June 2017 Running Challenge
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6/1 - 8 miles (daily double: 3.5 & 4.5)
6/2 - 9 miles
6/3 - 5 mile recovery run
6/4 - GW Bridge Challenge 10k (PR - 53:43)
6/5 - 6.25 mile recovery run
6/6 - 9 soaking wet miles
6/7 - 8 miles w/summer track workout (4x1000m w/400m recoveries)
6/8 - 10 miles (daily double: 6 & 4)
6/9 - rest
6/10 - NYRR Mini 10k (6.3 miles - 58:09)
6/11 - 13 mile slow, hottt, long run
6/12 - 8 mile rather hot run
6/13 - 7 mile run w/summer track workout (3x 10 min Indian file runs)
June Total: 95.85/140
696.7 miles/2,017 miles - goal for the year
Last night was 7 miles, including the Rockland Road Runners summer track workout. The workout was really fun as it was my first time doing Indian-file runs! We were instructed to split ourselves up into about 4 groups of around 10 people each, based on pace. We did 3x 10min sessions, with 5 min in between each. It was a good challenge because there was always someone in my group who was probably slightly too fast, which was a great way to really push myself, as they would pull the whole line of us to speed up. And I could feel my glutes working as I pushed on each of my bursts to get to the head of the line, so overall, I think it was a really great workout.
I ran 2 miles warmup first, 1 mile from my house to the track, and another mile doing laps. Since this is such an unstructured workout I didn't really know how many miles I would get out of the Indian-file runs, but it ended up working perfectly. I ran one recovery lap between the first two 10 min sessions, and just rested between the second two, since I was worried about getting too much distance, and I was tired, lol. By the end of the 3rd session I had exactly 6 miles, with a 1 mile cooldown run to get myself home, to get to exactly my 7 mile target, so it was perfect!
Since it's a taper week, tonight's scheduled recovery run is only three miles. Is it messed up that in my head I'm like, 'hmm, does it even count as a training run if it's ONLY 3 miles?'
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@VydorScope love the link to the article. Yes most of us would not recommend your plan. That's 1980's thinking about running and it's an even worse idea depending on your age. Recovery and miles at reduced pace are essential. Race on race day, run fast intervals but do not train like every run is about going faster. Think about the baseball player who wants to hit better, does he set up a machine that throws twice as hard and with more curve. No he develops good mechanics and trains his muscles to respond.1
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VydorScope wrote: »At least 80% of all your miles (or minutes if you go by time) should be easy or recovery (no faster than conversational pace). If you do any more, it's a recipe for burn out and will stunt your training.
Interesting. This is the first I have seen anyone suggest this. My plan for the summer (well until this blasted heat wave hit) was to do my 3 to 5 "short" runs (6-8 miles) each week at race pace+a little (trying to get faster) and my long run at a slightly-harder-than-easy pace. Which without doing the math is probably way more than 20% at a hard pace
Is that a bad plan?
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Pastor Vincent
get and read the book 80/20 Running by Matt Fitzgerald.
http://mattfitzgerald.org/8020training/
Also, these videos will help as well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veAQ73OJdwY&t=9s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaRYYhweiLQ 2 -
cburke8909 wrote: »@VydorScope love the link to the article. Yes most of us would not recommend your plan. That's 1980's thinking about running and it's an even worse idea depending on your age. Recovery and miles at reduced pace are essential. Race on race day, run fast intervals but do not train like every run is about going faster. Think about the baseball player who wants to hit better, does he set up a machine that throws twice as hard and with more curve. No he develops good mechanics and trains his muscles to respond.
Considering I was on the X-Country team in late 80/ealy 90s I guess calling it 1980s thinking is okay! Really though I am just making this up as I go. I figure "want to run faster, well run faster then." Seems logical.
Also, I know nothing about baseball, or really any sport, training. I probably would turn the pitching machine up faster if I was trying to learn to hit.
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Pastor Vincent1 -
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VydorScope wrote: »cburke8909 wrote: »@VydorScope love the link to the article. Yes most of us would not recommend your plan. That's 1980's thinking about running and it's an even worse idea depending on your age. Recovery and miles at reduced pace are essential. Race on race day, run fast intervals but do not train like every run is about going faster. Think about the baseball player who wants to hit better, does he set up a machine that throws twice as hard and with more curve. No he develops good mechanics and trains his muscles to respond.
Considering I was on the X-Country team in late 80/ealy 90s I guess calling it 1980s thinking is okay! Really though I am just making this up as I go. I figure "want to run faster, well run faster then." Seems logical.
Also, I know nothing about baseball, or really any sport, training. I probably would turn the pitching machine up faster if I was trying to learn to hit.
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Pastor Vincent
Ironically, The subtitle of the book recommended by @Stoshew71 is "Train Slower to Run Faster". I second the recommendation on the book.1 -
Saw this on other site.... never have I ever as a runner. I scored 9. Give yourself a point for every yes you have.
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WhatMeRunning wrote: »
Take your 400m time, and the time it takes you to eat one taco. Multiply by 4, and add a few seconds in case you throw up.WhatMeRunning wrote: »
We need this in Huntsville.
Description
The timed Taco Mile will be on Tuesday, June 27 at 6:30pm starting at 135th & Oak. We will run the race in several waves based on projected times. Each participant will eat one taco before running each quarter mile in the race, for a total of four tacos of eating and one mile of running.
How does one even project their own time for this?
I was unintentionally training for this race a couple months ago. It didn't end good. It was nice running weather then. I can't imagine JUNE!! ugh, I feel a little sick already.2 -
@skippygirlsmom -121
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@skippygirlsmom - 5 Lower score is better right? I hope? 1
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lporter229 wrote: »Ironically, The subtitle of the book recommended by @Stoshew71 is "Train Slower to Run Faster". I second the recommendation on the book.
Plan to check it out. Thanks!
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@skippygirlsmom - 81
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@skippygirlsmom - 11
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VydorScope wrote: »@SpiritHippo - For me it is easy. Run or die. That might sound like a stretch, but it is the truth.
For anyone that cares to know the details: http://www.losttalesofpower.com/2015/02/25/i-am-not-a-runner/
Now, cross training and strength training... I have yet to do that regularly. I was doing good when I was part of a bootcamp class, but my schedule change and have not been able to make it back. I need to. Slowly turning into a T-Rex here
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Pastor Vincent
This. Is. Awesome. I may be fast for an old guy, but @VydorScope is truly impressive.
Everyone who glazed past the original post - read the story at the link. I choked up.0 -
@skippygirlsmom 11 but it will be 9 or lower by october1
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VydorScope wrote: »@SpiritHippo - For me it is easy. Run or die. That might sound like a stretch, but it is the truth.
For anyone that cares to know the details: http://www.losttalesofpower.com/2015/02/25/i-am-not-a-runner/
Now, cross training and strength training... I have yet to do that regularly. I was doing good when I was part of a bootcamp class, but my schedule change and have not been able to make it back. I need to. Slowly turning into a T-Rex here
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Pastor Vincent
This. Is. Awesome. I may be fast for an old guy, but @VydorScope is truly impressive.
Everyone who glazed past the original post - read the story at the link. I choked up.
@mobycarp thanks for highlighting this, I did miss it. Wow @vydorscope amazing story and testament to eating right and exercise. So glad you are here.0 -
MNLittleFinn wrote: »@skippygirlsmom 11 but it will be 9 or lower by october
@MNlittlefinn how is your number going down?0 -
@skippygirlsmom my score is only a 5 but there are a few more that I might add by the end of this year.1
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VydorScope wrote: »At least 80% of all your miles (or minutes if you go by time) should be easy or recovery (no faster than conversational pace). If you do any more, it's a recipe for burn out and will stunt your training.
Interesting. This is the first I have seen anyone suggest this. My plan for the summer (well until this blasted heat wave hit) was to do my 3 to 5 "short" runs (6-8 miles) each week at race pace+a little (trying to get faster) and my long run at a slightly-harder-than-easy pace. Which without doing the math is probably way more than 20% at a hard pace
Is that a bad plan?
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Pastor Vincent
@VydorScope - Keep doing that, and you're likely to run yourself into injury.
It has taken me several injuries to learn by feel when I need to back off, even *knowing* that most of my miles should be easy.
On the aggressive side, I train with a club that has a goal of fielding nationally competitive teams of runners in every age group. We train with the Jack Daniels system of paces: E (easy), MP (marathon pace), T (threshold), I (interval, roughly = 5K race pace), and R (repetition, roughly = 1 mile race pace). There are two "quality workouts" per week. Sometimes the quality workout is states as something like "2-4 X 400 @ R". So how do you know whether you're doing 2, 3, or 4 repetitions?
The guideline in this system is, in a single day's workout you should run no more than 10% of your weekly miles at T, no more than 8% at I, no more than 6% at R. So if I'm running 50 miles per week, and the workout says 4-6 x 1 mile @ T, I run 5 x 1 mile at T. If an assignment has multiple paces (e.g., 4x200 @ R, 2 x 1600 @ T, 4x200 @ R), you reduce the percentage for each.
That last one was Tuesday's assignment. I ran it at pretty accurate R and T paces. By my standards, it isn't all that much distance at T; but I've been running a lot of miles as marathon training ramps up. I felt pretty beat up Wednesday morning. Wednesday's run was easy, but I felt the effort for the first 5 miles. Thursday morning, I felt great going out and running 5 easy miles. (Okay, I mostly felt wet after the rain started; but it was still a nice run.)
Today's assignment in the plan is 2-4x400 @ R, 2 miles @ T, and 6x200 @I. I'm not going to do that. Where I am right now, and wanting to race a 5K on Sunday, it's too much. So I ran 5 easy miles this morning, and this evening I'll go be a rabbit for the training program's 2 mile time trial. I'll likely have another 3 miles of easy running around that time trial.
Backing off the fast stuff is a way to recover from hard work and prevent injury. Given the history you've linked, I expect it will be more difficult for you to distinguish when running is beating you up and you need to back off; but you really need to learn how to do this. There should be a qualitative difference between hurting from pushing too much and the background pain you always have.
I'm not a firm believer in 80% easy as an unbreakable rule, but it's a reasonable guideline. Most miles and most time should be easy running. There comes a point in the distance runner's development when an easy running day is a recovery day, almost as much so as a rest day. That's a good place to be.
And there are times, such as rehabbing from injury, when *all* running should be easy. Been there, done that, and was delighted to get better on 30 easy miles a week instead of having to spend all my time on the couch.4 -
@skippygirlsmom 3 I'm pathetic haha!3
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@skippygirlsmom - 7, unless kicking myself off a treadmill counts. In that case, 6. And I'm taking "running circles" metaphorically. I doubt I ever ran geometrically accurate circles to meet a goal, but I've definitely run loops of parking lots and oval tracks.1
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I honestly had to Google "Leadville". And now I am at 13. LOL0
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@VydorScope funny I ran X-Country in the 80's. I remember the philosophy "run, run , run and faster, faster, faster" We did intervals and hill training some but rest days and days off to recover were considered the actions of slackers. Cross training and strength training, not given much value. Funny thing, a friend of mine got to know the late Johnny Kelley (the guy that ran the Boston Marathon into his 80's . He ran Boston more than 50 times.) and Johnny had told him that his training wasn't based on excessive training runs. There was definitely an aspect to his approach that was not run and train more and faster but smarter.1
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@MobyCarp @Stoshew71 @lporter229
So I bought that book, and hope to find time to read it. In the short term, if instead of what I posted above if I did like...
Day 1: 6-8 miles - conversational pace (60% effort)
Day 2: 6-8 miles - faster pace (80% ?? effort)
Day 3: 6-8 miles - conversational pace (60% effort)
Day 4: Long run - miles pending time, at least 10, easy pace
Day 5-6: Rest or easy run
Would that be better? I have my Apple Watch to track heart rate so I will use that to figure out effort levels. Might not be perfect but it is objective and needs no purchases.
I am not looking to win any races (though I am finding I kick it pretty good in 5k for my age group - and have won a few - my generation is fat and slow I guess) - just would like to slowly improve. Right now sub 4-hour marathon is my next target (PR 4:11) I need goals to stay focused... but I do not want to have to do tons of tracking. I need to be able to run with very little thought about what I am doing
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Pastor Vincent1 -
@skippygirlsmom - 7, unless kicking myself off a treadmill counts. In that case, 6. And I'm taking "running circles" metaphorically. I doubt I ever ran geometrically accurate circles to meet a goal, but I've definitely run loops of parking lots and oval tracks.
@mobycarp I'll give you 7 ha ha I can't even count the number of times I've run around the circle in my cul de sac because I misjudged the distance to home. I'm much better now can almost hit the .0 at the bottom of my driveway. However, I've run around way too many parking lots when I'm at some place new0 -
cburke8909 wrote: »@VydorScope funny I ran X-Country in the 80's. I remember the philosophy "run, run , run and faster, faster, faster" We did intervals and hill training some but rest days and days off to recover were considered the actions of slackers. Cross training and strength training, not given much value. Funny thing, a friend of mine got to know the late Johnny Kelley (the guy that ran the Boston Marathon into his 80's . He ran Boston more than 50 times.) and Johnny had told him that his training wasn't based on excessive training runs. There was definitely an aspect to his approach that was not run and train more and faster but smarter.
heh. I remember biking 40 mins to practice, multiple mile warm ups, intervals, multiple mile cooldowns, and biking home. Probably, guessing here, like 150 miles a week. All to train for a 5k. Never did break a 20 min 5k, heh, was just slow even then. Could eat like a blue whale and loose weight though. Miss that
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Pastor Vincent1 -
VydorScope wrote: »@SpiritHippo - For me it is easy. Run or die. That might sound like a stretch, but it is the truth.
For anyone that cares to know the details: http://www.losttalesofpower.com/2015/02/25/i-am-not-a-runner/
Now, cross training and strength training... I have yet to do that regularly. I was doing good when I was part of a bootcamp class, but my schedule change and have not been able to make it back. I need to. Slowly turning into a T-Rex here
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Pastor Vincent
This. Is. Awesome. I may be fast for an old guy, but @VydorScope is truly impressive.
Everyone who glazed past the original post - read the story at the link. I choked up.
Thanks. I do not see myself as impressive, just too stupid to quit.
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Pastor Vincent0 -
Date :::: Miles :::: Cumulative
06/01/17 :::: 2.4 :::: 2.4
06/02/17 :::: 0.0 :::: 2.4
06/03/17 :::: 8.4 :::: 10.7
06/04/17 :::: 3.1 :::: 13.9
06/05/17 :::: 3.3 :::: 17.2
06/06/17 :::: 3.5 :::: 20.7
06/07/17 :::: 5.0 :::: 25.7
06/08/17 :::: 0.0 :::: 25.7
06/09/17 :::: 3.6 :::: 29.3
06/10/17 :::: 7.8 :::: 37.0
06/11/17 :::: 7.5 :::: 44.5
06/12/17 :::: 2.8 :::: 47.4
06/13/17 :::: 4.0 :::: 51.4
06/14/17 :::: 2.6 :::: 53.9
06/15/17 :::: 3.3 :::: 57.2
Goal = 100 miles
Noon run today, trying to beat the thunderstorms forecast for this afternoon. Started to get pretty humid and my legs are tired, so it wasn't the best, but its done. I think I solved my foot numbness issue by adjusting my shoe laces. They had gotten pulled really tight at the toe end, like a V shape. Loosening everything up and snugging them more evenly across the foot seems to have helped a lot. Still, it's time for new ones and I'm excited they are on their way.
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VydorScope wrote: »@SpiritHippo - For me it is easy. Run or die. That might sound like a stretch, but it is the truth.
For anyone that cares to know the details: http://www.losttalesofpower.com/2015/02/25/i-am-not-a-runner/
Now, cross training and strength training... I have yet to do that regularly. I was doing good when I was part of a bootcamp class, but my schedule change and have not been able to make it back. I need to. Slowly turning into a T-Rex here
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Pastor Vincent
Wow! That perspective on running is really inspiring. Thank you for sharing that with me.0
This discussion has been closed.
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