Cutting Sugar From my Diet entirely
Replies
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GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
I think I would personally struggle to cut out sugars in fruits and veggies especially, and would probably find it much easier to cut out added sugar foods. But if taking it to a more extreme level works for the OP, in the end that is all that really matters.
As for all the comments from other posters about hidden sugars, logging and label reading is a great way to find them. It is surprising the number of foods that get added sugar, and in some cases the sugar IMO messes the flavor up. BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.2 -
Come to Australia where they put tomato sauce (ketchup) on just about everything!! It is bloody insulting when i make a yummy dish for someone, and they drown it in sauce because it's just the done thing
Personally, i don't eat it, is has a boring flavour to me, but my hubby goes through copious amounts of the stuff. If I'm going to dip my chips in something, it'll be mayo.
ETA: My hubby is anti calorie counting/weighing food etc etc and has never read a food label in his life! But even he is aware that ketchup contains sugar. Our brand has 4.4g of sugar per serve (15ml). Sugar is the 2nd ingredient on the list.3 -
robertw486 wrote: »GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
Especially if one, like the poster you quoted, misreads the OP to be about exactly what one has decided is helpful for oneself!
I didn't notice anyone telling OP that he absolutely must not cut out sugars from vegetables, but simply reminding him that it's not just cutting out fruit and sweets and lattes, that sugar is in a LOT of whole foods. Personally, if he wants to, whatever.As for all the comments from other posters about hidden sugars, logging and label reading is a great way to find them.
Gosh, just like all the people saying it's not hidden, it's on the label were recommending -- reading labels is always a good idea, and if you log it's impossible to claim hidden sugar (and then check out the various sources if one wishes -- that is what I do if surprised, but so far it's rare, the most surprising things to me have been some whole foods like leeks and blueberries (amount, not that they had it), nothing with added sugar, but then I've pretty much always read labels).BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).4 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
Especially if one, like the poster you quoted, misreads the OP to be about exactly what one has decided is helpful for oneself!
I didn't notice anyone telling OP that he absolutely must not cut out sugars from vegetables, but simply reminding him that it's not just cutting out fruit and sweets and lattes, that sugar is in a LOT of whole foods. Personally, if he wants to, whatever.As for all the comments from other posters about hidden sugars, logging and label reading is a great way to find them.
Gosh, just like all the people saying it's not hidden, it's on the label were recommending -- reading labels is always a good idea, and if you log it's impossible to claim hidden sugar (and then check out the various sources if one wishes -- that is what I do if surprised, but so far it's rare, the most surprising things to me have been some whole foods like leeks and blueberries (amount, not that they had it), nothing with added sugar, but then I've pretty much always read labels).BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).
I think most of the commercial brands are Kansas City style...which are very sweet tomato based sauces. There are styles that are vinegar based that have little or no sugar. They use that type in North Carolina often. I don't know of any brands, or if you would need to make your own. There are also mustard style sauces, but I've never tried this type so don't know how much sugar is added (if any). Bottom line, I think there are many regional variations, and not all are sweet. But overall, most Americans are used to the sweet kind.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).
The sugar in BBQ sauce is primarily there for the Maillard reaction, wherein the sugar is caramelized/reduced by the heat and helps give the distinctive BBQ flavor. One could certainly make their own without sugar, but it would definitely taste like something was missing. Kinda like pizza on a cauliflower crust....it's a substance resembling pizza, but it ain't pizza.10 -
I've cut off sugar , and it feels great
The only sugar I need is from fruit .1 -
MoiAussi93 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
Especially if one, like the poster you quoted, misreads the OP to be about exactly what one has decided is helpful for oneself!
I didn't notice anyone telling OP that he absolutely must not cut out sugars from vegetables, but simply reminding him that it's not just cutting out fruit and sweets and lattes, that sugar is in a LOT of whole foods. Personally, if he wants to, whatever.As for all the comments from other posters about hidden sugars, logging and label reading is a great way to find them.
Gosh, just like all the people saying it's not hidden, it's on the label were recommending -- reading labels is always a good idea, and if you log it's impossible to claim hidden sugar (and then check out the various sources if one wishes -- that is what I do if surprised, but so far it's rare, the most surprising things to me have been some whole foods like leeks and blueberries (amount, not that they had it), nothing with added sugar, but then I've pretty much always read labels).BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).
I think most of the commercial brands are Kansas City style...which are very sweet tomato based sauces. There are styles that are vinegar based that have little or no sugar. They use that type in North Carolina often. I don't know of any brands, or if you would need to make your own. There are also mustard style sauces, but I've never tried this type so don't know how much sugar is added (if any). Bottom line, I think there are many regional variations, and not all are sweet. But overall, most Americans are used to the sweet kind.
I actually looked at Carolina style because I thought it would be lower, but it was too high for my current goal. I can work with a dry rub anyway (and I do specifically like Memphis style for ribs, since I don't like messy anyway) -- I normally make up my own thing when doing pulled pork with spices and maybe some ACV. I was just curious since I was in a store with a lot of less common options (Plum Market is like WF on steroids) what would be available. Got some avocado oil aioli in addition to the salsa.
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lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).
The sugar in BBQ sauce is primarily there for the Maillard reaction, wherein the sugar is caramelized/reduced by the heat and helps give the distinctive BBQ flavor. One could certainly make their own without sugar, but it would definitely taste like something was missing. Kinda like pizza on a cauliflower crust....it's a substance resembling pizza, but it ain't pizza.
Yeah, that's what I suspected.0 -
Lol, love it when people go off the deep end. Can't find anything? Only finding what YOU'RE looking for? Here let me help then. And also, with 30 years behind of ACTUALLY TRAINING PEOPLE TO LOSE WEIGHT and being successful at it, I think I'm pretty qualified in my analogies.
I don't disagree because of a "personal view". I disagree because that's just not how biology works. Look up the digestive system and there is NO DISPUTE by any Journal of SCIENCE, PHYSIOLOGY or BIOLOGY on how the body digests any saccharide. As with all of them, they get broken down to their simplest forms (usually glucose or fructose) then digested. That's pretty much it.
NOT a peer reviewed article and written by a guy that SUPPORTS and sells Paleo books. FAIL.RuNaRoUnDaFiEld wrote: »Start reasonably and cut refined sugars for 2 weeks and see how you feel. Make sure you are not replacing with a bunch of artificial sweeteners. Due to a health issue I had to cut refined sugars but still use honey agave and natural sugars in fruits and vegetables. My goal is to stay under 30g a day. Think that is about as close as I can get to "no sugar" and eat a complete diet. (2100 cal/day)
How would cutting refined sugar help a health issue if you are replacing it with natural sugar?
Your body doesn't care where it comes from. Sugar is sugar.
Your body does care.
Refined sugar is broken down by the body differently than natural occouring sugars. Refined sugars are made of bonded sucrose and glucose and when they are processed by the body it dramatically increases insulin production. Or in my case fuel for bacteria production. Consuming 30g +/- of sugar daily is pretty low considering a 12oz can of coke contains 40g.
Got a link to some science on that?
1) Refined sugar (table sugar, also called sucrose) is made of glucose and fructose. Guess what honey is made of? Glucose and fructose. Guess what high fructose corn syrup is made of? You guessed it - glucose and fructose.
2) The body digests/metabolizes all sugars (refined or natural) into monosaccharides (chiefly glucose), regardless of their source. Sugar is sugar.
How your body metabolises naturally occurring sugars is different from how it metabolises artificial or processed/refined sugars. They did a study of artificial honey versus natural honey where the artificial honey had exact same ratio of glucose to fructose molecules. What they found was that the body treated the two honeys significantly differently. Too, in studies of the Kuna people who get the majority of their calories from fruit, there are no sugar related diseases and their body mass remains lean. Further studies have shown that the same molecules of sugar are processed differently...for example the fructose eaten with fruit was processed differently from HFCS...and actually that pure fructose was toxic.
https://chriskresser.com/is-all-sugar-created-equal/
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Given. But he is simply summarising peer reviewed studies that are published on PubMed and are referenced within his article via hyperlinks. It's up to you if you want to ignore the actual studies he's referencing simply because this news reporter as it were is not an expert and has personal views you don't agree with. Me, I don't really dig into the personal background of reporters, I just skip to the scientific studies behind it. You're never going to find an article without bias one way or another. But it seems you'd only actually consider articles by people with the same bias as yourself, which is a bit narrow minded imho. I'm not a Paleo advocate myself simply because there is no one Paleo Diet that ever existed in human history so the name itself and its whole theory is based on a nonexistent premise. But that said, doesn't mean I'm not going to be open to information from all sources. I'd be happy to review any articles or studies you may wish to post on the subject. Saying you don't agree because of the credential of a reporter isn't really presenting additional information so much as criticising a spokespersons personal views...somewhat irrelevant. Cheers.
People here look for information. But they also look for information that's accurate and not just written to fill a blog. I remember having to write articles for my Wellness Center. You LOOKED for stuff to write just to fill space.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Ok, well then if every journal of biology, physiology and science supports you opinion, then why haven't you posted any links to any studies supporting your viewpoint? And I've posted an article that references a dozen studies on PubMed that do support my viewpoint. Hmmmm, could it be because you can't find any? Obviously telling me to "look it up" isn't working because I have gone and looked it up and it all repeats what I posted...so yeah...right now I have the words of a lot of specialised Drs in lab coats versus a, what are you? Oh yeah a "certified personal trainer" who says otherwise. So, please bring on some guys in lab coats with doctorates that agree with you and I'd be happy to listen to you then.
https://www.boundless.com/physiology/textbooks/boundless-anatomy-and-physiology-textbook/digestive-system-23/chemical-digestion-224/chemical-digestion-of-carbohydrates-proteins-lipids-and-nucleic-acids-1104-1171/
In humans, dietary starches are composed of glucose units arranged in long chains of polysaccharide called amylose. During digestion, the bonds between glucose molecules are broken by salivary and pancreatic amylase, and result in progressively smaller chains of glucose. This process produces the simple sugars glucose and maltose (two glucose molecules) that can be absorbed by the small intestine.
Sucrase is an enzyme that breaks down disaccharide sucrose, commonly known as table sugar, cane sugar, or beet sugar. Sucrose digestion yields the sugars fructose and glucose, which are readily absorbed by the small intestine.
Lactase is an enzyme that breaks down the disaccharide lactose into its component parts, glucose and galactose, that are absorbed by the small intestine. Approximately half the adult population produces only small amounts of lactase and are therefore unable to eat milk-based foods. This condition is commonly known as lactose intolerance.
https://2012books.lardbucket.org/books/an-introduction-to-nutrition/s08-02-digestion-and-absorption-of-ca.html
http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovations/food2.htm
https://quizlet.com/15417076/digestive-system-and-carbohydrates-flash-cards/
Starch becomes glucose; amylase (enzyme breaks starch) starts in the mouth. Maltose deactivated in stomach. Pancreas secretes more amylase. Maltose ends up in small intestine. Maltose breaks it down to glucose.
Complex Carbohydrate (polysaccharide). Found in plants, made up of many glucose molecules linked in straight or branched chains. Starch is broken down into glucose.
It would be tedious to keep posting the same BASIC information that is TAUGHT in all biology and physiology classes.
Thanks for playing though.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Can I just like this 100 times please? Yes this whole ting is basic basic basic biology en physiology text book
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I can't speak for everyone here, but I've been reading labels for 30+ years ... ever since labels have started appearing on food! So yeah, I've got a reasonable idea what's in there. Even as a kid, I read the ingredients lists on cereal boxes in both English and French.
An interesting thing related to this is - that labels might differ in different languages! Some offer more detailed information than others.
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Christine_72 wrote: »Come to Australia where they put tomato sauce (ketchup) on just about everything!! It is bloody insulting when i make a yummy dish for someone, and they drown it in sauce because it's just the done thing Personally, i don't eat it, is has a boring flavour to me, but my hubby goes through copious amounts of the stuff. If I'm going to dip my chips in something, it'll be mayo.
ETA: My hubby is anti calorie counting/weighing food etc etc and has never read a food label in his life! But even he is aware that ketchup contains sugar. Our brand has 4.4g of sugar per serve (15ml). Sugar is the 2nd ingredient on the list.
When we first got married, my wife coated many (if not most) whole meats in ketchup. It reached a point where I told her that I would buy her a cheap cut of meat to slather with ketchup, and only I would get the good cut of steak. It took years for me to show her how meat actually has flavor and is not intended to taste like the condiment you coat it with.
The day she commented on how a medium rare steak with little seasoning tasted good was a day I should have marked on the calendar.
lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
Especially if one, like the poster you quoted, misreads the OP to be about exactly what one has decided is helpful for oneself!
I didn't notice anyone telling OP that he absolutely must not cut out sugars from vegetables, but simply reminding him that it's not just cutting out fruit and sweets and lattes, that sugar is in a LOT of whole foods. Personally, if he wants to, whatever.
I'm well aware of what I quoted, and what that poster stated. I find a short and sweet input, along with the emphasis on the OP doing what they find works for them, often more helpful than those going grossly off track with reasons why they think it shouldn't be done.3 -
robertw486 wrote: »I'm well aware of what I quoted, and what that poster stated. I find a short and sweet input, along with the emphasis on the OP doing what they find works for them, often more helpful than those going grossly off track with reasons why they think it shouldn't be done.
That's nice.
I, and many other posters, didn't waste much time telling OP he should not do whatever it is he decides to do either. Instead, since he asked for comments about giving up sugar and what he should expect, I commented on my experience giving up added sugar for a while (and currently eating very little added sugar) and why I think that can be a useful experiment, but noted that I had not given up ALL sugar and pointed out all that it is in, as his first post suggested that he might not be fully aware of/thinking of those things (as he seemed to think the main difference would be dropping fruit).
The post you quoted misread OP to be talking only about added sugar and suggested (falsely, IMO) that other posters were telling him not to do something he had decided he wanted to do (and that it was about cutting added sugar). It was, at the least, based on reading the OP to say something it did not (that of course was the thing the OP did) and also misreading the responses to be telling OP not to do something vs. just providing information (information that was actually related to what OP had said he was thinking of doing, unlike those who focused 100% on dropping added sugar when OP said fruit).
I started out misreading OP and asking IF he meant all sugar or only added (and then went into my anecdote about me dropping added sugar), but at least I managed to catch it and realize that he did mean all sugar. It's not the misreading I find objectionable, though -- it happens -- but the false assertion that the main thrust of the responses was to tell OP "no, no, don't do it!" when that's not true. Saying "you realize that means dropping vegetables and lots of other foods that most consider to add to a healthy diet, so IF the particular goal is about health it might be counterproductive" hardly = "no, no, don't do it!" and the idea that providing such information is somehow inappropriate and is non responsive to what OP started this thread to talk about seems, well, odd to me.7 -
For those later in the discussion focused on the evils of added sugar and so-called hidden sugar, I do have a question. Like I said, I gave it up for a while as an experiment (at the time I was trying to avoid non homemade stuff in general, so it was pretty easy). I've returned to cutting out sugary foods a couple of times, because for me doing that from time to time seems to help me moderate (I think for some it can have an opposite effect or no helpful effect, so I avoid assuming that because this helps me that it is something others should do).
Anyway, when I've returned to it, I haven't bothered about eliminating added sugar 100% since I know for me the issue is more sweets and my control with them. I don't add sugar or honey or syrup to stuff, but I don't bother eliminating something like sriracha, where sugar is the second ingredient, but where there's 1 gram (or less) of sugar per tsp, and serving size in reality might be bigger than that, but isn't huge given that it's quite spicy (and I am someone who actually does usually use sauces in their serving size or less). So for those who insist that added sugar and inherent sugar are 100% different and cutting out all added sugar is important for health, I'm curious how you think that leaving in the sriracha is harmful. Or even something like a BBQ sauce (I also don't care for super sweet ones, but they all will have some added sugar). I'm assuming here that one would use it on occasion, in a reasonable serving, not coat it on all foods at all meals (although inherent in the coating it on foods is that you are consuming it with other foods and protein and fat and fiber specifically).
(Aside, the sriracha fits fine in my current low carb macros.)5 -
I can't speak for everyone here, but I've been reading labels for 30+ years ... ever since labels have started appearing on food! So yeah, I've got a reasonable idea what's in there. Even as a kid, I read the ingredients lists on cereal boxes in both English and French.
I've also been counting calories for 30+ years. When there weren't helpful sites like this, I went to the library and researched how many calories were in things ... and what was in things.
Fortunately, my mother was a nurse and she had numerous medical texts some of which also assisted me in finding out what was in the food I ate.
I grew up in a family of readers, and my parents banned books from the table to encourage interaction. I think that's how I got started reading the nutritional info on our cereal boxes. No books? Well we'll show YOU! Ha!
I do like knowing what's in my food, but it's mostly out of curiosity about the choices that people/companies make. Why are they using this? What does it do to the flavor or the texture, for example? What else might they have used instead, and what made them choose not to use that, and to use this one?1 -
The only real effect of cutting sugar from your diet is you have more calories to eat for other foods. There might be some other health benefits.1
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I'm not a massive fruit eater, mostly berries when they're in season so I can buy British grown. But to never eat them or other fruit? That would be tough even for me.
I don't give sugar a second thought honestly, I'm not a huge consumer of sugary foods but it's not something I worry about.
As for condiments, I rarely use any, if it's ketchup it's Tiptree, brown sauce is Daddie's and both of those I usually only have on a sausage or bacon sarnie. Depends on my mood whether I go brown or red.0 -
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lemurcat12 wrote: »
Yeah, I forgot to say "added sugars".0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »I'm well aware of what I quoted, and what that poster stated. I find a short and sweet input, along with the emphasis on the OP doing what they find works for them, often more helpful than those going grossly off track with reasons why they think it shouldn't be done.
That's nice.
I, and many other posters, didn't waste much time telling OP he should not do whatever it is he decides to do either. Instead, since he asked for comments about giving up sugar and what he should expect, I commented on my experience giving up added sugar for a while (and currently eating very little added sugar) and why I think that can be a useful experiment, but noted that I had not given up ALL sugar and pointed out all that it is in, as his first post suggested that he might not be fully aware of/thinking of those things (as he seemed to think the main difference would be dropping fruit).
The post you quoted misread OP to be talking only about added sugar and suggested (falsely, IMO) that other posters were telling him not to do something he had decided he wanted to do (and that it was about cutting added sugar). It was, at the least, based on reading the OP to say something it did not (that of course was the thing the OP did) and also misreading the responses to be telling OP not to do something vs. just providing information (information that was actually related to what OP had said he was thinking of doing, unlike those who focused 100% on dropping added sugar when OP said fruit).
I started out misreading OP and asking IF he meant all sugar or only added (and then went into my anecdote about me dropping added sugar), but at least I managed to catch it and realize that he did mean all sugar. It's not the misreading I find objectionable, though -- it happens -- but the false assertion that the main thrust of the responses was to tell OP "no, no, don't do it!" when that's not true. Saying "you realize that means dropping vegetables and lots of other foods that most consider to add to a healthy diet, so IF the particular goal is about health it might be counterproductive" hardly = "no, no, don't do it!" and the idea that providing such information is somehow inappropriate and is non responsive to what OP started this thread to talk about seems, well, odd to me.
Your flaw in this post is thinking that I misread anything, or don't understand the intention of my post. Neither is true.
If you find it odd or objectionable that not everyone has the same input or form of providing said input, well.... that's on you. I don't find it odd at all that different people are different, and the OP's motivation for cutting sugars isn't for me to question.3 -
robertw486 wrote: »Your flaw in this post is thinking that I misread anything, or don't understand the intention of my post. Neither is true.
I didn't say either, so that's a non-responsive comment. I said the poster you highlighted and commended was speaking based on an obvious misunderstanding of both the OP and the other posters in the thread. I did not comment on your intentions, although I do have opinions about them.I don't find it odd at all that different people are different, and the OP's motivation for cutting sugars isn't for me to question.
See, with this comment you are implying (intentionally, I believe) that other posters are casting shade on OP's motivation for considering cutting out all sugar, and that is rather obviously not something that happened. So why would you suggest that it did? I'm not going to speculate here. But when you suggest something that is not true, I might choose to point it out, as I just did.
Again, OP asked for thoughts and experienced with cutting out all sugar and said he thought it would just mean cutting out fruit, mostly, of what was left. People gave their own experiences with cutting out sugar in various ways AND, what you seem to be objecting to, but correct me if I am wrong, noting that it did mean cutting out foods like vegetables and dairy, etc., not even just fruit, and thus didn't really lead to a healthier diet. I don't think it's terrible and wrong to assume that maybe OP is concerned with health or has an idea that less sugar is always better given the weird rhetoric that sugar sometimes attracts, so pointing out those things is not some kind of attack on OP. He is, of course, free to say "I am not saying it would be healthier, but the experiment interests me" or some such. Heck, I even mentioned that some people do follow a so-called carnivore diet and like it!4 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
Especially if one, like the poster you quoted, misreads the OP to be about exactly what one has decided is helpful for oneself!
I didn't notice anyone telling OP that he absolutely must not cut out sugars from vegetables, but simply reminding him that it's not just cutting out fruit and sweets and lattes, that sugar is in a LOT of whole foods. Personally, if he wants to, whatever.As for all the comments from other posters about hidden sugars, logging and label reading is a great way to find them.
Gosh, just like all the people saying it's not hidden, it's on the label were recommending -- reading labels is always a good idea, and if you log it's impossible to claim hidden sugar (and then check out the various sources if one wishes -- that is what I do if surprised, but so far it's rare, the most surprising things to me have been some whole foods like leeks and blueberries (amount, not that they had it), nothing with added sugar, but then I've pretty much always read labels).BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).
I think most of the commercial brands are Kansas City style...which are very sweet tomato based sauces. There are styles that are vinegar based that have little or no sugar. They use that type in North Carolina often. I don't know of any brands, or if you would need to make your own. There are also mustard style sauces, but I've never tried this type so don't know how much sugar is added (if any). Bottom line, I think there are many regional variations, and not all are sweet. But overall, most Americans are used to the sweet kind.
I actually looked at Carolina style because I thought it would be lower, but it was too high for my current goal. I can work with a dry rub anyway (and I do specifically like Memphis style for ribs, since I don't like messy anyway) -- I normally make up my own thing when doing pulled pork with spices and maybe some ACV. I was just curious since I was in a store with a lot of less common options (Plum Market is like WF on steroids) what would be available. Got some avocado oil aioli in addition to the salsa.
Most BBQ dry rubs contain sugar also. It's an essential element to create the "bark"/crust on ribs, pork shoulder, etc. when it caramelizes in the Maillard Reaction. I mean, you can certainly cook BBQ without it, but it's just not the same.
I always do my ribs Memphis style (dry rub, sauce on the side when they're served), but every rub I use has sugar in it - usually as one of the first three or four ingredients in the list.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »MoiAussi93 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »robertw486 wrote: »GlassslippersAndFairyDust wrote: »I find when I cut refined sugar out of my diet my cravings completely disappear. I never cut out fruits. I don't eat ketchup (before anyone jumps on that wagon). So IMHO it does make a difference. Don't know the science.....don't care. Just know it works for me. Also, I have an easier time shedding belly fat without refined sugar. Don't know the science, don't care....works for me. Do you and if it makes you crave less, lose more....whatever....just do you.
If only more people here took the approach of suggesting and OP make their own decisions and give their views a try, me might have less "but why cut out (whatever) threads"!
Especially if one, like the poster you quoted, misreads the OP to be about exactly what one has decided is helpful for oneself!
I didn't notice anyone telling OP that he absolutely must not cut out sugars from vegetables, but simply reminding him that it's not just cutting out fruit and sweets and lattes, that sugar is in a LOT of whole foods. Personally, if he wants to, whatever.As for all the comments from other posters about hidden sugars, logging and label reading is a great way to find them.
Gosh, just like all the people saying it's not hidden, it's on the label were recommending -- reading labels is always a good idea, and if you log it's impossible to claim hidden sugar (and then check out the various sources if one wishes -- that is what I do if surprised, but so far it's rare, the most surprising things to me have been some whole foods like leeks and blueberries (amount, not that they had it), nothing with added sugar, but then I've pretty much always read labels).BBQ sauce is one thing in particular where I wish there were more options lower in sugar.
You can make your own, although w/o sugar of any sort it might not count as real BBQ sauce under any of the standard styles (I am not savvy enough about BBQ to know if that's so). But again I think most people would expect a BBQ sauce to have some sugar, and the amount of sugar added varies quite a bit (I know this, because recently I was wondering if any might fit into my current macros and I looked through a bunch of different ones at Plum Market -- some weren't all that high, but as I expected none would work for me currently, bought some salsa for lazy nights when I don't want to make my own sauce, instead--one of the Frontera ones, 2 TBSP and 2 g carbs, <1 g sugar).
I think most of the commercial brands are Kansas City style...which are very sweet tomato based sauces. There are styles that are vinegar based that have little or no sugar. They use that type in North Carolina often. I don't know of any brands, or if you would need to make your own. There are also mustard style sauces, but I've never tried this type so don't know how much sugar is added (if any). Bottom line, I think there are many regional variations, and not all are sweet. But overall, most Americans are used to the sweet kind.
I actually looked at Carolina style because I thought it would be lower, but it was too high for my current goal. I can work with a dry rub anyway (and I do specifically like Memphis style for ribs, since I don't like messy anyway) -- I normally make up my own thing when doing pulled pork with spices and maybe some ACV. I was just curious since I was in a store with a lot of less common options (Plum Market is like WF on steroids) what would be available. Got some avocado oil aioli in addition to the salsa.
Most BBQ dry rubs contain sugar also. It's an essential element to create the "bark"/crust on ribs, pork shoulder, etc. when it caramelizes in the Maillard Reaction. I mean, you can certainly cook BBQ without it, but it's just not the same.
I always do my ribs Memphis style (dry rub, sauce on the side when they're served), but every rub I use has sugar in it - usually as one of the first three or four ingredients in the list.
Yeah, I realize that. I don't do BBQ for my pulled pork and do make up my own dry rub, but I have a couple of commercial ones that have sugar in them. My pulled pork is good, but the standard way I do it is by no means going to be really like BBQ, so not adding sugar makes no difference (I'm not anti adding sugar, which this is sounding like -- it was all just a digression because someone was talking about BBQ and I'd just looked at some on a whim, as it's not something I normally use much).
The comment about Memphis style was not meant to suggest it did not have sugar, but was just an aside.0 -
RuNaRoUnDaFiEld wrote: »Start reasonably and cut refined sugars for 2 weeks and see how you feel. Make sure you are not replacing with a bunch of artificial sweeteners. Due to a health issue I had to cut refined sugars but still use honey agave and natural sugars in fruits and vegetables. My goal is to stay under 30g a day. Think that is about as close as I can get to "no sugar" and eat a complete diet. (2100 cal/day)
How would cutting refined sugar help a health issue if you are replacing it with natural sugar?
Your body doesn't care where it comes from. Sugar is sugar.
Your body does care.
Refined sugar is broken down by the body differently than natural occouring sugars. Refined sugars are made of bonded sucrose and glucose and when they are processed by the body it dramatically increases insulin production. Or in my case fuel for bacteria production. Consuming 30g +/- of sugar daily is pretty low considering a 12oz can of coke contains 40g.
Got a link to some science on that?
1) Refined sugar (table sugar, also called sucrose) is made of glucose and fructose. Guess what honey is made of? Glucose and fructose. Guess what high fructose corn syrup is made of? You guessed it - glucose and fructose.
2) The body digests/metabolizes all sugars (refined or natural) into monosaccharides (chiefly glucose), regardless of their source. Sugar is sugar.
How your body metabolises naturally occurring sugars is different from how it metabolises artificial or processed/refined sugars. They did a study of artificial honey versus natural honey where the artificial honey had exact same ratio of glucose to fructose molecules. What they found was that the body treated the two honeys significantly differently. Too, in studies of the Kuna people who get the majority of their calories from fruit, there are no sugar related diseases and their body mass remains lean. Further studies have shown that the same molecules of sugar are processed differently...for example the fructose eaten with fruit was processed differently from HFCS...and actually that pure fructose was toxic.
https://chriskresser.com/is-all-sugar-created-equal/
You're citing a quack....... try citing peer reviewed scientific literature. What's next Drs Oz & Mercola.......6 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »For those later in the discussion focused on the evils of added sugar and so-called hidden sugar, I do have a question. Like I said, I gave it up for a while as an experiment (at the time I was trying to avoid non homemade stuff in general, so it was pretty easy). I've returned to cutting out sugary foods a couple of times, because for me doing that from time to time seems to help me moderate (I think for some it can have an opposite effect or no helpful effect, so I avoid assuming that because this helps me that it is something others should do).
Anyway, when I've returned to it, I haven't bothered about eliminating added sugar 100% since I know for me the issue is more sweets and my control with them. I don't add sugar or honey or syrup to stuff, but I don't bother eliminating something like sriracha, where sugar is the second ingredient, but where there's 1 gram (or less) of sugar per tsp, and serving size in reality might be bigger than that, but isn't huge given that it's quite spicy (and I am someone who actually does usually use sauces in their serving size or less). So for those who insist that added sugar and inherent sugar are 100% different and cutting out all added sugar is important for health, I'm curious how you think that leaving in the sriracha is harmful. Or even something like a BBQ sauce (I also don't care for super sweet ones, but they all will have some added sugar). I'm assuming here that one would use it on occasion, in a reasonable serving, not coat it on all foods at all meals (although inherent in the coating it on foods is that you are consuming it with other foods and protein and fat and fiber specifically).
(Aside, the sriracha fits fine in my current low carb macros.)
Sriracha is also known as "Thai ketchup"
And speaking of Thai foods, most (if not all) of my savory Thai recipes include sugar as an ingredient. At first I thought this was weird, and eliminated or reduced it, but have since learned that in Thai cuisine sugar is essential for balancing the salt, sour, and spice.
Indeed, the art of Thai cooking is combining ingredients at opposite ends of the flavor spectrum–chile paste and coconut milk, palm sugar and lime juice–and balancing them to create vibrantly flavored food.2 -
paperpudding wrote: »Too, in studies of the Kuna people who get the majority of their calories from fruit, there are no sugar related diseases and their body mass remains lean.
I had not heard of the Kuna people so i looked them up - they are an indiginous people of Panama and Colombia.
I expect they lived a traditional lifestyle, consuming far more whole foods and far less calories and being far more active than the average person in modern western countries - hence, surprise surprise
- they tend to be leaner.
I would think that is far more likely explanation than simply their diet is high in fruit.
I spent several months in south Costa Rica, near the Panama border. I ate tons of fruit, and lost weight without intending to. Of course, I was active, and eating no calorie-dense ultra-processed foods.
The Guaymi indigenous people near us did indeed live a traditional, active lifestyle, and none I met were overweight. Presumably they did eat a lot of fruit, as you couldn't swing an iguana without hitting some. Their portions of meat would be considered small by Americans.1 -
kshama2001 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »For those later in the discussion focused on the evils of added sugar and so-called hidden sugar, I do have a question. Like I said, I gave it up for a while as an experiment (at the time I was trying to avoid non homemade stuff in general, so it was pretty easy). I've returned to cutting out sugary foods a couple of times, because for me doing that from time to time seems to help me moderate (I think for some it can have an opposite effect or no helpful effect, so I avoid assuming that because this helps me that it is something others should do).
Anyway, when I've returned to it, I haven't bothered about eliminating added sugar 100% since I know for me the issue is more sweets and my control with them. I don't add sugar or honey or syrup to stuff, but I don't bother eliminating something like sriracha, where sugar is the second ingredient, but where there's 1 gram (or less) of sugar per tsp, and serving size in reality might be bigger than that, but isn't huge given that it's quite spicy (and I am someone who actually does usually use sauces in their serving size or less). So for those who insist that added sugar and inherent sugar are 100% different and cutting out all added sugar is important for health, I'm curious how you think that leaving in the sriracha is harmful. Or even something like a BBQ sauce (I also don't care for super sweet ones, but they all will have some added sugar). I'm assuming here that one would use it on occasion, in a reasonable serving, not coat it on all foods at all meals (although inherent in the coating it on foods is that you are consuming it with other foods and protein and fat and fiber specifically).
(Aside, the sriracha fits fine in my current low carb macros.)
Sriracha is also known as "Thai ketchup"
The history is similar -- they both come from the same precursor sauces, I believe, if you read the wiki on ketchup I posted above. So I am not surprised.And speaking of Thai foods, most (if not all) of my savory Thai recipes include sugar as an ingredient. At first I thought this was weird, and eliminated or reduced it, but have since learned that in Thai cuisine sugar is essential for balancing the salt, sour, and spice.
Indeed, the art of Thai cooking is combining ingredients at opposite ends of the flavor spectrum–chile paste and coconut milk, palm sugar and lime juice–and balancing them to create vibrantly flavored food.
Interesting and makes total sense.0 -
I have cut out fructose and sucrose entirely for over a month now. I eat meat, cheese, and vegetables. It has definitely helped in my weight loss because I am very rarely hungry and don't have the carb energy roller coaster.1
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I'm considering cutting sugar completely out from my diet. For the past three weeks that I've been dieting, I've cut down a ton because I'm no longer drinking fraps and other junk *kitten* every day and it hasn't felt like that much of a burden. Has anyone else gone sugar-free entirely? What effects have you noticed? The only thing now I feel like would affect me is the fact that I would have to cut fruits out which is rather disappointing.
I won't read through all 5 pages but you'll notice a few things:
1) Almost everything has sugar in it. Sauces are the worst. Ketchup? Yup. Teriyaki sauce? Lots. Bread? You betcha. Reading labels is important.
2) You'll have headaches, cravings and withdrawls like a MF. This is the hardest piece.
The only sources of sugar I have are from sugar alcohols (which aren't absorbed into our bodies anyway) and whatever is in veggies, which are very small amounts depending on the veg.
If you're going to have sugar at least stick to eating it as a fruit (not blended or juiced) because at least you're also getting fiber and vitamins with it. Cutting out Fraps, sodas and all forms of high fructose syrups would be a start.0 -
I'm considering cutting sugar completely out from my diet. For the past three weeks that I've been dieting, I've cut down a ton because I'm no longer drinking fraps and other junk *kitten* every day and it hasn't felt like that much of a burden. Has anyone else gone sugar-free entirely? What effects have you noticed? The only thing now I feel like would affect me is the fact that I would have to cut fruits out which is rather disappointing.
Eliminating fruit and vegetables seems like a rather bad idea...5 -
Cutting fruit is a good idea. Fruit is loaded with fructose which is essentially sugar. No real need to eliminate vegetables. I try to keep my carbs below 20grams per day and get all of my carbs from vegetables.cwolfman13 wrote: »I'm considering cutting sugar completely out from my diet. For the past three weeks that I've been dieting, I've cut down a ton because I'm no longer drinking fraps and other junk *kitten* every day and it hasn't felt like that much of a burden. Has anyone else gone sugar-free entirely? What effects have you noticed? The only thing now I feel like would affect me is the fact that I would have to cut fruits out which is rather disappointing.
Eliminating fruit and vegetables seems like a rather bad idea...
2
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