Losing weight and gaining Muscle

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Replies

  • RoxieDawn
    RoxieDawn Posts: 15,488 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol
  • quiksylver296
    quiksylver296 Posts: 28,443 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.
  • RoxieDawn
    RoxieDawn Posts: 15,488 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.

    I'll save you some and a cookie too.
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.

    I'll save you some and a cookie too.

    I hope you brought enough for everyone.
  • quiksylver296
    quiksylver296 Posts: 28,443 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.

    I'll save you some and a cookie too.

    I hope you brought enough for everyone.

    cgzev4tq9xxk.jpg
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    But was it clean? Apparently clean = magic in that nutrition class I missed due to illness.

    I had spaghetti night before last, this must be spaghetti week. I know it was clean because my wife used water to boil the pasta, so that's like rinsing it, right? And she rinsed the mushrooms before she sliced them to put them into the sauce, too. Oh so clean.

    I don't know, mushrooms grow in some pretty nasty stuff.
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    edited January 2018
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.

    I'll save you some and a cookie too.

    I hope you brought enough for everyone.

    cgzev4tq9xxk.jpg

    8e4ad76a3318e0eee982c85badb10034753c16ba4d45dd415b69e56be7b14642.jpg
  • RoxieDawn
    RoxieDawn Posts: 15,488 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.

    I'll save you some and a cookie too.

    I hope you brought enough for everyone.

    Cookies for all. But I am a cookie snob so the last two are mine.
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    RoxieDawn wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    usmcmp wrote: »
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Counting calories is useful for newbies. There was a recent thread about “foods that surprised you”, meaning calorie count was very high...usual things like peanut butter. Counting brings those things to light. Someone may not understand how real portions look. Calorie counting helps with that. Discounting it because it’s tedious is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard. “Tedious” is relative.

    I'm more about working them in, showing them the gym and making better choices in the kitchen first. Then once they get into a routine of making better choices, then have them learn how to count calories... that's just me I guess, I'm not saying your wrong, I'd just go about it a little differently.

    And he comes back in 2 months wondering why he hasn't lost weight because he cut out 500 calories worth of pizza per week, but replace it with 1,000 calories worth of granola and nuts because they're "healthy". We don't even know what his choices are, maybe he's on a completely "clean" diet and is gaining weight. In the end it really comes down to calories and personally I'm going to keep eating "garbage" foods all the way up to this bodybuilding competition just like I did last time.

    Well I hope he has a mentor to show him exercises in the gym, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. If he doesn't lose any weight, but cuts out *kitten* foods. He'll actually build some muscle, and then do a caloric deficit by 200-300 calories then when the weight comes off, he'll actually have baby muscles. And good luck with that competition mate

    how do you know he would be in a deficit if he cut out "junk", he may eat more non-junk that has even more caloreis to replace the junk.

    What I said was it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing if he went 6-8 weeks and didn't lose any weight on the scale but cut out garbage foods. Which would make him healthier... 6-8 of training as a newbie, he would pack on some muscle, even if he does gain a little more fat by eating "too much" healthier foods.. he'd for one be healthier, two be stronger, and three actually have some muscle under the fat for when he starts counting calories and is in a caloric deficit.

    Question: Why would you delay weight loss for 2 months? And it be okay to gain weight on healthier food?

    For him to gain weight on healthy foods is going to be a lot harder than to gain weight with garbage foods, in my opinion. But, if he did... as a beginner to the gym, he has little muscle mass if any, let him pack on some extra muscle before you strip him of calories.. Then when it's time to cut the weight, the calories get cut by however many 2,3, 500 whatever it is.. and there's actually muscle instead of just skin and bone.

    You claim to have studied nutrition, so you know about p-ratio, right? And you understand what effect it has on an already overweight/overfat individual trying to bulk, as opposed to doing it when they're leaner, right?

    I'm sure you know about that if you've studied nutrition.

    A clean nutritional lean bulk is not detrimental to ones health, even if overweight or "obese" that's why healthy fat burning foods and vegetables are recommended in lean bulk diets.

    Obesity is a health issue no matter the diet this advice is getting worse.

    Eat a *kitten* ton of cleaner more nutritional food, cut out the garbage. Lose weight. Eat a *kitten* tone of *kitten* processed and fast food, die or be obese. Wanna get blunt? I mean it's simple

    But you don't lose weight unless you're in a caloric deficit, regardless of what you're eating. Surely you learned that in your nutritional studies too. Didn't you? The most basic laws of energy balance? I'm sure they taught those in nutritional studies.

    And you do understand the concepts of context and dosage, right? That's it's actually possible to eat a diet that is reasonably somewhere in between completely "clean" and shoveling junk food into your pie hole 24/7? You know, a little moderation and common sense? Middle ground?

    Of course man, I'm not against cheat meals. I am against cheat days, but not cheat meals.

    I'm all for eating in a way that I don't have to cheat.

    Me, too! I made spaghetti with meat sauce and garlic bread fit in my calories and macros yesterday. It was glorious.

    I had this too. Girl you are my food twin!!!

    Steak on the smoker and baked sweet potato tonight. Still twinning, @roxiedawn?

    Steak;s on Saturday's in my house.

    Dinner tonight is chicken casadillia's, Mexican rice and yes refried beans. And I am topping off dessert with homemade m&m cookie sandwiches I made the other day with milk.

    I am so not sorry. lol

    Oooh, yum. We normally do steaks on the weekend, but hubby's schedule just changed and he has to work Sat and Sun night.

    I'll save you some and a cookie too.

    I hope you brought enough for everyone.

    Cookies for all. But I am a cookie snob so the last two are mine.

    I can live with that.