June 2017 Running Challenge

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  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    edited June 2017
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    Instead of editing the above again, long story short, while I have the endurance and stamina to do lots of regular long runs at HM distances at HM race efforts (by heart rate effort that is), I just don't have the speed to hit my potential HM pace at that heart rate.

    I can do a mile at near my estimated mile pace.

    That's it.

    So, I guess I start there. For the longer runs, I need to slow the hell down, probably meaning less mileage. Then for the workouts I need to stretch those "hard efforts" out further than the mile I can currently do. Once I do that, then I can probably work on doing a 5k at my estimated 5k pace. Then maybe a 10k. Then, maybe, just maybe, someday I can actually do a half marathon (at estimated pace).

    It seems so basic. How in the hell did I do this so back-*kitten*-wards?
  • Elise4270
    Elise4270 Posts: 8,375 Member
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    1---5.06
    3---6.31
    4---6.29
    6---3.69 walk
    7---4.37
    9---3.76

    29.39/70

    Upcoming races

    June 17th Turtle run 5K
    AIM for the Cure- 5K, virual run
    July 8- XTERRA Jurassic Trail Run, 5K.  Glen Rose,TX
    Dec 2- POOP trail run, Hoping for a half! Norman OK.

    Pre-op PR's
    1 mile 8:27  5k 24:42. 10k 1:00.52.  HM 2:17.28
    Post-op Training PR's
    1 mile 10:50  5k 37.46 10k 1:20.25
  • juliet3455
    juliet3455 Posts: 3,015 Member
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    skippygirlsmom I send my prayers and a Virtual Hug to the Harmening family, to everyone in the Church and your community, to Skip's and her friends who were on the same bus.
  • nFoooo
    nFoooo Posts: 136 Member
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    WhatMeRunning wrote: »
    Instead of editing the above again, long story short, while I have the endurance and stamina to do lots of regular long runs at HM distances at HM race efforts (by heart rate effort that is), I just don't have the speed to hit my potential HM pace at that heart rate.

    I can do a mile at near my estimated mile pace.

    That's it.

    So, I guess I start there. For the longer runs, I need to slow the hell down, probably meaning less mileage. Then for the workouts I need to stretch those "hard efforts" out further than the mile I can currently do. Once I do that, then I can probably work on doing a 5k at my estimated 5k pace. Then maybe a 10k. Then, maybe, just maybe, someday I can actually do a half marathon (at estimated pace).

    It seems so basic. How in the hell did I do this so back-*kitten*-wards?

    I don't understand. Wouldn't increasing your speed increase your heart rate and therefore take you out of HM pace?
  • skippygirlsmom
    skippygirlsmom Posts: 4,433 Member
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    @stoshew71 Skip is going to Atlanta next month with her Youth Group. My brother called me hysterical last night, he knew she was going to Atlanta and didn't recall the date, he thought she was on the bus.
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    edited June 2017
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    nFoooo wrote: »
    WhatMeRunning wrote: »
    Instead of editing the above again, long story short, while I have the endurance and stamina to do lots of regular long runs at HM distances at HM race efforts (by heart rate effort that is), I just don't have the speed to hit my potential HM pace at that heart rate.

    I can do a mile at near my estimated mile pace.

    That's it.

    So, I guess I start there. For the longer runs, I need to slow the hell down, probably meaning less mileage. Then for the workouts I need to stretch those "hard efforts" out further than the mile I can currently do. Once I do that, then I can probably work on doing a 5k at my estimated 5k pace. Then maybe a 10k. Then, maybe, just maybe, someday I can actually do a half marathon (at estimated pace).

    It seems so basic. How in the hell did I do this so back-*kitten*-wards?

    I don't understand. Wouldn't increasing your speed increase your heart rate and therefore take you out of HM pace?
    Yes. Keep in mind I am referring to "newer paces" based on my updated MaxHR, and not the paces I had previously.

    Even so...

    This stuff is pretty convoluted. I think the best way to say it is, on shorter distances I can match up my pace with actual HR based on my "new MaxHR". It's longer distances that are still out of reach. This is pretty normal as I understand it. Some people are better suited for longer runs, some better suited for shorter. To my surprise, I might be more well suited to the shorter end.

    Of course, my mind keeps trying to convince me that I just need to "build up the endurance to maintain that faster effort further and THEN I can do the longer distances at those paces and match the HR", but that doesn't pan out in the end based on the very thing you pointed out.

    Basically, I just have to rethink my target distances. Luckily I have a mileage base established and can just start doing more speedy, intense workouts to target shorter races. I might need to take it a touch easy for a week on the chance I have been pushing too hard at those higher HR efforts for so long.

    I guess my soul longs for the marathon, but my heart is pushing me towards the 5k.
  • shanaber
    shanaber Posts: 6,407 Member
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    Quick update - I will catch up on all the posts later tonight.

    @skippygirlsmom - I saw the bus crash on the news! I am so sorry that they were from your church! My thoughts are with the family who lost their beautiful daughter and all of those who were injured and terrified. I can't imagine what their parents were going through!!

    I had a wonderful run yesterday - felt almost normal and was able to run a really good pace for once! Today I planned to take it easy and the run was meh... but I also did not eat enough before I went out. The stark differences in the two days made that very clear. I will plan accordingly for my long run on Sunday. Should be perfectly cool and drizzly for it - helping me prepare for San Francisco!

    Date........Miles.......Total
    06/01......0.00........0.00 - Unplanned rest/life day
    06/02......6.06........6.06
    06/03......0.00........6.06
    06/04......6.51......12.57
    06/05......3.45......16.02 - + Agility class
    06/06......4.27......20.29 - + Strength Training
    06/07......0.00......20.29
    06/08......5.45......25.74
    06/09......5.80......31.54

    exercise.png

    My completed and upcoming Races - Let me know if you will be running too!
    02/05/17 - Surf City Half Marathon
    07/23/17 - San Francisco 1st Half Marathon
    10/14/17 - AIM for the Cure Melanoma 5K Walk/Run
    12/16/17 - San Diego Holiday Half Marathon
  • garygse
    garygse Posts: 896 Member
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    @WhatMeRunning I agree with @nFoooo in that running slower should help you build your endurance, but moreso by building up the aerobic system. We rely on our aerobic system heavily for most of our runs: 5k runs derive something like around 85% of the energy requirement from the aerobic system alone. For half-marathons and marathons, that percentage jumps higher to the upper 90s (something like 97-98 percent for marathon distances). So for distance running, it appears to make a lot of sense to really focus on building up the aerobic system primarily, and that can only be done with lots and lots of miles at an easy pace (60-75 percent of max HR).

    Build up the aerobic system, and you'll eventually give yourself the ability to run at a faster pace for longer. One way to think about endurance is this: not many people can run a four-minute mile, but a lot more can run a quarter mile in one minute. It's exactly the same pace...they just can't run that quarter mile pace 4x back-to-back with no resting in between.
  • garygse
    garygse Posts: 896 Member
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    @MobyCarp Fantastic run, and congrats on meeting both goals!
  • HonuNui
    HonuNui Posts: 1,464 Member
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    @skippygirlsmom : my thoughts and prayers are with your community and the family of that girl.....my (recently broken at the loss of my own child) heart breaks for them and the pain I know they will be feeling...and yes, new profile pic of the tattoo I had done to honor my son
  • nFoooo
    nFoooo Posts: 136 Member
    edited June 2017
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    garygse wrote: »
    @WhatMeRunning I agree with @nFoooo in that running slower should help you build your endurance, but moreso by building up the aerobic system. We rely on our aerobic system heavily for most of our runs: 5k runs derive something like around 85% of the energy requirement from the aerobic system alone. For half-marathons and marathons, that percentage jumps higher to the upper 90s (something like 97-98 percent for marathon distances). So for distance running, it appears to make a lot of sense to really focus on building up the aerobic system primarily, and that can only be done with lots and lots of miles at an easy pace (60-75 percent of max HR).

    Build up the aerobic system, and you'll eventually give yourself the ability to run at a faster pace for longer. One way to think about endurance is this: not many people can run a four-minute mile, but a lot more can run a quarter mile in one minute. It's exactly the same pace...they just can't run that quarter mile pace 4x back-to-back with no resting in between.

    I would imagine that the percentage for aerobic system usage in 5Ks goes down the faster one gets? I can't imagine a 13 minute 5K is 85% aerobic system and a 30 minute 5K is also 85% aerobic system?

    As for my run, today I ran the furthest and longest I have ever in my 25+ years of living. 7 miles at a steady 10 minute mile pace (finished in something like 69:30ish). I am pretty happy with myself right now. That's 11.25 KM towards my monthly goal. I think my pace was a bit too fast, I think it was somewhere between my desired aerobic training pace and what a tempo run would be. I don't have a heart rate monitor but I felt like I could go for maybe another 30 minutes max if I really wanted to and I could speak in short-mid length sentences (felt a bit stupid speaking out loud alone at midnight while running but whatever haha). From what I gather ideally aerobic training pace would allow me to speak in mid to long range sentences whereas a tempo run would be somewhere around what I could sustain for 1 hour, so I think I was definitely in between.

    My sympathies and prayers to everyone who is grieving right now, I can't imagine what you are going through.


    exercise.png

  • NikolaosKey
    NikolaosKey Posts: 410 Member
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    Hi fellow runners!

    6/1: 8.7k -w/u, Tempo Run, c/d-
    6/2: 10.3k -again Tempo-
    6/4: 7.1k - urban running
    6/6: 14.1k -Long run-
    6/7: 7.3k -Easy run-
    6/8: 1.5k -treadmill as w/u for strength training-
    6/10: 9k -urban running-

    Aim: 58k/161k

    Legs feel tired from concrete and asphalt terain. Maybe hotel's treadmill next run.

    Stay free of injuries!
  • girlinahat
    girlinahat Posts: 2,956 Member
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    @lporter229
    I have a tomtom Multisport watch. It allegedly records laps in the pool, but you need to sort of shove your hand against the side to get it to register. Or so I thought.

    Last night I was cheered by the fact that my watch told me 40 laps. I knew it had missed the first one so thought fine, I've done a kilometre, let's keep going. I noticed as I swam a few more laps it was measuring 2 or 3 laps within that one lap. I got to sixty laps slightly disheartened. I don't know if I did a mile. I did something like that.
  • garygse
    garygse Posts: 896 Member
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    nFoooo wrote: »
    I would imagine that the percentage for aerobic system usage in 5Ks goes down the faster one gets? I can't imagine a 13 minute 5K is 85% aerobic system and a 30 minute 5K is also 85% aerobic system?
    Congrats on your run and reaching a new milestone!

    To answer your question, I think you're right if we're talking about a person running two different 5k runs with the same level of fitness for each run (that is, if 30 minutes represents an easy run, and 13 minutes represents maximal effort). But if a person starts running with a lower level of fitness, and runs a 5k in 30 minutes, and then subsequently improves their aerobic capacity over time, that would help them to keep chipping away at that time while running with the same level of effort.

    Anecdote time. I started running at the end of July last year. Here are some runs of mine:

    Aug 01 2016
    7.78 mi (average pace: 11:27 min/mi), average HR 171 bpm

    May 16 2017 (similar distance at same location)
    8.04 mi (average pace: 9:56 min/mi), average HR 146 bpm

    Jun 05 2017 (similar level of effort - different location)
    13.44 mi (average pace: 8:13 min/mi), average HR 175 bpm

    From this, I can see that as aerobic capacity has improved:
    • for similarly-distanced runs, I've been able to increase pace while putting in a lower overall level of effort
    • for similar levels of effort, I've been able to increase pace and sustain it over a much longer period of time
  • MNLittleFinn
    MNLittleFinn Posts: 4,271 Member
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    cburke8909 wrote: »
    I made it. 19 miles at a not too shabby 9:07 pace. I don't know that I am ready yet for the full marathon but I think by October i will be. I've got the summer to train.


    If you're at 19 miles now, you're pretty much ready for a full. You could run one sooner than October fore sure.
  • MNLittleFinn
    MNLittleFinn Posts: 4,271 Member
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    6/1- REST
    6/2- 5.2 Miles
    6/3- 19
    6/4- 4.3
    6/5- 4.2
    6/6- 3.2
    6/7- 8.0
    6/8- REST
    6/9- 3.2

    Total: 47.1

    Goal for June. Finish Marathon training well, taper well and run Grandma's well
    Nominal mileage goal: 100

    Today's notes: Today's assignment was 9 miles with the last 4 miles at GMP-15. It was "warm" at 63 degrees this morning, with full sun, and a not so pleasant 83% humidity. First 5 miles I averaged 9:15 (avgHR 157, a tad too high for E). Last 4 miles I averaged 8:41 (avgHR 172 too high, but I didn't have my water).

    All in all, a decent run, Right when I was done, I had my new favorite recovery drink, a scoop of protein powder along with 6oz of Powerade. Got carbs, Protein and electrolytes all in one.

    After this run, I'm debating ditching my compression sleeves on race day. I've run most all of my real long Long Runs with them, but on these hotter days, I'm debating ditching them to gain a little more coolness.... Ah, taper thoughts.

    Have a runderful day all!

    ....

    2017 Races Scheduled
    6/16- William A Irvin 5k
    6/17- Grandma's Marathon (Full!)
    8/19- Rampage at the Ridge 5k OCR
    9/23- Ely Marathon (full)
    10/21 Wild Duluth 50k
    11/23- TBD 5k Turkey Trot

    Possible? 2017 Races
    7/15- Eugene Curnow Trail Marathon

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