Coronavirus prep
Replies
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So where I live in Wisconsin, the local public health department has been issuing regular updates and urging sensible supply prep like we would do for a big snowstorm. I haven't noticed anything besides hand sanitizer being bought out at the store. Over the last couple of weeks I have been sure to keep "one ahead" on the staples - usually as spring approaches we just eat our way through the pantry. I appreciate peoples' good humor and even-keel approach to this.4
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At this point, no one has all of the answers. No one can make prognostications about the weather or what kind of weather this thing likes or dislikes. It's brand new but hopefully we'll be much smarter when the next pathogen shows up.
https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/as-coronavirus-spreads-many-questions-and-some-answers-2020022719004#q5
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@moonangel12
How are your kids doing? Did they agree to test them?
I hope they are on the mend. :flowerforyou:0 -
I went to a party last night. Everyone was avoiding shaking hands or cheek kisses doing friendly waves instead. It was kinda good. Also before grabbing pizza people were washing hands. It was great.
I r.e.a.l.l.y. hope this starts to end all the touching between people in general.
Enough with your hugging, virtual strangers. Ick and ugh.16 -
Anyway, I legit needed toilet paper, so I grabbed some at Walmart (no shortage here BTW). But I felt like I wanted to tell everyone I walked past " I'm not hoarding it! I just ran out of toilet paper. Look, I'm getting eyeliner and a pint of Ben & Jerry's I'm going to eat right when I get home."
I need to get groceries today, and I thought I would get a little extra TP to have a couple weeks' supply on hand, because we do have a family member with a high-risk condition. I am already feeling self-conscious and wanting to explain myself to people! I don't anticipate a shortage where I am.
Now you've got me wondering if there are people out there hoarding beauty supplies. 2 -
WinoGelato wrote: »snickerscharlie wrote: »Lillymoo01 wrote: »I'm a doctor and an Infectious Diseases Specialist. I've been at this for more than 20 years seeing sick patients on a daily basis. I have worked in inner city hospitals and in the poorest slums of Africa. HIV-AIDS, Hepatitis,TB, SARS, Measles, Shingles, Whooping cough, Diphtheria...there is little I haven't been exposed to in my profession. And with notable exception of SARS, very little has left me feeling vulnerable, overwhelmed or downright scared.
I am not scared of Covid-19. I am concerned about the implications of a novel infectious agent that has spread the world over and continues to find new footholds in different soil. I am rightly concerned for the welfare of those who are elderly, in frail health or disenfranchised who stand to suffer mostly, and disproportionately, at the hands of this new scourge. But I am not scared of Covid-19.
What I am scared about is the loss of reason and wave of fear that has induced the masses of society into a spellbinding spiral of panic, stockpiling obscene quantities of anything that could fill a bomb shelter adequately in a post-apocalyptic world. I am scared of the N95 masks that are stolen from hospitals and urgent care clinics where they are actually needed for front line healthcare providers and instead are being donned in airports, malls, and coffee lounges, perpetuating even more fear and suspicion of others. I am scared that our hospitals will be overwhelmed with anyone who thinks they " probably don't have it but may as well get checked out no matter what because you just never know..." and those with heart failure, emphysema, pneumonia and strokes will pay the price for overfilled ER waiting rooms with only so many doctors and nurses to assess.
I am scared that travel restrictions will become so far reaching that weddings will be canceled, graduations missed and family reunions will not materialize. And well, even that big party called the Olympic Games...that could be kyboshed too. Can you even
imagine?
I'm scared those same epidemic fears will limit trade, harm partnerships in multiple sectors, business and otherwise and ultimately culminate in a global recession.
But mostly, I'm scared about what message we are telling our kids when faced with a threat. Instead of reason, rationality, openmindedness and altruism, we are telling them to panic, be fearful, suspicious, reactionary and self-interested.
Covid-19 is nowhere near over. It will be coming to a city, a hospital, a friend, even a family member near you at some point. Expect it. Stop waiting to be surprised further. The fact is the virus itself will not likely do much harm when it arrives. But our own behaviors and "fight for yourself above all else" attitude could prove disastrous.
I implore you all. Temper fear with reason, panic with patience and uncertainty with education. We have an opportunity to learn a great deal about health hygiene and limiting the spread of innumerable transmissible diseases in our society. Let's meet this challenge together in the best spirit of compassion for others, patience, and above all, an unfailing effort to seek truth, facts and knowledge as opposed to conjecture, speculation and catastrophizing.
Facts not fear. Clean hands. Open hearts.
Our children will thank us for it.
https://www.facebook.com/abdu.sharkawy/posts/2809958409125474?__tn__=,dH-R-R&eid=ARBOWPj71gA1ObjfZlXOXyWThC52Mt6U38slWK3w0VkylOu5m39gyZVqWSJaqVPpIimUaGEaEddG7DxN
I can't like this post enough. Thanks!
Agreed, thanks @Lillymoo01 for your insightful, thought provoking and logic grounding words.
I would love to share some of them on other social media channels as I think your advice could really resonate with a lot of people but obviously would share it as “quoted from a doctor specializing in infectious diseases on another social media forum” but would only do so with your blessing.
These aren't my words. If you open the link the source is there.1 -
lightenup2016 wrote: »So I’m not into extreme fear mongering, but I do think it’s a serious situation, particularly for a subset of the population (so far). To say that this virus could just come through our country and not have much effect (as a PP upthread insinuated) I think is pretty disrespectful of that more at-risk, older, or compromised population. We’ve “only” had 15 or so deaths in the US due to it, but most of those were older people with underlying conditions. Should we not be concerned at least for them?
I agree with this. I don't see a lot of panic around me (and the hoarding seems mostly to be revealed in a lack of hand sanitizer, as I said). I also don't go on FB or other social media where I'd see it, probably. (My social media has been way more dominated by the Dem primaries, which is annoying in a different way.)
We did have our governor do an update that I thought was fine -- it was about common sense things and testing. The biggest thing that's been happening that some might call "panic" is the cancelling of some huge events (a few conventions here, which isn't ideal for the local economy, things like ComicCon and SXSW, the latter of which is probably not good news for Austin's economy). Also, limiting work travel at a lot of places. However, I don't see that as a negative thing -- one thing that's been pointed out is that because it's going to be mild for lots of healthy people, they may not know they have it at all, and it's contagious before any symptoms anyway, I think. So you run a risk of more getting infected than need to, which is bad for those in higher risk groups.
Maybe those who think panic is a serious problem are seeing different things than I am or perhaps merely meaning to try to head off future panic. On the whole I've found the discussion on this thread quite level-headed, for example.6 -
I would actually think people would be going through less hand sanitizer, if they are staying home more and avoiding public events?1
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One other thing I don’t think we’ve touched on much in this thread is the economic impact this will have, particularly on small business owners reliant on travel and tourism directly and indirectly.
A colleague shared the story of the shoe shine guy at the airport hawking the corona special - buy one foot shine get the other for free. She stopped and asked how it was going and he said if things don’t turn around soon he will be forced to pack up.
Another colleague in Milan shared concerns that all the cafes and shops are closed - Italy relies almost exclusively on tourism.10 -
WinoGelato wrote: »One other thing I don’t think we’ve touched on much in this thread is the economic impact this will have, particularly on small business owners reliant on travel and tourism directly and indirectly.
A colleague shared the story of the shoe shine guy at the airport hawking the corona special - buy one foot shine get the other for free. She stopped and asked how it was going and he said if things don’t turn around soon he will be forced to pack up.
Another colleague in Milan shared concerns that all the cafes and shops are closed - Italy relies almost exclusively on tourism.
Was on the news yesterday.. some tourist spots are like ghost town.. hell .. they even show a modeling show in milan.. girls walking on catwalks and no guest..2 -
It's time to adapt. I live in a place where tourism is the main trough that feeds everyone. It's the cash cow that gouges everyone during the peak tourism months. It's time to adapt and go back to the well. Start producing more goods that everyone wants and quit depending on everyone else for everything. Our farmers and ranchers feed this nation but quickly those ranches are being turned into celebrity homes and dude ranches for tourism. Without farmers and ranchers everything must be sourced out of the country. Time to go back to the well and take care of business. History does repeat itself.4
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Amazon and Starbucks and Microsoft all have reported verified cases within their employee base - and in the case of Amazon the employees have been urged to stay away from the city and work from home.
The news here in Seattle had stories of restaurants being empty, hair salons having no customers and it's pretty much a ghost town all over the place here in the Seattle area.3 -
WinoGelato wrote: »One other thing I don’t think we’ve touched on much in this thread is the economic impact this will have, particularly on small business owners reliant on travel and tourism directly and indirectly.
Yes, good point.A colleague shared the story of the shoe shine guy at the airport hawking the corona special - buy one foot shine get the other for free. She stopped and asked how it was going and he said if things don’t turn around soon he will be forced to pack up.
I heard that someone was selling homemade hand sanitizer on a ferry in (near?) Seattle and making big bucks. Maybe he should adapt his business.0 -
I came across this by accident. Perhaps the WHO link has already been shared in the thread, but I didn't realize the breadth of information shared there.
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/coping-with-stress.pdf?sfvrsn=9845bc3a_2
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/helping-children-cope-with-stress-print.pdf?sfvrsn=f3a063ff_26 -
So where I live in Wisconsin, the local public health department has been issuing regular updates and urging sensible supply prep like we would do for a big snowstorm. I haven't noticed anything besides hand sanitizer being bought out at the store. Over the last couple of weeks I have been sure to keep "one ahead" on the staples - usually as spring approaches we just eat our way through the pantry. I appreciate peoples' good humor and even-keel approach to this.
Another 'Sconnie here. Don't know if you live in another part of the state from me but I am seeing the same thing. No stockpiling of anything except hand sanitizer. Those that ARE prepping are pretty much snowstorm prepping which means throwing one extra pack of TP in the cart.
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snickerscharlie wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »DecadeDuchess wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »DecadeDuchess wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »DecadeDuchess wrote: »While the main panic concerning daily necessities're customers, where I am via business & government here, causes it as well. Prior to the Blizzard of 1996, I took the bus to school whilst it was snowing. There were no delayed openings, ½ days, early release or snow days.
After we were coddled by many snow less winters, shovels & sleds, weren't sold here. Now I know better than to take the bus anywhere, unless I know that I'll be able to walk home because they'll cancel the buses & our government, orders vehicles off of the roads because of just a dusting, of snow.
Just out of curiosity, is the use of the apostrophe intentional here? necessities're
If so, what English word are you contracting with necesseties?
Yeah it's intentional, necessities're = necessities are. It's a habit to combine & shorten words because of low character limits elsewhere.
It makes your posts very difficult to read/understand.
I was going along the lines of how other words do, that everyone seems to be able to read & understand. They're = they are or I've = I have.
I can understand your posts, but only with a lot of extra effort. Since there is no character limit here, would you be willing to use only standard contractions?
I just skip over posts like that which are too difficult to read. I do make the effort for someone for whom it's apparent that English is their second language, but when it's done deliberately? Nope.
Yes, I work with a lot of people who speak English as a second language. I help them with theirs; they help me with my pathetic Spanish and barely-remember French. We all make efforts to get it right.10 -
cmriverside wrote: »DecadeDuchess wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »DD I don't particularly conform to grammar rules, at least I don't make any conscious effort to do so.
But I would consider adjusting my writing style if it were causing confusion and people politely informed me of this.
I did my regular grocery shopping today, as I do every Saturday.
As far as I could tell, everything else was available as usual, at least there were no huge gaps in the aisles.
Hand sanitiser doesn't take much space, I believe it is sold out, but I didn't notice.
But entire aisle totally bereft of toilet paper in every supermarket in a town with zero cases of coronavirus.
And, yes, a locally made product, it isn't imported from China or anything.
Just bizarre.
No 1 pleases everyone, thereby my posts're meant for those that don't mind them as they're.
You saved exactly four characters here.
I'm just avoiding your posts.
"Ignore" is a great feature. This is the second time I have used it in my 6 years on MFP. Neither of which is because I disagree with the content of the posts.6 -
I was watching Downton Abbey last night. I'm at the part that takes place during the Spanish Flu. After a funeral for someone who died from this, a man shared his handkerchief with a woman. Ay yi yi yi.4
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Biggiwig69 wrote: »
I'm wondering why is everyone stockpiling toilet paper?!?! That is selling out as quick as water around here!
Funny, I work at Wegmans (East Coast). Toilet paper is flying off the shelves. What are people doing with this? It‘s ridiculous. And then these facial mask shoppers.... ong! I feel like I am in the middle of a science fiction movie 😀
Have you seen anyone wearing a mask? I've seen one -- a bus driver. I actually saw more before this virus in that I live close to a neighborhood with a significant Asian population and it's not uncommon for Asians to wear them IME (my understanding is that the point is to protect others if you happen to have a cold or something).
I've seen two mask wearers so far - one at Walmart and one crossing the street.
The epidemiology guy I mentioned earlier said well people should not wear them for several reasons, including that to do any good, people need to be trained in proper donning and doffing procedures, and to save them for the people who actually need them.2 -
So where I live in Wisconsin, the local public health department has been issuing regular updates and urging sensible supply prep like we would do for a big snowstorm. I haven't noticed anything besides hand sanitizer being bought out at the store. Over the last couple of weeks I have been sure to keep "one ahead" on the staples - usually as spring approaches we just eat our way through the pantry. I appreciate peoples' good humor and even-keel approach to this.
Another 'Sconnie here. Don't know if you live in another part of the state from me but I am seeing the same thing. No stockpiling of anything except hand sanitizer. Those that ARE prepping are pretty much snowstorm prepping which means throwing one extra pack of TP in the cart.
I’m in Minnesota. It’s funny, I’ve lived here all my life and I’ve never noticed anyone buying things up before a forecasted snow storm until this year when I happened to be shopping on a Friday afternoon before an expected snowstorm. Everyone must have been planning a Netflix binge weekend. Went shopping this morning. They had sanitizer and TP in normal quantities, and the shelves were all full.2 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Biggiwig69 wrote: »
I'm wondering why is everyone stockpiling toilet paper?!?! That is selling out as quick as water around here!
Funny, I work at Wegmans (East Coast). Toilet paper is flying off the shelves. What are people doing with this? It‘s ridiculous. And then these facial mask shoppers.... ong! I feel like I am in the middle of a science fiction movie 😀
Have you seen anyone wearing a mask? I've seen one -- a bus driver. I actually saw more before this virus in that I live close to a neighborhood with a significant Asian population and it's not uncommon for Asians to wear them IME (my understanding is that the point is to protect others if you happen to have a cold or something).
I've seen two mask wearers so far - one at Walmart and one crossing the street.
The epidemiology guy I mentioned earlier said well people should not wear them for several reasons, including that to do any good, people need to be trained in proper donning and doffing procedures, and to save them for the people who actually need them.
I have a couple of fabric masks that I use when making some of my personal care products, mostly because a couple of ingredients are really fine powder and a couple need to be heated and the steam shouldn't be breathed in. If masks become a fashion statement I am all set with my mint green one with bunnies.4 -
kshama2001 wrote: »As far as preparing, I'm am stocking up on food sufficient for a couple weeks. Just enough in case there were a requirement to self-quarantine at home for a period of time. Not hording anything, but putting a couple extra packs of chicken and fish and frozen vegetables in the freezer, as well as the typical staples eggs, rice, bread, that keep well. There hasn't been any confirmed cases in my area yet, but I don't want to be behind the curve in case people get stupid once a few are reported.
I just listened to Radio Boston with guest Dr. Leonard Marcus, founding Co-Director of the National Preparedness Leadership Initiative, a collaborative effort of HSPH and the Kennedy School of Government, developed in collaboration with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the White House, and the Department of Homeland Security, and the Department of Defense.
At the end of the show when asked to pass along one key message, he said, "The key message is: Get prepared to be quarantined... what would you do? Have the procedures, have the food, go through the drill with your friends and family.
Host: And that means food and medications, right?
Lenny: All of your essentials. ...imagine that you will be out of the loop for two weeks and prepare yourself for that eventuality.
@NewLIFEstyle4ME I see nothing unreasonable or fear-mongering about having a two week supply of stuff on hand.
I was woefully unprepared for the hurricane season of 2005. We weren't much affected by Katrina, but Rita and Wilma were quite consequential to south Florida. Fortunately, some neighbors were better prepared, and we pooled resources.
My mother lives in a pine forest, and often loses power in the winter when there is heavy snow, or other times when there are strong winds, and since her location is sparsely populated, it takes a long time to restore power, so she prepares for this. (Without panicking.)
Coronavirus prep is different than hurricane prep, for example, I have no expectation of loss of power, but I think it's best to be prepared.7 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Biggiwig69 wrote: »
I'm wondering why is everyone stockpiling toilet paper?!?! That is selling out as quick as water around here!
Funny, I work at Wegmans (East Coast). Toilet paper is flying off the shelves. What are people doing with this? It‘s ridiculous. And then these facial mask shoppers.... ong! I feel like I am in the middle of a science fiction movie 😀
Have you seen anyone wearing a mask? I've seen one -- a bus driver. I actually saw more before this virus in that I live close to a neighborhood with a significant Asian population and it's not uncommon for Asians to wear them IME (my understanding is that the point is to protect others if you happen to have a cold or something).
I've seen two mask wearers so far - one at Walmart and one crossing the street.
The epidemiology guy I mentioned earlier said well people should not wear them for several reasons, including that to do any good, people need to be trained in proper donning and doffing procedures, and to save them for the people who actually need them.
I have a couple of fabric masks that I use when making some of my personal care products, mostly because a couple of ingredients are really fine powder and a couple need to be heated and the steam shouldn't be breathed in. If masks become a fashion statement I am all set with my mint green one with bunnies.
Ha, I was researching how to make them at home...looks easy, but still a lot of fiddly work. I may pick up some thin elastic just for something fun to do.1 -
Biggiwig69 wrote: »
I'm wondering why is everyone stockpiling toilet paper?!?! That is selling out as quick as water around here!
Funny, I work at Wegmans (East Coast). Toilet paper is flying off the shelves. What are people doing with this? It‘s ridiculous. And then these facial mask shoppers.... ong! I feel like I am in the middle of a science fiction movie 😀
Have you seen anyone wearing a mask? I've seen one -- a bus driver. I actually saw more before this virus in that I live close to a neighborhood with a significant Asian population and it's not uncommon for Asians to wear them IME (my understanding is that the point is to protect others if you happen to have a cold or something).
I see people in masks every once in a while, COVID-19 alarm or not. (I'm not counting the masks in doctors' waiting rooms that have a "Sneezing/sniffles? Wear a mask." or similar sign, but I've of course seen some there.)
I live in a moderate-sized metro area with a large research university that has a signficant international-student population. Like you, I gather that mask-wearing is more common in certain Asian countries, and it's usually young Asian people whom I see wearing masks here. It's not a daily thing (I don't usually go on campus; may be daily there). Maybe once a month I see one? Most recent was - I think - in the parking lot at Whole Foods sometime in about the past week.
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DancingMoosie wrote: »We just got some extra dry beans, rice, and gallon jugs of water. We aren't really afraid of the virus, but more of the panicked shoppers that might clear the shelves, lol.
I don’t get the stocking up in water for most folks. Since when does a potential quarantine come with a utility shut off?
I live in a rural area and we have a private company for our water supply that isn't always reliable. Having extra water isn't going to hurt anyone, especially if we wake up to the water being off or coming in off-color.1 -
. meh. don't want the aggravation of defending that post...
Edit/.delete3 -
One of the things that's interesting to me, in something like this, is the extent to which it exposes fragilities in our global interconnectedness.
Before I go on: I'm not an isolationist. I mostly think global interconnection is a good thing (very nuanced, but don't want to digress).
I think we're quite new to this degree of interconnectedness - complex supply chains, international travel and personal/family mobility and geographic distribution, daily tightness of connection between different arms of international corporations, primary sourcing of raw materials and labor in certain constrained areas for economic reasons, etc. It's not totally new, of course, but there's been tremendous increase over my lifespan.
New systems have unanticipated fragilities, and certain non-routine events stress those systems, and highlight the fragilities.
IMO, there's a sense in which "national security" or "regional security" (or whatever geographic bound) involves evaluating and planning for events that can disrupt access to basic needs (for a fairly broad, modern definition of basic needs). I'm not referring just to disease management here, but to any potential weak links that can lead to disruption in essential systems we rely upon. Epidemics are just one potential system stressor.
I'll give an example, related to COVID-19. We now have a shortage of medical masks in the US. China, which is a (maybe the) major global source under normal circumstances, is keeping all they manufacture now. According to a recent news report I heard, the US has one manufacturer. For them to ramp up production beyond current "pull out all the stops" levels, they'd need to invest in new machinery, would take many months to arrive (and might also be constrained by supply-chain problems), and be very costly. Most of the time, when no epidemic, that capacity would go unused.
In some past scares, similar manufacturers have ramped up production to serve immediate needs, and ended up in significant financial distress when the boom was over, needing layoffs of more than their temporary staff increase and other broad negative consequences. They can't gear up for peak needs and stay there, while maintaining a globally cost-competitive business. Excess capacity has a cost.
The US manufacturer who was intereviewed had been trying to raise an alarm about this kind of scenario, after some of the past supply stresses, and seeking some strategic collaboration to reach a more robust state. Once the immediate crises end, interest from others wanes. The systemic fragility continues.
What we'd like, I think, is some strategic attention as things like the COVID-19 scenario (and panic) ensue, with a view to identifying and mitigating systemic weaknesses that the systemic stressor reveals. I think that to some extent, this does happen over time, but it becomes more difficult as complexity increases, and especially as rate of change increases. Risk management has difficulty keeping up with quickly-evolving, increasingly complex systems. At the same time, the populace becomes more dependent on those systems (less able to be individually self-sufficient in various ways).
I don't have any brilliant insights about this, but have been thinking a bit about this, recently: How black-swan events highlight systemic fragilities, and how we collectively respond to that (if we do).12 -
Anyway, I legit needed toilet paper, so I grabbed some at Walmart (no shortage here BTW). But I felt like I wanted to tell everyone I walked past " I'm not hoarding it! I just ran out of toilet paper. Look, I'm getting eyeliner and a pint of Ben & Jerry's I'm going to eat right when I get home."
I'm finally buying it today because I need it too, and plan to get some extra because it's nice to have plenty around the house to avoid having to ever be low on it, and similarly I am afraid it will look like hoarding. Oh, well. ;-)
I'll only stock up when my favourite brand goes on sale. I find things like toilet paper are ridiculously expensive otherwise. Even before this poop show happened.
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cmriverside wrote: ». meh. don't want the aggravation of defending that post...
Edit/.delete
Managing my own brain is often the most crucial part of handling any situation. And the most difficult. 5 -
cmriverside wrote: »DecadeDuchess wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »DD I don't particularly conform to grammar rules, at least I don't make any conscious effort to do so.
But I would consider adjusting my writing style if it were causing confusion and people politely informed me of this.
I did my regular grocery shopping today, as I do every Saturday.
As far as I could tell, everything else was available as usual, at least there were no huge gaps in the aisles.
Hand sanitiser doesn't take much space, I believe it is sold out, but I didn't notice.
But entire aisle totally bereft of toilet paper in every supermarket in a town with zero cases of coronavirus.
And, yes, a locally made product, it isn't imported from China or anything.
Just bizarre.
No 1 pleases everyone, thereby my posts're meant for those that don't mind them as they're.
You saved exactly four characters here.
I'm just avoiding your posts.
"Ignore" is a great feature. This is the second time I have used it in my 6 years on MFP. Neither of which is because I disagree with the content of the posts.
That only works if no one quotes them, though. Because if they do, you get to see the posts anyways. 6
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