provided you with links if you require any more links or research into those let me know.
Without prescription and approval from a doctor I find it more appropriate to not discuss particulars but you get the idea
Why not post your citations here? As a professional researcher, one of my great joys in life is destroying clown science.
The fact that you "know" all this but can't post your supersecret, magical compounds or link to any science backing you up is hysterical.
I've already done it in private. Since he has namedropped two examples and I've provided further information I'll assume you've heard of search engines? I'm not here to be your joey or dog and fetch for you when I've already provided my examples as well as sent him links.
I'm glad you get joy in destroying clown science. So do I. We're in the same boat, then.
Why kind of research is it, that you do? I do some research, myself.
You're missing the point of the discussion. You cannot spot reduce based on things that are readily available to us. You cannot, for the most part, exercise a muscle to death to spot reduce fat. You just can't. TECHNICALLY, there are likely a bunch of cagey, unsafe, massive side affect, drugs out there that could slightly increase it. But there is no magic thigh pill that if you take 3x's a day you're thighs will magically shed fat! Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducing. You can't. End of story.
Sigh. You've contradicted yourself there. The OP asked about spot reduction. The OP employed a method of use that dealt more with water and sweat than actual fat. The responses were of a technical nature regarding fat loss. water. muscle. etc etc. I gave a technical dispute using science. I was asked to clarify. The thing went to pot with ignorance. The rest is history.
I appreciate your rebuttal that I am, in fact, the one missing the point; however, I'm well aware what the point of this thread was. You are holding strong to your argument that spot reduction can happen with "compounds". My response was, spot reduction cannot happen with things readily available to us or without extreme measures.
My first opening post on here was this: "There are certain compounds that will allow spot reduction and others that have been medically shown in studies to fight certain areas of fat. Naturally through diet and exercise: NO. Your genetically predisposed to storing fat in certain areas depending on your genetics. Everybody differs. Unless you plan on taking certain compounds you cannot spot reduce fat. Water retention is another issue, completely."
In other words we agree on the enhanced vs natural differences.
Where we don't agree on is your use of 'slight' when studies have shown dramatic reduction of fat with the aforementioned compounds and in particular with abdominal areas in one and relative to subc. administration in the other which is specific to spot reduction. It is what it is.
"Don't over complicate things, the OP brought up spot reducting. You can't. End of story" <-- Just lol.
I may have missed this, but if these compounds ares so effective, why aren't they being used and prescribed more often?
apparently, there is a legality issue with said compounds.
Not to mention that fact that said person has produced zero proof that they actually spot reduce.
Can I personally ask you how you came across this site?
University of Southern California 2004 is a good place to start.
http://jap.physiology.org/content/96/3/1055
http://jap.physiology.org/content/96/3/1055.figures-only
Oxandrolone reduced total (-1.9 ± 1.0 kg) and trunk fat (-1.3 ± 0.6 kg; P < 0.001), and these decreases were greater (P < 0.001) than placebo. Twelve weeks after oxandrolone was discontinued (week 24), the increments in LBM and muscle strength were no longer different from baseline (P > 0.15). However, the decreases in total and trunk fat were sustained (-1.5 ± 1.8, P = 0.001 and -1.0 ± 1.1 kg, P < 0.001, respectively). Thus oxandrolone induced short-term improvements in LBM, muscle area, and strength, while reducing whole body and trunk adiposity. Anabolic improvements were lost 12 wk after discontinuing oxandrolone, whereas improvements in fat mass were largely sustained.
Among other research:
Oh brother here let me do it for you since this appears to be going around in circles:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14578370
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25899102 (for older women)
Oxandrolone treatment augmented increases in lean tissue for the whole body (2.6 kg; 95% confidence interval (CI), 1.0-4.2 kg; P = 0.003), arms (0.3 kg; 95% CI, 0.1-0.5 kg; P = 0.001), legs (0.8 kg; 95% CI, 0.1-1.4 kg; P = 0.018), and trunk (1.4 kg; 95% CI, 0.4-2.3 kg; P = 0.004). Oxandrolone also augmented loss of fat tissue of the whole body (-1 kg; 95% CI, -1.6 to -0.4; P = 0.002), arms (-0.2 kg; 95% CI, -0.5 to -0.02 kg; P = 0.032), legs (-0.4 kg; 95% CI, -0.6 to -0.1; P = 0.009), and tended to reduce trunk fat (-0.4 kg; 95% CI, -0.9 to 0.04; P = 0.07). Improvements in muscle strength and power, chair stand, and dynamic balance were all significant over time (P < 0.05) but not different between groups (P > 0.05).
CONCLUSIONS:
Oxandrolone improves body composition adaptations to PRT in older women over 12 wk without augmenting muscle function or functional performance beyond that of PRT alone.
As for GH:
https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article-lookup/doi/10.1210/jcem.83.2.4594
"In vitro and in vivo studies have shown that GH is anabolic, lipolytic, and has an antinatriuretic action (8–10). Each of these properties has an impact on body composition. Most of the studies investigating body composition have referred to a two-compartment model consisting of fat mass and lean body mass (LBM)."
. Fat mass. GH replacement therapy has resulted in a mean reduction in fat mass of approximately 4–6 kg in GH-deficient adults (6, 7, 12–17, 21, 26–32). A recent study suggests that this reduction occurs similarly in both CO and AO GH deficiency (33). Anthropometric measurements indicate that the most important change occurs in the abdominal region (6). In addition, studies using CT (12) and MRI (13) have shown that the reduction in abdominal fat mass is mainly due to a reduction in visceral fat mass.
so it reduced body fat all over? not sure how that relates to spot reduction.
I can just eat in a deficit and strength train and lose fat all over, over time.8 -
No - look at the figures and differences. Particular emphasis on abdominal in Ox and through its pharmacology with GH precisely *WHERE* you inject it into the fat cells before it spreads.
Yeah - sure you can eat in a deficit, train and lose fat as well as muscle - all over.... over time. What you CANNOT do is remain static on calories or even in a deficit in a sedentary manner and lose fat whilst gaining strength. Particularly abdominal fat which Ox is known to do.
As for GH - if you look into how it works within cells via administration in a particular site of course it's going to spot reduce that fat moreso unless you go for the other option (IM) rather than Subc administration whereby itll be more even.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »trigden1991 wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Oh lookie, neither of the two things you sent me in the PMs actually showed spot reduction, just fat loss induced because one is a steroid and the other is hgh.
Care to share which miracle "spot reduction" things these are?
Oxandrolone and HGH. Really this secrecy crap stinks to high heavens. There's no reason to not write it public unless being afraid of being shown to be wrong.
Both of those are well known and regularly used by bodybuilders and others during cutting cycles. HGH is profoundly good at mobilising fat and oxandrolane (Anavar) anecdotally is good at the same.
However neither have any spot reduction capabilities.
The only compound that I can think of that "spot reduces" (and I use that phrase very loosely) is Yohimbine as it targets the stubborn fat areas due it stimulating the beta receptors.2 -
No - look at the figures and differences. Particular emphasis on abdominal in Ox and through its pharmacology with GH precisely *WHERE* you inject it into the fat cells before it spreads.
Yeah - sure you can eat in a deficit, train and lose fat as well as muscle - all over.... over time. What you CANNOT do is remain static on calories or even in a deficit in a sedentary manner and lose fat whilst gaining strength. Particularly abdominal fat which Ox is known to do.
As for GH - if you look into how it works within cells via administration in a particular site of course it's going to spot reduce that fat moreso unless you go for the other option (IM) rather than Subc administration whereby itll be more even.
so my options are 1) take steroids, eat regularly, lift heavy, and lose fat from all over; 2) eat in calorie deficit, lift heavy, lose fat all over; 3) recomp and lose some fat and gain some muscle...
I dont see anything in what you have posted that by taking these compounds I can just target, say, belly fat...0 -
No - look at the figures and differences. Particular emphasis on abdominal in Ox and through its pharmacology with GH precisely *WHERE* you inject it into the fat cells before it spreads.
Yeah - sure you can eat in a deficit, train and lose fat as well as muscle - all over.... over time. What you CANNOT do is remain static on calories or even in a deficit in a sedentary manner and lose fat whilst gaining strength. Particularly abdominal fat which Ox is known to do.
As for GH - if you look into how it works within cells via administration in a particular site of course it's going to spot reduce that fat moreso unless you go for the other option (IM) rather than Subc administration whereby itll be more even.
so my options are 1) take steroids, eat regularly, lift heavy, and lose fat from all over; 2) eat in calorie deficit, lift heavy, lose fat all over; 3) recomp and lose some fat and gain some muscle...
I dont see anything in what you have posted that by taking these compounds I can just target, say, belly fat...
Oxandrolone will specifically target more abdominal 'belly' fat than any other. Prostaglandin 2a (PGF2A) will in particular spot reduce an area where you inject it. It works directly on the fat cells you inject it into. I don't condone its use for this purpose but some people use it for that purpose.2 -
No - look at the figures and differences. Particular emphasis on abdominal in Ox and through its pharmacology with GH precisely *WHERE* you inject it into the fat cells before it spreads.
Yeah - sure you can eat in a deficit, train and lose fat as well as muscle - all over.... over time. What you CANNOT do is remain static on calories or even in a deficit in a sedentary manner and lose fat whilst gaining strength. Particularly abdominal fat which Ox is known to do.
As for GH - if you look into how it works within cells via administration in a particular site of course it's going to spot reduce that fat moreso unless you go for the other option (IM) rather than Subc administration whereby itll be more even.
so my options are 1) take steroids, eat regularly, lift heavy, and lose fat from all over; 2) eat in calorie deficit, lift heavy, lose fat all over; 3) recomp and lose some fat and gain some muscle...
I dont see anything in what you have posted that by taking these compounds I can just target, say, belly fat...
Oxandrolone will specifically target more abdominal 'belly' fat than any other. Prostaglandin 2a (PGF2A) will in particular spot reduce an area where you inject it. It works directly on the fat cells you inject it into. I don't condone its use for this purpose but some people use it for that purpose.
OK--and what are the side effects?0
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