5k Jogger to Ultra Runner in 14 weeks
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Thanks for the update. Looking forward to the next 12ish weeks.
Demonstrating what any new 5k runner can accomplish if they just commit to putting in the remarkably increased mileage in a relatively short period of time, right?
(Myself, I'm in the middle of week 7 of the 14 week couch-2-10k program, so my runs are about 2.7 miles now...because I've done the too-much-too-soon plan before and it ended in injury that sidelined me for ~4 months.)0 -
Thanks for the update. Looking forward to the next 12ish weeks.
Demonstrating what any new 5k runner can accomplish if they just commit to putting in the remarkably increased mileage in a relatively short period of time, right?
(Myself, I'm in the middle of week 7 of the 14 week couch-2-10k program, so my runs are about 2.7 miles now...because I've done the too-much-too-soon plan before and it ended in injury that sidelined me for ~4 months.)
Please read the entire thread. This is no beginner plan.0 -
Demonstrating what any new 5k runner can accomplish if they just commit to putting in the remarkably increased mileage in a relatively short period of time, right?
(Myself, I'm in the middle of week 7 of the 14 week couch-2-10k program, so my runs are about 2.7 miles now...because I've done the too-much-too-soon plan before and it ended in injury that sidelined me for ~4 months.)
Let's be sure we define "new runner" as it is being used in this conversation. A "new runner" is somebody who has been running for over a year and does 25 miles a week - I've been running for 9 months and am up to 17, so I haven't achieved the status of a "new runner" yet.
I think Jof was being sarcastic and pointing out what a "too much too soon" plan does to runners that don't have that awesome base.0 -
I think Jof was being sarcastic and pointing out what a "too much too soon" plan does to runners that don't have that awesome base.
Yeah, he was. I missed that the first time through. Just wanted to make sure it wasn't a new(ish) runner getting caught up with the "plan".0 -
My tuppence worth. First up, it's really not for beginners. If you've done a marathon or have done regular halves within the last year of so, you might be OK using this to get back to fitness.
Second, most running trainers agree that total weekly distance should increase by no more that 10% over the previous longest week (allowing for drop-back weeks). There are four serious red flag weeks in this plan. I'd increase total training time by at least 6 weeks to make this more gradual, even for serious regular runners:
Week Weekly total mileage % increase over previous longest week
1 19
2 17
3 27 42.1%
4 36 13.8%
5 41 13.9%
6 25
7 41
8 41.2
9 35
10 46 13.9%
11 50.2 9.1%
12 37
13 32
14 32.2
Next, 2,000 calories a day for a man? You're having a giraffe, right? Even when rowing, James Cracknell reckoned he got through 4,000 to 6,000 calories a day. A marathon burns an extra 3,000 on top of BMR.
Finally I'd like to share this article on James Cracknell's ultra marathon training:
http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/the-running-blog/2013/jun/07/james-cracknell-fitness-running
Pertinent highlights are:What the worst thing about running? I was at a marathon training event and someone asked the group: "How many people in the room have got a niggle?" Everybody put a hand up. People wouldn't have those injuries if they'd stopped earlier, if they'd had the confidence to listen to their body and spent a week doing other stuff. But people are so focused on what they're doing – they think they can't take a day off, they've got to complete the programme … and then a little pain somewhere becomes more and more serious.
AndSo recovery is crucial? Absolutely. Another name for over-training syndrome is under-recovery syndrome. When I became a full-time athlete, the biggest change wasn't in the volume of training I did, it was in the the amount of time I had to recover. Before I went full-time I'd train, go to work all day, and then train again – so you're not recovering properly. If you're a full-time athlete you get the luxury of spending time chilling out and resting, which is something you don't get in normal life, especially with kids. That's underestimated. Getting rest at the end of a training day is the only way you can guarantee training the next day and the day after that … so you can build up to where you want to get to.
FinallyPeople spend a lot of money on trainers, on a gym membership, on a bike … but it's worth spending money getting a training programme. You can plan your own programme – but I would advise going to a professional and saying, this is my weekly routine, this is the time I have available, this is my goal – and they will work it out. That way you maximise everything. I think the key thing about making the most of the training you're doing – around work, family and the goal – is a programme which gets the balance right between what's steady stuff, what's progressional stuff, what's lactate threshold … You don't have to do long, slow runs all the time – it's not actually going to help you that much and there's only so much you can do of that.
Running is awesome. Running Marathons and beyond can be the most amazing experience of a runner's life... if you choose the right programme for your level.
Unless you're a lapsed athlete, I wouldn't recommend going beyond a half marathon in your first year. In fact, for most people, getting to 10K for the first year, keeping that distance ticking over "off-season" then doing the same for a half marathon the second year and only then seeing how your body feels about a marathon the following year would be a good approach.
Even James Cracknell broke a metatarsal doing the Marathon des Sables.0 -
Ah .... just found a very similar plan in issue 22 of the UK Magazine 'Outdoor Fitness' this one is jogger to Ultra Runner in 12 weeks and is even harder but very similar to weeks 3 to 14 of the plan I'm doing.
It's written by Ultra Running Coach Rory Coleman who has run 780 Marathons and 190 Ultra Marathons including completing the 'Marathon Des Sables' 10 times. You can check his credentials out at www.rorycoleman.co.uk.
I suppose he's got no credibility either ... that's an Olympic Athlete and Britains most successful Ultra Running coach against erm some geezer called 'CarsonRuns' and a lass called 'Vardaeml' ????0 -
OK, this plan is assuming you are already a regular 3 mile plus jogger
Remember that distance is the key NOT speed or time. As always with all trail runs a combination of running and walking helps Try to run in the country on paths rather than on tarmac as it's easier on your feet and joints. It's amazing how quick your body does strengthen to do the distance.
Get a camel pack and fill it with electrolytes. On the longer runs take nuts, seeds, chocolate & jelly babies and eat continually (four jelly babies a mile) and stop half way to eat. Take Ibuprofen with you to get you through the little niggles.
Eat sensibly when you get home. Max 2k calories for a man for the day
Week 1
Mon 3 miles
Tues 3 miles
Weds cross
Thur 3 Miles
Fri Cross
Sat 4 miles
Sun 6 miles
Week 2
Mon cross
Tues 3 miles
Wed 3 miles
Thur 3 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 5miles
Sun 3 miles
Week 3
Mon 4miles
Tues cross
Wed 4 miles
Thur 4 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 6miles
Sun 9 miles
Week 4
Mon cross
Tues 5 miles
Wed 5 miles
Thur 5 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 6miles
Sun 15 miles
Week 5
Mon cross
Tues 5 miles
Wed 5 miles
Thur 5 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 8miles
Sun 18 miles
Week 6
Mon cross
Tues cross
Wed 5 miles
Thur 5 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 6miles
Sun 9 miles
Week 7
Mon cross
Tues 5 miles
Wed 5 miles
Thur 5 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 6miles
Sun 20 miles
Week 8
Mon cross
Tues 5 miles
Wed 5 miles
Thur 5 Miles
Fri cross
Sat cross
Sun 26.2 miles
Week 9
Mon cross
Tues cross
Wed 6 miles
Thur 6 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 8 miles
Sun 15 miles
Week 10
Mon cross
Tues 6miles
Wed 6 miles
Thur 6 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 8 miles
Sun 20 miles
Week 11
Mon cross
Tues 6miles
Wed 6 miles
Thur 6 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 6 miles
Sun 26.2 miles
Week 12
Mon cross
Tues cross
Wed 6 miles
Thur 6 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 10 miles
Sun 15 miles
Week 13
Mon cross
Tues cross
Wed 6 miles
Thur 6 Miles
Fri cross
Sat 10 miles
Sun 10 miles
Week 14
Mon cross
Tues 3 miles
Wed 3 miles
Thur cross
Fri cross
Sat cross
Sun Hardmoors 26.2 - come on!!!
Hello
Well I am training for a trail marathon stone Cat trail marathon Nov 2!
You SHOULD NOT run a marathon before your Marathon in week 8 or week 11. I am following a 16 week training program from the website (marathonrookies.com). This is my first trail marathon but I have run 3 road marathons and 4 halfs and a bunch of 16 milers and 10K,5milers, 5ks. My first and second marathon I did a month a part and that was my biggest mistake.
I am not saying it cant be done I am saying your plan needs to be changed a little. Also make sure you get fitted for trail shoes and that you are training on the trails or similar to trails the race is on.0 -
Ah .... just found a very similar plan in issue 22 of the UK Magazine 'Outdoor Fitness' this one is jogger to Ultra Runner in 12 weeks and is even harder but very similar to weeks 3 to 14 of the plan I'm doing.
It's written by Ultra Running Coach Rory Coleman who has run 780 Marathons and 190 Ultra Marathons including completing the 'Marathon Des Sables' 10 times. You can check his credentials out at www.rorycoleman.co.uk.
I suppose he's got no credibility either ... that's an Olympic Athlete and Britains most successful Ultra Running coach against erm some geezer called 'CarsonRuns' and a lass called 'Vardaeml' ????
You don't need to get nasty because people are questioning aggressive training plans you found on the internet. Carson and Vardaeml are simply trying to help others not get caught up in a plan that isn't right for them, to help them prevent injury and getting discouraged.
If this plan is working for you and you understand the risks, go ahead, do it. Good luck. I hope you complete your trail marathon without getting hurt and have a blast with your family.
You need to be careful about who you recommend this plan to. It works for seasoned runners. It works for Cracknell because he is already an elite athlete. Someone already running a base of 25-30 mpw might be able to take this on and be ok.
Most people in MFP who have done C25K are not fit enough or experienced enough to take on this plan. They also come to these forums and place a lot of trust in people like you giving them false hopes.
Lucky for these people, we have someone like Carson, who has TONS of credibility and experience (if you knew him, you would know this, too) warning beginners not to take on the plan you're promoting to them.0 -
You need to be careful about who you recommend this plan to. It works for seasoned runners. It works for Cracknell because he is already an elite athlete. Someone already running a base of 25-30 mpw might be able to take this on and be ok.
Most people in MFP who have done C25K are not fit enough or experienced enough to take on this plan. They also come to these forums and place a lot of trust in people like you giving them false hopes.
Lucky for these people, we have someone like Carson, who has TONS of credibility and experience (if you knew him, you would know this, too) warning beginners not to take on the plan you're promoting to them.
Exactly! (and where do they come up with 2,000 cal maximum? Especially on a long run day?......Lunacy)0 -
...some geezer called 'CarsonRuns' ...
I attack the "plan" and you attack me.
I stand by every word I wrote in this thread.0 -
You need to be careful about who you recommend this plan to. It works for seasoned runners. It works for Cracknell because he is already an elite athlete. Someone already running a base of 25-30 mpw might be able to take this on and be ok.
Most people in MFP who have done C25K are not fit enough or experienced enough to take on this plan. They also come to these forums and place a lot of trust in people like you giving them false hopes.
Lucky for these people, we have someone like Carson, who has TONS of credibility and experience (if you knew him, you would know this, too) warning beginners not to take on the plan you're promoting to them.
Exactly! (and where do they come up with 2,000 cal maximum? Especially on a long run day?......Lunacy)
I KNOW! I eat 2500 calories on long run days (and I'm a 125 lbs female) and I'm still losing weight. How on earth can a man live on less than that?0 -
You need to be careful about who you recommend this plan to. It works for seasoned runners. It works for Cracknell because he is already an elite athlete. Someone already running a base of 25-30 mpw might be able to take this on and be ok.
Most people in MFP who have done C25K are not fit enough or experienced enough to take on this plan. They also come to these forums and place a lot of trust in people like you giving them false hopes.
Lucky for these people, we have someone like Carson, who has TONS of credibility and experience (if you knew him, you would know this, too) warning beginners not to take on the plan you're promoting to them.
Exactly! (and where do they come up with 2,000 cal maximum? Especially on a long run day?......Lunacy)
I KNOW! I eat 2500 calories on long run days (and I'm a 125 lbs female) and I'm still losing weight. How on earth can a man live on less than that?
Well, some of us little fellas can.
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You need to be careful about who you recommend this plan to. It works for seasoned runners. It works for Cracknell because he is already an elite athlete. Someone already running a base of 25-30 mpw might be able to take this on and be ok.
Most people in MFP who have done C25K are not fit enough or experienced enough to take on this plan. They also come to these forums and place a lot of trust in people like you giving them false hopes.
Lucky for these people, we have someone like Carson, who has TONS of credibility and experience (if you knew him, you would know this, too) warning beginners not to take on the plan you're promoting to them.
Exactly! (and where do they come up with 2,000 cal maximum? Especially on a long run day?......Lunacy)
I KNOW! I eat 2500 calories on long run days (and I'm a 125 lbs female) and I'm still losing weight. How on earth can a man live on less than that?
Well, some of us little fellas can.
But everyone knows you're superhuman.0 -
<Rats, wrote out a post, then managed to accidentally edit it out of existence.>0
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Demonstrating what any new 5k runner can accomplish if they just commit to putting in the remarkably increased mileage in a relatively short period of time, right?
(Myself, I'm in the middle of week 7 of the 14 week couch-2-10k program, so my runs are about 2.7 miles now...because I've done the too-much-too-soon plan before and it ended in injury that sidelined me for ~4 months.)
Let's be sure we define "new runner" as it is being used in this conversation. A "new runner" is somebody who has been running for over a year and does 25 miles a week - I've been running for 9 months and am up to 17, so I haven't achieved the status of a "new runner" yet.
I think Jof was being sarcastic and pointing out what a "too much too soon" plan does to runners that don't have that awesome base.
Not so much sarcastic as it was asking OP for his insight into for whom he thought this approach was best suited. That clarification is important. And the second paragraph of my post was entirely serious.0 -
I KNOW! I eat 2500 calories on long run days (and I'm a 125 lbs female) and I'm still losing weight. How on earth can a man live on less than that?
Well, some of us little fellas can.
But everyone knows you're superhuman.
Ha! Nope, just tiny. :laugh:0 -
I would do this, but I'm not a fan of knee surgery.0
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I would do this, but I'm not a fan of knee surgery.
That is a very remote possibility. The most likely injuries will be soft tissue injuries like IT Band, Runner's Knee, Piriformis Syndrome and Plantar Fasciitis.0 -
Ah .... just found a very similar plan in issue 22 of the UK Magazine 'Outdoor Fitness' this one is jogger to Ultra Runner in 12 weeks and is even harder but very similar to weeks 3 to 14 of the plan I'm doing.
It's written by Ultra Running Coach Rory Coleman who has run 780 Marathons and 190 Ultra Marathons including completing the 'Marathon Des Sables' 10 times. You can check his credentials out at www.rorycoleman.co.uk.
I suppose he's got no credibility either ... that's an Olympic Athlete and Britains most successful Ultra Running coach against erm some geezer called 'CarsonRuns' and a lass called 'Vardaeml' ????
I do admire your commitment to the plan and your defense of it.
And yes, if coach Rory Coleman is advocating a similar program for *someone who is new to running*, then while he may have "credibility", I would still say the program is "idiotic".0 -
I think part of the problem lies with the fact that elite athletes and running gurus with lots of races under their belts who propose these types of training schedules forget what it's like (if they ever knew) to be overweight and barely running 30 minutes straight without keeling over. Going from that state to a trail marathon, however slow the running pace, is not one I would ever recommend to anyone in 14 weeks. Not if I wanted to maintain any sort of credibility or self-respect.Ah .... just found a very similar plan in issue 22 of the UK Magazine 'Outdoor Fitness' this one is jogger to Ultra Runner in 12 weeks and is even harder but very similar to weeks 3 to 14 of the plan I'm doing.
It's written by Ultra Running Coach Rory Coleman who has run 780 Marathons and 190 Ultra Marathons including completing the 'Marathon Des Sables' 10 times. You can check his credentials out at www.rorycoleman.co.uk.
I suppose he's got no credibility either ... that's an Olympic Athlete and Britains most successful Ultra Running coach against erm some geezer called 'CarsonRuns' and a lass called 'Vardaeml' ????
I do admire your commitment to the plan and your defense of it.
And yes, if coach Rory Coleman is advocating a similar program for *someone who is new to running*, then while he may have "credibility", I would still say the program is "idiotic".
I'm barely starting to get back into running after an emergency appendectomy and a hot summer spent deciding if I really wanted to get back into it at all. I'm currently running 3-4 mile long runs and have a half marathon in January and I'm hoping I'll be able to survive the *14 weeks* of training without injury. I can't imagine going to a trail marathon in that same time frame.
I certainly wish the OP and his family luck on this journey. I'll be watching this thread with interest for his results as I do my own training.0
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