Asked for help, REFUSED! *rant*

CollieFit

So just to clarify, when they say you need to go to hospital, it doesn't mean all your treatment will take place their and that you're some kind of lost cause. Not at all.

It just means that the specialist multi-disciplinary team best cut out to assist you are based there that is all. Much of your treatment is likely to be based in the community or a dietitian seeing you at home etc.

cowgirlupkelly

OP I think you are trying to read 'RUDE' and 'MEAN' into something that isn't there. It was just another way to look at it.

RML is a very nice person (I know her from way way back at another message board would curl your toes with rude and mean).

cwolfman13

I dont want special medical help

It's not a matter of what you want or don't want. It's what you need. You need to be on a doctor supervised diet and light exercise program. There are factors at play that a basic lifestyle group cannot safely address.

Just because you are consulting a doctor does not automatically mean you have to go for lap band surgery, if that's your concern. You can state categorically that you do not want surgical intervention.

After a couple of years on a properly supervised diet and exercise plan, you'll be in good enough shape to drop into a more conventional support group. And they will be able to help you from there.

This is pretty much what I was thinking. I believe this group simply lacks the resources to properly address your needs safely.

CollieFit

And remember even a Tier 4 service will be completely free of charge. The NHS is great like that.

Don't mind me, just coveting your national health care system...

*fans self*

Well obviously we all pay for it out of our taxes so it's not strictly FREE, but you know what I mean.

nomeejerome

Thanks for the informed comment size10again. Are you a professional in this area?

I guess they must be going off that tier thing. And that is what frustrates me, I dont want special medical help, I want that teit lifestyley, public health stuff. Apart from being more positive, it is also more sustainable because it gives real long term strategies for life, not just acute medical care. I really feel this approach would be best for me.

I don't think people are out to get me, promise, I just think I am being prevented from accessing services I feel I could really benefit from.

Is it possible that you may actually need acute medical care so you are able to make sustainable changes and have them be a part of your long term strategies?

I'm not a doctor but I think long term approach is better. My immeidate health is actually OK, it is the future I worry about, which is why I feel I need a sustainable life long appraoch.

rml_16, you are being presumptious and unfair. That's OK (I will just skim over it)

Thanks to the few people above me who give really helpful, understanding yet honest answers, I really value that.

1. You are right, you are not a doctor and just because you think your approach is better, does not mean it to be true. You say your immediate health is ok and it is the future you are worried about, so what is the big deal about receiving medical care? And receiving a medically supervised program to get you into the category that would make you qualified to join the group you are upset about right now?

2. You might want to be careful about skimming over comments because you could miss some really useful information.

3. It sometimes helps to listen to all answers to make an informed decision. There is value in that.

MariaAkeroyd

I'm sure their recommendation to seek help at the hospital was purely due to liability issues. Try not to take it personally.

This ^^^^

redheaddee

I know it is entitle to make it's own rules but I just think those rules are not fair. I don't want to have to go to a hospital to get help, I want help in that kind of setting. I really feel I would benefit from it, so I don't know why I can't. I think I could keep up because I have as good brain as anyone and I always try my best. I don't know why they assume I couldn't. I don't know that there are any other groups out there, this is the main local organisation for this sort of thing. It's just really frustrating

I don't assume they are out to get me, I just feel it's not fair.

I am going to say it:

LIFE IS NOT FAIR.

ETA and your immediate health is NOT ok. Your BMI is 61. This is not OK. Please seek doctor supervision as recommended.

supplemama

No offense but 40 BMI is not considered a minor weight problem. That is considered obese. 60 is extremely high and morbidly obese.

Exactly! At my heaviest (238 pounds) my BMI was 46.5 Minor? Really? I was on 2 different medications* to deal with the health issues triggered by my obesity! It wasn't minor at all. Yes, compared to someone twice that weight I looked and was in better condition but I was pummeling towards death's door.



*I'm off them now Yay!

joselo2

Thanks for the informed comment size10again. Are you a professional in this area?

I guess they must be going off that tier thing. And that is what frustrates me, I dont want special medical help, I want that teit lifestyley, public health stuff. Apart from being more positive, it is also more sustainable because it gives real long term strategies for life, not just acute medical care. I really feel this approach would be best for me.

I don't think people are out to get me, promise, I just think I am being prevented from accessing services I feel I could really benefit from.

A tier 3/4 service will give you all the lifestyle advice as well as many other things that you may not get from the group such as specialist assessments regarding diabetes and heart health etc.

This is the service spec for a Tier 2 service (which from the sounds of it I very much suspect you went to see), and somewhere in there it'll probably say what the cut off point is for people for whom the interventions are best suited. So it's not the the staff don't want you or rejected you, I think they just feel that they're not cut out to deal with needs that may exceed that spec.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/142723/Weight_Management_Service_Spec_FINAL_with_IRB.pdf

Yes I was involved with the Obesity Care Pathway in my local area, but I was in Wales then and thinds work slightly differently as Health is devolved to the Welsh Assembly Government, but much is very similar to England.

http://www.wales.nhs.uk/sitesplus/888/page/52135

So where I work Our tiers were:

Level 1: Community based prevention and early intervention (self care)
Level 2: Community and primary care weight management services
Level 3: Specialist multi disciplinary team weight management services
Level 4: Specialist medical and surgical services.

I reckon from what the member of staff said to you, your Tier 3 service is based in a clinical / hospital setting. That's probably because they will need to have access to all kinds of clever machinery that you can't get into a community centre.

Please don't be offended by being told you need the team "the next floor up" it's all in the interest of you getting the best possible service for you. Do yourself a favour and check them out. :flowerforyou:

Thank you for your really helpful knowledge xx I guess I could see about looking into it when you out it that way, but I hope I can have some consultation were i can tell them i really want all the lifestyly stuff also because that is what I think is best help.

Thanks for everyone who give me really useful information and help.

I don't accept these people who trying to make me feel bad, and saying stuff like 'you've got your wieght so out of control' and stuff to shame me. I don't feel ashamed. I HAVE ACTUALLY ALREADY LOST A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF WEIGHT and looking into this because i want to continue to progress with this. I am really PROUD of myself, nothing you can do to chnge it ok.

postrockandcats

And remember even a Tier 4 service will be completely free of charge. The NHS is great like that.

Don't mind me, just coveting your national health care system...

*fans self*

Well obviously we all pay for it out of our taxes so it's not strictly FREE, but you know what I mean.

I do! Everyone paying into something to reap the benefits?? WHAT SORCERY IS THIS??

*resists urge to comment more*

RachyLovesRattys

Okay, i'm sorry. I understand all the "but the group was not suited for his needs" comments but STILL...WHO SAYS THAT TO SOMEONE?! And with a statement like "you could only get help from a hospital" it is very much about the tone that was used as opposed to the statement alone. If it was said in a nasty way, well, that's plain rude.

That being said, there should be other options out there for a person of your BMI that aren't sticking you in some all white pine-scented hospital room for days and days on end. Perhaps one of those retreat type places that have doctors and hospital equipment available if needed, but are located in the mountains or at the beach in a resort would be an option? Someplace where you can get exercise, advice, support, and work on the you INSIDE as well. I know they can be expensive, but it is something that will benefit the rest of your life.

Just my two cents... that group you went to pushed my buttons lol

CorvusCorax77

All I can say is don't give up!

3foldchord

Start your own group.
Do research and start a group for others like yourself to meet and support and teach each other.

joselo2

OP I think you are trying to read 'RUDE' and 'MEAN' into something that isn't there. It was just another way to look at it.

RML is a very nice person (I know her from way way back at another message board would curl your toes with rude and mean).

I don't think she is nice, but that is irrelevant to all of us.

cmcollins001

Thanks for the informed comment size10again. Are you a professional in this area?

I guess they must be going off that tier thing. And that is what frustrates me, I dont want special medical help, I want that teit lifestyley, public health stuff. Apart from being more positive, it is also more sustainable because it gives real long term strategies for life, not just acute medical care. I really feel this approach would be best for me.

I don't think people are out to get me, promise, I just think I am being prevented from accessing services I feel I could really benefit from.

A tier 3/4 service will give you all the lifestyle advice as well as many other things that you may not get from the group such as specialist assessments regarding diabetes and heart health etc.

This is the service spec for a Tier 2 service (which from the sounds of it I very much suspect you went to see), and somewhere in there it'll probably say what the cut off point is for people for whom the interventions are best suited. So it's not the the staff don't want you or rejected you, I think they just feel that they're not cut out to deal with needs that may exceed that spec.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/142723/Weight_Management_Service_Spec_FINAL_with_IRB.pdf

Yes I was involved with the Obesity Care Pathway in my local area, but I was in Wales then and thinds work slightly differently as Health is devolved to the Welsh Assembly Government, but much is very similar to England.

http://www.wales.nhs.uk/sitesplus/888/page/52135

So where I work Our tiers were:

Level 1: Community based prevention and early intervention (self care)
Level 2: Community and primary care weight management services
Level 3: Specialist multi disciplinary team weight management services
Level 4: Specialist medical and surgical services.

I reckon from what the member of staff said to you, your Tier 3 service is based in a clinical / hospital setting. That's probably because they will need to have access to all kinds of clever machinery that you can't get into a community centre.

Please don't be offended by being told you need the team "the next floor up" it's all in the interest of you getting the best possible service for you. Do yourself a favour and check them out. :flowerforyou:

Thank you for your really helpful knowledge xx I guess I could see about looking into it when you out it that way, but I hope I can have some consultation were i can tell them i really want all the lifestyly stuff also because that is what I think is best help.

Thanks for everyone who give me really useful information and help.

I don't accept these people who trying to make me feel bad, and saying stuff like 'you've got your wieght so out of control' and stuff to shame me. I don't feel ashamed. I HAVE ACTUALLY ALREADY LOST A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF WEIGHT and looking into this because i want to continue to progress with this. I am really PROUD of myself, nothing you can do to chnge it ok.

You totally miss the point, don't you.

Nobody is here to shame you or make you feel guilty about your weight. And you have made really decent progress so far.

It's your entitlement attitude that is the problem. It's your inability to consider the other options because you don't feel you need them, and that someone should make an exception to their policy just because you don't think something is fair.

You're weight had nothing to do with a lot of the answers you were given. You were given tons of useful information which you dismissed simply because you didn't like people telling you to quit whining about help you can't get and get out there and find help you can get.

rml_16

OP I think you are trying to read 'RUDE' and 'MEAN' into something that isn't there. It was just another way to look at it.

RML is a very nice person (I know her from way way back at another message board would curl your toes with rude and mean).

I don't think she is nice, but that is irrelevant to all of us.

That's OK. You seem to only like people who agree with you.

postrockandcats

I don't accept these people who trying to make me feel bad, and saying stuff like 'you've got your wieght so out of control' and stuff to shame me. I don't feel ashamed. I HAVE ACTUALLY ALREADY LOST A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF WEIGHT and looking into this because i want to continue to progress with this. I am really PROUD of myself, nothing you can do to chnge it ok.

Yes, you should be proud! People can be blunt, which hurts, but sometimes that's the best medicine.

I honestly didn't see anyone trying to shame you.

joselo2

So just to clarify, when they say you need to go to hospital, it doesn't mean all your treatment will take place their and that you're some kind of lost cause. Not at all.

It just means that the specialist multi-disciplinary team best cut out to assist you are based there that is all. Much of your treatment is likely to be based in the community or a dietitian seeing you at home etc.

Thank you. I am happy not to be a lost cause. I beleive in myself i am glad other ppl can also.

Contrarian

Thanks for the informed comment size10again. Are you a professional in this area?

I guess they must be going off that tier thing. And that is what frustrates me, I dont want special medical help, I want that teit lifestyley, public health stuff. Apart from being more positive, it is also more sustainable because it gives real long term strategies for life, not just acute medical care. I really feel this approach would be best for me.

I don't think people are out to get me, promise, I just think I am being prevented from accessing services I feel I could really benefit from.

A tier 3/4 service will give you all the lifestyle advice as well as many other things that you may not get from the group such as specialist assessments regarding diabetes and heart health etc.

This is the service spec for a Tier 2 service (which from the sounds of it I very much suspect you went to see), and somewhere in there it'll probably say what the cut off point is for people for whom the interventions are best suited. So it's not the the staff don't want you or rejected you, I think they just feel that they're not cut out to deal with needs that may exceed that spec.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/142723/Weight_Management_Service_Spec_FINAL_with_IRB.pdf

Yes I was involved with the Obesity Care Pathway in my local area, but I was in Wales then and thinds work slightly differently as Health is devolved to the Welsh Assembly Government, but much is very similar to England.

http://www.wales.nhs.uk/sitesplus/888/page/52135

So where I work Our tiers were:

Level 1: Community based prevention and early intervention (self care)
Level 2: Community and primary care weight management services
Level 3: Specialist multi disciplinary team weight management services
Level 4: Specialist medical and surgical services.

I reckon from what the member of staff said to you, your Tier 3 service is based in a clinical / hospital setting. That's probably because they will need to have access to all kinds of clever machinery that you can't get into a community centre.

Please don't be offended by being told you need the team "the next floor up" it's all in the interest of you getting the best possible service for you. Do yourself a favour and check them out. :flowerforyou:

Thank you for your really helpful knowledge xx I guess I could see about looking into it when you out it that way, but I hope I can have some consultation were i can tell them i really want all the lifestyly stuff also because that is what I think is best help.

Thanks for everyone who give me really useful information and help.

I don't accept these people who trying to make me feel bad, and saying stuff like 'you've got your wieght so out of control' and stuff to shame me. I don't feel ashamed. I HAVE ACTUALLY ALREADY LOST A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF WEIGHT and looking into this because i want to continue to progress with this. I am really PROUD of myself, nothing you can do to chnge it ok.

I don't think anyone is trying to shame you, honey. You have done very, very well and you SHOULD be proud of yourself. The point most people were trying to make, myself included, is that not every program is designed for every person, and this appears to be one of those times.

It sucks when we cannot do what we want because of what seem like silly rules, but we don't always know why the rules are in place. If you can't do this thing, just do something else. Don't join Brownies, though. It's terrible.

pennysteed

Size 10 has given you some great advice. When I first read your post I thought that the group was wrong in turning you away. If it is a liability issue, then they could always make you sit out the exercise, but there is a lot to be gained from group forums and classes on nutrition. Then Size 10 pointed out that you are in a different country, and different medical system, than the rest of us. So, I am with Size 10, talk to your doc, go to the other tier group and see what they have to offer. I was recently referred to a weight-loss surgery seminar from my doctor, but no where did I have to sign and commit to surgery. But I did come away informed, and now have more options. From that class, I enrolled in a hospital based weight loss group class and am slowly losing weight. We have a different topic each week and we each support each other through other ideas and information. Bottom line, you have nothing to lose by checking out the other tier or hospital based program. You have the right to walk away, and continue losing weight with us. Good luck in what ever you decide to do, losing weight regardless of the amount is not easy, and we are here for you.

BTW, you are more than welcome to friend me, I love friends. :-)