Coronavirus prep

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  • SuzySunshine99
    SuzySunshine99 Posts: 2,989 Member
    MikePfirrman wrote: »
    What does everyone think about the J&J results? If you haven't heard, it's not nearly as effective as Moderna or the Pfizer (both 95%). It's like 67% effective, but keeps 85% from being severe and out of the hospital.

    My two cents. I'd take it and wait on Moderna or Pfizer being more widely available. I think they also said the the J&J is only like 50% effective against the S Africa strain.

    I had read that they are going to do a trial to see if a second dose of the J&J might boost its effectiveness closer to the level of the other two. Everyone was excited about the J&J vaccine, because they had been saying only one dose was needed. That might not end up being the case.
  • RetiredAndLovingIt
    RetiredAndLovingIt Posts: 1,395 Member
    @spiriteagle99 Thanks.. I couldn’t remember which one.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
    lokihen wrote: »
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    FWIW, just for consideration:

    Report on NPR station a little while ago (didn't notice whether it was national or state level) says double masking is now a good idea, partly because of the new variants that are more highly contagious. The expert ** they were interviewing suggested a disposable filter-type mask next to the face because of better filtration, cloth mask over that to add layers but especially to keep fit to the face better (fewer, smaller gaps).

    ** I didn't catch the intro; could've been anything from a science journalist regurgitating info to a high-level epidemiologist/doctor. Don't know, sorry. 😐🤷‍♀️

    Other comments: N95 should still be primarily reserved for health care workers & similar. KN95 are fairly available, but lots of substandard/fake ones on the market (said CDC website has a list of reliable brands). Interviewee said she wouldn't worry about double mask for (say) walking the dog, but a good idea for places like grocery stores

    Curious about the bolded because I've heard that many times in the last year, but the hospital I worked at only used surgical masks or PPAP hoods. I've even heard anecdotal stories that hospitals didn't allow nurses to bring in their own higher quality masks.

    my understanding is that in the mask hierarchy it goes like this:
    1. N95 mask - Filters out 95% of particles, most effective.
    2. Surgical Mask - filters out about 50% of particles
    3. Cloth Masks - filters out like 10% of particles and is basically worthless...

    I am slightly generalizing on the percent's in point 2 and 3..but I can probably dig up the article/study that I read it in.
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 34,234 Member
    SuzySunshine99 wrote: »
    MikePfirrman wrote: »
    What does everyone think about the J&J results? If you haven't heard, it's not nearly as effective as Moderna or the Pfizer (both 95%). It's like 67% effective, but keeps 85% from being severe and out of the hospital.

    My two cents. I'd take it and wait on Moderna or Pfizer being more widely available. I think they also said the the J&J is only like 50% effective against the S Africa strain.

    I had read that they are going to do a trial to see if a second dose of the J&J might boost its effectiveness closer to the level of the other two. Everyone was excited about the J&J vaccine, because they had been saying only one dose was needed. That might not end up being the case.

    Besides the one-dose thing, I'd heard that another plus of the J&J vaccine is that it doesn't have the extreme cold storage requirement.

    Even at the lower efficacy number, with a one-shot regimen, it would seem like the J&J has the potential to be very useful in an overall global sense. It can potentially be delivered effectively to areas with less infrastructure, and used in populations for which it's much more difficult to reliably carry out a 2-shot, time-sensitive regimen.

    What I'd heard is that it's *very* effective in reducing the cases that require hospitalization (to zero or near), which, if true, would be a pretty big deal to recipients, especially if the comparison is waiting longer for a 2-shot, difficult-storage, yet more effective alternative to arrive, in particular areas. Realistically, that difference - not needing hospitalization - seems like it could reduce death risk in remote areas or underserved populations.

    *IF* all of that is true, I do see the potential for a arguably-rational distribution strategy that still could be seen as two-tiered and unfair. To put it baldly, if the people who are underserved by health care and hard to reach (homeless, maybe economically disadvantaged, nomadic, whatever) get a less effective vaccine in larger proportions, it may be perpetuating systems that overall disadvantage the already disadvantaged, in some views.
  • rheddmobile
    rheddmobile Posts: 6,840 Member
    MikePfirrman wrote: »
    Athijade wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    My large US company announced we are extending WFH for those that can from April 1 to July 6 for the earliest return to office date.

    We have been working from home since last March and have had no updates on our status. While there is no way I will be going back in office 5 days a week (they redid our work space as 2 floors instead of 3 so there are less spots for employees), it is possible at some point it will be a couple days of the week... or not at all. They supposedly have a policy that they came up with, but have yet to share it even though word of that came out like 6 months ago.

    I am worried about the double mask remarks. As many of you know from the start of this, I had issues with masks early on due to anxiety and PTSD. I was able to finally get myself wearing them without panic attacks and working through the issues that caused said panic attacks. There is no way in heck I think I can handle two masks. So now I am all stressed about doing my grocery shopping (which is the only time I really go anywhere except for medical stuff).

    That's a great step for you to wear a mask. Congrats on that. Curbside delivery, like @L1zardQueen said, is a great idea. Would it be too much of a stretch to try to get a KN-95 instead of a cloth mask? With those, you don't need two masks, just one, assuming the quality is good. Personally, I don't find them much worse than a cloth mask. That's what I do wear when I'm shopping at the grocery store (I do all the grocery shopping for my family).

    I was going to suggest this. I also feel like an N95 type mask which stands away from the face feels less oppressive than a cloth mask.
  • Gisel2015
    Gisel2015 Posts: 4,187 Member
    edited January 2021
    spiriteagle99 wrote: »
    RetiredAndLovingIt wrote: »
    I thought I saw they weren’t recommending J&J for people 65+. Has anyone else seen this?
    A little ways back I was saying gkids in school since Sept, no problems. Well, just found out gson in OK is in quarantine from school exposure. :'(
    I think I am usually optimistic, but the vaccine rollout is discouraging. Seems like the chance of getting a shot, now that I am eligible, is the equivalent of winning the lottery.

    It's the Astra-Zeneca vaccine that they are saying to only give to people under 65. I don't know why.

    Because there were not many older people (above 65) enrolled in the trial so enough data to actually confirm safety and efficacy in that patient population.

    https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/28/europe/germany-astrazeneca-vaccine-coronavirus-grm-intl/index.html
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 28,052 Member
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    Antiopelle wrote: »
    In Belgium any type of cloth mask is now prohibited in most hospitals and the disposable blue masks are generally encouraged. Apparently hospital staff encountered too many patients and visitors wearing cloth masks that were clearly not hygienic anymore, becoming a source of bacterial infection in themselves.
    Cloth masks should be washed every day with soap at a temp of at least 60°c. The reasoning behind is that this is a hurdle most people do not take and disposables will be replaced more often as they are more convenient. Normally the max time to use the disposables is 4 hours, but I do believe that many people wear them more than that, usually until one of the elastics break.

    Thanks for this! For those of us who use F, 60°C = 140°F.

    (snip useful infographic and some good comments, for reply length)

    I'm almost never in public though - just at supermarkets, where there is 100% face covering wearing compliance (but a lesser amount of wearing CORRECTLY), and I go at times of day where I'm not within 6 feet of people for more than a few seconds.

    This is probably weird, but as I mentioned I've been doing bandit-style cotton scarf over disposable blue mask. I've actually *boiled* the cotton scarves on the stove - they hold up well.

    (Maybe this sounds freaky compulsive, so I'll add for context that my hot water heater only goes to 120F, and my clothes-dryer died awhile back mid-pandemic and I don't want deliverers/installers in my house until I can at least air the place out (it's 24F, -4C here at 3:47PM today), so I'm air drying stuff I wash for the time being.) Boiling elastic (and maybe synthetic fiber fabric) would be a bad idea, but it can work on all-cotton.

    I KNEW I'd be getting the temp of my water at some point and you've just confirmed it ;)

    Huh? In my case, it's on a digital readout right on the front of the (tankless) heater. IMU, they set it at 120F for people without a dishwasher, higher (with a different electronic controller, I think) if there is a dishwasher.

    We don't have a readout. A tech said it was set at the max, which is 130 degrees in my state, but when I measure it from the sink with a digital thermometer, I get 136.
  • Psychgrrl
    Psychgrrl Posts: 3,177 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    FWIW, just for consideration:

    Report on NPR station a little while ago (didn't notice whether it was national or state level) says double masking is now a good idea, partly because of the new variants that are more highly contagious. The expert ** they were interviewing suggested a disposable filter-type mask next to the face because of better filtration, cloth mask over that to add layers but especially to keep fit to the face better (fewer, smaller gaps).

    ** I didn't catch the intro; could've been anything from a science journalist regurgitating info to a high-level epidemiologist/doctor. Don't know, sorry. 😐🤷‍♀️

    Other comments: N95 should still be primarily reserved for health care workers & similar. KN95 are fairly available, but lots of substandard/fake ones on the market (said CDC website has a list of reliable brands). Interviewee said she wouldn't worry about double mask for (say) walking the dog, but a good idea for places like grocery stores

    I've heard the same, from multiple sources. That for stuff like grocery shopping where you're indoors with strangers, to double mask or get a pro grade mask. In addition to KN95, I saw a suggestion of a KF94 (I think?). No idea what the difference is, but something I made a mental note to look into.

    The only place I go where there's even a chance of having strangers close to me is grocery/toiletry shopping, and I go at odd times and I'll just not get an item on my list if an aisle isn't mostly clear, but if I can up my mask game I'm starting to think it might be worth it.

    A couple of the recommendations I saw saw surgical mask underneath, cloth one on top. Can’t hurt!
  • Psychgrrl
    Psychgrrl Posts: 3,177 Member
    lokihen wrote: »
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    FWIW, just for consideration:

    Report on NPR station a little while ago (didn't notice whether it was national or state level) says double masking is now a good idea, partly because of the new variants that are more highly contagious. The expert ** they were interviewing suggested a disposable filter-type mask next to the face because of better filtration, cloth mask over that to add layers but especially to keep fit to the face better (fewer, smaller gaps).

    ** I didn't catch the intro; could've been anything from a science journalist regurgitating info to a high-level epidemiologist/doctor. Don't know, sorry. 😐🤷‍♀️

    Other comments: N95 should still be primarily reserved for health care workers & similar. KN95 are fairly available, but lots of substandard/fake ones on the market (said CDC website has a list of reliable brands). Interviewee said she wouldn't worry about double mask for (say) walking the dog, but a good idea for places like grocery stores

    Curious about the bolded because I've heard that many times in the last year, but the hospital I worked at only used surgical masks or PPAP hoods. I've even heard anecdotal stories that hospitals didn't allow nurses to bring in their own higher quality masks.

    Also, N95s should be fit-tested per user for maximum effectiveness. Wearing them is effective regardless, but they are the gold standard when they are adjusted to the user by someone qualified to do so. For people who need them at my work, the office responsible for all our safety regulations and training does the fitting.

    I don’t wear one. Would personally rather save them for the folxs cleaning our vacated isolation spaces. I’m at risk for exposure, but not like they are.
  • Psychgrrl
    Psychgrrl Posts: 3,177 Member
    corinasue1143 wrote: »
    I’ve seen people who work outside—construction, garbage collection, etc.— wearing gators. Looks smart to me. Warmth + a
    Little protection, even though they are outside and usually distanced from others. Don’t know what’s underneath.

    Disneyland (well, Downtown Disney when it reopened for a bit) wouldn’t allow them (gators, bandanas, any masks didn’t fully cover the more and mouth with no openings). People were apparently getting very creative and had masks with mesh or lace inserts. Which really aren’t that effective. Initially a big controversy here.
  • Psychgrrl
    Psychgrrl Posts: 3,177 Member
    SModa61 wrote: »
    Here is a reason you can be glad to not live in China ATM. They are apparently rolling out anal swabs as a more accurate way of testing for COVID. Curious if it is self swab, or some poor medical personnel are having to carry out those tests.

    I honestly haven’t paid much attention to it, but there are ways of testing how widespread the virus is by sampling the sewer system. I think that and this new test might be related.

    I self-administer my nasal swab tests under someone’s supervision. They know from a marking on the swab if it’s in far enough. (Not going to ask about the other kind of swab! 😬)
  • Psychgrrl
    Psychgrrl Posts: 3,177 Member
    SuzySunshine99 wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    SuzySunshine99 wrote: »
    My husband just bought some of the KN95 masks. I know they vary as far as quality, and have no idea if these are better or worse than my multi-layer cloth masks.

    He's trying to convince me that I should be wearing these to work instead of the cloth masks, especially with the new strains of the virus.

    I don't work with the "public", but I have to sit in a closed room with 9 of my co-workers, separated by plexiglass (which I'm not convinced helps at all).

    Not sure which ones I'll end up wearing.

    I bought some a bit ago but didn't like them, as I felt my breath way more which was weird (they have this compartment). Oddly enough I was talking to a friend today about them, and he said basically what Mike did -- that they are better for fogging but tug on the ears. When I go to work, which I am tomorrow, I usually do masks in public spaces but not in my private office, so based on this discussion I'm leaning toward the KN95+cloth mask in public and then no mask otherwise.

    Many people have mentioned the ear-tugging issue with the KN95s. I tried one of mine on, and actually have the opposite problem. I have a small head, and they are too loose on me. My cloth ones have adjustable ear loops, so they fit much better.

    I might try doubling them up...maybe the KN95 will fit me better over the cloth mask. Or else I'll have to try to rig something to tighten the ear loops on the 95s.

    Regular masks fall off me, I need the adjustable ear loops. I found a vendor on Etsy where you could order different sizes by measuring your face and using the corresponding size chart.

    Found out I have a face on the small side of a 7-12 year old child. 😂😂😂
  • paperpudding
    paperpudding Posts: 9,284 Member
    yes, come to think of it, I have often supervised people doing self vaginal swabs (not for Covid, of course) - I explain how to do it, they do it to themself behind a privacy curtain while I talk them through it.

  • MikePfirrman
    MikePfirrman Posts: 3,307 Member
    edited January 2021
    Athijade wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    My large US company announced we are extending WFH for those that can from April 1 to July 6 for the earliest return to office date.

    We have been working from home since last March and have had no updates on our status. While there is no way I will be going back in office 5 days a week (they redid our work space as 2 floors instead of 3 so there are less spots for employees), it is possible at some point it will be a couple days of the week... or not at all. They supposedly have a policy that they came up with, but have yet to share it even though word of that came out like 6 months ago.

    I am worried about the double mask remarks. As many of you know from the start of this, I had issues with masks early on due to anxiety and PTSD. I was able to finally get myself wearing them without panic attacks and working through the issues that caused said panic attacks. There is no way in heck I think I can handle two masks. So now I am all stressed about doing my grocery shopping (which is the only time I really go anywhere except for medical stuff).

    I saw these and thought of you. These look super comfy and have a disposable insert. Made by Honeywell. I might get one of these. You can tell the ear loops are longer and wouldn't tug on your ears as bad as the KN-95s I currently have.

    https://www.honeywellstore.com/store/products/honeywell-dual-layer-face-cover-dark-gray-rws-50111.htm
  • ythannah
    ythannah Posts: 4,371 Member
    Psychgrrl wrote: »
    I honestly haven’t paid much attention to it, but there are ways of testing how widespread the virus is by sampling the sewer system. I think that and this new test might be related.

    My city just started doing the sewer testing because the virus does appear in fecal material. I guess they do daily tests anyway so this just involves a matter of collecting one additional sample. Apparently Ottawa has been doing Covid sewer testing for a while to monitor prevalence.

    https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/covid-19-levels-in-ottawa-wastewater-rising-but-still-below-october-peak-1.5252715
  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,159 Member
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Chef_Barbell wrote: »
    CDC recommends schools reopen for in person learning.

    https://www.npr.org/2021/01/26/960885936/cdc-makes-case-for-school-reopening

    Thought about this a bit more and I'm not a conspiracy thinking person but the idea that in person schools don't spread Covid may be a bit of wishful thinking than all out science. Talk to anyone in education, they will tell you they had colds, etc all during the school year for the first several years from being around all the little germ carriers until they built immunity. Don't see why Covid would work any differently.

    Of course now you have the kids wearing masks, etc. Any pictures you see the kids are separated properly wearing masks, wonder if that's the normal situation? In normal times educators have to tell kids to keep their fingers out of their noses, wash their hands etc. And these are normally functioning kids, never mind the behaviorally challenged and/or special needs kids.

    https://news.yahoo.com/clinical-trials-raise-fears-coronavirus-040855671.html

    Too bad this virus is watching our moves and is out playing us in this game of Cat and Mouse it appears. Yes a few of us will die but nothing like when white men showed up in North and South America 500 years ago.

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