Asked for help, REFUSED! *rant*
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Yes, this is what i've been syaing all along, i don't want a clinical approack, because i dont beleive i am sick. But i do think i cant do this without help. I don't think i ever said i dont want general nutiritional advice, i do want it, that is what they would NOT let me access though, which was a shame. hope I don'tcome across like i am shouting at you, i dont mean it like that, only saying my point.0
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its good to be proud of yourself, and dont take this the wrong way, but your bmi could well be the risk reason. i had a bmi of just over 40, and it was a nightmare... i had a good doctor, and had a gastric bypass, best thing i ever did..in my personal experience, but i understand its not for everybody...
I don't see why you would be upset at them, I would be upset at myself, actually when I was excluded due to weight...I got fit and now the people who excluded me can't keep up with me...
I am not upset at myself at all. I am doing my very best to make changes. that don't mean never going wrong but recognising where i went wrong and trying to push forward. Seeking this was part of it, getting over my plateau. Not upset with myself one bit, am proud of myself, just annoyed about the situation here.
do you have a good ractice nurse, or a citizens advice centre, they may be able to provide the support you would like... and then ofcourse there is us!!mfp is a real help to me, and i log even my 'bad 'foods...
hope you continue on your weightloss journey with great success, and feel ree to add me as a buddy if you want...i am a bit bonkers!!lol!!:laugh: :laugh: :happy:0 -
Yes, this is what i've been syaing all along, i don't want a clinical approack, because i dont beleive i am sick.
I don't believe you are either.But i do think i cant do this without help.
You already are doing it? And why does help have to provided by the health service? Again what are you asking them for?I don't think i ever said i dont want general nutiritional advice, i do want it, that is what they would NOT let me access though, which was a shame. hope I don'tcome across like i am shouting at you, i dont mean it like that, only saying my point.
Yes you didI am going to see my doctor and I am not going to be fobbed off with something like a dietician referal on its own.I'm sorry that is just a blinkered point of view. A lot of people with weight issues have such because of psychological issues these need to be addressed. You seem to be worried about the cost to your taxes. Just do a quick Google and you'll see the cost obesity related illnesses cost the bag. By treating and helping people it will reduce your tax burden overall. No matter what people like you wish to think obesity is not as simple as eat less
At no point did I say it was as simple as eating less. I am aware of the issues people face, if you notice how much weight I have to lose, i'm going through them myself (y'know but people like me haven't got a clue because I don't scream about my issues?!) People like you need to not make snap judgements about people like me.
I agree, helping people will reduce my tax burden BUT in order for the NHS to do that it needs to help the greatest number of people i.e. the 21% with a BMI under 40 rather than the smaller % of people over that?! How is that blinkered?!0 -
When I was a little girl, my brother was in the Cub Scouts. They got to do all kinds of really cool stuff and went camping, etc. I wanted to join. I was not allowed to, because I was a girl. Instead, I had to join Brownies, where they made us wear ugly brown dresses, and did stupid crafts and ****. It wasn't fair, either.
Now we all know where you learned to make a pine cone bird feeder.
The circle is complete.
*I've got something in my pocket,
That belongs across my face,
I keep it very close at hand,
In a most convenient place.
I'm sure you couldn't guess it,
If you guessed a long long while.
So I'll take it out and put it on,
It's a great big brownie smile.*
Awwwww! Thanks for the memories! Personally, I loved being in Brownies, even though I was disappointed that we didn't get to go camping like the cub scouts did (but I did go as an older girl scout).0 -
Double post0
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stackhead, i never said or even slightly implied u dont have a clue about the issues, sorry if u picked it up that way.
what i want from the nhs? idk, i dont care if it is nhs or local council, i just want some sort of holistic support that helps with all the facrtors that lead to obesity, preferably with other ppl, i think this face to face input will keep me on track is all.0 -
I CALLED LEVEL 3 PPL AND THEY SAID I CANNOT GO THERE BECAUSE IT IS CLOSING IN TWO WEEKS, FML
DEVASTATED.
is that the only one? I cant believe that is your ONLY option. Now, try to find another one. Im not in England so i dont know how this works. Its just one door closed. there has to be another right?0 -
stackhead, i never said or even slightly implied u dont have a clue about the issues, sorry if u picked it up that way.
what i want from the nhs? idk, i dont care if it is nhs or local council, i just want some sort of holistic support that helps with all the facrtors that lead to obesity, preferably with other ppl, i think this face to face input will keep me on track is all.
I've just been watching this thread as i don't want to open a can of worms over what i think thr nhs shouldn't pay for!
But have you seriously considered a gym and a trainer? And don't tell me your to fat my trainer trains a 34st man and a 29st man now and I'm willing to bet they will lose weight and get fit and never be put at risk, because my trainer (as are many others) is brilliant with weight loss at all levels, yes it costs money, but I'm of the opinion that i got myself fat nobody else did so why should they pay to get me thinner!0 -
Well, I am entitled to everything as it happens,I am a UK citizen who pay taxes, as such I am entitled to have my health care needs met, either by the local authoriy or nhs that is all.
The same could be said of most illness(yea yea i know obesity is not a 'proper' condition because it is self inflcted etc, I agree, this is what i am saying, that i dont want too clinical an approach as it happens), they only affect a small number of people, but it still matters.
I just really really DO think I am entitled to this sort of thing. I am going to see my doctor and I am not going to be fobbed off with something like a dietician referal on its own.
Hi -well, if you feel you are entiitled to care, then that is what is going to give you the motivation to search till you find one and not give up.
it may happen that you will settle for a doctor which you originally said you did not like, but it may be your only option, you dont have to go for surgery, but you might have to do something you didn't originally like, but it may be your only option - but good news - it may be what you need - a lifesaver.
or, why not just continue on MFP here with us, and you are already doing it, i think we could be a kind of support group for free. maybe thats the solution right here. Hey for me, I was the worst food addiction person,, but just a few months of making a few changes and im not that person anymore.. all for free. i am seeing a nutritionist for the first time next month but so far i've been doing this all by myself - with a little help and direction from my friends here. (Joe Cocker song)0 -
Good for those 34stone29stones ppls. Personally i apprecaite a more holistic approach to the problem, because i think it works better for me however. Also, I have a trust in nhs/local authority, that they know best (no disrespect to ayone elses choices). It is down to me to sort this out, not like anyone can lose weight for me, but everyone needs help, and if there is good help available on the nhs i will use it. Looks like it been cut so manybe not but hopefully else where. u can write to your mp if you dont agree with it, but if it is there and funded, id like to avail myself of it. i adore the nhs, and general welfare state.
edit- i used to go to circuit training and swimming at a gym and i hope to get back into it (still do swimming) but that is additonal not instead of.0 -
stackhead, i never said or even slightly implied u dont have a clue about the issues, sorry if u picked it up that way.
what i want from the nhs? idk, i dont care if it is nhs or local council, i just want some sort of holistic support that helps with all the facrtors that lead to obesity, preferably with other ppl, i think this face to face input will keep me on track is all.
That wasn't a quote from you, but from another poster. So no worries on that front.
So essentially you want some kind of group counselling sessions? Have you thought about asking your Dr to refer you to a slimming class? You don't have to follow the diet plan but the group support involved might help, and most areas will pay your fees for you if you're refered by the GP.0 -
I might think about the diet class thing if all else fails, i think i need myappointment at the gp to find out my options. i have to go for many hrs now, catch you all tomorrow afternoon!xx0
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Don't let this minor setback discourage you. You have done very well on your own, and I have every confidence that you will continue to be successful.
Don't give up on the NHS, but, in the meantime, keep up what you have been doing. You have moral support and good advice here on MFP.0 -
I'm sure their recommendation to seek help at the hospital was purely due to liability issues. Try not to take it personally.
+1
It's this. The last thing this group wants is to put you on a training program where you'll actually do more harm than good to your body. What small group can afford to get sued into oblivion.0 -
Lol i do disagree but writing to mps is pointless, we all know that.
Why don't you join WW or slimming world?
Seems to me your wasting time when you could already be getting started some other way just so you don't have to pay, and also so you can have someone else to put the blame onto?
This is the harshest post I've ever written and I'm sorry about that, but I'm rather irked over the nhs putting money towards things that people bring on themselves and I'm not just talking weight! When i lost a dear friend the other year because they couldn't afford to fund enough ambulances and she bled out in rta because it took to long for the closest ambulance to get there. So yes i am a little sore on how they use my taxes and your attitude of entitlement!0 -
Have you thought about asking your Dr to refer you to a slimming class? You don't have to follow the diet plan but the group support involved might help
I was going to suggest that too, for the regular group support element.0 -
I'm sure it's more of a liability issue than anything else. Someone with a BMI of 61 is probably not going to be able to do the exercise safely that they have planned.
There's no reason you need a class to get you started on a healthier lifestyle. Start tracking your calories on here, eat at a deficit and start walking if you can. Weight comes off easily when you're in the morbidly obese range and you should be able to make some great progress without a hospital to help.
This! MFP can give you as much support as many local groups, and just by logging what you eat, being mindful of your choices and walking more you can probably bring yourself down to a BMI of 40+ relatively easily. Every extra step you take - even if its just going up and down your stairs at home, or parking at the other side of the car park from the shops - will help bring the weight off.And if you can't take those extra steps - well, that is probably why the group was concerned about you being able to manage their classes.0 -
You say that YOU are the only one that can lose weight, yet you want help, but not Hospitals, they are the 'link' to services... You must have 'mental issues' in your life to have become so obese (many are depressed etc), yet you say you are not sick.
Perhaps you have to confront why you are SO obese... Then you will be able to take control of your eating and general life more...
Don't rely on the NHS, unless you have a mental problem (but you say you are not sick), get them to sort this if it is a problem and the weight might drop off... Find a trainer at a council gym, perhaps just once a week to give you that boost, and/or join slimming world etc...
Good luck... But take steps yourself... NHS is there for breaking a leg, cancer or mental problems...0 -
I might think about the diet class thing if all else fails, i think i need myappointment at the gp to find out my options. i have to go for many hrs now, catch you all tomorrow afternoon!xx
Have you thought about joining Slimming World (I am not sure if GP's can refer you on to a group?) - I swear, it's the one eating plan that's made sense to me, and I know people have really good results with it. That way you can get support of a group, but still have control and it's not so "medical"?0 -
A person must be really in bad shape, more than they know, if a group of overweight people reject him. And for one of those overweight people to look at him and exclaim "you need a doctor!" is telling something.
I beleive when the fat person (like me) realizes that the world does not or cannot accommodate their girth, when things become so uncomfortabel, and the person cant even find a two-seater to sit in, cant go to the theatre because there are no seats wide enough, and cant walk more than 1 city block, and cant breathe while walking up steps, and things get so hard that their pants rip in public, when they try to join a fat group and even the fat people reject him, then when life becomes so uncomfortble that they cant even breathe, they cant even control their food choices, and when the person realized how deathly sick that their fat might actually kill them and they will have to be on a breathing tube because their poor heart gave out finally, then that is the pain that will motivate them to change.
As long as someone is catered to, is not made uncomfortable, wants only someone to pity them, and coddle them, and if a person can go along in life "ok" and not be discomforted because of their large girth, then they will not change.. no reason to. coz food tastes better than the denying of it. and life accommodates them in general, so no need to change.
I think its a damn good thing that the OP got rejected.. This is the first step in getting so angry - that they will get angry enough at themselves for getting so damn big that even the fatties reject him. He needs to get angry at himself ,, and how he got there, and now how to get out of it so he wont go there EVER again.
yes i said it - "fatties".. its a hard word to take, but its reality.0 -
stackhead, i never said or even slightly implied u dont have a clue about the issues, sorry if u picked it up that way.
what i want from the nhs? idk, i dont care if it is nhs or local council, i just want some sort of holistic support that helps with all the facrtors that lead to obesity, preferably with other ppl, i think this face to face input will keep me on track is all.
Just to explain for your info what the local council could do....
The local council will have very limited involvement with you I suspect unless you meet "critical and substantial" levels of need under Community Care legislation, and you say you're not sick or disabled at this stage. Your local authority provides people with social care (for people who need home care, meals on wheels stuff like that) or adaptations to housing (stair lifts, adaptations to bathrooms etc).
Very occasionally (as you know I work in this area) we get very large individuals for whom this applies, for example people who can no longer provide their own intimate care without help (washing etc), but like you said you're still fine for getting about and looking after yourself, so no point knocking on your council's door.
I agree with people who said not to dismiss groups like WW or SW, as many people do great in that group environment with the peer support etc. Next step is an honest chat with your GP I think. :flowerforyou:0 -
Ask your GP if you might be ok to be referred to your local "Exercise Referral" scheme.
This gives you free access to gyms and a supervised activity plan with lifestyle support.
Look here for your local one. http://activenewcastle.co.uk/health/livewell/0 -
I'm interested to see what you will do next! Seems like Size10 has offered you even more good advice.
I'm doing a Paleo Whole 30 and I'm in smaller pants than I have been in ages. If you want holistic, it uses food and not supplements or drinks. If you combine that with your GP sending you to gyms (lucky!) you could push past the plateau and keep losing.
Sometimes your body just needs to be shaken up a bit after you have lost a substantial amount of weight. I don't know what plan you were using to lose the 60+ pounds you already lost.
Personally, I wouldn't want to go to a group aimed at the bikini crowd. I don't think people who need to lose 20 or 30 pounds really understand what life is like for the morbidly obese. Speaking as one with a BMI in the 40s.
Good luck, and please do let us know what happens!0 -
they have this policy probably for one of two reasons:
1) insurance recommendation/ limiting liability or 2) it is part of a research project that must have certain parameters in it
look for another program, check out some church-held programs, there are lots of those0 -
A person must be really in bad shape, more than they know, if a group of overweight people reject him. And for one of those overweight people to look at him and exclaim "you need a doctor!" is telling something.
I beleive when the fat person (like me) realizes that the world does not or cannot accommodate their girth, when things become so uncomfortabel, and the person cant even find a two-seater to sit in, cant go to the theatre because there are no seats wide enough, and cant walk more than 1 city block, and cant breathe while walking up steps, and things get so hard that their pants rip in public, when they try to join a fat group and even the fat people reject him, then when life becomes so uncomfortble that they cant even breathe, they cant even control their food choices, and when the person realized how deathly sick that their fat might actually kill them and they will have to be on a breathing tube because their poor heart gave out finally, then that is the pain that will motivate them to change.
As long as someone is catered to, is not made uncomfortable, wants only someone to pity them, and coddle them, and if a person can go along in life "ok" and not be discomforted because of their large girth, then they will not change.. no reason to. coz food tastes better than the denying of it. and life accommodates them in general, so no need to change.
I think its a damn good thing that the OP got rejected.. This is the first step in getting so angry - that they will get angry enough at themselves for getting so damn big that even the fatties reject him. He needs to get angry at himself ,, and how he got there, and now how to get out of it so he wont go there EVER again.
yes i said it - "fatties".. its a hard word to take, but its reality.
I think I love you... :drinker: :flowerforyou:0 -
There is a lot of prejudice against very overweight people. Somehow, people feel free to make moral judgments about prople because of their size. In my judgment, body weight and composition are morally neutral.
Beautifully put. :-)0 -
A person must be really in bad shape, more than they know, if a group of overweight people reject him. And for one of those overweight people to look at him and exclaim "you need a doctor!" is telling something.
I beleive when the fat person (like me) realizes that the world does not or cannot accommodate their girth, when things become so uncomfortabel, and the person cant even find a two-seater to sit in, cant go to the theatre because there are no seats wide enough, and cant walk more than 1 city block, and cant breathe while walking up steps, and things get so hard that their pants rip in public, when they try to join a fat group and even the fat people reject him, then when life becomes so uncomfortble that they cant even breathe, they cant even control their food choices, and when the person realized how deathly sick that their fat might actually kill them and they will have to be on a breathing tube because their poor heart gave out finally, then that is the pain that will motivate them to change.
As long as someone is catered to, is not made uncomfortable, wants only someone to pity them, and coddle them, and if a person can go along in life "ok" and not be discomforted because of their large girth, then they will not change.. no reason to. coz food tastes better than the denying of it. and life accommodates them in general, so no need to change.
I think its a damn good thing that the OP got rejected.. This is the first step in getting so angry - that they will get angry enough at themselves for getting so damn big that even the fatties reject him. He needs to get angry at himself ,, and how he got there, and now how to get out of it so he wont go there EVER again.
yes i said it - "fatties".. its a hard word to take, but its reality.
Well put. I live with an obese person who hasn't gotten to the point of realizing that it isn't up to the rest of us to make his life easy. I'd have him read this if I didn't think it would just make him go into the rant about being picked on again.0 -
When i was overweigh last year, and getting more and more overweight, this is when i had no control over my food.. i didn't want to give up the pleasure of food. too much trouble,, easier to go eat lunch out, and when i had a craving, man, look out,, dont get in my way. i knew i was making myself worse, knees hurting, feet hurting, had to look for a bench every 20 minutes to sit down, etc... i knew it but the food was worth it. it also fulfilled some boredom and such like that. i did not have the strengh, motivation, willpower, nothing,, and i swear Classic Coke was an addiction, i mean really when that coke went down my throat, it was so cold and refreshing,, had to have it with ice cubes in a real glass. no disgusting diet coke for me. all the pizza i wanted. etc.. slowly i was doing even less and less, but had no control. and also no need to change, because if i was ok with it, then fine. you can live with this discomfort for a while. and i didn't look that bad. but i went up to 360 pounds, yikes... that is getting too close for comfort, another 40 pounds and i'll be 400.
so when i started on my diet, i didn't know what to do or if i could do it, but i had to make up in my mind to start somewhere. and i did - gave up coke, desserts and added salt on food, i could live with that. i did that for a few weeks and then seen what else i could do,, then i found mfp.
wow i feel like I've gotten church up in here, "I'm saved hallelujah" and now, after 3 months, I'm doing ok! I appreciate all who have helped me along the way, but really it was hard at first, but now not so hard. i do miss a few of my old Taco Bell and Pizza places, and KFC chicken, Popeyes, etc.. but really, its ok.. it really is 0 -
When i was overweigh last year, and getting more and more overweight, this is when i had no control over my food.. i didn't want to give up the pleasure of food. too much trouble,, easier to go eat lunch out, and when i had a craving, man, look out,, dont get in my way. i knew i was making myself worse, knees hurting, feet hurting, had to look for a bench every 20 minutes to sit down, etc... i knew it but the food was worth it. it also fulfilled some boredom and such like that. i did not have the strengh, motivation, willpower, nothing,, and i swear Classic Coke was an addiction, i mean really when that coke went down my throat, it was so cold and refreshing,, had to have it with ice cubes in a real glass. no disgusting diet coke for me. all the pizza i wanted. etc.. slowly i was doing even less and less, but had no control. and also no need to change, because if i was ok with it, then fine. you can live with this discomfort for a while. and i didn't look that bad. but i went up to 360 pounds, yikes... that is getting too close for comfort, another 40 pounds and i'll be 400.
so when i started on my diet, i didn't know what to do or if i could do it, but i had to make up in my mind to start somewhere. and i did - gave up coke, desserts and added salt on food, i could live with that. i did that for a few weeks and then seen what else i could do,, then i found mfp.
wow i feel like I've gotten church up in here, "I'm saved hallelujah" and now, after 3 months, I'm doing ok! I appreciate all who have helped me along the way, but really it was hard at first, but now not so hard. i do miss a few of my old Taco Bell and Pizza places, and KFC chicken, Popeyes, etc.. but really, its ok.. it really is
This is "real" and a great post - good job ! ^^^0 -
Well we're happy to help you out. what can we do? the heck with those creeps.0
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