July 2017 Running Challenge

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  • KatieJane83
    KatieJane83 Posts: 2,002 Member
    edited July 2017
    @cburke8909 yeah I have a running acquaintance who was just talking about the Yasso 800s yesterday. She said for her, they're a pretty reliable indicator, but she also runs ultras so she has that high mileage foundation. Maybe one week I'll make my speed training Yasso 800s and see what I can do. If I want a sub-4 marathon I'll have to be able to 10x800m, with each interval being under 4 min. Sounds like a tiring workout to me!

    I'm hoping as I get closer to my marathon date, and actually get into my marathon training plan, I'll get a slightly better idea of, at least loosely, what to aim for. Because like you said, I don't want to go out too fast and burn out, but I also don't want to be too conservative, finish, and think, gee, I could've done that much faster! Lol
  • SpiritHippo
    SpiritHippo Posts: 53 Member
    angmarie28 wrote: »
    Thank you everyone for all your advise with all my marathon questions, today was the day.
    Due to the high heat, they shortened the race from 7.5 to 6.5 hours, most the slow runners eother switched to the half or deferred to next year, but i was determined to do it. And my longest run to date was only 9 miles

    I was up at 3am, lost my bananas I brought and had the only motel room with no coffee pot, so had a rice krispie treat and a store bought bottled frappe drink (didn't think that through since dairy doesn't like me) then I realized I forgot my compression shorts at home, 5 hours away, so I didn't have the pockets I needed, luckily I packed my compression capris, so I put my belt on and tucked my chews in there, seemed great, got to the bus pick up and realized i left my cooling towel in the motel, well *kitten*, oh well. Got to the start, they had bananas, yayyy. Joined in the back of the pack, definetly not many slow runners, oh well, took off, all 4 packs of my chews fell out before i passed the start, ugh, guess I'll deal with the cliff shot gels they provide, never used them but had no choice.
    Felt great, was doing 12 min miles until mile 7, and my hip started hirting really bad, ugh, it's been an off and on issue for 2 months, but Bern fine the past month, still managed 12.5 to 13 min miles until mile 13, then there was 2 miles of a steep hill, my hip was not liking that, and I got passed by everyone on that hill. Ran with a lady up the hill, but she was so slow I had to move on or I wouldn't finish on time. Got to the top and passed one lady and left the lady I was with behind. They both ended up dropping out. Mile 19 I almost broke down, I was so sore and 8 miles left, At mile 20, their was a volunteer that asked if I was ok, I said ya, my hips killing me, but it's ok, he asked if he could ride hos bike beside me, I was really struggling so figured company was a good idea. At this point I had to do 15 Min miles to finish on time, mile 22 my hop finally loosened up, but my feet hurt so bad, felt like my shoes were shrinking, and it was as sooo hot, another volunteer kept bringing my frozen rags, and the other vopunter stuck with me (after all, I was last) mile 25 I realized I wasn't going to finish in 6:30:00, then I just wanted to cry, then I started having trouble breathing, I couldn't get breath on so I sat a minute, and vented to Tim (my volunteer buddy) that I wasn't going to finish on time, he told me if they weren't there to give me a medal, than he's find them and get me one, I got up and finished the damn race in dead last at 6:39:50, and got my medal, my husband was waiting at the end with me kids, 2 of them joined me the last 10 feet across the finish line. My final tome isn't "official"since I was 10 minutes past the cut off, but for not being a runner, and everything working against me, I really don't care, I finished it, and I'm pretty proud of that

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    What an amazing post! I really enjoyed readying the play by play on everything you were dealing with. I am so proud that you didn't give up!! Especially with your kids and husband at the finish line, I bet you were very happy you kept going. I know you can't control the circumstances, but it would have been a shame not to get to the end after all the miles you put in. Tim, the volunteer, sounds amazing too.
  • Bakins929
    Bakins929 Posts: 895 Member
    Got in 5.5 today. Just a nice relaxing run.

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  • Bakins929
    Bakins929 Posts: 895 Member
    RespectTheKitty wrote: »
    Oddly enough, after the 13.1 mile trek yesterday, my hip feels okay. I think I may have a clue into what is making it hurt. I think it's the shoes.

    That is entirely reasonable. I tried a pair of Brooks Ghost 9 because they were so much lighter than my previous Brooks. Within a couple of days, I had terrible knee pain. I switched back to my Dyads and was fine. There just wasn't enough padding in the Ghosts for me. You might should go to a running store and have them assess your gait and recommend some shoes for you.
  • BettyM1017
    BettyM1017 Posts: 616 Member
    @angiemarie28 Way to go!! That's how you become an inspiration!!
  • Elise4270
    Elise4270 Posts: 8,375 Member
    @PastorVincent That's some skinny lunch walking around! Guess they'd make a turkey dog or two!
  • BettyM1017
    BettyM1017 Posts: 616 Member
    July 10 – 4.0 miles Easy with Strides (8) & 21DFX Plyo Fix Extreme
    Total: 40.75/100 miles

    Upcoming Races:
    July 21 - St. Pete Beach Series, Race #2, 5K
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
    edited July 2017
    @Elise4270 Congrats on your AG win. Awesome job.

    @angmarie28 that is some heck of determination. Kudos to you big big time!!!!!!

    @RespectTheKitty Awesome job on finishing the HM distance.

    @HonuNui Happy anniversary!

    @KatieJane83 Congrats on your 5K finish. For the record, I have not done an official 5K yet and I agree with you that I rather do longer grinding distances than the shorter painful races.
  • juliet3455
    juliet3455 Posts: 3,015 Member
    Well done @RespectTheKitty on your first 13.1. Also a great catch on the Hip Pain being related to the Shoes.
    @HonuNui Happy anniversary! Congrats on 41 years
    @angiemarie28 You win the Tough Runner B) award for the month. Well Done

    A slow 5.5km on the Riverbank Trails this morning. With all the Forest Fires in our neighboring province of BC we are getting a lot of High Altitude Smoke which caused a Brilliant Red Sky and Sun this Morning. Of course I never run with my phone so no pictures to share. Hoping the best for all my BC Neighbors.

    07/01 0 km – 160 km - 0 km – YTD 686.27
    07/01 15.0 km – 145 km - 15km – YTD 701.27 15km Canada Day Race Edmonton
    07/04 13.5 km - 131.5km - 28.5km - YTD 714.77
    07/06 13.6 km - 117.9km - 42.1km - YTD 728.37km
    07/09 6.7 km - 111.2km - 48.8km - YTD 735.07km
    07/10 5.5 km - 105.7km - 54.3km - YTD 740.57km 5.5 km Morning Riverbank Run

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    There is talk that we may be deployed to help restore Telecommunications infrastructure that has been damaged/destroyed so I could be in the center of the mess.
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
    Elise4270 wrote: »
    @PastorVincent That's some skinny lunch walking around! Guess they'd make a turkey dog or two!


    hA! Good point. Gotta fatten them up real quick
  • T1DCarnivoreRunner
    T1DCarnivoreRunner Posts: 11,502 Member
    @KatieJane83 When I had fitness testing done, Max HR was included as part of the VO2 Max testing. I was thinking it would be MaxHR as in what is the fastest my heart could actually beat. I've seen 190's... but the result was HR at VO2Max. So while my HR can actually go faster, it is an anaerobic state at that point and not sustainable for long. Now I need to train my lungs to be able to keep up with my heart.
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
    Something worth reading regarding the Yasso 800's and using it as a marathon predictor....

    https://runnersconnect.net/yasso-800s/
  • autumnblade75
    autumnblade75 Posts: 1,661 Member
    exercise.png

    7/1 - 3.4 miles
    7/2 - 4 miles
    7/3 - 7 miles
    7/4 - 4.25 miles
    7/5 - 8 miles
    7/7 - 6.25 miles
    7/9 - 6.5 miles
    7/10 - 9 miles
  • MobyCarp
    MobyCarp Posts: 2,927 Member
    July Running Totals (miles)
    7/1 – 14.00 paced run
    7/2 – 14.03 easy
    7/3 – 6.21 easy + 4 strides
    7/4 – 8.07 warm up + 4 mile race
    7/5 – 7.40 group run
    7/6 – 12.06 warm up + MP intervals
    7/7 – rest day
    7/8 – 15.01 paced 10 + ad hoc 5
    7/9 – 11.83 easy 90 minutes
    7/10 – 6.95 easy + 4 strides

    July total to date – 95.56

    Nominal Challenge Goal – 260 miles
    Real Goals: Stay healthy. Train toward Rochester Marathon. Pace Shoreline Half as close as possible to a 1:40 finish with even splits. Run Karknocker 5K in under 20 minutes.

    Today's notes – Today's assignment was easy + 4 strides, and I had 7 miles penciled into my plan. I was willing to accept a short 7 miles, because yesterday's 90 minutes came in a bit longer than the 11.5 miles I estimated and I'm targeting weekly mileage.

    It occurred to me this morning that yesterday's average pace of 7:37 was very close to the 7:38 average I need to maintain to accurately pace the Shoreline Half on Saturday. Granted, I didn't produce even splits yesterday; but I came in close to the average. So today, I decided to watch pace and try not to run faster than 7:35 because my watch only tells me current pace to 5 seconds, and 7:35 Garmin pace is probably pretty close to 7:38 certified race distance pace.

    I noticed early on that my Vivofit still had the same Zone distinctions it had yesterday; but I had not proactively synced it to Garmin Connect, so that didn't tell me anything. Still, it did give me the 80-20 Zones 1 and 2 to play with as I ran. Most of the time, my HR was in the mid to high 120s, near the border between 80-20 Zones 1 and 2. I slowed myself down a couple of times, when I saw a 7:20 or faster current pace and I was running on level or very slight decline. Watch the pace, watch the HR. Came to the same little bump of a hill where my HR went to 140 yesterday; it only went to 136 today. But I'm running slower, and I have been running less intensely. Adjusted the route on the fly, so I wouldn't get back home too soon and I could start my strides after I had completed 6 miles. Estimated that my strides (measured by the intervals between fire hydrants) would average 150 meters. I came close; when I got to the end of the recovery after the 4th stride, I looked at the watch and it said 6.95 miles. Thought about OCD running for 7, and stopped anyway.

    So, how did I do? Mile splits were 7:46, 7:36, 7:38, 7:42, 7:37, and 7:33 for the full miles. At mile 6, the watch reported an average pace of 7:39, very close to the 7:38 target. I'm a bit shocked that I had 3 mile splits within 1 second of the 7:38 target. Then the average pace for the last 0.95 mile, which included those long strides, was 7:05.

    Heart rate thoughts: Average HR for the run was 126. Max HR for the first 6 miles, where the idea was to run easy, was 136. Max for the entire run was 144. 52:37 total duration, and Garmin reports 48:41 in Zone 1 (set to be 80-20 Zones 1 and 2), and 1:26 in Zone 2 (set to be 80-20 Zone X). The remainder will be Zone Zero, before my heart rate got up to Zone 1. 80-20 doctrine is to stay out of Zone X; but the strides were not long enough to elevate my HR into 80-20 Zone 3. If I had run 600m continually at that pace, I would have got there, and probably into 80-20 Zone 4 as well. Garmin reports "best pace" of 5:25, which may be faster than I was actually running; but it is plausible that I was at a sub-6 minute pace for those strides. After all, I didn't work all that hard the first 6 miles and I was still pretty fresh for some short, fast running.

    I'll have to think about whether I want to continue to look at the 80-20 HR zones. I have historically trained by pace, and not understood the HR data well enough to use it for training. I think I'm beginning to understand it better, but perhaps not well enough to train by HR. Factors I really don't understand include the impact of adverse weather on HR and pace and how pace and HR should be managed in adverse weather conditions. I know the principle, slow down when it's hot and humid; the difficulty is determining how much I should slow down. Today I was blessed with 79º F (26º C), overcast skies, a nice breeze, and 48% relative humidity. That feels pretty nice in July, until I stop running and start sweating profusely.

    Oh, yeah. The sweaty runner meme. I don't think I sweat excessively while running, but in the summer I certainly do as soon as I stop. It's nice to be able to do stretches outside, so I cool down and the volume of new sweat abates before I go into the house.

    2017 races:
    January 1, 2017 Freezeroo #2 (Resolution Run 7.5 mile) (Mendon, NY) Finished in 50:45
    January 7, 2017 Winter Warrior Half Marathon (Gates, NY) Finished in 1:32:40
    January 14, 2017 Freezeroo #3 (Pineway Ponds Park 5 mile) (Spencerport, NY) Finished in 33:42
    January 28, 2017 Freezeroo #4 (Hearnish 5 mile) (Victor, NY) short course, finished 4.88 miles in 32:50
    February 4, 2017 USATF Cross Country National Championship Masters 8K (Bend, OR) Finished in 35:39, team won the 60+ Men's cross country championship
    February 11, 2017 Freezeroo #5 (Valentines Run "In Memory of Tom Brannon" 8 Mile) (Greece, NY) sat out due to training schedule
    February 25, 2017 Freezeroo #6 (White House Challenge 4.4 mile) (Webster, NY) short course, finished 4.34 miles in 27:51
    March 11, 2017 Johnny's Runnin' of the Green 5 mile (Rochester, NY) finished in 33:25
    March 18, 2017 USATF Masters 8K Championship (Shamrock 8K, Virginia Beach, VA) finished in 30:59, PR for 8K
    April 17, 2017 Boston Marathon (Hopkinton, MA) finished in 3:49:42
    April 30, 2017 USATF Masters 10K Championship (James Joyce Ramble, Dedham, MA) finished in 39:54, PR for 10K
    May 21, 2017 Lilac Run 10K (Rochester, NY) finished in 40:04
    May 27, 2017 Canandaigua Classic Half Marathon (Canandaigua, NY) finished in 1:33:06
    June 9, 2017 Charlie McMullen Mile (Fairport, NY) finished in 5:44.90, PR for mile
    June 18, 2017 Medved 5K to Cure ALS (Rochester, NY) finished in 19:32
    July 4, 2017 Firecracker Four Mile (Fairport, NY) finished in 25:42
    July 15, 2017 Shoreline Half Marathon [1:40 pacer] (Hamlin, NY)
    July 28, 2017 Karknocker 5K (East Rochester, NY)
    September 3, 2017 Oak Tree Half Marathon (Geneseo, NY)
    September 17, 2017 MVP Rochester Marathon (Rochester, NY)
    November 23, 2017 Race with Grace 10K (Hilton, NY)
  • hanlonsk
    hanlonsk Posts: 762 Member
    @wishiwasarunner - coming to wyoming? Where about are you coming to? What is bringing you to the square states?
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
    angmarie28 wrote: »
    I always thought marathoners were nuts, but now here I am the day after and thinking about when I'll do it next year better trained and will get a time that actually is recorded on their records

    :smile:

    There is something odd about the Marathon race. That is pretty much everyone's reaction. My wife went from "never running more than 10 miles again" when she crossed the finish line of the half to "I want to the full" - in less than 24 hours. It makes no logical sense, but time and time again I see it with the marathon.

    And yes, we are all probably at least a bit nuts. Welcome to the club :)
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
    MobyCarp wrote: »
    July Running Totals (miles)
    I'll have to think about whether I want to continue to look at the 80-20 HR zones. I have historically trained by pace, and not understood the HR data well enough to use it for training. I think I'm beginning to understand it better, but perhaps not well enough to train by HR. Factors I really don't understand include the impact of adverse weather on HR and pace and how pace and HR should be managed in adverse weather conditions. I know the principle, slow down when it's hot and humid; the difficulty is determining how much I should slow down. Today I was blessed with 79º F (26º C), overcast skies, a nice breeze, and 48% relative humidity. That feels pretty nice in July, until I stop running and start sweating profusely.


    @MobyCarp running by HR is the same as running by effort. So making up numbers... say "comfortably hard" for you is 7:00 in great conditions with a flat course, and 8:00 in high humidity with hills. The basic idea is for the 7:00 pace conditions your HR would be 150, and for 8:00 conditions your HR would still be 150 (again making up numbers). To run 7:00 in those adverse conditions your HR might have to spike to 165 or something, showing that it was harder to do.

    You HR stays constant as the measure of effort, while your pace reflects the hardness of the conditions. That is one reason I like running by HR. It seems a more objective measure and self-adjusts for conditions. It is not as good for interval running because HR lags behind efforts by 30-90 seconds (it takes a bit for your body to catch up to what you are doing) but for anything longer than that, it works well.

    In the end, running by pace, running by effort, and running by HR are all different ways of measuring the same outcome. HR is considered easier for newer runners, but ultimately, if your goal is to beat a certain time then only PACE will tell you that.

    You are good with pace (based on your posts) so you CAN train by pace. Training by pace is just as far beyond me as clapping on beat is. :) Based on what I see during races, most people can not keep a set pace. So you are a bit exceptional in that regard. IMO :smiley:
  • garygse
    garygse Posts: 896 Member
    After yesterday's high-intensity run, today meant a nice easy recovery run. So I ran a few warm-up miles before meeting with the group to run their 5-mile route. One of the runners was having trouble with the humidity, and was starting to lag behind everyone else, so I ended up running with her to keep her company and make sure she was doing ok. Overall, Garmin reckons I spent 83% of my run in Z2, and a little bit in Z3 when we ran up the ramps in the parking structure. The rest of the time was Z1 or less, so apart from the ramps, it was as a nice easy recovery run should be.

    Also, it feels like we should be further into the week. Why is it only Tuesday?

    05 - 13.56
    06 - 9.72
    07 - 22.03
    10 - 13.55
    11 - 9.76

    Total: 68.62 / 250 miles

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