DESPERATE AND ABOUT TO QUIT
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I got obese eating one meal a day. My stomach showed no sign whatsoever of shrinking.12
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HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »Instead of Keto, how about low-carb? It can be as high as 150 carbs/day. Get a food scale. Don't eat back your exercise calories. I'm your height and my calorie intake is 1340 calories/day.
She doesn't need to go low carb. She also needs to eat back some of her exercise calories.. and so should you!
On what authority do you say she does not need to go low carb? She may not "need" to eat any certain way but there are more than one way to skin a cat as they say and only eating 150 grams of carbs daily might work for her. I think she is very close to getting things going her way because she wants this thing.What I don't understand is the resistance to try something, or resisting even the suggestion of trying something, especially for folks who are struggling making what they are doing work, especially when the suggester acknowledges that it may be better for some staying the course their on. If it works for her great, don't change (or make the changes you suggested). If it's not working, then you might consider a change. There is more than one way to skin a cat!
It's interesting you and Gale seem to both of said the same thing..
That's because it's true! There is more than one way to skin a cat. I'm open to more than one way.
If it's true, then why did you edit it out of your post?
I thought it sounded better without it. They responded before I was done editing my post.3 -
rheddmobile wrote: »I got obese eating one meal a day. My stomach showed no sign whatsoever of shrinking.
Then I wouldn't do that anymore (and you should have probably changed sooner)! Do what works. It has worked for many others.1 -
You know Blambo61, Back in the other thread about jason, I had a response typed out for you about binge eating disorder and what the differences are, however the thread was locked before i could post it.
It took me 5 hours to type out something i felt was very descriptive and informative.
As the days have passed since that thread was locked however and I see threads being created and responses being made, etc.. I realize that maybe that response wouldn't of made a difference in the out come of that conversation/debate.
My boyfriend is much like you. Believes to be open minded but unfortunately his open mindedness is really only as wide ranged as the box of things he believes and understands. Which is why he too cannot understand my eating disorder but besides that, he also couldn't understand my anger this morning as i walked out to the kitchen while he was cooking breakfast for us and i saw a giant string of boogers hanging down from his nose, seconds away from falling into my pan of eggs he was cooking for me. He couldn't understand what the problem was, the boogers didn't fall in, so why should i be upset and refuse to eat my breakfast? He just wanted to get the eggs flipped over first before blowing his nose, he had time, he claims.
In his view, i am the one being stubborn and not open minded by letting something like that bother me. He is open minded because as long as the boogers didn't fall in, there is no issue, nothing happened, so i should just forget it and eat.
Much like you believe you are open minded to all things diet, but regardless the topic or actual solution to the topic, be it binge eating disorder or simply just logging accurately, you believe I.F is the solution to both of these things and that this way is easier then calorie counting and logging and that it could be the winning solution to an eating disorder.
I recommend lifestyles when it's needed. I don't recommend lifestyles as a solution to everything. Just like i don't tell every person with binge eating disorder they should go on Vyvanse because it works for me. I ask them what their therapist recommended for them and then work with them on those recommendations. I do not try to change their path, especially when the problem they are having does not require change.
You feel you are more open minded then me.
Which isn't true at all.. I am just here to help people with their actual situation rather then promote one lifestyle as a solution to all things problematic. There is more to being open minded then posting solutions to problems (Which aren't actually a problem on this thread) and suggesting another way to achieve deficit. Being open minded means helping people the way they need to be helped on the path they are currently on without feeling the need to change them if the problems needing solutions do not require it.
There is tons of people on MFP right now doing lifestyles that probably aren't going to work for them. But what i am not doing is going to those threads and suggesting a different lifestyle to solve problems they aren't having simply because i think it's easier. People do have to navigate on their own with this a little bit. When they do finally come to this forum seeking guidance as to why theyre currently struggling with their lifestyle choice and the struggles seem to centralize around over eating carbs while diabetic or junk foods or whatever, then i will offer a new lifestyle suggestion and people can offer their suggestions and the OP of that thread can then choose what suggestions seem to be the correct solution for low carbing or how to control themselves and moderate junk foods.
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HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »You know Blambo61, Back in the other thread about jason, I had a response typed out for you about binge eating disorder and what the differences are, however the thread was locked before i could post it.
It took me 5 hours to type out something i felt was very descriptive and informative.
As the days have passed since that thread was locked however and I see threads being created and responses being made, etc.. I realize that maybe that response wouldn't of made a difference in the out come of that conversation/debate.
My boyfriend is much like you. Believes to be open minded but unfortunately his open mindedness is really only as wide ranged as the box of things he believes and understands. Which is why he too cannot understand my eating disorder but besides that, he also couldn't understand my anger this morning as i walked out to the kitchen while he was cooking breakfast for us and i saw a giant string of boogers hanging down from his nose, seconds away from falling into my pan of eggs he was cooking for me. He couldn't understand what the problem was, the boogers didn't fall in, so why should i be upset and refuse to eat my breakfast? He just wanted to get the eggs flipped over first before blowing his nose, he had time, he claims.
In his view, i am the one being stubborn and not open minded by letting something like that bother me. He is open minded because as long as the boogers didn't fall in, there is no issue, nothing happened, so i should just forget it and eat.
Much like you believe you are open minded to all things diet, but regardless the topic or actual solution to the topic, be it binge eating disorder or simply just logging accurately, you believe I.F is the solution to both of these things and that this way is easier then calorie counting and logging and that it could be the winning solution to an eating disorder.
I recommend lifestyles when it's needed. I don't recommend lifestyles as a solution to everything. Just like i don't tell every person with binge eating disorder they should go on Vyvanse because it works for me. I ask them what their therapist recommended for them and then work with them on those recommendations. I do not try to change their path, especially when the problem they are having does not require change.
You feel you are more open minded then me.
Which isn't true at all.. I am just here to help people with their actual situation rather then promote one lifestyle as a solution to all things problematic. There is more to being open minded then posting solutions to problems (Which aren't actually a problem on this thread) and suggesting another way to achieve deficit. Being open minded means helping people the way they need to be helped on the path they are currently on without feeling the need to change them if the problems needing solutions do not require it.
There is tons of people on MFP right now doing lifestyles that probably aren't going to work for them. But what i am not doing is going to those threads and suggesting a different lifestyle to solve problems they aren't having simply because i think it's easier. People do have to navigate on their own with this a little bit. When they do finally come to this forum seeking guidance as to why theyre currently struggling with their lifestyle choice and the struggles seem to centralize around over eating carbs while diabetic or junk foods or whatever, then i will offer a new lifestyle suggestion and people can offer their suggestions and the OP of that thread can then choose what suggestions seem to be the correct solution for low carbing or how to control themselves and moderate junk foods.
I don't believe IF is the solution for everyone for losing weight or for BED. I've said that about losing weight in about every post I've posted on this thread. I said that in the other thread on BED. I think for those with BED it could very well not be a thing to do and that those people should only try it with under a physicians supervision. I can understand your concerns and being very cautious about it for people with BED. I do not think there is anything wrong though with recommending a lifestyle change if it can help people which I do think IF can (it can help some but not all and I do suppose that it may even be harmful for some with BED).3 -
I am not going to derail this thread any longer.
If you can understand the repercussions of recommending a diet to someone with BED, then also understand that there is also repercussions doing the same thing to others based solely on the premise that it is easier in your opinion.
It's easier for you because it works for you.
The OPs problem was not one that required I.F as a suggestion.
There was no mentions of any struggles with weighing, logging, time, hunger and over eating.
The OP did not mention any concerns about shrinking her stomach.
The things about your method of IF that make it easier for you are not anything the OP is experiencing, therefore there is no grounds to determine that IF would make it easier for her, Suggesting it is one thing, but when someone is at their wits ends.. the last thing we should be doing is sending them down a path with no real reason other then they are are desperate and about to quit, that isn't going to be a fix to their current problem and potentially cause more problems and leaving them now quitting and not losing any weight.
We all know that weight on the body can hurt us. If the solution is obvious, like just logging accuracy, lets fix that and get the ball going so we can get her on the road to getting healthy
This is all i am going to say on this now, i feel like im just repeating myself a lot.4 -
HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »I am not going to derail this thread any longer.
If you can understand the repercussions of recommending a diet to someone with BED, then also understand that there is also repercussions doing the same thing to others based solely on the premise that it is easier in your opinion.
It's easier for you because it works for you.
The OPs problem was not one that required I.F as a suggestion.
There was no mentions of any struggles with weighing, logging, time, hunger and over eating.
The OP did not mention any concerns about shrinking her stomach.
The things about your method of IF that make it easier for you are not anything the OP is experiencing, therefore there is no grounds to determine that IF would make it easier for her, Suggesting it is one thing, but when someone is at their wits ends.. the last thing we should be doing is sending them down a path with no real reason other then they are are desperate and about to quit, that isn't going to be a fix to their current problem and potentially cause more problems and leaving them now quitting and not losing any weight.
We all know that weight on the body can hurt us. If the solution is obvious, like just logging accuracy, lets fix that and get the ball going so we can get her on the road to getting healthy
This is all i am going to say on this now, i feel like im just repeating myself a lot.
It's kind of like going into a thread where someone is struggling with their studies in law and asking for study strategies, and immediately recommending they transfer to accounting.16 -
Alatariel75 wrote: »HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »I am not going to derail this thread any longer.
If you can understand the repercussions of recommending a diet to someone with BED, then also understand that there is also repercussions doing the same thing to others based solely on the premise that it is easier in your opinion.
It's easier for you because it works for you.
The OPs problem was not one that required I.F as a suggestion.
There was no mentions of any struggles with weighing, logging, time, hunger and over eating.
The OP did not mention any concerns about shrinking her stomach.
The things about your method of IF that make it easier for you are not anything the OP is experiencing, therefore there is no grounds to determine that IF would make it easier for her, Suggesting it is one thing, but when someone is at their wits ends.. the last thing we should be doing is sending them down a path with no real reason other then they are are desperate and about to quit, that isn't going to be a fix to their current problem and potentially cause more problems and leaving them now quitting and not losing any weight.
We all know that weight on the body can hurt us. If the solution is obvious, like just logging accuracy, lets fix that and get the ball going so we can get her on the road to getting healthy
This is all i am going to say on this now, i feel like im just repeating myself a lot.
It's kind of like going into a thread where someone is struggling with their studies in law and asking for study strategies, and immediately recommending they transfer to accounting.
This is an excellent example of what i was trying to say
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a) your stomach absolutely does shrink if you fast for 20-hrs.
Sure. To about 200 ml. And then it can - and will - promptly expand to accommodate a liter (or more in some people) upon the proper hormonal signaling from your brain/body.
And, yes, with chronic prolonged fasting researchers are saying you can actually adversely affect the innervation, pacemaker cells, and smooth muscle fibers ability to allow for this normal relaxation and expansion. This will indeed effectively reduce the volume the stomach can hold.
Guess what? A 20% reduction in food intake over a four week period was also shown to achieve the same thing.
But don't take just my word on it: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/does-dieting-actually-make-your-stomach-shrink-180955521/
Cherry picking the parts of "Science!" that confirm(s) your preconceived opinion(s) and pretending the rest doesn't count/exist plays a significant role in the whole "Why nutrition and diet information is such a hot mess" phenomenon.7 -
Suggesting IF in this instance is like saying “try yoga! If you eat at a deficit and do yoga you will lose weight” or “eat a dandelion! If you eat at a deficit and a dandelion a day you will lose weight”
Like ...truuue, but kind of masking what the real solution is. To eat at a deficit. Knowing that you’re doing that is the first step. If after doing that she wants to do low carb or eat a dandelion, rage on.6 -
HellYeahItsKriss wrote: »Okay, so my next question is..
Since the OP's only issue was that she was using inaccurate logs in her diary.. and not anything else.. why would she have to drastically alter the way she eats? regardless of if she eats within 4 hours or 24 hours, if the logs shes using are wrong, they are going to be wrong at 4pm, 9pm, 7am, 1am... you were eating a vast portion of your calories within your small time frame, if shes going to copy your suggestion, then shes not going to have any different results, still using the same logs with the same calorie errors.
Once she fixes the logs however, she will then be eating the correct amount of calories for loss.. why does she need to fast if the problem is then resolved?
Her stomach will shrink eating in a small window and it will be harder to overeat. She doesn't have to log at all. Just weigh the body and see if your losing weight. If not shorten the eating window for dinner or practice and easier method of portion control like only eating one-large plate of food. No need to measure every thing you eat. That actually would be almost impossible at my house to do that because almost everything we eat we make from scratch. To know how much I eat, I would have to ask my wife to measure every ingredient put into everything, weigh the whole thing, then weigh my portion, then calculate the percentage of the whole I ate. No way is my wife going to be willing to do that (she does most of the cooking) and I have no interest in spending the time doing it either. It was a major pain just guessing and logging the cals I ate when I did that.
I did IF and my stomach didn't "shrink." I didn't gain anything, but I didn't lose either.
I started losing when I began accurately measuring my food and consistently hitting a specific calorie goal.
It's not impossible to accurately measure when you cook from scratch -- the vast majority of my meals, I'm preparing at home from scratch. I can understand that you don't want to ask your wife to do it and you don't want to do it, but a general unwillingness to do something or to ask someone else to do it doesn't equal something being impossible.6
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