The men who made us fat
Replies
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I'm not sure making food corporations let people knowing what is in food, and yes imposing some rules to ensure the food does us no harm, is communism or fascism, I think it's health ism. They are accountable to the consumer, as I said in the Uk earlier this year, lots of big manufacturers were labelling Hungarian horse meat as beef! Most people would have liked to trust the manufacturers , but unless the consumer acts, the profits won't be affected, and there is no need to change things. I am not sure why people feel this is communism,,it's social responsibility?I think people got way off on a tangent.
The OP asked what foods were your surprised that they had added sugar.
So far, here in Australia, sugar isn't added to everything and it isn't promoted as a health food.
I was comparing labels on bread for the US and here and was surprised sugar is added to plain white bread in the USA.
Yes people, usually Americans raised on Ayn Rand, will go on and on about personal responsibility. The world is black and white, and terms are always absolute and determined before the conversation started. Other cultures are strange and arbitrary, ours is rational.
Because, you know, taking high fructose corn syrup off the GRAS list would be COMMUNISM
I think you'll find a totallitarian body imposing rules on the free market is fascism.
Every individual making the same decision to not buy products with corn syrup to bring the capitalists down is communism.
It's not. That was my point.0 -
lighten up a bit guys xxxx
We can't because of all the corn syrup they are putting in ours foodz.
*BA DUM BOOSH*0 -
ha...ok ok0
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Lots of Lolz :laugh:
Hello from Germany.Socialist! Hitler was a vegetarian!
Hello!
On my way to Germany in a few weeks, trying to get a job there.
Please read the whole thread. I am being facetious and I believe in a reasonable balance between collective and individual welfare rather than an all or nothing proposition and dramatic name calling.
Just saying the OP (me) is actually German too lol so Hello to both
Am all in favour of a balance between collective and individual welfare. And while we are all responsible for our own choices, we can not ignore the effect they have on the collective and vice versa. As a collective we are also responsible for the individual. So my point is to not lose sight of either
Its taken me 2 hours to read through every single post and all I can say is I am baffled by the dynamic the thread has taken on. Fascinating! keep them coming!
You have no idea what a relief it is to encounter an OP who opens a debate and enjoys it, rather than opening a debate and then reporting everyone that disagrees with them.
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And here I thought people were getting fat from eating too much and being lazy.0
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I NEVER used to check calories on products. It was a case of "if I want it, I'll eat it" I pretty much threw caution to the wind.
Now I check everything, or I'm aware of exactly what is in what I'm eating.0 -
OP:
How's about no...
I will be damned if I am going to blame any poor decision that I have made on anybody else. Also, sugar is not evil and don't talk bad about bacon. Geez.
Lighten up and read again: it's just about a documentary on tv last night. I'm not saying at all sugar is evil nor do I talk bad about bacon .... Though good quality bacon (or salmon or whatever) does not need added sugar to make it taste better. I love my bacon sandwich and my chocolates 0 -
Hello from Germany.Socialist! Hitler was a vegetarian!
Hello!
On my way to Germany in a few weeks, trying to get a job there.
Please read the whole thread. I am being facetious and I believe in a reasonable balance between collective and individual welfare rather than an all or nothing proposition and dramatic name calling.
Just saying the OP (me) is actually German too lol so Hello to both
Am all in favour of a balance between collective and individual welfare. And while we are all responsible for our own choices, we can not ignore the effect they have on the collective and vice versa. As a collective we are also responsible for the individual. So my point is to not lose sight of either
Its taken me 2 hours to read through every single post and all I can say is I am baffled by the dynamic the thread has taken on. Fascinating! keep them coming!
You have no idea what a relief it is to encounter an OP who opens a debate and enjoys it, rather than opening a debate and then reporting everyone that disagrees with them.
You're welcome isn't the debate about a topic (and various aspects of it) part of the fun? 0 -
lighten up a bit guys xxxx
We can't because of all the corn syrup they are putting in ours foodz.
*BA DUM BOOSH*
Pmsl ... That's the funniest yet lol0 -
I'm with the OP.
I loves me some high fructose corn syrup concoctions like the McDonald's chocolate dipped cone.
I just think the price should reflec the cost.
Sorry for any jokes I missed, people. As implied a few responses ago, I am stupid.
Great post OP and thanks for the lively debate everyone!0 -
I'm with the OP.
I loves me some high fructose corn syrup concoctions like the McDonald's chocolate dipped cone.
I just think the price should reflec the cost.
Sorry for any jokes I missed, people. As implied a few responses ago, I am stupid.
Great post OP and thanks for the lively debate everyone!
Thanks and there I was thinking last night nobody is going to read my post to begin with lol .... Thoroughly enjoyable responses. Let's see what part 2 of the documentary next week will spark off 0 -
Hello from Germany.Socialist! Hitler was a vegetarian!
Hello!
On my way to Germany in a few weeks, trying to get a job there.
Please read the whole thread. I am being facetious and I believe in a reasonable balance between collective and individual welfare rather than an all or nothing proposition and dramatic name calling.
Just saying the OP (me) is actually German too lol so Hello to both
Am all in favour of a balance between collective and individual welfare. And while we are all responsible for our own choices, we can not ignore the effect they have on the collective and vice versa. As a collective we are also responsible for the individual. So my point is to not lose sight of either
Its taken me 2 hours to read through every single post and all I can say is I am baffled by the dynamic the thread has taken on. Fascinating! keep them coming!
You have no idea what a relief it is to encounter an OP who opens a debate and enjoys it, rather than opening a debate and then reporting everyone that disagrees with them.
You're welcome isn't the debate about a topic (and various aspects of it) part of the fun?
in for ze'Germans debating.0 -
The OP said in a reply: "Its taken me 2 hours to read through every single post and all I can say is I am baffled by the dynamic the thread has taken on. Fascinating! keep them coming!"
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OP, what we have here is one facet of the most fundamental poli.tical debate in contemporary U.S. of A. When it comes to social welfare, health care, social safety nets, the education of children, crime, poverty and many many other issues facing America, the question comes down to the decision about whether these are ONLY a matter of individual choice/responsibility, or whether these are the result of a combination of personal responsibility AND societal factors.
In America, the Dem.ocr.ats usually (though not always) side with the combo option, and set policies accordingly, which sometimes means enacting government policies that regulate how corporations must label food and/or the quality/content of products sold for human consumption. Meanwhile the Rep.ubli.cans usually (though not always) side with the individual-only option, and set policies accordingly in the belief that consumer choice and the free market will result in products that are honest and safe.
I'm trying to tread carefully and represent these sides fairly and with relative objectivity, since this is not a pol.iti.cal forum. I only wanted to explain the baffling intensity and the strength of the opinions in the responses.
OP, my personal thoughts are akin to yours, as stated.0 -
The OP said in a reply: "Its taken me 2 hours to read through every single post and all I can say is I am baffled by the dynamic the thread has taken on. Fascinating! keep them coming!"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
OP, what we have here is one facet of the most fundamental poli.tical debate in contemporary U.S. of A. When it comes to social welfare, health care, social safety nets, the education of children, crime, poverty and many many other issues facing America, the question comes down to the decision about whether these are ONLY a matter of individual choice/responsibility, or whether these are the result of a combination of personal responsibility AND societal factors.
In America, the Dem.ocr.ats usually (though not always) side with the combo option, and set policies accordingly, which sometimes means enacting government policies that regulate how corporations must label food and/or the quality/content of products sold for human consumption. Meanwhile the Rep.ubli.cans usually (though not always) side with the individual-only option, and set policies accordingly in the belief that consumer choice and the free market will result in products that are honest and safe.
I'm trying to tread carefully and represent these sides fairly and with relative objectivity, since this is not a pol.iti.cal forum. I only wanted to explain the baffling intensity and the strength of the opinions in the responses.
OP, my personal thoughts are akin to yours, as stated.
I figure, debating is very much an American thing. I believe over here, the intense exchange of opinions and all that goes with it, would be more considered an argument than a debate. Hence people tend to take it personal when the other doesn't concurr with their opinion. I like the idea of getting all firy about a subject, really give it to each other, than shake hands after and still be friends As an observer I find it very stimulating 0 -
The OP said in a reply: "Its taken me 2 hours to read through every single post and all I can say is I am baffled by the dynamic the thread has taken on. Fascinating! keep them coming!"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
OP, what we have here is one facet of the most fundamental poli.tical debate in contemporary U.S. of A. When it comes to social welfare, health care, social safety nets, the education of children, crime, poverty and many many other issues facing America, the question comes down to the decision about whether these are ONLY a matter of individual choice/responsibility, or whether these are the result of a combination of personal responsibility AND societal factors.
In America, the Dem.ocr.ats usually (though not always) side with the combo option, and set policies accordingly, which sometimes means enacting government policies that regulate how corporations must label food and/or the quality/content of products sold for human consumption. Meanwhile the Rep.ubli.cans usually (though not always) side with the individual-only option, and set policies accordingly in the belief that consumer choice and the free market will result in products that are honest and safe.
I'm trying to tread carefully and represent these sides fairly and with relative objectivity, since this is not a pol.iti.cal forum. I only wanted to explain the baffling intensity and the strength of the opinions in the responses.
OP, my personal thoughts are akin to yours, as stated.
And then there is the bipartisan consensus that actually determines outcomes and is untouchable0 -
Nothing like absolving yourself of personal responsibility!
I agree! The market doesn't dictate what we CHOOSE to eat, we do.0 -
I'm gonna be the devil's advocate here. Industry and politicians are partially responsible for making people fat. When junk food is subsidized and healthy food is not, the price of the end product is often the factor why people reach for some food over the other. When people can't afford healthy food, they buy what's within their range.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNENeM4LPh4 -- this documentary is worth watching.
last time I checked, you can buy any kind of food with food stamps...but nice try, trying to absolve everyone of any kind of personal responsibility ...
Suuuuuuure the politicians made me fat, because they made me eat big macs everyday...rolling eyez...0 -
I see this thread has gone from moronic to idiotic over night...0
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I thought this was going to be about unsupportive or abusive husbands that kept us barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen.0
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I thought this was going to be about unsupportive or abusive husbands that kept us barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen.
Me, too. Thought I was going to get to go and beat up my first husband or something. :grumble:0 -
I thought this was going to be about unsupportive or abusive husbands that kept us barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen.
Me, too. Thought I was going to get to go and beat up my first husband or something. :grumble:
Same here. :laugh:0 -
I'm gonna be the devil's advocate here. Industry and politicians are partially responsible for making people fat. When junk food is subsidized and healthy food is not, the price of the end product is often the factor why people reach for some food over the other. When people can't afford healthy food, they buy what's within their range.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNENeM4LPh4 -- this documentary is worth watching.
last time I checked, you can buy any kind of food with food stamps...but nice try, trying to absolve everyone of any kind of personal responsibility ...
Suuuuuuure the politicians made me fat, because they made me eat big macs everyday...rolling eyez...
I don't think you actually checked. I can pick any number of food deserts, drop you there, give you transport options typical for someone close to federal poverty levels, and you will have to choose between eating real food and going to work.
If I make you a single mom it gets twice as hard.
What makes you assume the things you take for granted are even known to you? What kind of "checking" do you actually do?
Have you any idea how ignorant that post makes you sound? It doesn't look good on you, because you are obviously more intelligent and better than that.0 -
It's no one's fault but us for how we gained weight. Don't blame corporations or anyone but yourself. Those corporations adding sugar to things is not what made us fat... sugar alone did not make us fat... we made ourselves fat because we ate too much and were too lazy.
That's only partially true. If people are "educated" to believe that diets high in simple carbs and low in fat are the best way to lose weight (which is what we were told throughout the 80's and 90's), then part of the blame goes on the corporations spreading misinformation.0 -
I'm gonna be the devil's advocate here. Industry and politicians are partially responsible for making people fat. When junk food is subsidized and healthy food is not, the price of the end product is often the factor why people reach for some food over the other. When people can't afford healthy food, they buy what's within their range.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNENeM4LPh4 -- this documentary is worth watching.
last time I checked, you can buy any kind of food with food stamps...but nice try, trying to absolve everyone of any kind of personal responsibility ...
Suuuuuuure the politicians made me fat, because they made me eat big macs everyday...rolling eyez...
I don't think you actually checked. I can pick any number of food deserts, drop you there, give you transport options typical for someone close to federal poverty levels, and you will have to choose between eating real food and going to work.
If I make you a single mom it gets twice as hard.
What makes you assume the things you take for granted are even known to you? What kind of "checking" do you actually do?
Have you any idea how ignorant that post makes you sound? It doesn't look good on you, because you are obviously more intelligent and better than that.
If you need government aid to be able to afford food, then you shouldn't complain when you get so much of it that it makes you fat.0 -
If the sugar in today's foods is responsible for obesity, then why can some people eat those foods and stay thin?0
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and it makes you sound even smarter to say that "the government makes us fat" ....please...I'm gonna be the devil's advocate here. Industry and politicians are partially responsible for making people fat. When junk food is subsidized and healthy food is not, the price of the end product is often the factor why people reach for some food over the other. When people can't afford healthy food, they buy what's within their range.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNENeM4LPh4 -- this documentary is worth watching.
last time I checked, you can buy any kind of food with food stamps...but nice try, trying to absolve everyone of any kind of personal responsibility ...
Suuuuuuure the politicians made me fat, because they made me eat big macs everyday...rolling eyez...
I don't think you actually checked. I can pick any number of food deserts, drop you there, give you transport options typical for someone close to federal poverty levels, and you will have to choose between eating real food and going to work.
If I make you a single mom it gets twice as hard.
What makes you assume the things you take for granted are even known to you? What kind of "checking" do you actually do?
Have you any idea how ignorant that post makes you sound? It doesn't look good on you, because you are obviously more intelligent and better than that.
Eat too much = fat
eat at maintenance = no gain
eat at under maintenance = lose weight
its not hard, and its not a government conspiracy...0 -
I'm gonna be the devil's advocate here. Industry and politicians are partially responsible for making people fat. When junk food is subsidized and healthy food is not, the price of the end product is often the factor why people reach for some food over the other. When people can't afford healthy food, they buy what's within their range.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNENeM4LPh4 -- this documentary is worth watching.
last time I checked, you can buy any kind of food with food stamps...but nice try, trying to absolve everyone of any kind of personal responsibility ...
Suuuuuuure the politicians made me fat, because they made me eat big macs everyday...rolling eyez...
I don't think you actually checked. I can pick any number of food deserts, drop you there, give you transport options typical for someone close to federal poverty levels, and you will have to choose between eating real food and going to work.
If I make you a single mom it gets twice as hard.
What makes you assume the things you take for granted are even known to you? What kind of "checking" do you actually do?
Have you any idea how ignorant that post makes you sound? It doesn't look good on you, because you are obviously more intelligent and better than that.
If you need government aid to be able to afford food, then you shouldn't complain when you get so much of it that it makes you fat.
That sounds like a great reason to ignore evidence and use assistance programs to increase the burden on society for the sake of corporate profits. Great point.0 -
and it makes you sound even smarter to say that "the government makes us fat" ....please...I'm gonna be the devil's advocate here. Industry and politicians are partially responsible for making people fat. When junk food is subsidized and healthy food is not, the price of the end product is often the factor why people reach for some food over the other. When people can't afford healthy food, they buy what's within their range.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNENeM4LPh4 -- this documentary is worth watching.
last time I checked, you can buy any kind of food with food stamps...but nice try, trying to absolve everyone of any kind of personal responsibility ...
Suuuuuuure the politicians made me fat, because they made me eat big macs everyday...rolling eyez...
I don't think you actually checked. I can pick any number of food deserts, drop you there, give you transport options typical for someone close to federal poverty levels, and you will have to choose between eating real food and going to work.
If I make you a single mom it gets twice as hard.
What makes you assume the things you take for granted are even known to you? What kind of "checking" do you actually do?
Have you any idea how ignorant that post makes you sound? It doesn't look good on you, because you are obviously more intelligent and better than that.
Eat too much = fat
eat at maintenance = no gain
eat at under maintenance = lose weight
its not hard, and its not a government conspiracy...
Right.
I'm not going to go back and rehash the points I've already argued, sorry.
Summary: individual responsibility is not the opposite of smart social policy. The two work well together.
Government intervention is a given unless you are demagoguing for campaign cash. You can make it effective or make it counter productive.0 -
If the sugar in today's foods is responsible for obesity, then why can some people eat those foods and stay thin?
magic.0 -
I thought this was going to be about unsupportive or abusive husbands that kept us barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen.
Me, too. Thought I was going to get to go and beat up my first husband or something. :grumble:
Same here. :laugh:
Pmsl ... Im sure there's a lot to say about that one too ... But unless they've force fed any of you against your will (in which case they should be imprisoned anyway) one can hardly put the blame for excess flab on them (it's too easy and doesn't get us (women) anywhere! x 0
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