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Gut Microbiome impact on Health and Fitness
Replies
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Nothing is wrong with constructive criticism. But a lot of what i am seeing is just nay saying for the sake of it.
It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
Anyway, this is not what this post is about so let’s move on.lukejoycePT wrote: »i see a hell of a lot of negative comments on here and not many thanks. At least Gale bothers to try and help others. Even him posting studies with links isn't enough for you lot. You are all too set in your ways and are in danger of not seeing the forest for the trees. Don't be so quick to call BS on something just because it isn't proven, it's well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself, especially when it comes to nutrition and gut health. If it isn't doing you any harm then surely its better to be safe than sorry?
What is wrong with negative comments? Any new theory should stand up to criticism and adversity to prove itself or be placed on the back burner until it can be confirmed. Until then it is unproven and anyone deciding to invest time or money into it should understand they may be very well wasting their time.
Also, "it is well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself" is a very popular thing to say when trying to sell snake oil. It also doesn't apply here and probably applies nowhere.
I don't actually believe the OP believes half of what he is saying or he wouldn't do such haphazard research. Anyone truly invested in a theory would be more careful. He also conveniently ignores most of what is posted in rebuttal. These are characteristics of a troll.lukejoycePT wrote: »i see a hell of a lot of negative comments on here and not many thanks. At least Gale bothers to try and help others. Even him posting studies with links isn't enough for you lot. You are all too set in your ways and are in danger of not seeing the forest for the trees. Don't be so quick to call BS on something just because it isn't proven, it's well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself, especially when it comes to nutrition and gut health. If it isn't doing you any harm then surely its better to be safe than sorry?
What is wrong with negative comments? Any new theory should stand up to criticism and adversity to prove itself or be placed on the back burner until it can be confirmed. Until then it is unproven and anyone deciding to invest time or money into it should understand they may be very well wasting their time.
Also, "it is well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself" is a very popular thing to say when trying to sell snake oil. It also doesn't apply here and probably applies nowhere.
I don't actually believe the OP believes half of what he is saying or he wouldn't do such haphazard research. Anyone truly invested in a theory would be more careful. He also conveniently ignores most of what is posted in rebuttal. These are characteristics of a troll.
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lukejoycePT wrote: »It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
That's a big assumption...9 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
That's a big assumption...
No it’s an observation, sadly.12 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »lukejoycePT wrote: »It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
That's a big assumption...
No it’s an observation, sadly.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯6 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »lukejoycePT wrote: »It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
That's a big assumption...
No it’s an observation, sadly.
I would love to see a specific example of this. What people tend to push back against is unfounded claims, and the poster you are defending seems to have quite a few of them. If you are going to make claims, you should at least be able to defend your position. I don't see that happening.12 -
So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.17 -
So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
So you're asking to prove a negative...
Sorry, meant to say disprove a negative...7 -
So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
So you're asking to prove a negative...
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So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
Please quote these posters who are claiming that gut microbiome research is trivial. Hint: that is not the same thing as saying that it does not back up Gale’s specific claims.8 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »Nothing is wrong with constructive criticism. But a lot of what i am seeing is just nay saying for the sake of it.
It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
Anyway, this is not what this post is about so let’s move on.lukejoycePT wrote: »i see a hell of a lot of negative comments on here and not many thanks. At least Gale bothers to try and help others. Even him posting studies with links isn't enough for you lot. You are all too set in your ways and are in danger of not seeing the forest for the trees. Don't be so quick to call BS on something just because it isn't proven, it's well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself, especially when it comes to nutrition and gut health. If it isn't doing you any harm then surely its better to be safe than sorry?
What is wrong with negative comments? Any new theory should stand up to criticism and adversity to prove itself or be placed on the back burner until it can be confirmed. Until then it is unproven and anyone deciding to invest time or money into it should understand they may be very well wasting their time.
Also, "it is well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself" is a very popular thing to say when trying to sell snake oil. It also doesn't apply here and probably applies nowhere.
I don't actually believe the OP believes half of what he is saying or he wouldn't do such haphazard research. Anyone truly invested in a theory would be more careful. He also conveniently ignores most of what is posted in rebuttal. These are characteristics of a troll.lukejoycePT wrote: »i see a hell of a lot of negative comments on here and not many thanks. At least Gale bothers to try and help others. Even him posting studies with links isn't enough for you lot. You are all too set in your ways and are in danger of not seeing the forest for the trees. Don't be so quick to call BS on something just because it isn't proven, it's well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself, especially when it comes to nutrition and gut health. If it isn't doing you any harm then surely its better to be safe than sorry?
What is wrong with negative comments? Any new theory should stand up to criticism and adversity to prove itself or be placed on the back burner until it can be confirmed. Until then it is unproven and anyone deciding to invest time or money into it should understand they may be very well wasting their time.
Also, "it is well known that the medical industry is 10 years behind itself" is a very popular thing to say when trying to sell snake oil. It also doesn't apply here and probably applies nowhere.
I don't actually believe the OP believes half of what he is saying or he wouldn't do such haphazard research. Anyone truly invested in a theory would be more careful. He also conveniently ignores most of what is posted in rebuttal. These are characteristics of a troll.
Darn those meddling professional microbiologists and their objective evidence.9 -
So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
Professionals don't write scientific papers to prove that some new theory is not true, that's not how it work.
And if the research has gone back over 50 years and no one can post a meta-analyses showing all the scientific truths that have been proven by this research, then there's nothing to rebuff.
And again, no one is saying it's trivial. They are saying it's theoretical and specific cause and effect for specific outcomes is unproven.
Unfortunately, the OP tends to contradict himself from one post to the next, misrepresent conclusions of links he posts, and change the focus of his argument as his threads evolve, which makes it difficult to continue to "rebuff" and often leaves most of us just ignoring the thread. I'd say the direction this thread has taken has far more to do with the OP and his debate style rather than the subject matter.
I'd guess the general idea that "The gut microbiome is important to an individual's health, though exactly how and what to do about it on an individual case basis is unclear" is a statement that would be generally agreed with by the majority here, at least I would, speaking for myself.9 -
So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
Please quote these posters who are claiming that gut microbiome research is trivial. Hint: that is not the same thing as saying that it does not back up Gale’s specific claims.
Because once again...
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So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
So you're asking to prove a negative...
J would you like to review your myth question you just asked?9 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
So you're asking to prove a negative...
J would you like to review your myth question you just asked?
If you don’t see what is wrong about asking for proof of a negative, would you like to review the basic principles of science?7 -
So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
Please quote these posters who are claiming that gut microbiome research is trivial. Hint: that is not the same thing as saying that it does not back up Gale’s specific claims.
And you know it is false that I have made any specific claims. You can accept or reject the work on the human gut microbiome in full or in part but that does not demean their finds about the gut microbiome unless you come up with something more than a personal opinion by a mystical web character.13 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »John you know I have not made any claims
If you are not making claims, then why is this thread in the debate forum?but posted links to articles showing the different positive and negative ways one's gut microbiome may be of a concern as it relates to health and fitness.
You realize that this is a claim, right?
As is thisI found that to be puzzling until I learned about the gut microbiome and how it can demand binging to get more carbs in some cases.
And this.Simple. That diseases like Obesity and most all others may have a link to the all important gut microbiome.
And this.I just wanted to know how eating low carb in my case for the past 5 years has fixed or improved 40 years of serious health issues.
etc...
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GaleHawkins wrote: »So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
Please quote these posters who are claiming that gut microbiome research is trivial. Hint: that is not the same thing as saying that it does not back up Gale’s specific claims.
And you know it is false that I have made any specific claims. You can accept or reject the work on the human gut microbiome in full or in part but that does not demean their finds about the gut microbiome unless you come up with something more than a personal opinion by a mystical web character.
The irony is killing me.5 -
lukejoycePT wrote: »Nothing is wrong with constructive criticism. But a lot of what i am seeing is just nay saying for the sake of it.
It appears that there are a number of regular posters who gang up together on people and just disagree with them without any real knowledge themselves, they just believe their opinion is gospel.
Anyway, this is not what this post is about so let’s move on.
I completely disagree.
Here's a sample of what us "regular posters" are reading.
https://time.com/5360407/microbiome-diet-gut-health/
First off, that's less than a year old.
For my earlier point that you ignored:The gut microbiome—the billions of bacteria that live inside the human digestive tract—is the focus of some of today’s most exciting and compelling medical research. Studies have linked microbiome-related imbalances to health conditions ranging from depression and Parkinson’s disease to heart disease. Some researchers have even started referring to the microbiome as a “forgotten organ” because of the indispensable role it plays in human health.
No one is saying it isn't important. Literally no one.
What they are saying is this:But when it comes to strengthening or restoring the microbiome in ways that promote optimal health in humans, Czaja says there are promising theories but no hard-and-fast answers yet. “Our understanding of mechanisms regulating the gut-microbiome-brain axis is negligible,” he says. “We are not even sure about the number of microbes in the human body.”Figuring out which foods or probiotics could help reshape or harmonize the microbiome for improved health is like baking a perfect cake using 5,000 different ingredients, he says. The idea that eating this fruit or popping that supplement will do the trick is a woeful oversimplification of the microbiome’s complex role in human health.
Others agree. “We’re still learning what is a ‘healthy’ microbiome,” says Dr. Vincent Young, a professor in the department of microbiology and immunology at the University of Michigan Medical School. “There’s tremendous promise, and the research is being done, but right now, we don’t know what’s deranged or lacking, or how to fix it.”
Young points to the studies that have tied certain microbiome characteristics with disease states. The assumption is that by altering the microbiome to resemble a healthy person’s, we can cure or combat those diseases. This is the theory behind fecal transplants, which are basically transfusions of gut bacteria from a healthy person into a sick one. “But so far, fecal transplants are only proven to be effective for patients with recurrent C. difficile infection,” Young says, referring to a common type of infection that occurs in some people who have had their microbiome disrupted, typically by antibiotics. “People are trying these transplants for everything from autism to depression, but the results are uncertain and anecdotal.”The medical science community is only “scratching the surface” when it comes to understanding the microbiome’s role in human health, McDonald says, and experts who study it still can’t even say what a healthy or unhealthy microbiome looks like. “A lot of the technology we’re applying now is of relatively low precision,” he says. “We are not even in a position to say that one person’s microbiome is more or less healthy than another’s.”
There's more in there, with some supporting links. Your assumption is that "regular posters" like me are simply jumping on a bandwagon is insulting. A few of us are capable of reading information and drawing our own conclusions as well.
I have absolutely nothing against Gale at all. But I personally will not accept questionable sources when leading experts in the field are saying what I just posted above.7 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »So where are the well founded scientific papers to support the triviality of microbiome research which goes back over something like 50 years.
Sorry Kimny, there are people who do decry the role of the biome and do not back up their assertions with appropriate scientific research to rebuff the information within the given links.
Please quote these posters who are claiming that gut microbiome research is trivial. Hint: that is not the same thing as saying that it does not back up Gale’s specific claims.
And you know it is false that I have made any specific claims. You can accept or reject the work on the human gut microbiome in full or in part but that does not demean their finds about the gut microbiome unless you come up with something more than a personal opinion by a mystical web character.
I just did.5 -
I am starting to wonder if there is a language barrier with certain posters. I am not trying to be funny. It would explain why some posts just make no sense to me...6
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We have before us a number of links, the vast majority of which are not peer reviewed journal articles. Please explain why I, or anyone for that matter, should trust what is discussed in those links.We have had placed before us a number of links which provide information detailing the beneficial nature of our microbiome. The last one by Dr. Chris Kresser, educated in both eastern and western medicine, lays out everything neatly, how the body can be susceptible to issues within our microbiome.
I put it to you John, particularly, the debate is framed in the links. These links provide information on the ways to improve one's biome and why in various instances it could be helpful. As a younger person able to eat and drink what ever you choose seemingly without health issues have no wish to increase your knowledge - true this is news relating our microbiome will be new to many a Western Medical adviser don't we owe it to ourselves to look after ourselves to the best we can so as not to become an impediment to our families or societies?
Kindly do us a favour and set out your objections to the concept of the microbiome being beneficial. Enlighten us as to why any talk of a healthy microbiome is totally floored.
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I am starting to wonder if there is a language barrier with certain posters. I am not trying to be funny. It would explain why some posts just make no sense to me...
More of a Aristotelian logic and ego preservation barrier.
The underlying goal of this interest (and others like this) appears to be an attempt to place blame on behavior onto some other object.
6 -
Like blaming Big Sugar for weight gain.I am starting to wonder if there is a language barrier with certain posters. I am not trying to be funny. It would explain why some posts just make no sense to me...
More of a Aristotelian logic and ego preservation barrier.
The underlying goal of this interest (and others like this) appears to be an attempt to place blame on behavior onto some other object.
10 -
I am starting to wonder if there is a language barrier with certain posters. I am not trying to be funny. It would explain why some posts just make no sense to me...
My posts are for MFP readers that come here for science behind today's health and wellness yet never post. Since most are not into being the mole in a game of Whack The Mole it is a role that works well for me. I know who I am and my intent so taking a whacking for others is the least I can do for others that are seriously looking for better health and fitness for themselves, family and others without all of the dieting myths of yesterday year.
I grew up on a farm in the 50-60's two miles from where I live today and socially was always an underdog because I was not in the click crowd because I was a dirt poor farm boy with no cash or car. After high school I joined the Navy to See The World. That was when I realized I had been taught by my area "If It Is Different It Is BAD".
To change that mindset after the Navy I picked up two undergrad degrees (that many posters over the years know because the factual info in my MFP profile leads one to my LinkedIn account) before earning my OD degree. I started reading medical research back in 1976 about Ankylosing and have added other diseases for family reasons.
As you know I am 68 years old with 45 years of serious health issues relating to Ankylosing Spondylitis and earned an doctor of Optometry in 1986 from SCO in Memphis TN.
MFP and friends here have helped me greatly. For the those that actually post on MFP on the side of science I enjoy reading their posts. Over the last 5 years I and most other readers now know who is into the promoting eating science in the field of health and fitness and who are not.
Websites like this one needs content from the pioneers of health and fitness scientific research not a lot of personal opinions from mystical web characters with unknow backgrounds and education.
I would encourage others to stand up for science when it comes to health and wellness. Sure what is known today will be replaced with better data points and outcomes over time. That is a given in life.
For those who love to control the hammer I guess you have to do what you have to do but please think of others especially the owners of MFP when making tracks on this site instead of treating it as personal playhouse of a few while the resource is still in place.
Go for great content and it will attract other great content to this site.25 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »I am starting to wonder if there is a language barrier with certain posters. I am not trying to be funny. It would explain why some posts just make no sense to me...
My posts are for MFP readers that come here for science behind today's health and wellness yet never post. Since most are not into being the mole in a game of Whack The Mole it is a role that works well for me. I know who I am and my intent so taking a whacking for others is the least I can do for others that are seriously looking for better health and fitness for themselves, family and others without all of the dieting myths of yesterday year.
I grew up on a farm in the 50-60's two miles from where I live today and socially was always an underdog because I was not in the click crowd because I was a dirt poor farm boy with no cash or car. After high school I joined the Navy to See The World. That was when I realized I had been taught by my area "If It Is Different It Is BAD".
To change that mindset after the Navy I picked up two undergrad degrees (that many posters over the years know because the factual info in my MFP profile leads one to my LinkedIn account) before earning my OD degree. I started reading medical research back in 1976 about Ankylosing and have added other diseases for family reasons.
As you know I am 68 years old with 45 years of serious health issues relating to Ankylosing Spondylitis and earned an doctor of Optometry in 1986 from SCO in Memphis TN.
MFP and friends here have helped me greatly. For the those that actually post on MFP on the side of science I enjoy reading their posts. Over the last 5 years I and most other readers now know who is into the promoting eating science in the field of health and fitness and who are not.
Websites like this one needs content from the pioneers of health and fitness scientific research not a lot of personal opinions from mystical web characters with unknow backgrounds and education.
I would encourage others to stand up for science when it comes to health and wellness. Sure what is known today will be replaced with better data points and outcomes over time. That is a given in life.
For those who love to control the hammer I guess you have to do what you have to do but please think of others especially the owners of MFP when making tracks on this site instead of treating it as personal playhouse of a few while the resource is still in place.
Go for great content and it will attract other great content to this site.
And yet, far from encouraging people to stand up for science, you consistently argue with them when they do.
I’m with J72FIT - there’s clearly a language barrier. Specifically, you don’t seem to understand the word ‘science’.19 -
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Metformin Alters Microbiota, Improving Insulin Sensitivity
https://endocrineweb.com/professional/type-2-diabetes/metformin-alters-microbiota-improving-insulin-sensitivity
"The use of metformin in people with diabetes appears to favorably alter their gut microbiome, resulting in an improved glucose metabolism. The primary effect of metformin aims to stimulate levels of certain bacteria to enrich the microbiota milieu,1according to a team of researchers including the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, MD.
"In particular, my colleagues and I found that mucin-degrading Akkermansia muciniphila and several butyrate-producing bacteria were positively associated with metformin use," said study researc
her Juan S. Escobar, PhD, of the Vidarium Research Center in Medellin, Colombia. These results echo findings from an earlier study.2...."
The Gut Microbiome as a Target for the Treatment of Type 2 Diabetes
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6013535/
Summary
The intestinal microbiota is known to be associated with metabolic syndrome and related comorbidities. Associated diseases including obesity, T2D, and fatty liver disease (NAFLD/NASH) all seem to be linked to altered microbial composition; however, causality has not been proven yet. Elucidating the potential causal and personalized role of the human gut microbiota in obesity and T2D is highly prioritized.
The human gut microbiome and body metabolism: implications for obesity and diabetes.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23401286
CONCLUSION:
Advances in the Human Microbiome Project and human metagenomics research will lead the way toward a greater understanding of the importance and role of the gut microbiome in metabolic disorders such as obesity, metabolic syndrome, and diabetes.
© 2013 American Association for Clinical Chemistry
8 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »Metformin Alters Microbiota, Improving Insulin Sensitivity
https://endocrineweb.com/professional/type-2-diabetes/metformin-alters-microbiota-improving-insulin-sensitivity
"The use of metformin in people with diabetes appears to favorably alter their gut microbiome, resulting in an improved glucose metabolism. The primary effect of metformin aims to stimulate levels of certain bacteria to enrich the microbiota milieu,1according to a team of researchers including the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, MD.
"In particular, my colleagues and I found that mucin-degrading Akkermansia muciniphila and several butyrate-producing bacteria were positively associated with metformin use," said study researc
her Juan S. Escobar, PhD, of the Vidarium Research Center in Medellin, Colombia. These results echo findings from an earlier study.2...."
The Gut Microbiome as a Target for the Treatment of Type 2 Diabetes
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6013535/
Summary
The intestinal microbiota is known to be associated with metabolic syndrome and related comorbidities. Associated diseases including obesity, T2D, and fatty liver disease (NAFLD/NASH) all seem to be linked to altered microbial composition; however, causality has not been proven yet. Elucidating the potential causal and personalized role of the human gut microbiota in obesity and T2D is highly prioritized.
The human gut microbiome and body metabolism: implications for obesity and diabetes.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23401286
CONCLUSION:
Advances in the Human Microbiome Project and human metagenomics research will lead the way toward a greater understanding of the importance and role of the gut microbiome in metabolic disorders such as obesity, metabolic syndrome, and diabetes.
© 2013 American Association for Clinical Chemistry
From the article...
"More research is needed, both Dr. Apovian and Dr. Escobar agree. Physicians aren’t to the point where they are testing patient's stools routinely to assess individual gut bacteria, said Dr. Apovian. However, the study findings do suggest that metformin should be used more broadly than just for people with diabetes, she said.
Dr. Escobar’s lab aims to examine how to restore balance in the gut microbiota to prevent disease onset. However, he also championed the prospect of its use for those who already have a disease.
"For those already sick, our results can inform novel ways in which therapies could potentially be used to treat an assortment of gut microbiota-associated diseases, including type 2 diabetes."
Future research must also determine if the observed associations are causal, Dr. Escobar said, and of course, that would necessitate a randomized controlled trial..."14 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »Metformin Alters Microbiota, Improving Insulin Sensitivity
https://endocrineweb.com/professional/type-2-diabetes/metformin-alters-microbiota-improving-insulin-sensitivity
"The use of metformin in people with diabetes appears to favorably alter their gut microbiome, resulting in an improved glucose metabolism. The primary effect of metformin aims to stimulate levels of certain bacteria to enrich the microbiota milieu,1according to a team of researchers including the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, MD.
"In particular, my colleagues and I found that mucin-degrading Akkermansia muciniphila and several butyrate-producing bacteria were positively associated with metformin use," said study researc
her Juan S. Escobar, PhD, of the Vidarium Research Center in Medellin, Colombia. These results echo findings from an earlier study.2...."
The Gut Microbiome as a Target for the Treatment of Type 2 Diabetes
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6013535/
Summary
The intestinal microbiota is known to be associated with metabolic syndrome and related comorbidities. Associated diseases including obesity, T2D, and fatty liver disease (NAFLD/NASH) all seem to be linked to altered microbial composition; however, causality has not been proven yet. Elucidating the potential causal and personalized role of the human gut microbiota in obesity and T2D is highly prioritized.
The human gut microbiome and body metabolism: implications for obesity and diabetes.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23401286
CONCLUSION:
Advances in the Human Microbiome Project and human metagenomics research will lead the way toward a greater understanding of the importance and role of the gut microbiome in metabolic disorders such as obesity, metabolic syndrome, and diabetes.
© 2013 American Association for Clinical Chemistry
From the article...
"More research is needed, both Dr. Apovian and Dr. Escobar agree. Physicians aren’t to the point where they are testing patient's stools routinely to assess individual gut bacteria, said Dr. Apovian. However, the study findings do suggest that metformin should be used more broadly than just for people with diabetes, she said.
Dr. Escobar’s lab aims to examine how to restore balance in the gut microbiota to prevent disease onset. However, he also championed the prospect of its use for those who already have a disease.
"For those already sick, our results can inform novel ways in which therapies could potentially be used to treat an assortment of gut microbiota-associated diseases, including type 2 diabetes."
Future research must also determine if the observed associations are causal, Dr. Escobar said, and of course, that would necessitate a randomized controlled trial..."
That lines up with the doctors statements in the Times article I posted, and quite frankly most of everything else I've seen. It's too early to make bold claims, which is not the same as "against microbiome research - but OP is non responsive to any discussion pertaining to exactly what the medical community knows, people who may be profiting off of another goldmine nugget of info in the health field and which sources are legitimate or not.
I thought this was the Debate forum, where ideas are exchanged, defended and/or debunked?14 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »Metformin Alters Microbiota, Improving Insulin Sensitivity
https://endocrineweb.com/professional/type-2-diabetes/metformin-alters-microbiota-improving-insulin-sensitivity
"The use of metformin in people with diabetes appears to favorably alter their gut microbiome, resulting in an improved glucose metabolism. The primary effect of metformin aims to stimulate levels of certain bacteria to enrich the microbiota milieu,1according to a team of researchers including the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, MD.
"In particular, my colleagues and I found that mucin-degrading Akkermansia muciniphila and several butyrate-producing bacteria were positively associated with metformin use," said study researc
her Juan S. Escobar, PhD, of the Vidarium Research Center in Medellin, Colombia. These results echo findings from an earlier study.2...."
The Gut Microbiome as a Target for the Treatment of Type 2 Diabetes
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6013535/
Summary
The intestinal microbiota is known to be associated with metabolic syndrome and related comorbidities. Associated diseases including obesity, T2D, and fatty liver disease (NAFLD/NASH) all seem to be linked to altered microbial composition; however, causality has not been proven yet. Elucidating the potential causal and personalized role of the human gut microbiota in obesity and T2D is highly prioritized.
The human gut microbiome and body metabolism: implications for obesity and diabetes.
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23401286
CONCLUSION:
Advances in the Human Microbiome Project and human metagenomics research will lead the way toward a greater understanding of the importance and role of the gut microbiome in metabolic disorders such as obesity, metabolic syndrome, and diabetes.
© 2013 American Association for Clinical Chemistry
From the article...
"More research is needed, both Dr. Apovian and Dr. Escobar agree. Physicians aren’t to the point where they are testing patient's stools routinely to assess individual gut bacteria, said Dr. Apovian. However, the study findings do suggest that metformin should be used more broadly than just for people with diabetes, she said.
Dr. Escobar’s lab aims to examine how to restore balance in the gut microbiota to prevent disease onset. However, he also championed the prospect of its use for those who already have a disease.
"For those already sick, our results can inform novel ways in which therapies could potentially be used to treat an assortment of gut microbiota-associated diseases, including type 2 diabetes."
Future research must also determine if the observed associations are causal, Dr. Escobar said, and of course, that would necessitate a randomized controlled trial..."
That lines up with the doctors statements in the Times article I posted, and quite frankly most of everything else I've seen. It's too early to make bold claims, which is not the same as "against microbiome research - but OP is non responsive to any discussion pertaining to exactly what the medical community knows, people who may be profiting off of another goldmine nugget of info in the health field and which sources are legitimate or not.
I thought this was the Debate forum, where ideas are exchanged, defended and/or debunked?
And of course, none of this is meant to say that the topic is not of great interest.6
This discussion has been closed.
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