Of refeeds and diet breaks
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I love my Apple Watch -- it's fantastic for workouts, especially since it's waterproof and even can monitor *which* stroke I do in the pool. You do need to have an iPhone, though, for it to give you any useful data.2
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I’m team Garmin. I just don’t think anyone makes a better product and I think Fitbit are really shoddy having seen just about everyone on this forum have quality issues with theirs.
And the Apple Watch is more smart less fitness. So it would depend on what you want there as a primary concern.
I recently got my third device from Garmin, the Vivoactive 3. I will say I think it is overshooting calories from incidental activity but exercise calories are spot on and I have just made a manual adjustment in MFP to compensate. But that can be an issue with any device as it’s all estimates.1 -
Oh and my comment about Apple comes from someone who got a new Garmin at the same time as me but also had an AW, they feel the Garmin surpasses the Apple Watch from a fitness perspective and I think he’s made it his every day Watch now too IIRC.2
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Yeah -- for my price point, the Watch was the best option I could get that didn't look clunky *and* was waterproof, but I would definitely be Team Garmin if I didn't swim or didn't care about it not looking like a watch... (I am such a princess in this regard.)0
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That’s why I jumped on the VA3, it’s the newest one and it looks like a normal watch. All Garmin are waterproof and the upper end models have native swimming apps.1
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So random musings, in the post-Thanksgiving period.
Thanks to a combination of glorified slug status, and Thanksgiving itself, my average intake over the past week was pretty much on par with maintenance/TDEE.
My weight was lower this morning than yesterday morning, and although not what it was on Saturday, *also* came about on the same day that the anovulatory bleeding started. Which usually brings about a few pounds. And, since I got clearance to run again, I started that, and OMG the DOMS in my thighs is ridiculous. Like, I went to spin this morning thinking that it would help it out, and now I'm walking like I'm 90. Which ... well, if they hurt, there's water. Duh.
Still none of that "whee, here's all the cortisol water coming off," which I find highly annoying. But there is a relief of sorts that at least things were actually stable. And although I hate this current weight, it's not as bad as the peak high weight from a few weeks ago.
I have no idea how to get myself to do this consistently, but it was a relief to see that if it weren't for the OMG sodium, the presumed water weight from starting running again, and this cyclical weight, that I might have actually lost weight if things had been like a "normal" week.1 -
*waves hi to @janejellyroll *
I had a very rare sleep in. Which is actually annoying, because I wanted to get to market before a) it gets busy and full of old ladies with their gross old lady perfume, and b) before they run out of strawberries. I'm not caffeinated enough to go yet, so I'll just have to suck it up and face the crowd.
Weight is back to what it was last Saturday at the start of diet break. I thought it would sit slightly higher for the duration, so I'm pondering if I need to up my cals slightly. I may be slightly dehydrated though.
Have not remotely planned what I'm having for dinner tonight. I had thought maybe pasta, but then looked at the twice the price for half the amount with gluten-free pasta and just couldn't bring myself to do it.2 -
We seem to have scared off the men folk with our period talk...harden up, guys!
Planning tomorrow's day hike. It has a 15% gradient in places, but only for short sections, and 10% fairly consistently for a couple of km. Of course I had no idea what that actually translates to in reality, but checking some previous hikes I can totally handle that (someone remind me I said that when I'm puffing up there in 22 C heat). Also checked the gradient on the world's steepest street, which happens to be in my hometown, so reference to something I can visualise, that's 35% at the top section, so way worse (of course I can't remember if I've actually walked up the whole that street, I'm thinking not). It's an old forestry road, so won't have the convenient nature steps (tree roots).2 -
To those doing refeeds. Do you eat your exact maintenance calories or go over? The reason i ask is i see a few folks struggling to get enough food in, this is a foreign concept to me
Sorry if this was explained 50 pages ago, my memory is not that good
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On the fitness tracker, I have a Garmin and like it from a performance POV, but it's something I only wear for actual training sessions (and only some of those), because I just hate wearing the HRM around the chest and the watch/monitor is clunky (and I have an Apple Watch I wear all the time so other than swimming I end up wearing both).
Drawback -- if you want to track steps/overall calories or if you don't like the HRM, like me. Positives: more accurate HRM, good cadence and elevation and other training features for running and biking and so on (actual bike computer would be more accurate, but I'm not a serious biker, and the Garmin is good enough for me). Also works for swimming.
My Apple watch is basically analogous to a fitbit but it also does smart phone type things I like. I don't know if it's accurate, but I use it to hit goals for the day (activity/calories/steps) and to compare day to day.
I basically stopped trying to track calories from workouts and instead focus on my TDEE/maintenance calories and if my activity is more/less/the same as a normal day or week.
Is the new Apple Watch actually officially waterproof/a swim tracker? Mine is the old one and I was told it probably was but Apple did not say it was and if they could tell you were using it in the water (like you had a swim tracker going) they'd not honor the warranty. I always take it off.
Most cost effective option is probably one of the newer Fitbits (can you use those with a chest HRM?).0 -
My favorite tracker is still just Runkeeper on my phone, though, which is basically GPS. (On that note, I left my phone in a rental car on Tuesday and am waiting to get it back and going crazy not having it.)0
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lemurcat12 wrote: »My favorite tracker is still just Runkeeper on my phone, though, which is basically GPS. (On that note, I left my phone in a rental car on Tuesday and am waiting to get it back and going crazy not having it.)
I misplaced my phone for 15 minutes today and I felt antsy. I might have a problem . . .1 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »On the fitness tracker, I have a Garmin and like it from a performance POV, but it's something I only wear for actual training sessions (and only some of those), because I just hate wearing the HRM around the chest and the watch/monitor is clunky (and I have an Apple Watch I wear all the time so other than swimming I end up wearing both).
Drawback -- if you want to track steps/overall calories or if you don't like the HRM, like me. Positives: more accurate HRM, good cadence and elevation and other training features for running and biking and so on (actual bike computer would be more accurate, but I'm not a serious biker, and the Garmin is good enough for me). Also works for swimming.
My Apple watch is basically analogous to a fitbit but it also does smart phone type things I like. I don't know if it's accurate, but I use it to hit goals for the day (activity/calories/steps) and to compare day to day.
I basically stopped trying to track calories from workouts and instead focus on my TDEE/maintenance calories and if my activity is more/less/the same as a normal day or week.
Is the new Apple Watch actually officially waterproof/a swim tracker? Mine is the old one and I was told it probably was but Apple did not say it was and if they could tell you were using it in the water (like you had a swim tracker going) they'd not honor the warranty. I always take it off.
Most cost effective option is probably one of the newer Fitbits (can you use those with a chest HRM?).
Yes -- Series 2 and Series 3 are officially waterproof, and have swim settings within the Workout app.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »My favorite tracker is still just Runkeeper on my phone, though, which is basically GPS. (On that note, I left my phone in a rental car on Tuesday and am waiting to get it back and going crazy not having it.)
I misplaced my phone for 15 minutes today and I felt antsy. I might have a problem . . .
Oh, I definitely have a problem. I realized I had left it when boarding in Jackson, seriously thought about running back to get it and missing my plane (and spending another night in Jackson), decided not to (which I currently regret), and basically sat there freaking and unable to concentrate on anything during my flight to Atlanta. Then I spent my layover in Atlanta trying to contact people who were ridiculously hard to contact (and that the whole entire Atlanta airport seems to have no payphones anymore is just obnoxious -- and maybe they do, but I search the maps and asked people who work there and was told no).
Just found out they screwed up the shipping part too, so now I'm not getting it 'til Monday (I hope Monday!). Argh. Why do I always do this kind of idiotic stuff at the worst possible time?0 -
collectingblues wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »On the fitness tracker, I have a Garmin and like it from a performance POV, but it's something I only wear for actual training sessions (and only some of those), because I just hate wearing the HRM around the chest and the watch/monitor is clunky (and I have an Apple Watch I wear all the time so other than swimming I end up wearing both).
Drawback -- if you want to track steps/overall calories or if you don't like the HRM, like me. Positives: more accurate HRM, good cadence and elevation and other training features for running and biking and so on (actual bike computer would be more accurate, but I'm not a serious biker, and the Garmin is good enough for me). Also works for swimming.
My Apple watch is basically analogous to a fitbit but it also does smart phone type things I like. I don't know if it's accurate, but I use it to hit goals for the day (activity/calories/steps) and to compare day to day.
I basically stopped trying to track calories from workouts and instead focus on my TDEE/maintenance calories and if my activity is more/less/the same as a normal day or week.
Is the new Apple Watch actually officially waterproof/a swim tracker? Mine is the old one and I was told it probably was but Apple did not say it was and if they could tell you were using it in the water (like you had a swim tracker going) they'd not honor the warranty. I always take it off.
Most cost effective option is probably one of the newer Fitbits (can you use those with a chest HRM?).
Yes -- Series 2 and Series 3 are officially waterproof, and have swim settings within the Workout app.
Good to know!0 -
I think most if not all Garmins now have OHR and don’t need a chest strap. I no longer use my chest strap though I can if I want more accurate data. There are cheap entry level options too that rival Fitbit. Fitbit just have the marketing power but Garmin are accepted to be a better product all round. My last tracker is still fine after wearing it every day for nearly 2 years.
If you want to look at reviews and comparisons check out DC Rainmaker, really really good reviews and cemented my choice to pre-order my device when it was announced.0 -
Christine_72 wrote: »To those doing refeeds. Do you eat your exact maintenance calories or go over? The reason i ask is i see a few folks struggling to get enough food in, this is a foreign concept to me
Sorry if this was explained 50 pages ago, my memory is not that good
I do exact maintenance according to Fitbit TDEE, or as close as I can get. Don't think I've managed right on the nose, but I can usually predict within about 10 cals what I need to be at by bedtime.
I generally only struggle now if I have a higher than anticipated TDEE (like I decide to do an evening walk) and haven't gotten enough cals in during the day (ie pre-dinner), and refeeds were a learning curve because of needing to keep fat at 50g. I couldn't just default to a massive dark choc peanut butter protein shake to soak up extra cals.4 -
Oh and back to day hike planning, I had the inspired idea to get dark choc covered ginger pieces for this one. One of my favourite things. Nom!! Of course I'd already gotten my little bulk bin bag of tropical fruit, and I know (or think) they chuck out bags of bulk bin stuff that people decide they don't want so had to get it, so am now quite set with my high carb energy bursts for hiking for a few weeks.
But somehow it's easy to go over maintenance when you're not thinking about it, and not when you are (the not assuming you have a decent TDEE, if I was sedentary it would be super easy to go over, that's how I got fat!).3 -
Christine_72 wrote: »To those doing refeeds. Do you eat your exact maintenance calories or go over? The reason i ask is i see a few folks struggling to get enough food in, this is a foreign concept to me
Sorry if this was explained 50 pages ago, my memory is not that good
I do maintenance according to my Fitbit TDEE, or thereabouts. I've come to find that Fitbit underestimates my burn by a bit, so I might not quite be eating maintenance calories. I still have to play with things as I get deeper into doing this.
Edit: Unlike Nony, the macros for the redeeds aren't a struggle for me. I tend to eat low fat anyway. I keep my fat and protein constant to my regular diet and just add in more starch than I normally eat, and ... that's a refeed for me.4 -
I'm not knocking the chest strap. My purpose with the Garmin was to use it for training and get super accurate information about a variety of things. I just hate wearing them.0
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lemurcat12 wrote: »I'm not knocking the chest strap. My purpose with the Garmin was to use it for training and get super accurate information about a variety of things. I just hate wearing them.
Yes yes, I was just pointing out you don't have to use it if super accuracy isn't needed as most if not all of the devices have wrist read now. I thought you were saying that was a minus, that in order to use heart rate you needed the strap which isn't the case now. So no need to switch out watches if you want all day HR and don't like chest straps. I never minded my chest strap but I don't need the accuracy and have found my OHR to be good enough. It's very nice not to have to strap up!0 -
Ah. I'm just conflicted, since I think the strap is both a positive and negative. ;-)0
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Christine_72 wrote: »To those doing refeeds. Do you eat your exact maintenance calories or go over? The reason i ask is i see a few folks struggling to get enough food in, this is a foreign concept to me
Sorry if this was explained 50 pages ago, my memory is not that good
I've been doing mine a bit different as I'm on a diet break anyways... But still doing a high carb day for fun. I have two lower carb days during the week, so add those carbs on, plus decrease fat a bit and add those cals on as carbs as well.
The only thing I struggle with is completely changing my thoughts to how I plan meals and the foods I choose. I get sad that I have less "protein" (ie, meat, eggs, fish) because so much protein comes with my carbs. Keeping fat low as low as I do is also hard. It takes me forever to plan my day... But then I have no issue eating the food. It's fun.4 -
Yeah, I think once I hit maintenance proper I will still do higher carb on the weekends. Higher carbs on hike days are kind of a necessity, and carbing up the day before seems to be an effective strategy too.3
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A garmin vivosmart 3 has been added to my husband's amazon cart in anticipation of Christmas. My sister-in-law likes her Fitbit, but I'm really more about the heart rate and calorie burn tracking. Years and years ago (like ten years), I had a polar heart rate monitor that had the chest strap and watch. It worked well for tracking workouts and giving me estimated calorie burns, but it wasn't something I wore all the time.
Refeed continues. Not quite bacchanal levels of indulgence but still good. More family parties, more food, more wine. That's how refeeds work, right? Eat all the things? No?
Oops.2 -
@Luna3386, I'm lucky in that I don't really have problems and it just comes when it comes. A bit like @VintageFeline but I'm not on the pill and my cycle is not that regular.collectingblues wrote: »@Christine_72, interesting, never thought to use an app at all.
@bioklutz, I have not gotten cramps since my 20's. I'm also of an age (46) where I need to watch out for perimenopause but don't think I've got any symptoms yet. I also don't feel any different?!!
@collectingblues, yeah too young though I've heard anecdotes about some women experiencing symptoms that early. Hope things resolve for you soon. Are you getting any thyroid meds to regulate your hormones?
Yup -- I'm well-controled with synthroid. TSH/T3/T4 are all completely normal, both within range, and within what I usually run. There are some female triad things at play, so right now, this is all supposedly "normal" for me/the recovery process.
But -- for apps, if you're looking for one, I use Clue. It's generally accurate within a couple of days for me.
Thanks for the tip on the app. Will check it out.
Hope the female triad issues resolve themselves soon. I read that you had some good news in your later post after this one? Maintaining a stable weight at TDEE is a good thing!
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Regarding trackers, I've always only ever had a Garmin so I can't compare with other brands but my husband likes his Tom Tom.
As for accuracy of calorie burn and using it to gauge TDEE, I find it very accurate for me personally. They have several data inputs for calculating burns including HR (which is good because I've got a very low RHR and it takes time for me to get my HR up so I get less burn). I'm also usually very accurate with CI and that helps. In reading other posts in the forums, sometimes people can either be over-estimating or under-estimating CI and may find their tracker's CO inaccurate that way (either too low or too high).
I think with trackers, whatever brand you decide on, you need to get the type suitable for your activities. I have a forerunner because I use it mainly for tracking runs (pace, HR, distance etc). If you want something that can track swims for example, you need to get something specific for that. Likewise, if you want to track floors climbed or if you want a long battery life (mine's not that great), then get something specific to that.
The CO aspect can be an albatross around your neck though, especially if you have an ED. When I first got my Garmin which tracked calorie burns (I had old ones which did not), I used to be so anxious if I didn't burn enough. In my head, I had to reach a specific number and if I didn't reach it during the day, I'd try to make it up at night (till midnight even and continued the next day, especially if I binged...)2 -
Christine_72 wrote: »To those doing refeeds. Do you eat your exact maintenance calories or go over? The reason i ask is i see a few folks struggling to get enough food in, this is a foreign concept to me
Sorry if this was explained 50 pages ago, my memory is not that good
I am loosely following a refeed approach and go over with mainly carbs if I need to on that day.
Getting enough food in has not been a problem for me even when I eat 3k cals while keeping fats to 50g but I think that's because I usually only eat high when I need to (my refeed days aren't fixed days).0 -
Christine_72 wrote: »To those doing refeeds. Do you eat your exact maintenance calories or go over? The reason i ask is i see a few folks struggling to get enough food in, this is a foreign concept to me
Sorry if this was explained 50 pages ago, my memory is not that good
I'm not able to hit my exact numbers most days -- I'm mostly under, with a few days over. Part of that is being unsure of how much of my exercise calories to eat back; I aim for about 1/3 on just-walking days, maybe 1/2 on swimming days. I seem to be hovering within 3.5 lbs of my beginning weight, so I think I'm in the right maintenance range. The other part of it is not yet feeling comfortable with having no calories left over at the end of the day. I'm trying to wrap my head around that, but haven't got there yet.
My break ends on Sunday, and I'm actually eager to get back to deficit. Eating at maintenance has been like walking on a frozen pond, unsure of when or if the ice will break. These two weeks have been really eye-opening, and I'll definitely do a break again around the end of February or so. I realize I need to do more reading on human biology and nutrition to grok things better.3 -
I'm starting my second week of diet break and I'm really surprised that maintenance eating takes at least as much planning as deficit eating. I'm used to eating at deficit by now, and it's much easier to plan. MFP's default split for carbs requires a lot more thought. I'm not sure I trust such a high level of carbs, partly because of the diabetes and partly because I find myself trying to bump up the carbs with sweet/baked baked things. That's a habit I've been trying to break, and this isn't helping.
On the other hand, I thought resetting my leptin levels was more dependent on my carb intake, so that more carbs (within reason) are necessary. Maybe just not as many as the MFP default.
I'm up just 2 lbs from last Monday and well within normal fluctuations and the expected gain (glycogen replenishment, right?). I KNOW it's normal, I KNOW it's expected, and I KNOW it's water weight -- but there's still a little twitch in the back of my brain that wants me to go back to deficit RIGHT NOW. These two weeks are experimental; I'll keep eating 2460 calories for the next week, but I'm working hard on not tinkering with the macros. My inner perfectionist wants to keep the experimental protocols the same for the full two weeks (my inner perfectionist is a scientist) and have that time as a learning experience. That'll also leave me room for Thanksgiving's carbs, which was the point of picking this time frame in the first place.
I just don't trust the carbs -- or I don't trust myself with that many carbs, one or the other.
Maintenance is sometimes more difficult than planning a deficit or surplus, especially if being in a specific diet pattern for a long time.
Just from dealing with diabetes myself and working with others, carb tolerance is going to be variable. My suggestion specifically for diabetics is to eat according to your glucose monitor. If you're medicated and are still running high, the ingestion of digestible carbs is what's going to determine a large portion of that. Obviously, by focusing on nutrient density and fibrous carbs, you reduce the postprandial excursion so that your glucose doesn't spike so high and drop so low between meals.
Resistance training and regular exercise increases insulin sensitivity so on those days where carbs are higher, your body will be better equipped to partition glucose into muscle glycogen instead of partitioning them into fat cells.
Even during maintenance feeding, my carbs are about 75-150g on average, and I adjust total calories with fat macros. Fasting glucose ranges from 70-88mg/dL every morning.
Not to say you need to low carb, just make sure you're using your own levels as a guide for food choices. It's a bit of a way to entertain your inner N=1 researcher while still being able to maintain manageable health markers.
I saw my doctor this week, and have been given the okay to halve my metformin dosage. (Hooray!) We discussed my last bloodwork, which indicated that I was well below the pre-diabetic levels, and he asked me what my morning BG was like. I reminded him that he'd never prescribed a meter for me. He blinked and said, "Why didn't I do that?" (He's a nice guy, but I'm beginning to think I need to switch doctors.) A year and a half of metformin, and no glucose meter; I should have asked about it months ago.
Long story short, I now have one and my Dr. Inner N=1 is actually getting some hard data. I'm enjoying the data collection part of this more than I thought I would.
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