Of refeeds and diet breaks

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  • GottaBurnEmAll
    GottaBurnEmAll Posts: 7,722 Member
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    Oh, and yes... happy birthday to Lemon, Jr.!
  • bioklutz
    bioklutz Posts: 1,365 Member
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    bioklutz wrote: »
    Thanks for posting the video. I have been intrigued by carb refeeds so it was interesting to hear Lyle talk about it.

    I bulked last fall/winter and wanted to do the same this fall but didn't get lean enough in time. So I am going to recomp for the year. I wanted to take a more natural approach this time around - instead of eating the same calories every day I was thinking of eating 100-150 days under maintenance and then have one day where I eat more. I am rethinking this strategy after watching the video. I am probably going to eat 300-400 calories under every 3 days or so to make room for a higher day. Does that make sense? Did I understand correctly? :blush:

    So it has been a month later and I haven't exactly been following this. I have been eating heavier 2 days a week though. They have not always been consecutive days but mostly they were. So if I eat above maintenance Saturday and Sunday I have had 2 lighter days Monday and Tuesday - maybe around 1600 calories. Wednesday and Thursday have been around 1700 calories. Friday has been around 1700-2000 depending on how I am feeling.

    I have no idea how much above maintenance I have been eating on the heavy days. It is hard to track as it has been meals at restaurants and meals at family members homes. Maybe the calories have been around 3,000? I do know it has been carb and fat heavy so it not exactly a refeed. But overall my workouts have been fantastic.

    For my weight - I am only comparing low days of the week because of crazy fluctuations. I might be 1 pound down but really would need another month to determine that.

    So far I am liking this approach. I am not sure if it is a good approach for recomp but it feels far less restrictive than last time. Also odd - I have no idea what my TDEE is anymore!
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    edited November 2017
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    bioklutz wrote: »
    But overall my workouts have been fantastic.

    I am not sure if it is a good approach for recomp but it feels far less restrictive than last time.

    You answered your own question as to why it's good for recomp.

    Anything that aids recovery and allows a truly hard workout that calls on the body to make more muscle - is great for recomp.

    Might say it's faster. That's why bulking is faster than recomp. Recomp is faster than in a diet.

    How often has someone been in the midst of what felt like a good lifting program, every session felt hard and had to give it your all.

    It wasn't until a forced break perhaps, or non-diet week, or several days of great sleep - that upon return to it you realized "your all" was actually not true from purely an overload by weight perspective.

    Same way you could be sick with a head cold and tired, and still decide to do a session.
    But you cut the weight, and/or the sets, or several things.
    At the end you are wiped out, just as much as a workout when felt perfectly fine.

    But was it truly a workout for the muscles, were they really overloaded for weight?
    That's what building muscle needs, bulking or recomp.

    And yes - TDEE is very difficult to nail, hence the advice better to go slightly over than under.
    Body will know what to do with extra calories if lifting.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
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    Dammit, typed a big long post and lost it because apparently I don't know how to forum on my mobile...

    Update pending once I have a new adapter for my laptop.
  • GottaBurnEmAll
    GottaBurnEmAll Posts: 7,722 Member
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    I've cut my deficit slightly since my activity level has decreased. Well, duh, my activity basically creates my deficit.

    I'm still very fatigued and at this point I'm actually leaning more towards thinking this is a psoriatic arthritis flare than a thyroid problem, but it's good that I was due to see my endocrinologist this week anyway just to eliminate that possibility.'

    The last time I has a PsA flare, it lasted about six weeks and I had some major shenanigans involving one of my eyes going on, so this is a piece of cake compared to that.

    The problem with this is that it sucks for exercise because I lose a LOT. I lose basically anything I gained on weight lifting, I lose running progress, and I have to start everything back up again when the flare passes. Everything comes back soon enough, but it feels slow, you know?

    During the flare, it will just be body weight work and walking as briskly as I can manage as well as keeping my NEAT up. Recovery is not something that happens when I feel like this. The fatigue is all consuming.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
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    GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
    I've cut my deficit slightly since my activity level has decreased. Well, duh, my activity basically creates my deficit.

    I'm still very fatigued and at this point I'm actually leaning more towards thinking this is a psoriatic arthritis flare than a thyroid problem, but it's good that I was due to see my endocrinologist this week anyway just to eliminate that possibility.'

    The last time I has a PsA flare, it lasted about six weeks and I had some major shenanigans involving one of my eyes going on, so this is a piece of cake compared to that.

    The problem with this is that it sucks for exercise because I lose a LOT. I lose basically anything I gained on weight lifting, I lose running progress, and I have to start everything back up again when the flare passes. Everything comes back soon enough, but it feels slow, you know?

    During the flare, it will just be body weight work and walking as briskly as I can manage as well as keeping my NEAT up. Recovery is not something that happens when I feel like this. The fatigue is all consuming.

    :( I know how much fatigue sucks, and I know yours is way worse than mine. I'm always super impressed at what you manage to still do.

    So, refeeds over for this round. Four (and a bit) more days at a deficit, then bring on the diet break!!

    I'm skipping strength training today, back to working at my lab instead of putzing around at home, and didn't get it done this morning (mostly because I was following a cat around trying to get his damn medicine into him, at least I got some steps!!). I should have known the odds of me wanting to train after dinner would be zero. And tomorrow I want to get it done in the morning, so doing one now would only leave around 12 hours between workouts, I'm thinking that's not sensible for someone at my level, especially since I want to increase resistance now that I have a feel for everything.
  • ZoneFive
    ZoneFive Posts: 570 Member
    edited November 2017
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    I'm starting my first diet break today. I've changed the calories/macros to MFP's default for maintenance and planned today's food. Let me just say I'm startled at how difficult it was to fit things in properly -- I didn't expect to have trouble filling in the carbs! It's going to be interesting allowing myself to plan for things like pasta and baked potatoes.

    I haven't yet started any resistance training. The last time I tried it on my own I promptly did too much too soon and hurt myself, so I'm a little anxious about it. Maybe the end of the break will be a good time to look at bodyweight exercises for the wimp. I do walk a lot, and swim and do water aerobics three times a week -- I can just carry on with those, right?

    And I'm having a pumpernickel bagel with cream cheese and lox for lunch. OMG pumpernickel bagels, how I have missed thee!
  • livingleanlivingclean
    livingleanlivingclean Posts: 11,751 Member
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    ZoneFive wrote: »
    I'm starting my first diet break today. I've changed the calories/macros to MFP's default for maintenance and planned today's food. Let me just say I'm startled at how difficult it was to fit things in properly -- I didn't expect to have trouble filling in the carbs! It's going to be interesting allowing myself to plan for things like pasta and baked potatoes.

    I haven't yet started any resistance training. The last time I tried it on my own I promptly did too much too soon and hurt myself, so I'm a little anxious about it. Maybe the end of the break will be a good time to look at bodyweight exercises for the wimp. I do walk a lot, and swim and do water aerobics three times a week -- I can just carry on with those, right?

    And I'm having a pumpernickel bagel with cream cheese and lox for lunch. OMG pumpernickel bagels!

    I struggled initially to add more carbs - now I have no issues enjoying my pre-workout toasted sandwich and rice with my dinner.
    (bagels aren't big here, as much as I enjoyed them fresh in the US, I can't bring myself to buy supermarket ones)
  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
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    ZoneFive wrote: »
    I'm starting my first diet break today. I've changed the calories/macros to MFP's default for maintenance and planned today's food. Let me just say I'm startled at how difficult it was to fit things in properly -- I didn't expect to have trouble filling in the carbs! It's going to be interesting allowing myself to plan for things like pasta and baked potatoes.

    I haven't yet started any resistance training. The last time I tried it on my own I promptly did too much too soon and hurt myself, so I'm a little anxious about it. Maybe the end of the break will be a good time to look at bodyweight exercises for the wimp. I do walk a lot, and swim and do water aerobics three times a week -- I can just carry on with those, right?

    And I'm having a pumpernickel bagel with cream cheese and lox for lunch. OMG pumpernickel bagels, how I have missed thee!

    Yeah just carry on with your normal routine but moar fuds.

    As to strength training, everyone starts somewhere, some people only ever do bodyweight so do whatever is comfortable for you.
  • bmeadows380
    bmeadows380 Posts: 2,981 Member
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    ZoneFive wrote: »
    I'm starting my first diet break today. I've changed the calories/macros to MFP's default for maintenance and planned today's food. Let me just say I'm startled at how difficult it was to fit things in properly -- I didn't expect to have trouble filling in the carbs! It's going to be interesting allowing myself to plan for things like pasta and baked potatoes.

    I haven't yet started any resistance training. The last time I tried it on my own I promptly did too much too soon and hurt myself, so I'm a little anxious about it. Maybe the end of the break will be a good time to look at bodyweight exercises for the wimp. I do walk a lot, and swim and do water aerobics three times a week -- I can just carry on with those, right?

    And I'm having a pumpernickel bagel with cream cheese and lox for lunch. OMG pumpernickel bagels, how I have missed thee!
    VintageFeline wrote: »
    ]

    Yeah just carry on with your normal routine but moar fuds.

    As to strength training, everyone starts somewhere, some people only ever do bodyweight so do whatever is comfortable for you.


    Someone posted a link not long back that had suggestions for bodyweight training - I emailed it to myself so I can find it later :smile: I want to give it a try once I'm actually in my house and not living out of a camper.... We're doing a ton of remodeling and working hard so I can get moved in as soon as possible (winter is here!), so that's eating up all my time. And I won't be able to afford a gym until I sell my other house, but once I do have some free money, I think I will look up a small, local gym and talk to the owner to see what they can set up for me. The last gym I tried was a Snap Fitness facility - a chain gym that had a huge amount of cardio and weight machines, but offered little in terms of helping a person really tailor a workout - at least, not without paying a pretty significant amount over the membership! I'd like to have some one-on-one time with a personal trainer for a while with free weights and see if that makes a difference (I disliked the weight machines and found it really hard to judge if I was using them correctly).

    Meanwhile, best of luck, Zone! My carb intake REALLY went up when I started the diet break - I was trying for 40/35/25 carbs/fats/protein, but I'm doing more like 50/35/15; I still find it incredibly hard to get enough protein in during the day and still get veggies in.
  • GottaBurnEmAll
    GottaBurnEmAll Posts: 7,722 Member
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    ZoneFive wrote: »
    I'm starting my first diet break today. I've changed the calories/macros to MFP's default for maintenance and planned today's food. Let me just say I'm startled at how difficult it was to fit things in properly -- I didn't expect to have trouble filling in the carbs! It's going to be interesting allowing myself to plan for things like pasta and baked potatoes.

    I haven't yet started any resistance training. The last time I tried it on my own I promptly did too much too soon and hurt myself, so I'm a little anxious about it. Maybe the end of the break will be a good time to look at bodyweight exercises for the wimp. I do walk a lot, and swim and do water aerobics three times a week -- I can just carry on with those, right?

    And I'm having a pumpernickel bagel with cream cheese and lox for lunch. OMG pumpernickel bagels, how I have missed thee!

    When I could have gluten, pumpernickel bagels used to be one of my favorites!

    Remember that for your diet break, you don't necessarily need to change your macro mix if you don't want to. It's easy to add carbs if your protein and fat are constants, though.

    The days that I ate at maintenance trying for a diet break, I ate more carbs, but it was a mix of starchy carbs and more non-starchy vegetables.

    As for your exercise routine, yes, start resistance training. Even if you start with twice a week body weight to ease into it. And you can definitely carry on with your cardio activities.
  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
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    bmeadows380 wrote: »
    ZoneFive wrote: »
    I'm starting my first diet break today. I've changed the calories/macros to MFP's default for maintenance and planned today's food. Let me just say I'm startled at how difficult it was to fit things in properly -- I didn't expect to have trouble filling in the carbs! It's going to be interesting allowing myself to plan for things like pasta and baked potatoes.

    I haven't yet started any resistance training. The last time I tried it on my own I promptly did too much too soon and hurt myself, so I'm a little anxious about it. Maybe the end of the break will be a good time to look at bodyweight exercises for the wimp. I do walk a lot, and swim and do water aerobics three times a week -- I can just carry on with those, right?

    And I'm having a pumpernickel bagel with cream cheese and lox for lunch. OMG pumpernickel bagels, how I have missed thee!
    VintageFeline wrote: »
    ]

    Yeah just carry on with your normal routine but moar fuds.

    As to strength training, everyone starts somewhere, some people only ever do bodyweight so do whatever is comfortable for you.


    Someone posted a link not long back that had suggestions for bodyweight training - I emailed it to myself so I can find it later :smile: I want to give it a try once I'm actually in my house and not living out of a camper.... We're doing a ton of remodeling and working hard so I can get moved in as soon as possible (winter is here!), so that's eating up all my time. And I won't be able to afford a gym until I sell my other house, but once I do have some free money, I think I will look up a small, local gym and talk to the owner to see what they can set up for me. The last gym I tried was a Snap Fitness facility - a chain gym that had a huge amount of cardio and weight machines, but offered little in terms of helping a person really tailor a workout - at least, not without paying a pretty significant amount over the membership! I'd like to have some one-on-one time with a personal trainer for a while with free weights and see if that makes a difference (I disliked the weight machines and found it really hard to judge if I was using them correctly).

    Meanwhile, best of luck, Zone! My carb intake REALLY went up when I started the diet break - I was trying for 40/35/25 carbs/fats/protein, but I'm doing more like 50/35/15; I still find it incredibly hard to get enough protein in during the day and still get veggies in.

    No need to have anyone set anything up for you. Have a look at this thread for lots of different programs and just pick one that sparks your fancy. I don't go to a gym, I have adjustable dumbbells, my lounge and three judgemental cats.

    http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
  • collectingblues
    collectingblues Posts: 2,541 Member
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    ZoneFive wrote: »
    If I’m not mistaken, the presence of judgmental cats raises perceived exertion by 12%, yes?

    Definitely. And more, if said judgmental cats start mimicking your actions.
  • ZoneFive
    ZoneFive Posts: 570 Member
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    Mercy. Judgmental MOCKING cats. That’s just not right.

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